Have you ever felt the need to expirience faith?
I'm a non-believer but sometimes I feel the need to believe in something bigger than me, something spiritual.
But I just can't, no mather how hard I try, I cannot have faith in any god or religion.
How can I expierience that feeling? Do you feel like that sometimes? Got any books or theories for this subject? Am I just a pretentious, angsty faggot?
It's not something you talk into somebody. I would seriously just recommend reading and reflection in lieu of asking an imageboard. Training the mental faculties is far more fun than arguing.
4chan to me is more of a leisure, not a place where I look for serious thought, even if something profound might pop up every now and then.
just belive in yourself
:D
seriously
time 2 embrace dog
>>961203
>Have you ever felt the need to expirience faith?
No
>feel the need
Just get an endorphin rush or experience a high altitude sensation.
Sometimes I'm scared of death, but I've never felt the need to experience faith.
>>961203
You can't escape your nature anon. The average human has a need for something like that. Maybe you should try communism, I hear it's quite like a religion, with it's own devil and heroes, it might do for you.
I was atheist till I read Thomas Aquinas works, which made me more agnostic or at least not firmly against existence of god, and I suppose has made me think twice about the joy I feel when experiencing things and at least now consider the possibility that opening oneself up to the irrational sublime is the same as an act/manifestation of faith
Iktf op
Kinda went away for me when I learned what determinism was, and accepted it as a possible reality.
While we're at it please understand theists we don't want to be this way, we just are
>>961203
I'm exactly the same.
Sure there could be a supernatural entity but I doubt any established religion is on the right path.
>>962139
This. Even if there is a omniscient being controlling the universe, there's no way any of our Gods are close to what it is.
>>961203
Sounds like you need Kierkegaard
>>961203
>>961203
I've accepted that urge you describe is merely a part of human nature that's no longer necessary (at least for me). People in poverty are more religious for a reason. Faith is useful, but I'll never think it's worth it to believe in something wacky.
>>962337
>Moral relativism, can't trust the laws of man. Also can't judge people because the same mode of thought applies to everyone.
>Muh superior nature, I can totally take moral advice from nature because my independent observations of it will totally yield objective morality.
>Oh shit, it's not working. I'm basically an empty husk of decadence. It's almost like the general norms and behavior of a bunch of apes aren't applicable to humans somehow.
>I like religious society. If I just keep deluding myself I can eventually accept this as the law of god, rather than man.
>>962337
really disappointing. though I should've expected something this cringy from a Nietzschefag (former)
>>962337
>/his/ thinks that this is deep
>>962620
I think it's just one faggot posting his shitty conversion story
If anyone else actually saved this and think it's some poignant and convincing anecdote I'll be mad.
>>962624
I've seen it posted on other boards before
>>962629
Well that's disappointing.
Sometimes when I see something really naturally beautiful I get a little deist for all of half an hour. It goes away after that.
>>962673
I think it's interesting that nonreligious people can have somewhat religious experiences like this. Despite being a former christian I've never had experiences after the fact that I would call religious. After I stopped believing I just completely stopped feeling any such emotions. of course I was always more analytic in my religious devotion than emotional. Guess it all boils down to how your brain is wired
>>961203
>>962748
I've never been religious in the slightest, and I've had an incredibly intense religious/spiritual experience, probably mania though (not that it lessens it in any way).
>>962673
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izeDRfkyMAQ
Certain music will do that for me. This album.
>>961203
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ePfsdr94ow
>>961203
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvEI7k8pfHg
There are a lot of things I have faith in. I just don't believe in God(s).
I will never seriously accept any greater being, but I do believe In the real, psychological benefit that prayer and belief can bring. I just see it as a placebo effect really.
I used to be a neckbeard fedora tipper who would argue with religious people on youtube etc.
As I've grown older, though, I've found myself questioning the idea that there is no creator. Once I started going into nature (particularly the mountains) the transcendent feeling you receive from seeing something beautiful, be it a landscape or interaction between animals I abandoned the notion that "God" doesn't exist. It's something you feel in you -- your emotions may be caused by chemicals, but the experiential phenomena is something separate from the physical property of the chemical. Therefore I see God only as something you experience, and the mystics of various religions (like Sufi Muslims) have seemed really interesting to me.
I don't understand the properties of what God-like entity is out there, and I don't see why the Christian God is more correct than the Hindu one, so I've been looking for what all religions have in common... which is the transcendent experience. That is what should be paid attention to and investigated philosophically, in my opinion.
>>963372
If you see God as simply a feeling, then why call it God? A feeling isn't a deity. That religious transcendent feeling you describe is a part of the human psyche, which is why most religions have it.
Genesis, chapter 1.
>>963644
Quran, chapter 1.
>>963648
OP asked for truth, not satanic lies.
>>963661
t. infidel
>>963665
t. unsaved sinner
>>963666
t. infidel
The first thing you need to do is remove all the mental blocks and indoctrinations you've been through. The devil has been working very hard to avoid people from knowing the truth.
>Christian "Dark Age" is a myth
http://www.strangenotions.com/gods-philosophers/
>Evolution Debunked
http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html
>Evolution is the Greatest Deception
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMr278CMAIA
>Kent Hovind debunks Evolution
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shyI-aQaXD0
>Evolution is a modern fairy tale
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gjvuwne0RrE
>The Greatest Lie Ever Told
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1ufK04tjOI
>Overwhelming Evidence for a Global Flood
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lktmmd7YnD8
>Dinosaurs are not "millions" of years old
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niDCq3TbvOo
Then you can look into Christian sources. Salvation is not attained by joining a religion, but by a Person. His name is Jesus Christ.
>Theology & Eschatology
http://www.ichthys.com/
>100% accurate Biblical prophecies
http://www.reasons.org/articles/articles/fulfilled-prophecy-evidence-for-the-reliability-of-the-bible
>Bible has divine origins
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZsZLDWWZMs
>King James Bible & the Catholics
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHcf3E8qOqA
>The Choice
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-SzIJngWqE
>Top 3 Atheist Arguments
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYr5cpRc92k
>Why Jesus died for us
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDmwCwr0nI8
>Gospel in 11 minutes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e23cdDUxMVc
>Marching to Zion
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=styLx-iWwC8
>Pagan/Occult Satanism (Illuminati, Freemasons, Jesuits, etc)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o__D464kGyY
>AGE OF DECEIT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjmFm8PIz8M
>Zeitgeist Debunked
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFI6m6Icav4
>Exposing the Catholic Church
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bVEXZ38Vs8
>History of the Papacy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xta31joiIhU
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/false_religions.htm
http://www.compellingtruth.org/
>>963679
can you please use a trip so I can filter all your posts out?
>>963688
Don't respond, just report and hope the mods stop being retarded.
>>963712
We all know you don't believe the things you say. Please stop shitposting.
>>962629
Probably still the same guy
>>963714
I do.
You're just mad your monkey myths have been proven wrong.
>>963719
Not mad at all. I just have trouble believing someone could actually believe your nonsense on /his/. I don't believe it, and accepted you're a shitposting falseflagger. So stop.
>>963719
No, people are mad that you're pseudoscientific bullshit is taking up space on this board. Hence, they want to block you.
>>963723
>>963722
samefag
>>963726
>>963722
OP asked a question and I provided the most detailed and quality answer in the entire thread.
Keep crying.
>>963729
I'm not crying. As I said, I don't think you actually believe it.
>>963732
So you suffer from cognitive dissonance.
>>963734
No. How would that follow
>>962337
This guy just likes to have a bunch of people be nice to him, as is to be expected from a social human being.
The problem lies not with religion, it lies with the corrupt, selfish society we've created which prefers wealth and exploitation over human compassion and love.
>>961203
I wish that I had faith, I seriously SERIOUSLY wish I did. I cannot find it and it seems to me the only way I will be at peace with my place in the universe.
My parents are still alive but my Dad has had a couple of health scares. The day will come when they depart and I just want to find solace that they're still with me.
>>965141
Read Camus and Sartre. They really help you find your way in a meaningless universe.
>>963734
knight made wrong turn
>>963669
Islam used to mean something but today is just used as a smoke screen for filthy barbarians to slaughter their neighbors and terrorize others
>>961203
Maybe you just need to praise the sun, it's the only thing worth worshipping these days considering it's the reason why were alive, well that and the moon.
Plus unlike all of those other 'gods' it's not all loving or knowing and will fucking kill you at any time, but not out of any malicious intention or anything but because it's just doing it's own thing like us
I certainly feel this, despite being a strong atheist. I would like to experience faith, and get the same joys from it others do.
>>965341
That's what it was always used for. Read the Qu'ran.
>>963666
t. Satan
>>965401
Or, akhi, help them read the qur'an. You'd refer them to a translation with about a millionth of the substance of the original arabic.
Bismillah arrahman arraheem.
In the name of the one God, the extremely and infinitely loving.
Praise and thanks be unto the master of all the worlds of man, angel and djinn
The extremely and infinitely loving,
The king of the day of recompense.
It is you we worship, and you we ask for assistence,
guide us onto the straight path(upward),
the path of those upon whom you've bestowed your blessings, not the path of those who sin from ignorance, nor those who sin from malice.
Amen.
>>963679
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUYRoYl7i6U
Op here:
What du you guys think would be a good startingpoint to expierience spirituality?
Nature? Solitude? Any specific religious text, practice or autor?
I always thought being alone in nature would be nice, getting in touch with Creation and/or Mother Nature, cause no mather who/what created the universe, nature would offer some connection to it's maker. But I hate Insects, so I never really gave it a try.
>>962337
funnily enough st augustine of hippo also had an experience with an arc like that (and he related it in his confessions)
>>962337
I read the whole thing up until:
>"I was surprised when my arguments against Christianity were met with valid counter-arguments and defenses"
Which is absolutely absurd, and anyone who has *actually* read any arguments against theism in general would know that neither Christianity nor any other monotheism for that matter has a leg to stand on, other than their reductio ad fide.
>>965922
please anon, i know that you are an atheistic materialist evolution marxist psychobabble intellectualist lover but you know that both sides have incredible well thought sides
you know that most of your life you have to choose so hard between being compassionable or being logical and that's the most basic tenet of all christianity
>>965401
We get it, you are the second coming of Malcom X who tries to liberate niggers from the so encompassing opression of the white people (and you prefer killing all whites rather than educating black people because it seems more just) and in your so great battle against this very evil the Quran just speaks so deep about this struggle against the west and his perversion that is christianity
give me a break
>>965948
>you know that both sides have incredible well thought sides
Are you talking about religious philosophers or people like William Lane Craig who try to misrepresent science and logic to argue for his god?
>>965966
I will give you a chance to show me an important argument against christianity that's not something based on autistic cosmological postures or revisiting internal ideas about definitions
>>965985
Which aspect of Christianity do you want me to argue against?
>>966015
I think the ideas related to the most practical ones, which is the
>original sin
>justice with heart not with pure law logic
>faith on a trascendental result that can't be secured unless you put your heart to god (which goes to not having a hard heart at life)
>sincerity, honesty and simplicity at life
>searching wisdom rather than intellectualism
hardmode is not speaking of catholic tradition but of just the gospels
i was an atheist for quite awhile and it was put to me once this way
"you have you studies, your science, your evidence and your lack of evidence, im not trying to tell you who or what god is, i just want you to hear this, regardless of what your opinion is about god, the truth cares nothing for your opinion, if you rely on eveloution or the big bang as your opinion your placing a bet, placing a bet that their is no chance of intelligent design, now look at your cell phone, look at the complexity, look at all it can do, objects of that sophistication can only exist through intelligent design, its not likely that a random even will lead to the development of such a complex system, so you can place your bet on the opinion of science, and i can place my bet on a higher power, if im wrong, we are in the same boat and ive lived my life with a set of values, if your wrong, you have wasted your life and will spend an eternity separated from your creator. with that in mind can you honestly tell me that discounting the idea of god is a good or educated decision for you?"
believe in something or you will fall for anything
>>966050
>original sin
Is there any evidence for original sin? It seems like a mythology on how the human race was created. We all know that's not how the human race came to be.
>justice with heart not with pure law logic
What law? So called god's law or laws of the land?
>sincerity, honesty and simplicity at life
What does any of this have to do with Christianity? These are all things that can be done secularly.
>searching wisdom rather than intellectualism
Define wisdom.
>>961203
Sounds like you need some psilocybin mushrooms in your life
>>966098
The original sin teaches that even a king can sin, and that the sin between a king and a poor man aren't different, they come from personal decision
The law that christ teaches is not the human law, is one that comes from the heart and it's incredible personal and trascendental. Christ teaches to have charity not because there is an institution which does it, but because you have a personal decision to do it. The jews tried giving a lot of shit to Christ for surpassing the "gods law" about the sunday and what not, and christ broke it just to show how the heart is the guideline towards justice from a personal point of view and common sense.
Sincerity, honesty and simplicity is much easier to find once you abandon human idols. Pompousity is found in the life of the rich and poor likewise, it comes from abandoning god in favor of vanity (like trying to impress the ladies using a lot of flak, for example). You can't do sincerity and simplicity secularly, because your life revolves around society and society revolves around politics, and politics is all about your image and how to manipulate others.
I define wisdom as having an healthy common sense, with a rightful approach to knowledge. Intellectualism is for me the enemy of common sense, it tries to erase common sense in favor of more obscure approach just to have more pride. In my faith I believe only god and personal experience can bring you real wisdom.
If anything i'm more of a stoic but I still respect christianity (however i can't stand their rituals, they are too vain in my eyes sometimes) because I think it has an important idea about individuality that has went over the head of all modernity with all the collectivism poison that we have even in the church
I hope you can bring some reply to this, i'm interested
>>966190
I don't think that's what original sin is. You're just describing generic sin. Original sin is what we supposedly get from the supposed Adam and Eve.
Law of the heart just seems like doing whatever you feel is right, regardless of consequence. And because the bible is composed of books heavily tainted by personal viewpoints (No NT books are eyewitnesses and were tailored to different audiences) it can't be honestly said that one is following Christs example through lessons from the bible as one is following the law of man once more.
Religion also involves society and politics and the interpretation of religion revolves heavily around the two as well.
Common sense is often neither common nor is it sensible and is always fallible. Intuition has its qualities but "Intellectualism" is not a false approach to truth. It does not do what it does to have more pride but to have a better chance at being correct as well as having a better chance of being proven wrong if it is wrong. Common sense and reliance on intuition seems the more prideful option as experience and authority is taken for granted over reasoning and logic.
>>966084
Literally "but what it like, god WAS real lmao"
I think you mean "I", not "you"
>>966084
This seems to be a composition of two arguments.
1. Pascal's Wager
Basically wrong. It's a false dichotomy and ignores the effort invested to hold a belief. Statistically speaking it's not significantly better or worse to be an atheist over holding the specific religion being proposed as the opposition for PW when considering many more religions as possible outcomes.
2. Irreducible complexity or just argument from design or argument from complexity or whatever
This uses a technological construction as an analog for a biological system. The two can't really be compared because a complex biological system can simply emerge from a more simple system that existed one generation prior etc as opposed to the phone which would have to generate all of its complexity at once as it has no generational quality.
Everyone has a need for the transcendental, and they experience and structuralize it in different ways. Many go for the full package of religion to provide meaning, others are satisfied with art as a means to approach the feeling of transcedence ; others still return to the natural world and find it in the abandonment of industrialism. Many thinkers have written about this in ways apart from religion.
My preffered approach is classic romanticism, finding authenticity in traditional music, storytelling and embracing the non-rational.
>>966084
>argument from complexity
>pascale's wager
you fell for the two most stupid arguments in religion
Religion is a spook. Not even memeing.
