How do I into Yoh Yoshinari dynamicism? Studies of his work? Focus on improving my gestures? Become a god at anatomy? What?
>>2543574
Yes.
Also, realize he's been drawing for a long ass time, working professionally since 1992 and who knows how long before that as an amateur and student
>>2543586
this
always keep in mind that most of the big industry artists you look up to have likely been doing this for longer than the average poster on this board has been alive
>>2543574
You have to think like an animator. So you need to be able to think of form and shape at the same time, and understand movement and action really well, then distort the forms to support the action. There's no magic trick, it's just a lot of experience and knowledge. Books on animation or school for it will help you think in the right way (and teach basic principles like anticipation or squash and stretch) and approach it correctly, but you can teach yourself it too.
Watching videos of sports or other actions in slow motion, or looking at photography of motion like Muybridge will help, but at the end of the day you need to know where to emphasize certain parts and downplay others, which is something only experience will teach.
Doing studies of his work might help, but realize you will be learning his shorthands and his solutions to problems and his shape and form language. If you want to be great you need to develop your own ways of doing things.
>>2543574
the fuck anyone would know on this board. any advice is talking out their ass.
>>2543600
>Doing studies of his work might help, but realize you will be learning his shorthands and his solutions to problems and his shape and form language. If you want to be great you need to develop your own ways of doing things.
Yoshinari did the same thing though. All great artists have studied the work of their own heroes. You will naturally develop your own way of doing things while trying to copy and learn from artists that inspire you.
>>2543608
Yeah especially you.
>>2543630
>All great artists have studied the work of their own heroes
Well that depends how you define "study". If you use it in the /ic/ way of copying it out, then not everyone has done that. If you just mean analyzing then yeah of course. Although at some point every great artist has had to step out of that mimicry stage and start to develop their own voice.
The anatomy isn't all that great in this when you look closely. But the shapes and gesture are top notch, so you don't really notice. So, definitely not anatomy.
>>2543693
SOME PEOPLE ASSUME THAT THERE ARE SHORTCUTS TO ACHIEVING GREATNESS AND EXCELLENCE. OTHERS MISTAKE HAVING A STYLE WITHIN THE FIRST THREE YEARS OF STUDY FOR THE MARK OF A MAESTRO. IT IS ALL VERY STRANGE WHEN YOU CONSIDER HOW MUCH TIME PEOPLE SPEND ON THIS BOARD AND HOW LITTLE DEDICATION THEY SHOW TOWARDS WHAT THEY OBSESS OVER.
>>2543641
likewise
>>2543711
agreed, my outspoken friend.
When you understand that the greats that are shared around on the internet too casually these days achieved their look not as a direct product of a set routine, but from years of working, not working, self doubt, finding oneself again, losing faith, losing family, losing friends, despair, but continued practice through all this, one can finally begin to appreciate just what is drawn, and learn to enjoy art a whole lot more.
>>2543717
>implying every master struggled that much or had to sacrifice things
>>2543717
THERE IS NO LINE BETWEEN WHAT YOU DO AND WHAT YOUR LIFE IS. GOODBYE.
>>2543723
Name one?
>>2543726
Sorolla had a highly successful career where he painted how he wanted, enjoyed tons of quality time with his family and took frequent trips and enjoyed the outdoors and beach every day in the Spanish sun. He had a wonderful balance of family and art and lived a happy life.
>>2543728
The dude grew up without parents as the eldest child.
>>2543734
>>2543734
It happened when he was 2 and he was raised by his aunt and uncle. He had a normal life, stop trying to make art and artists be all "woe is me!". You don't need to suffer to make great art.
>>2543741
>it happened when he was 2
>He had a normal life
Yeah, I'm sure it's like losing a pencil.
Losing your parents when you're 50, I can understand. Losing them during imprinting? Not very normal, no.
>>2543762
He was two. Infantile amnesia is a thing, he would have no memories of his parents or that happening. The fact that the entire rest of his life was great and he had a very happy life free from mental issues is proof that it didn't have a large negative impact whatsoever.
>>2543736
That's fucking sad, man.
>>2543699
I'm still a fucking noob so I dunno how good he is at anatomy but to be fair, the OP drawing is a sketch he did for fun and not a serious project. You can Youtube-search for his animation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFRDSbjnasY and Gelbooru-search for his more serious art.
Anatomy aside I always thought the guy's stuff always had a great and very specific type of flow to it so I assume he's done shitloads of gesture drawing. And his stuff also looks very fucking solid and three-dimensional to me.
>>2543765
>implying he couldn't have had an emotional struggle throughout his life just because "well it was a good ending!"
>>2544864
>>2543699
A good artist uses anatomical elements to strengthen the gesture, shape language and form.
These can be exaggerated, played down or even omitted altogether.
Noobs use "anatomy" just for the sake of it and complain about it when they don't understand the decisions a good artist made.
>>2544864
>>2544918
Basically this.
Yoh has a great grasp of gesture and shape language, as well as anatomy. His choice to simplify the anatomy of his drawings are well-thought out and wholly intentional and purposeful to describe the action of the character.
Refer to Force by Mike Mattesi for more information about this subject.
>>2544918
>>2544973
I honestly don't think his knowledge of anatomy is all that extensive. He's just very good at drawing appealing shapes, and has solid fundamentals. What I mean is you won't learn to draw like him by doing intense studies of muscles insertions and learning every little muscle on the forearm in the sense a digital sculptor does, but rather focus on how to draw appealing shapes, gesture and how to draw form.
>>2545010
You need to know a decent amount of anatomy in order to simplify it properly, dude.
>>2543728
He worked to the point that it crippled him. During his last unfinished painting, He couldn't do another stroke and cried in agony. His wife and a buddy had to carry him away. Then again he was pretty old at that point, so I guess he did have a fruitful life.
>>2545057
Damn
>tfw will never work that hard in your life
does anyone have a link to that behind scenes video of Little Witch Academia?
>>2545010
If you think he never studied that stuff at least several times over his dozens of years of experience you're pretty delusional dude, you can be 100% certain that he knows it, now stop looking for shortcuts and go study you piece of shit
![latest[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/Ps9CJ86.jpg "latest[1].jpg")
>>2545010
>>2545628
Not that guy, but there are lots of very good professionals who only know surface anatomy and important skeletal landmarks and are doing just fine with that knowledge. Also nowhere in that post does it say anything about looking for shortcuts. Just that you might want to focus on more important fundamental aspects of drawing than anatomy if you want to draw like Yoshinari.
>>2545666
name those "very good professionals" because there's very little chance they have the same level as skill as yoshinari.
And yes , skipping anatomy which is one of the more fundamentals element of drawing and design, even more when you're talking about drawing and animating figures, is looking for shortcuts. It's equally as important as perspective and everything else and you will never actually be good if you never study it
>>2545682
Are you stupid? No one has ever talked about _skipping_ anatomy and never studying it. You're arguing against a strawman you yourself just put up.
And no, anatomy is not nearly as important as say perspective or understanding volume and 3d space. A mediocre understanding of landmarks and surface anatomy paired with a very strong understanding of form, gesture and perspective will get you very far. Perfect medical anatomy knowledge paired with mediocre understanding of everything else, not so much.
>>2545689
When you say focus on more important things you are skipping it, and no, a mediocre understanding will not get you very far and be clearly visible, especially in figure invention, and the study of anatomy encompasses literally everything else, whether it is form, movement, function or perspective, all of those are directly related to it and you will need to study it along with everything else and be good at it, there is no way around it if you want to get even close to being as good as Yoh.
I'm sick of this board sucking lactating gook dick as if each and every one of them was touched on the forehead by the son of God during birth, defending them like their life depends on it and out for blood if they see anything negative said against X artist.
>>2543711
nice caps faggot
>>2545695
>When you say focus on more important things you are skipping it,
No your not, your either an idiot or intentionally misrepresenting his position. There is a difference between skipping something and not learning every possible piece of information of that field.
He's talking about learning the basics of anatomy and using gesture and form to supplement the basics instead of knowing every insertion and origin/ muscle name.
from vilppu >"It is also true that just because you know something very well, it does not mean that you can draw it. I have taught many medical personnel, including doctors, nurses, and various specialists, with much more understanding of anatomy than myself.
In fact, it took a while for me to realize that although I already knew this truism, that knowing anatomy would still not make me draw better."
>>2543600
Any suggestions on good books for animation?
>>2546015
Skipping fundamental knowledge is skipping it stop being retarded.
Knowing the names is not really relevant unless you're teaching, but knowling the insertions and origins IS important, and directly related to the muscles form and function.
What vilppu is talking about is medical knowledge , not artistic knowledge, like knowing and being able to visualize how certain muscles affect the form and movement of a figure, which IS necessary for any form of proper figure invention. Not to mention that studying the mechanics of the human (or even animal) machine will teach you extremely valuable knowledge about functional and complex design, which is why you see so much of it present in really good robot designs for example.
Anatomy alone is certainly not enough, but without it you will be worse than someone who actually knows it and didnt take shortcuts, and you can be pretty fucking certain that someone like Yoshinari knows it on an intuitive level.
>>2546045
Disney's The Illusion of Life and Animator's Survival Guide.
>>2546066
Your saying the equivalent that if I don't know how to do perfect architectural projections that I skipped perspective.
Same as with perspective you can get pretty far with the basics,I'm not arguing that in depth anatomical knowledge is useless. I'm arguing not necessary to draw the human figure convincingly. especially if your figures are usually clothed and stylized like Yoshinari.
I see no evidence he knows anatomy on the same level say a Russian academic artist would, It's the same with many animators.
>"I don't think you really need to know what the cross section of a bicep looks like, and how it attatches to the bone. They waste alot of time with this crap. "
Joe Mad
>>2546156
>I see no evidence
Because you're not looking for it, and are only looking for shortcuts, if you think you can achieve that level of understanding of the human form and it's movement without indepth study of it's intricacies and by just knowing "surface muscles and bony landmarks" then you're either retarded or just completely delusional.
As for that Joe mad quote, i looked it up and he followed it by this " learn the basics first. You can fill in the gaps later. " Which clearly shows that you eventually HAVE to go more indepth in your understanding if you want to actually be good.
He also says this "This is intended to illustrate what has helped me. Individual results may vary".
Now you can keep looking up quotes that you can take out of context so you can make yourself feel better about not actually studying, because with the internet it will always be easy to find someone who agrees with you but that won't make you draw like Yoshinari, In the end i know i won't be able to convince you, but when you look at your art and wonder why it's shit at least you'll know where to look
>>2545010
I think you are full of shit and don't know what you are talking about.
>>2544918
You have to be a noob that learns about anatomy in order to become a master that can use anatomical 'elements' (or rather knowledge) in order to make your work appear more lifelike.
If he knows anatomy he'd do something that pays better then animetion
>>2546296
If you think money should be a big factor when deciding what you want to do for a living, then you've come to the wrong place.
>>2546296
That's why he owns Trigger.
>>2543574
Didn't Yoh Yoshinari say something on his deviantart a long time ago (or twitter, I don't remember). Someone asked him how to gid as gud as him, and he just replied with "fundamentals, fundamentals, fundamentals, fundamentals, fundamentals, fundamentals..."
>>2546206
Of course I'm going to post quotes out of context, all quotes out of context.I'm not going to post entire interviews on the forum.
Then you make assumptions about me not studying and that my art is somehow shit, the funny thing is I have actually studied orgins/insertions/anatomy and that's why I am posting this, because I know its a massive waste of time. Or at least is something you shouldn't be studying until you've mastered a long list of other things.
If you were intellectually hoenst you would apply your own crits to yourself, maybe you are the one who's mind is incapable of being changed? Maybe your just looking for evidence to support your claims and ignoring any evidence to the contrary?
It's pretty sad you have to make up shit about me in your mind to justify your views.
Once people began asking for animation books, I see this thread is finally turning toward something important.
I'm not arguing with anyone when I say anatomy is important, and form and perspective even more so. But you need to know when to use it. All ideas about anatomy and form and even shape must be subservient to your idea and story.
People usually don't pay for perfect anatomy unless they're students wanting to learn it. The only way you can make a career in art is telling stories, clarifying other people's ideas, and designing solutions. Notice how none of them is busting out an ecorche model.
Yoh Yoshinari knows this. That's why his drawings turn down the anatomy dial and focus on storytelling and gesture. Just from OP's pic you can tell he knows his anatomy. But just enough to communicate his ideas. That's what professionals do. So do you have to learn anatomy? Yeah. But if you can't tell a story or hell, communicate visually, whats the point?
>>2546340
He doesn't. But I suppose he is at a high position.
>>2546367
As far as I can see, nope. But it would still seem like an obvious answer. Also Trigger_Tattun runs his DA page.
>>2546296
Holy Fuck
>>2543574
Shit anatomy.
>>2545653
That's his twin sibling tho. Koh Yoshinari.
>>2547129
both of them actually worked on VP.
>>2547129
Is that a joke? There's twin artists named Yoh and Koh?
>>2543574
OP here. So how do I into learning form and good gesture and shit? I have been drawing figures and people from real life surroundings and pictutes on my computer, but I dont feel like I'm any closer to being able to create from imagination.
>>2547380
You need some sort of generic mannequin you can hold in your head. Vilppu uses a sort of rounded pillow torso-ed one, Hampton uses one out of cubes and cylinders, some old masters used only cubes, etc. Essentially you need to break the human form into simpler forms that you can then rotate and manipulate at will, and then from there it is not as difficult to transform it to being closer to the actual human body.
KJG shows this way of thinking in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiRFoqX9_Fk
>>2547386
Thanks. I have no clue what he's saying but this is definitely appreciated.
>>2547402
>not speaking Korean
I don't understand it either to be honest, but you can understand the idea of what he's saying just from how/what he is drawing.
>>2545697
jesus christ nobody's doing that in this thread, they're just arguing pointlessly about the fundamentals and anatomy you whiny little bitch
>>2547402
Try Krenz patreon
>>2547188
They're both quite well respected animators. Yoh for his animating talent and Koh for his technical (SFX) approach.
>>2546615
> I have actually studied orgins/insertions/anatomy and that's why I am posting this, because I know its a massive waste of time.
that's exactly why you are a shit artist anon, you don't just study it once and give up saying its a waste of time, you study it along with everything until it clicks, and then you keep studying it until the day you fucking die, studying all those other concepts will amount to nothing if you can't apply them to anatomy (you can't even study them without studying anatomy since in a figure everything is anatomy)
