Hi /his/.
Let's have a discussion on African slave trade shall we? I am pretty new to the subject and admittedly I only want to learn about it so I can argue with "WE WUZ KINGZ" proponantes and the fact that they sold their own into slavery across the known world.
Let's start with the birth of America. Were the slaves used to build the nation 'sold' by their own kind or were they 'taken'?
>>802164
ere the slaves used to build the nation 'sold' by their own kind or were they 'taken'?
they didn't build the nation, they picked cotton for 2% of the population, stealing jobs and wages from the poorest classes.
>>802164
Most slaves were taken from other ethnic groups, not from within their own people with the exception of criminals
Periodically europeans would raid for slaves in the less organized areas of the west coast, it was a risky venture and most preferred to just bu from locals on the coast
Africans already practiced slavery, and sometimes sold slaves to merchants (Arabs and Jews originally). When demand from European colonists in America increased, they started raiding rival tribes specifically to acquire slaves to sell. Merchants didn't go around capturing slaves themselves, no.
On a related note, slavery was first introduced to British America when a Mozambican Negro successfully sued for the right to keep his slave in Virginia.
>>802201
>Merchants didn't go around capturing slaves themselves, no.
How did they aquire slaves then? I have been reading and it seems slaves could be used in marriage to gain control over a family, as an exploitation of tribal laws. Was being a slave a sort of born-'right'? If you were born to slaves then you were a slave?
>>802190
>Most slaves were taken from other ethnic groups
So comparable to say Aztecs and how they would capture and sacrifice peoples? Less the sacrifice of course, were theere any slave wars of the kind?
Muslims were raiding Europe and taking white christians for slaves into the 19th century.
Muslims took so many Slavs as slaves. That it caused the word we use to be.
White Christian Europe/NAmerica was the first society to abolish the practice of slavery for good.
there are more africans held as slaves now, in Africa, than were ever in the New World.
Slavery may still exist in the arab world. Arabs definitely treat foreign workers like they are slaves.
>>802226
>How did they aquire slaves then?
They bought them from local tribes, which in turn had captured them in raids or war. As to whether Africans had hereditary slavery, I'm not sure, but seeing as slaves belonged to different ethnic groups, I doubt their potential children would be admitted into the tribe as equals. All of that most likely varied from place to place though.
>>802201
Anthony Johnson was from Angola
And though Casor was the first person declared a slave in a civil case, there were both black and white indentured servants sentenced to lifetime servitude before him.
John Punch was a black indentured servant who tried to escape with two white indentured servants. They were merely given longer sentences while Punch was enslaved for life.
John Punch was actually the 1st slave in Murrica.
>I only want to learn about it so I can argue with "WE WUZ KINGZ" proponantes
I can assure you that the descendants of African slaves in America certainly wuz no kangz. The real kangz sold their grandpappy to a merchant.
>>802226
>How did they aquire slaves then? I
Tribe X wages war upon Tribe Y. Tribe X wins, and takes multiple prisoners of war from Tribe Y. Alberto Barbossa needs extra hands on his ship's deck, and an Arab Merchant needs money. So, Tribe X sells slaves to Arab Merchant. Arab Merchant in turn sells slaves to Alberto Barbossa.
>>802226
>So comparable to say Aztecs and how they would capture and sacrifice peoples?
Kinda
The Ashanti nation, Dahomey, and the empire of Benin loved human sacrifice of enemy captives.
Whoever wasn't killed was sold.
>were theere any slave wars of the kind?
Yes and no
There were raids on village level tribes, but one kingdom outright attacking another kingdom for slaves was costly and pointless
Tribute was a better method anyway
The Yoruba kingdom of Oyo took about 100 slaves from Dahomey each year as tribute
African slavery varied from place to place
But overall local enslaved debtors and their children were treated VASTLY better than war captives
They could buy their way out, own property, and the chastity of their women was safe from the masters
>>802164
I mean by what definition of "their people" because in West Africa/KiKongo the polities that sold Africans to Europeans saw themselves as White/Portugee/Christian.
The first major slave trader in Europe literally kidnapped Africans, they also realized that stateless groups would not trade and so Portuguese slowly married into African populations and influenced their culture and sense of self.
It's really interesting to read about, we in fact still see in the early colonial period of the United States lusoafricans who retained a Portugee/Portuguese identity into the 20th century: the melungeons.
anyways I argue with you people all the time, you guys put modern applications on things in the past that don't apply like race as merely biological in Eurafrican interaction and trade.
>>802278
This is actually false, African royalty ended up all over the New World. From the US to Bolivia and Brazil.
>>802284
>But overall local enslaved debtors and their children were treated VASTLY better than war captives
This is one thing I am finding out, that even though they were slaves they were treated 'well', but who knows how true this is, if at all.
>>802296
Sure thing LaQueshawn.
>>802247
>Slavery may still exist in the arab world. Arabs definitely treat foreign workers like they are slaves.
I remember watching a documentary on Indian migrant workers in Dubai. The companies that take them there make all these promises but when they arrive, the company confiscates their passport so they can't leave and trap them in Dubai under a contract. Then they work long hours in the blistering heat for jack shit pay.
>>802304
It varied all over the place
But some acts were universally considered dishonorable against slaves
>>802325
Just so you know, that's a vice video. Not really a documentary.
>>802325
Fllipinas and Indonesian women are often lured to Saudi Arabia to work as maids where they have their IDs destroyed and wind up like Harem Girls
Arabs are absolutely horrifying in their treatment of servers
Doesn't matter if it's a fast food joint or housemaid
They see all people in service as subhumans and property
just sit down and listen to this. you'll walk away brimming with knowledge and cleansed of false suppositions:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao7FKReHYKY
>>802340
>using Thomas Sowell as a historical source
>be a black American in the 70s
>I WON'T BE NAMED AFTER SOME CRACKA WHO OWNED MY GRANDPA. JIM WILLIAMS? FUCK DAT SHIT! IMMA HONOR MY AFRICAN ANCESTORS AND NAME MYSELF ABDUL MUHAMMAD!
>completely oblivious to the fact muslims enslaved a lot more blacks than Europeans and treated them like absolute shit
Why are blacks so historically clueless?
>>802346
>going to rekt
Fantastic grammar, DeAngelo.
>>802354
>I have no actual knowledge of the issue or argument against the stated case, so I'll just employ pointless ad hom attacks to make me feel superior to it
don't you have to write a report on Guns Germs and Steel?
>>802357
>be an edgy white American in any time post WW2
>WHITE PRIDE WORLDWIDE MUH CODEWORD FOR ANTI-WHITE MUH ANCESTORS FUCKING NORDIC VIKING RUNES AND WOTANISM
>completely oblivious to the fact Vikings were basically the niggers of 8th-10th century Europe
Why are whites so historically clueless?
>>802378
Good question, doesn't really answer the one I asked, though.
>>802357
Islam was a faith that was one largely of trade, 1/3rd of African American slaves arguably were either Muslim or Islamic all you influenced. its not as though Islam started the enslavement of Africans.
Christian wars were fought to force the mass conversion of European pagans, why do they speak of Christianity as a part of European identity when it caused the death of European religion.
Why do European Neopagand worship Indo-European gods from the Middle East, that's not an expression of the original Europeans how can they be so clueless?
>>802378
>There's a preexisting group of retarded people, so I can be retarded too!!!!111
>>802296
What even is 'African royalty'? What were their Kingdoms actually like? What did they achieve? Did they build anything on the scale of roads/aqueducts/wheels anything technologically relevant in this day and age?
Are they only being remembered for prosterities sake?
>>802357
He changed his name because of his new religion, not to "give it to whitey". I honestly think Ali could have cared less about slave traders. He was more focused on current issues and knocking out George Foreman.
>>802338
>Wahhabis are absolutely horrifying in their treatment of servers
Fix'd
>>802404
>The morning after defeating Liston, the new heavyweight champion confirmed reports that he had become a member of the Nation of Islam. With Malcolm X at his side, the champ told reporters that he had renounced his surname, which he called his “slave name,” and would be known as “Cassius X” until Nation of Islam leader Elijah Muhammad gave him a holy name.
It's pants on head cousin fucking retarded to discard your "slave name" only to adapt a muslim name even though muslims conquered Africans by force and enslaved the locals en masse.
>>802369
Thomas Sowell is not a historian.
>>802443
>Muslims conquered Africans
I want you to sit with this for a moment and ask yourself what's wrong with this statement
>>802448
Absolutely nothing.
>Christians enslave blacks
>give them christian names
>SLAVE NAME!
>Muslims enslave blacks
>give them muslim names
>perfectly acceptable
>>802443
>Muslims are a race
>Black muslims weren't mostly converted through trade
>>802459
>Black muslims weren't mostly converted through trade
I think you should brush up on actual islamic primary sources from before 1000 AD to know what fucking happened.
>>802464
....do you ever like look up something before posting things like this that end up making you look stupid?
>>802457
>Muslims purchase slaves from native blacks and come to take their place in African mercantile
>convert black merchants whom gave them slaves
>convert slaves too
>perfectly acceptable
Fixed that for you.
>>802471
>still nothing
>>802470
>doesn't know about Kanem
>still thinks they can tell others about Islam in Africa
>>802473
I'm not exactly sure how this changes anything. They were still slaves converted to a foreign religion by their masters.
I mean I'd understand if they went full ancestral faith and started practicing Vodun, but fucking ISLAM?
All you have to say to an American afrocentrist is you weren't a king and queen an sheeit,the real kings and queens sold you to the Arab and the white man
>>802476
>being this stupid and unaware of a literal Fulani Prince who was sold to a cotton plantation with knowledge of cotton cultivation in West Africa vastly improving the conditions of the estate
>>802485
Many practice Vodou, Santeria, Palo, Candomble, Umbanda, Shango, 21 Divisions, etc.... However Islam is also an old faith that freely blended with African religions, Islam was a faith of resistance with enslaved populations in the New World.
>>802493
>implying Arab is a race
>>802470
>I think you should brush up on actual islamic primary sources from before 1000 AD to know what fucking happened.
...what?
Islam didn't even penetrate sub sahara until AFTER 1000 AD
>>802499
Arabs are non white according to progressives, who are usually the afrocentrist in america
>>802444
>only degree holding historians are qualified to discuss history
>>802518
Arab is a cultural identity you fool, not racial.
>>802451
Nah, Oman and Jordan are still cool. Jordan was facing some rough times with ISIS sympathizers though, before the dumbfucks set their pilot on fire. The bottom rather fell out of ISIS support there after that.
>>802523
That other guy is full of shit, Thomas Sowell is as based as they come.
>>802523
As a qualified source when discussing historical subjects yes
>>802524
The people I'm talking only consider Anglo-saxons, frankish, celtic, pictish, slavic, nordic, and Germanic people to be "white" with saxons being the whitest and most privileged of all
>>802529
Why only the pilot, isn't one of the vote tenants of ISIS to destroy Jordan?
>>802543
No one cares. Arab is a cultural identity it's not one of color or race.
>>802556
That's not my stance, it's the afrocentrist position
>>802554
Fuck if I know. All I know is that everybody who was using ISIS to clamor about bringing down the Hashemites suddenly got real quiet after that video dropped.
>>802164
Are there any famous examples of any man purchasing a slave solely to be his mistress for sexual relations? What did they usually do with the kids.
I know I'm the Caribbean it was ok but what about else where?
>>802565
"Fancy Slaves" were common and legal.
Most mixed race children. Were enslaved seeing as all slave descendant have European ancestry.
>>802438
>Someone's moving the goal post
I am not that anon, just curious.
>>802558
No it's not, if you actually read books of academic afrocentricism you wouldn't make such a stupid remark.
>>802591
>Academic afrocentrism
On par with academic astrology.
>>802565
Fancy slaves
For when you a hankerin fer the dark chocolate
>>802614
>>supposedly being curious but not taking the time to learn on their own
>implying I am not learning ITT
?
>>802569
>>802598
I was born too late to taste the jungle.
>>802621
>learning is asking random people on 4chan silly questions rather than taking the time to study a given subject
Are you doing this to get others to do your homework for you?
>>802629
What do you think you are doing when you are learning?
Other people explaining things to you.
:^)
>>802647
Not in the format of a Cambodian Shadow Puppet forum known for its anti-african reactionaries
>>802621
>there are people who learn things from /his/
>about Africa
>and think they're true
>>802247
>Muslims took so many Slavs as slaves. That it caused the word we use to be.
The root for the word for "slave" comes from Latin and it's way older than Islam.
The connection with "Slav" is still possible though, albeit disputed.
>>802443
Didn't he mean "slave name" in the sense of "not-Muslim name"?
Islam theology teaches that everyone who isn't a Muslim isn't truly free, because they're slaves of something else that isn't Allah.
