What are the best films about the Eastern Front?
Certainly not the propaganda trash in your picture.
Possibly this: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0108211/
>>789618
pleb detected
>>789610
Stalingrad 1996(I think). Maybe it was 1994.
>>789631
It's '93, see >>789618
>>789625
The only inaccuracy in Stalingrad I can think of is the fact they used T-34/85s because they were the only ones they could find. Come and See meanwhile is full on commie propaganda train and pretty pretentious at that. It aims to fish an emotional response out of the audience.
>>789610
Ivans Childhood
Cross of Iron
The Ascent
White Tiger
Enemy at the Gates
There was another Stalingrad movie made in 2012 I think
1944 (2015)
Defiance
Escape from Sobibor
I honestly enjoy Enemy at the Gates a lot despite the blatant fictionalization and inaccuracies.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0075404/
>>789650
>It aims to fish an emotional response out of the audience.
no shit, its a fucking drama movie. That doesnt mean its bad. Or that the germans werent complete cunts
>>789671
>einsatzgruppen dindu nuffin dey was gud bois fishin out partesuns n shiet
Literally everything made by anybody is propagandistic. Soviet war films are probably the most honest, and that's not a big accomplishment given how Russian wartime crimes are always ignored.
>>789660
>There was another Stalingrad movie made in 2012 I think
MAXIMUM KEKS
>>789618
Agree
but that half german volga sniper shouldn't be in the movie, she should be in Siberia
>>789683
>implying people aren't always bitching about 'muh soviet rapes' and 'muh katyn'
>>789671
>no shit
So it's not really /his/ approved.
>>789675
I don't think anyone is denying that nazis committed numerous war crimes, but portraying random troops as literally cartoon villains erupting into psyhopathic laughter and clapping while burning down little children and dropping edgelord racial speeches to every random civilian they meet, while in the meantine Soviet partisans quite literally dindu nuffin, yeah, that's pretty much propaganda.
>>789694
They have a right to bitch about it IMO
All injustice deserves recognition
>>789699
>So it's not really /his/ approved.
>"the film is a drama so it isnt /his/ approved based on my stupid autistic definitions of what is acceptable and what isnt, even though the OP never made any such specifications"
Let me guess, you want nothing but a hololow and boring reenactment of battle scenes and thats it and want the human element completely taken out.
>ut portraying random troops as literally cartoon villains erupting into psyhopathic laughter and clapping while burning down little children and dropping edgelord racial speeches to every random civilian they meet
lol
>>789720
I have no problem with people actually affected by said atrocities complaining, but they're always brought up by Nazi apologists who think it somehow diminishes the crimes of Germany.
>yeah well did you know that the USSR literally raped 300 trillion German women bet the nazis don't look so bad now huh
>>789724
I think Platoon probably tackled the human element of war crimes the best. Come and see is reducing soldiers to Erric Harris tier adolescent sociopathic edgemansters and the only way the filmmakers could dehumanize them more would be giving them horns and hooves.
>>789744
>Erric Harris tier adolescent sociopathic edgemansters
kek
>>789683
>Soviet war films are probably the most honest
Have you seen Alexander Nevsky? Literally the biggest propaganda historical film ever made, even Braveheart appears historically accurate compared to that shit.
>>789683
>Soviet war films are probably the most honest
Really now. Before Stagnation WW2 was a painful subject for the people (duh) and Germans were mostly painted either as complete retards or Disney tier villains. After that WW2 became something akin to necromantic cult, and movies started reflecting that. I mean, there's some obscure shit like Trial on the Road (which is one of the few movies actually exploring Russian collaborationism) but by and large they're boring regurgitated garbage.
>>789699
The problem with Come and See isn't even Germans being fuckheads, the problem is the whole guerrilla warfare thing. Soviet partisans are probably the most mythologized part of Russian WW2 historiography.
>>789737
My grandfather always talked how after "liberating" their village Soviets rounded up all the men and herded them as a meat shield in front of actual troops (he was a kid then, thankfully). His own father died when crossing Don because he didn't know how to swim. I can shit on both Germany and Russia for all I want.
>>789744
>Come and see is reducing soldiers to Erric Harris tier adolescent sociopathic edgemansters
because thats what they were. People get so caught up in that "just following orders" shit that they never considered that some people could actually love that shit, like the guy who doesnt regret killing those people at all because they were "subhuman" If you actually believed people like that didnt exist at all during the war, you are naive
>>789750
>the problem is the whole guerrilla warfare thing.
They are hardly in the movie though. Most of the movie is some kid just trying to survive in the chaos of WW2. Its basically a post apocalyptic story
>>789625
The '93 Stalingrad is up there with the best eastern front films.
It doesn't dehumanize any side, has some very nice battle scenes that don't pull any punches when displaying the horrors of war (including a guy ripped in two by a T-34 and friendly fire in urban combat), is reasonably accurate (except for the aforementioned T-34s, where they couldn't get the right model) and hits the viewer right in the feels at times.
It's definitely a better movie than Enemy at the Gates or the 2014 Stalingrad.
>>789778
There were probably trigger happy psychopaths fighting in every war ever, but it's fair to assume vast, ridiculously overwhelming majority of soldiers don't fall into that cathegory.
>>789661
Like most of Jude Law's movies, I just see it as over the top nearly fantastical stuff
>>789782
The 2014 Stalingrad is pretty much Russians going full Hollywood. The movie might have as well been made by Michael Bay and you wouldn't even notice.
>>789661
It sort of follows Zaytsev's narrative, except Zaytsev was probably one of the biggest bullshitters of WW2. The German sniper guy he's supposedly had that monumental duel with probably didn't even exist.
>>789782
>The '93 Stalingrad is up there with the best eastern front films.
Come and See is more highly regarded and though, so to just brush it off as "hurr propaganda" is plebish. Also,not every movie has to "humanize" the other side.
>>789810
I'm sure one with such patrician spelling can decide what is and is not plebish.
>>789810
>Come and See is more highly regarded
Not when it comes to accurate portrayal of the war.
>>789784
>but it's fair to assume vast, ridiculously overwhelming majority of soldiers don't fall into that cathegory.
Do you even know what the fucking Einsatzgrouppen was?
>>789818
>muh accuracy!
no one gives a shit, especially when theres no real major issues of accuracy in the movie anyway. It is regarded as a better film
>>789828
>"muh accuracy"
On /his/ we give a shit about accuracy. If you want to jerk off to cinematography, sound design and pretentious existentialist themes while disregarding accuracy, kindly haul your ass back to /tv/.
>>789750
>Germans were mostly painted either as complete retards or Disney tier villains
people always say this, but it not true at all. Other than actual war time propaganda, like Daffy Duck hitting hitler on the head with a big hammer, pretty much every movie does a pretty fair job depicting Germans.
Kids still romantize this shit and think it was all respect and honor and what not, when they were brutal and trying to kill each other. People even cry about Saving Private Ryan depicting Germans as "cartoon villians" because they show them fighting and trying to kill Americans
>>789841
>On /his/ we give a shit about accuracy.
And how is Come and See so inaccurate that its regarded as a shitty movie despite everything else?
>If you want to jerk off to cinematography, sound design and pretentious existentialist themes while disregarding accuracy, kindly haul your ass back to /tv/.
yeah, fuck all the things that make a movie good. If you want accuracy THAT bad that you dont care about any other aspects of the movie, just go watch fucking footage from the war or a documentary
>>789842
>Kids still romantize this shit and think it was all respect and honor
Actually, kids are the ones that view nazis and cartoon villains and this appeals to the more edgelord kids who adopt this SCARY VILLAINS idea and strive to emulate it. Someone mentioned Eric Harris, well people like him adored the nazis precisely because of this distorted portrayal of them.
For all it's worth, the Saracens during the Crusades were portrayed in similar fashion by the Europeans, as pretty much monsters from hell. I give it another 200 years before the general public starts viewing the events without overt bias.
>>789842
I was talking about pre-Stagnation Soviet movies specifically, and that is largely true for them. The Dawns Here Are Quiet (1972) was one of the first movies trying to get a more realistic depiction of Germans.
>>789828
>muh accuracy!
I don't think this is the board for you.
>>789855
>kids are the ones that view nazis and cartoon villains and this appeals to the more edgelord kids who adopt this SCARY VILLAINS idea and strive to emulate it.
yeah, disaffected autistic kids prop them up as these anti-heros and then get into all that revisionist history DINDU NUFFIN! history of them (actually had 2 stormfags on /pol/ say something along the lines of "So what if you researched the holocaust more! I dont need to study it to know it didnt happen!" and had one call me a jew shill for "thinking too much" lol)
But it seems like its all middle class kids who live a pretty comfortable life, while the skinheads of the 80s were usually lower class poor white kids who turned to neo-nazism simply because the black kids would always beat them up at school
This new bunch loves LARPing though
>>789888
>skinheads of the 80s
And also organizations like Aryan Brotherhood, which is just a white ethnic prison gang that uses nazi symbolism a lot and was created to protect themselves from black and Hispanic gangs. Most of them probably didn't even read Hitler and the only thing they have to do with nazis is the racism.
Regarding the LARPers, sure. It's basically on par with little kids thinking they are Darth Vader.
>>789899
>like Aryan Brotherhood, which is just a white ethnic prison gang that uses nazi symbolism a lot and was created to protect themselves from black and Hispanic gangs. Most of them probably didn't even read Hitler and the only thing they have to do with nazis is the racism.
it actually started off as an Irish/boston type of led gang for white people in reaction to black prisoners teaming up with all the black panther stuff like you said. Their real symbol to this day is a 4 leaf clover and they will kill people if they walk around with a clover tattoo and arent in the gang. They also had 2 leaders already who were jewish (they had a star of david tattoo right next to their swastika lol) and one that was mostly native american
modern nazis are either those guys, edgy shitposters, angry ghetto white kids, or weirdo sex fetishist
>>789946
Nah, AB started in California prisons. I'm not sure where you got that Boston thing from, not all white gangs are affiliated or related to the AB.
>>789737
You never met an average Polish history enthusiast who will shit on both equally.
>>789737
>The holocaust? lol didnt happen. No genocide occurred, a million people starved to death tops. 6 million jews across europe being killed over the course of 6 years is literally impossible anyway! more like the holohoax!
>NEVER FORGET HOLODOMOR THE SOVIET GENOCIDE WHERE THEY LET UKRANIANS STARVE TO DEATH! 7 million people in 1 year died of starvation and it was a genocide!
This is actually what they argue
>>789737
Oh yeah, that shit is rank
>>790049
>NEVER FORGET THE HOLOCAUST
>Soviet atrocities? Either western propaganda or the victims deserved it
>>789618
I think the movie was fairly accurate since the Nazi unit massacring the village is based off either the Collaborationist unit made up of Russian criminal volunteers commanded by Kaminski or the Dirlewanger brigade which pretty much did those kinds of massacres portrayed in the movie whenever the brigade was called out to preform "anti-partisan" operations.
>>790387
>Russian criminal volunteers
Weirdly enough they're all German in the film, except for that one guy.
>>789784
This an average speech given to German soldiers by their commanders right before Barbarossa:
>The war against Russia is an important chapter in the German nation's struggle for existence. It is the old battle of the Germanic against the Slavic people, of the defense of European culture against Muscovite-Asiatic inundation and of the repluse of Jewish Bolshevism. The objective of this battle must be the demolition of present-day Russia and must therefore be conducted with unprecedented severity. Every military action must be guided in planning and execution by an iron resolution to exterminate the enemy remorselessy and totally. In particular no adherents of the contemporary Russian Bolshevik system are to be spared.
>>790392
You have to listen closely. You can make out their language like I think near some scenes where a collaborator preforms some kind "trick" I guess that involves placing a bag over a villager's head or that midget with the swastika helmet. You can even make out some uniforms with RONA on it which was the Russian collaborationist unit under Vlasov and some other men are wearing uniforms of the Cossacks i think or maybe Askari uniforms, probably native to their Belarus local police since that's where the movie takes place.
>>790549
Yeah well it's interesting that collaborators are almost always more brutal than the conquerors. Not talking about just WW2.
>>790556
Case in point: UstaĊĦe
>>789810
>Also,not every movie has to "humanize" the other side.
A war-movie has to convey some deeper message, because it turns into a mindless action flick without it. And if you're going for the anti-war angle (as did Stalingrad 93 and many other good war movies) it helps to paint both sides as humans with emotions, ordinary guys caught up in a hellish situation that they couldn't influence.
>>790954
>ordinary guys caught up in a hellish situation that they couldn't influence.
thats a pretentious 19 year old whos never so much as been in a fight tier mentality though. Sure, there are humans, but in the middle of a war, they are pieces of fucking shit. Especially in the context of Come and See, which is from the view of some 14 year old Belorussian boy.
They were murderous cunts as he saw them. The point of the film is to put you in that position, not to have this over view of the whole thing.
>>789888
>(actually had 2 stormfags on /pol/ say something along the lines of "So what if you researched the holocaust more! I dont need to study it to know it didnt happen!" and had one call me a jew shill for "thinking too much" lol)
So you basically got trolled hard and are offended about it, nice. Some sick newfaggin' going on here.
>>790556
Probably to settle old scores. When a certain party, like the National Socialists, enables you to have power in a certain region then the amount of atrocity you can commit against a smaller and hated certain people can go beyond any limit.
>>791059
>haha i trole u get rused x^P
http://www.upvoted.com
>>790526
All of this is basically true, though. Not that it's morally correct, but it is factually true.
>>790954
>deeper message
Well you have shit tier understanding of art.
Also did you not notice this is a story about a 14 year old growing up and surviving in a middle of the war?
>>791074
>Slaps out the big reddit boogeyman to defend sticking around on a site where he just flatly doesn't get it or belong.
Keep cryin', bitch nigga.
>>791079
This is part of a German pamphlet handed out to soldiers describing their enemy:
>Anyone who has ever looked into the face of a Red commissar knows what the Bolsheviks are. There is no need here for theoretical reflections. It would be an insult to animals if one were to call the features of these, largely Jewish, tormentors of people beasts. They are the embodiment of the infernal, of the personified insane hatred of everything that is noble in humanity. In the shape of these commissars we witness the revolt of the subhuman against noble blood. The masses whom they are driving to their deaths with every means of icy terror and lunatic incitement would have brought about an end of all meaningful life, had the incursion not been prevented at the last moment" [the last statement is a reference to the "preventive war" that Barbarossa was alleged to be].
>>790526
>"The Germans are not human beings. Henceforth the word German means to us the most terrible curse. From now on the word German will trigger your rifle. We shall not speak any moe. We shall not get excited. We shall kill. If you have not killed at least one German a day, you have wasted that day... If you cannot kill your German with a bullet, kill him with your bayonet. If there is calm on your part of the front, if you are waiting for the fighting, kill a German before combat. If you leave a German alive, the German will hang a Russian and rape a Russian woman. If you kill one German, kill another - there is nothing more amusing for us than a heap of German corpses. Do not count days; do not count miles. Count only the number of Germans you have killed. Kill the German - this is your old mother's prayer. Kill the German - this is what your children beseech you to do. Kill the German - this is the cry of your Russian earth. Do not waver. Do not let up. Kill."
Ilya Ehrenburg
Both sides had deep hatred towards one another. War that was fought on the Eastern Front was almost literally war of hatred
>>791121
Was this view not justified, considering they had a war of annihilation waged against them?
>>791079
If you think Russian culture is "Muscovite-Asiatic" you are retarded.
>>791121
This is so fucking badass.
>>791121
This was published in the summer of 1942, when the situation was nearly to critical for USSR.
>>791121
Also, this translation is not very accurate
>>790988
belarusian*
>>791079
>Jewish Bolshevism
>Muscovite-Asiatic
You're saying these things are factually true? Okay bud...
Come and See was a great movie. It isn't completely accurate, although you'd be a fool to deny the massive amounts of massacres that took place on the Eastern Front perpetrated by the Nazis. The Nazis of the Eastern Front weren't good people.
>>791277
Care to provide more accurate one? Genuinely interested.
>>791334
>Implying Russia isn't Muscovite-Asiatic in its core
Other stuff is bullshit, though.
