Were the founding fathers really just ungrateful little bitches?
people are greedy by nature.
imagine an american colony in mars and make it self sufficient. How long we will have to wait till it fights for their "muh freedom"
>>773086
Nope. Taxation without representation is tyranny and indistinguishable from a foreign army demanding tribute from a subjugated people.
>>773226
The problem with that though is there was some representation, just not by population. Plus, if they really wanted to be completely represented things would've taken months to even reach Britain as it is.
As someone who likes America and freedom and all that, I would say the founding fathers were good at manipulation and covering their own asses. The majority population didn't care and mostly sided with the British.
>>773226
pretty much this
Brit government got sloppy and got cucked by the French
>>773086
The Colonies would have ended up dominating the British Empire if they stayed
>>773242
That would have been glorious.
>>773086
Yes and no; on the one hand, the Revolution was certainly something of a power grab but on the other the colonies had traditionally been quite autonomous.
>>773086
Before the seven years war American colonies had been governing themselves for the most part. Colonists also did not accept the idea of the supremacy of parliament. In their thinking their rights as Englishmen were being violated.
>>773226
The problem with this is that Australia and Canada had no problems. Their excistance is an eternal reminder just how pathetic the Americans actually were.
>>773086
Taxation without representation ain't cool broham.
>>773266
>pathetic for fighting for your independence instead of waiting for it to be granted to you in the future
those who don't fight for their freedom deserve none
t. bennie franklin
>>773266
In what universe? It's the meekly compliant who are pathetic.
>>773232
>The problem with that though is there was some representation, just not by population. Plus, if they really wanted to be completely represented things would've taken months to even reach Britain as it is.
If they aren't represented by population (of citizens) then they aren't represented.
If it's too difficult to represent Americans in Parliament because of distance, then that's just another argument for independence.
>As someone who likes America and freedom and all that, I would say the founding fathers were good at manipulation and covering their own asses. The majority population didn't care and mostly sided with the British
The estimates I've seen say one third patriot, one third loyalist, one third neutral.
But if it's truly how you say, then you have to wonder why the loyalists weren't more successful with their militias to overthrow the patriot governments.
>>773285
Because the french were bankrupting themselves giving guns to the rebels.
"How is it that we hear the loudest yelps for liberty among the drivers of negroes?"
-Samuel Johnsom
>>773266
The difference is that neither Canada nor Australia really had the means to become independent. By 1776 the thirteen colonies were beginning to outproduce the British isles in population and agriculture.
>>773306
"I can't resist fucking my slaves, I mean do you see the booty on these bitches?"
- Thomas Jeffersom
>>773277
>Slavers
>Talking shit about liberty
>>773086
They saw a chance to grasp what the English Civil War and the Commonwealth had only glimpsed. A true Republic.
No gods, no kings, no slaves.
>>773420
>Benjamin Franklin
>Slaves
kek
>>773442
nigga loved him some dat brown sugar tho
"I'm jewish and mentally retarded."
- Benjamin Franklin
>>773086
They were rich and swept up in enlightenment ideals.
The idea that America was being choked off by taxes or something like that is basically nonsense. Yeah, there were taxes. Yeah, tehy didn't have seats in parliament. However, they mostly just wanted to run their own country and make it awesome.
Also: the revolution was not about the founding fathers just wanting to save money. The revolution was extremely expensive for most of them, and had they failed most would have hanged.
>>773497
Well yeah, traitors usually get hanged. Only in America do traitors get put on an altar and worshiped.
>>773226
MURICA
>>773100
Hello, Tomino!
>>773448
he loved everything with an ax wound and mammaries
>>773520
>Only in America do traitors get put on an altar and worshiped.
Taken a look at yurop lately, senpai?
>>773226
>Britain save me the French are attacking
>Don't you dare ask for a slight tax increase after bankrupting yourself protecting us
Fuck off that's your representation
>>773440
>no gods
>no slaves.
All of them believed in a god
Plenty of them owned slaves
>>774232
>protecting us
They protected themselves more than anything in the 7 Years War and were capable of seizing power. The British treated the colonists as expendable bodies to crew their ships, man their armies, and manufacture their goods.
>>773086
yes
>muh taxation without representation
even most english subjects were not represented in the parliament back then
>>774247
>If I make up lies of persecution it'll give my cause more credence
'no'
>>773335
what?
>>773100
fuck off zeon scum
>>774260
Read Benjamin Franklin's autobiography. Brit soldiers were all chav pricks who treated the Americans like shit.
>>773420
There is literally nothing wrong with slavery. Slavery was abolished because hiring workers is cheaper.
>>774237
And some of them wanted Washington as a king
>>775318
>There is literally nothing wrong with slavery.
please explain this to me
>>773226
>Taxation without representation
They were represented. They were british citizens, and there were british representatives.
Just because you are on a separate island doesnt make you non-british.
>>773442
He did own some for a time, before setting them free.
>>775347
How are they represented if they don't vote?
>>775360
The british did vote on some things, there is this assembly of lords or whatever.
What do you want, to elect a king democratically?
>>775363
>what is house of commons
You have basically zero idea about how represantion works. Please educate yourself or remain silent.
>>775368
People in what is now USA were british. British were represented.
Thats like Texas refusing to pay tax, because the president isnt a Texan.
>>775371
They were not represented by anyone at all.
People making decisions for you is not representation. Representation is voting for someone who represents you. The colonies had no influence over British parliament and were peeved about that.
>>775375
The colonies were british citizens, you dumb shit. You are british, and there are people who speak for the british, they represent the british.
>>775371
It's more like Texas refusing to pay a tax because they have no members of Congress to represent them.
The Colonies had no members of Parliament to represent their interests.
>>775379
The colonies were british people. British people had people representing their interests.
Maybe not THOSE british here, but british in general did.
Using that logic, you can divide things up to "my family isnt represented, so we wont pay tax".
>>775382
Honest question, are you American, British, or neither?
>>775385
Neither. Are you going to use that as an insult to dismiss what I am saying?
>>775386
No, but I needed to know to make an analogy. Where are you from?
>>775389
I really dont see how this is in any way relevant.
I am from Bulgaria, historically it has been a khaganate, a kingdom, a communist republic and a democratic republic.
The closest you can do is saying that during Ottoman times bulgarians werent represented, but that was despotism. There was one single person in charge.
And the regions themselves did elect some local figure, which was often a person born in the area in the later times.
The american independence wasnt for freedom, representation or principles, it was a power play. People saw that they are in a position to not pay tax, and despite the british negotiating more and more lax terms, practically embarrassing ones in the latest proposal, the americans went on and declared their sovereignty.
>>773226
D-d-dont tread on me!
>captcha snake
>>775378
That's like saying people in Scotland were represented because the people of Wales voted for represenatives.
The truth of the matter was that the colonies had no one to represent them in British Parliament, asked for it, were denied that, and revolted as a result of that among many other slights and injustices they perceived against them.
>>773086
Who knows? History was written by the winners. What i've always wondered is how the hell do one room full of guys get off organizing a government around 13 colonies and their populations. Surely not everyone gave their consent to be ruled.
>>773335
This.
>>773086
Well yeah, but king george was a heavy handed idiot with his conflict resolution, so things might not have gotten so out of hand if he had reacted differently.
>>775468
The Founders were mostly opposed to revolution until the British started confiscating arms. That's when they knew the British were done with negotiations.
If the colonies stayed British Boston, Philadelphia or New York would have become a secondary Capital for the Empire. South America would also be speaking English.
>>773382
Kek straight from the top shelf
>>775497
>some asshat is going to comment on how it was the Revolutionary War not the Civil War
Before you do, realize the Revolutionary War was A civil war not THE Civil War.
>>775476
That's what I meant, the Americans were being ungrateful bitches, but King George could easily have avoided a civil war if he hadn't decided to come down so hard on them and do his best to prove that he was every bit the tyrant he was accused of being.
>>774788
I'm sure it's an unbiased account
>>775445
Welp, the US of A just fell apart.
>>773335
Australian here.
We couldn't care less.
