do you think you can get better at art from simply going into it head first without knowing what you're doing, or go in with some experience on the things you want to do?
>>2399855
>red nose
>>2399860
Well think of it like this
>Want to get into designing and building cars
>don't have a clue about anything or bother trying to learn from sources of knowledge
>okay now I've got to build a wheel
>spend 10 years discovering how to build a wheel
>okay now I've invented the wheel time to move onto the car door
>spend 20 years inventing the car door
>okay great now I've got to-
>die of old age
The sole purpose of writing things down is so that other people can read them and learn from them so they don't have to spend all the time you spent learning it
>>2399855
>do you think you can get better at art from simply going into it head first without knowing what you're doing
Yeah, eventually. But why reinvent the wheel? Learn from the masters, anon.
How the fuck do you go into it "with some experience" without having started?
You get good at art by drawing. If you draw, and study (IE read books, watch tutorials, etc), then apply what you studied (BY DRAWING), you will learn. You find out what you're worst at and need to fix by actually fucking up. So if you mean 'going in head first without knowing' as 'trying to reinvent the wheel and stubbornly refuse to learn from other resources' that's a waste of your time. You'll improve if you're intelligent, but it will be slow.
If what you mean by going in head first as "starting to draw, and figuring it out by any means" as opposed to "just watch Proko or Scyra or whatever for half a year without so much as picking up a pencil" then going in head first is better ten times out of ten. 90% of what you absorb watching tutorials will go in one ear and out the other if you don't try to apply and understand the concepts being address.
Designers and Fine Artists tend to hold degrees and consider art an at least in part, an intellectual discipline, requiring certain amounts of knowledge. Designers (I'm going to group in viz dev guys in the group) might hang out in engineering circles, either software dev. or auto or chemical/medical, while Fine artists might hang out with historians, critics, and other academic types. These are usually the people that will argue that you need a formal education to improve in art, or that it least is partly necessary.
Cartoonists, Illustrators, and Animators, tend to have different views on this. A lot of cartoonists and animators I know grew up tracing comic books before they could read and write, and draw and paint because it just gets them fucking buzzed, and they love it. Illustrators can often also come out of communication majors, which requires a college education, and marketing/advertising, all of which require, again, a certain amount of education to succeed in.
This is all from my very small sample of people I know (maybe a couple hundred) who work in these various fields at different levels of skill and responsibility, some are directors, some technicians, some rarely touch a pencil, etc. Take it with a huge grain of salt.
Draw a lot and learn a lot. If you're learning a lot and not drawing you're an idiot. If you're drawing a lot but not studying, you're an idiot. End of discussion.
To be honest, no. If you just draw everyday you can definitely improve, but if you aren't consciously applying principles you've read about or probably just observed from life, then you aren't going to get very far. There are people here who have drawn for years and have made the progress of a studious beginner of 6 months.
>>2400180
Draw what you study from memory.
If you're doing lots of figure studies, draw figures and poses from imagination. If you're doing lots of landscape studies, do landscapes from imagination.
Even if you suck at drawing from imagination it will force you to think about what you learned. When something stumps you, you'll remember that the next time you do a study. If you just do studies it's easier to go into copy mode.
>>2400180
Draw what you just studied. Studies can be from imagination you know. For example grab a pose and try to draw it from a diff angle.
>>2399855
>don't actually spend anytime seriously drawing
I'm assuming she means actually practicing said art tutorials, right? Or am I'm looking too much into this?
>>2399855
I'm a professional fine artist (doesn't know if that means anything to you guys since a lot of you are digital, respects tho)
Here is my 2 cents, and maybe you can take some knowledge from it:
Going into it head first? No. However, going into it with "experience on things you want to do"? Those two don't even correlate together, so let's say you're asking:
>how do i git gud and where should i start
Let's say you have a bit of an idea of what you want to do. I'll choose >figurative art
Let's narrow it down more, to lets say,
>conceptual figure art
>narrative
>scifi
>space
So now you have a set of options of what to study.
>figure
For the figure aspect, worship the human form. Collect ref images, however, don't hoard them like a fuckin idiot. Do studies of them and try to do a skeletal structure model side by side. Understand the mechanisms of the joints, and how muscle and fat interact. Understand basic proportions before exaggerating.
-
>Narrative
This one is on your part of own exploration. Look at artists from dead old to new - you musn't be stuck in your own set of ideals. Explore. Watch films. Listen to music. Look at different art styles and movements. Find the type you like, but still stay in the groove of being inspired by things out of the main picture of what YOU want.
>Scifi, space
Study textures. Metal. Rock. Et cetera. Study things that you know you'll input into your environment
TL;DR: Think logically and study/work SMART, as well as hard.
also, P.S:
It's great to work from life to understand depth. Photo studies shouldnt be a great counterpart of your portfolio. Instead, reference, not copy.There's a difference.
>>2400223
I mean, depends on the study.
For example, Hampton will teach you each body part, so when it comes to the final lesson, you'll use all the knowledge he taught you and complete a human body.
Same with things like what Proko teaches. He'll give you the very basics of Gesture Drawing, then slightly more info on anatomy so that your gestures will become better.
Most studies build up to that final understanding.
>>2399882
Horrible analogy. You don't need to study shit to get good at drawing. There's no prior knowledge you need and no tip is going to give you skill. Sure you can take classes or watch videos on how to draw certain things, but that gets you absolutely no where if you don't actually take the time to draw.
The true way to get good at drawing is by drawing from life. Draw people that are in front of you. Draw complicated objects. Use pen. Force yourself to draw exactly what you see and be confident in every line you put down. It's like working out, if you do it consistently and long enought there is progress. Pump out as many horrible drawings as you can because out of a pile of a thousand awful drawings there's going to be at least one that you think is good.
You don't need to know every aspect of the human anatomy to learn how to draw people. When you first jump into it it will look like shit, but the more hours you put into practicing, the more things you pick up on. You learn how to draw things correctly.
Now I'm not saying to not learn anatomy or anything like that, but thinking that knowing anatomy or anything for that matter will somehow make you a better artist is ansolutely ridiculous.
>>2400322
>thinking that knowing anatomy or anything for that matter will somehow make you a better artist is ansolutely ridiculous.
is this a b8
>>2400761
You know what I mean. Yes knowing anatomy will add a ton of substance to your drawings, but knowing anatomy alone doesn't give you better line quality. You're still a shit artist in the end if you don't put in the practice. Don't kid yourself
>>2400762
>writes inane shit
>"oh you know what I mean"
Be more clear the next time and try not to overstate simple ideas.
>>2400322
>It's like working out, if you do it consistently and long enought there is progress
>Hmm better hit the gym
>I have no idea how any of these machines work
>Oh well I'll experiment until I figure it out
>I just need to do like 2-3 different exercises right?
Horrible comparison desu
>>2399855
You have to define "better," as in, what is "good". Based on that, and regardless of it, my best guess is that it depends. However, all things are possible. Some things are more probable.
>>2399855
>someone drew that
>then there's der shing tutoring art for patreons
>>2400762
>knowing anatomy alone doesn't give you better line quality.
Man, you just went full retard. Who the fuck implied that nonsense? Line quality won't do shit for you if you can't understand from. You can polish that turd up, but it will still be a turd.
>>2400801
Agreed... how do you think an artist is going to learn anatomy? By drawing it.
You can get really good at telling people to draw by reading tutorials. Look at /ic/, people here are amazing at telling people they suck and that they need to draw more, yet nobody can ever seem to post good artwork, and the ones that get good and assist those actually trying and posting shitty work are chased off by assholes telling them they suck -- Teal Line Guy, for instance. This is basically a place for people who suck more than you and draw less than you can tell you how much you suck and how you need to draw more until you can draw a perfect circle with a perfectly straight line using nothing but shame like everyone else - and when they can't find anything genuinely wrong with your work, they just compare you to someone else who doesn't even do the same type of illustration as you while they beat off to their smug superiority.
Welcome to /ic/.
Irony intended.
So what's the difference between seriously drawing and seriously drawing while studying?
>>2400801
What's your definition of "good"? Because there are plenty of artists who have drawn very little, if anything from life and got pretty decent at drawing.
>>2400812
Or "What is love?"
>Baby, don't hurt me.
>>2399855
>all that pretentious hand-writing
>not using actual font
>lmao hand-writing makes my ART so...ARTSY xDDD
i fucking hate this shit
It seems that only tumbrina/females from tumblr use handwriting that is hard to read if you not from USA.
Every time i see this bullshit it reminds me of picrelated - another hand-writing driven picture that i had troubles to read through because those letters are so small and "curly", it limits my reading speed because i have to stop and understand what the fuck is written here.
I see what is written on OP's picture but its harder to read through like if it was just font.
Listen faggy tumblrine.
1) You making an ADVICE-picture.
2) Advice picture should be simple and easy to understand
3) Not artsy-retardsy with hand-written stuff to make it look "natural xD"
Don't do that again.
>>2399855
like..i can't even understand what did she wrote on that left bottom part... what is it?
>hcHsilu
>hchsnu
fuck this
>>2399855
whenever i see a block of handwritten text like this, when i try to read it in my head it always sounds like a drunk man trapped inside a glass box
>>2399855
I think it was Howard Pyle who said this, not entirely sure.
A good way to improve is to just jump into creating the illustrations you want to make, even if you think they'll look bad. Do thumbnails and sketch it out (looking at whatever reference), take the full illustration as far as you can on your own imagination, and then use the reference to patch it up and bring it to a finish.
I'm not sure if the process needs to be that specific of when to use reference and when to put it away, but there needs to be a focus that guides what you study. If you're just drawing random objects for study without a purpose, you probably won't get anywhere.
>>2409745
English is my third language and the text in OP is perfectly readable to me.
>[...] i have to stop and understand what the fuck is written here.
Seems like a good outcome given what the original artist intended.
>>2409745
what the fuck
>>2409777
You kinda sound like a person who was offended because you use the same shit on tumblr but whatever lets start:
If you are not from USA and never learned english except through the internet and you see picrelated, the word SELF is the last thing you will think of seeing this.
>Seems like a good outcome given what the original artist intended.
>hard to understand text
>well it's cool bcuz it means people will stop to spend more time translating eet! xDDD
I see that you are not a designer either and like OP's pic you dont actually care about readers but want to just throw around pics that show how "smart" you are while it actually only makes you look like an immature tumblrtard.
PS:
>I see what is written on OP's picture
Not to mention that you are quite blind too.
>>2409792
>the word SELF is the last thing you will think of seeing this.
Different anon, but wow, must suck for you that school never taught you how to read.
I'm from the UK, that's cursive, and I don't get why you're making this such a big issue.
>>2409792
I've seen plenty of shit handwriting in my day and can still read most of it because there's this great thing called context that does half the work for you. that particular handwriting isn't even especially terrible. stop generalizing in order to give your argument credibility when the problem is you.
>>2409798
>I'm from the UK, that's cursive
>UK
>english is different from american
Are you like literally retarded?
My language is not even close to english and its english letters. It's impossible to understand what it is written here if you are prson from my country because in our schools we dont learn Tumblr-tier cursive.
You autistic manchild.
>>2409813
>stop generalizing in order to give your argument credibility when the problem is you.
Here is your answer. Keep up the great work. Sure you will become a good deisgner with this moronic logic. :^)
>>2409823
I actually misunderstood your sentence as meaning that you, yourself, WERE from the USA and so were acting arsey about non-USA English speakers being idiots. Kind of ironic I guess?
It's not really the fault of anyone that writes cursive that you can't understand it. Cursive isn't tumblr-tier though, that handwriting is a pretty normal way for people to write here, if a bit girly.
Calm down though, I get that we're all raging from the tumblr art in here but still.
>>2400203
just assume that's what she means i guess. she's addressing the problem when people only read tuts but dont draw, not trying to tell them to draw and not read tuts
>>2409865
>that you, yourself, WERE from the USA
what i wrote:
>hard to read if you not from USA.
>IF YOU NOT FROM USA
yeah you are retard. not even reading the rest of your message. im in the middle of drawing anyways
>>2399855
>OMG LITERALLY! xD
>OOMGG FUCKING DRAWW :\
I know young people are future and shit but fuck. This whole image makes me cringe.
>>2410048
>young people are future and shit but fuck
What are you talking about?
>>2399855
>I literally can't teach
>>2409911
holy shit just stop
>>2399855
Yeah. I'm certain masters of old did it, and by old I mean where any teachings of art - whether verbal or written - just weren't available.
>>2410056
>What are you talking about?
i mean that person (girl who drew OP's pic) is clearly a teenager or around 17-19. And it shows how dumb young people are.
>>2409911
Woah there anon, think of your blood pressure. I strongly recommend using a custom browser font designed for readability to decrease the generation of salt on your keyboard - would be a shame if it stopped working from short-circuiting, after all. The following study covers a nice range to pick from: http://dyslexiahelp.umich.edu/sites/default/files/good_fonts_for_dyslexia_study.pdf
>>2399855
Yes and no.
Lessons can offer you perspective and understanding that you never could have gotten otherwise and tutorials are good food for thought, but you really just have to experiment with things on your own.
>>2409911
The troll thinks he's in the middle of drawing and on 4Chan. That's cute. I know that if there's one thing I have to do when I'm balls deep in drawing, it's go have an argument on 4Chan. Nothing maintains high levels of focus like dropping the pencil and running off to an Internet site to participate in trivial arguments.
>>2409792
So... you've never once in your life read bad/poor handwriting? Most people I know can read anything that wasn't written by a doctor, and I'm not from an english-speaking country
>>2407351
Care to name a few? Because I've never seen any "artist" that good from not drawing a lot. Maybe your standards are pretty low, or maybe these people yore talking about pick up on certain things quicker than others, but you NEED to actually draw and dedicate time to drawing to actually become a skilled artist. No other way around it, and the vibe I get from your post is that you're trying to trick yourself into not having to put in actual work to get to a desirable end point.
>Should I use french by only using a dictionary?
>No you should never ever use a dictionary. Dictionaries are useless shit and everybody knows it
>Yes you should never ever use anything but a dictionary, any lessons or texts are useless and you should ignore them.
This thread in a nutshell.
>>2399855
You get better at drawing in your own style, but there are things most people simply won't get without some sort of instruction or criticism.
It will end up taking longer to master certain skills and perception training in order to actually git gud.
>>2415012
>The troll thinks he's in the middle of drawing and on 4Chan. That's cute.
it's ok if you are looser and i have respect for your honesty
However thinking that everybody else is the same looser as you is quite retarded
>the other guy who in the middle of drawing and watching a TV-show while he drawing a freelance job for videogame project
>>2416558
>I know that if there's one thing I have to do when I'm balls deep in drawing, it's go have an argument on 4Chan. Nothing maintains high levels of focus like dropping the pencil and running off to an Internet site to participate in trivial arguments.
PS:
Not to mention you probably has problems with your head. Like literally. Me and all my art friends dont mind talking while drawing/checking updates while they in the middle.
Git gut.
I guess you just doing babysteps into drawing world while holding your pencil and focusing on "le art".
_thats_ pretty cute
>>2409745
>fat =/= unhealthy
>humans deserve respect & dignity (even unhealthy ones)
?????
I doubt any of us start out really knowing what we're doing. I think the smoothest path in art is one where you do research, take classes, read books etc. Pure practice is good but may not yield the results/speed youre looking for without focus or guidance.
