Why didn't the native americans tame this shit and ride them instead of genociding them?
They rode horses with no saddles and zero guidance.
>>701384
have you ever tried riding a Paraceratherium? They're pretty cantakerous and because they are so big and strong you can't really control them.
One of my mates fell off and got his skull crushed by a stray foot when he tried to ride one.
>>701392
We domesticated fucking aurochs, those redskins have no excuse.
The skeletal structure on all the animals listed is actually worse, both calorie and juke wise, than the homo sapien, so there's no point in riding them. The only thing they can do better is top speed, and that's fucking worthless in a winter fucking hellscape where the meta is finding dead corpses and fighting over them, where packs of homo sapien cannot be contested at all.
It would take a few hundred thousand years of domestication for them to be useful in battle, since their psych doesn't have things like honor, and the natives didn't have that long. They had animal for and spears to survive the winter and the megafauna wasn't just competition, it was the only means of survival.
Shout out to any dead indians that raised young megatherium and used them in battle, you weren't metababies.
>Paraceritheum heavy cavalry
could have been GOAT
>>701427
>worse
worse at distance travelling, forgot to add that.
>>701392
Indians domesticated elephants
>>701407
>muh aurochs
For starters, domestication of aurochs happened when agriculture made domestication feasible. These animals all were extinct by the time agriculture rolled around so I'm not really sure why you think it would make sense for hunter gatherers to domesticate these megafauna.
>>701384
>you will never have a megasloth bro to ride around on
>>701407
Aurochs were at most, slightly taller than you and act like feral cows. Dangerous, but workable, given enough time.
These things are massive.
>>701440
this
and Elephants are damn smart and stubborn in their own right to boot
>>701440
>Indians domesticated elephants
This board is really great.
>>701440
Indians tamed elephants. They were never able to get them to go through enough matings in captivity to create a distinct breed, which is what true domestication is.
>>701384
when you're a stonecuck you can only tame small animals like llamas and goats
>>701407
Who's 'we'? I've never seen an aurochs, have you?
>>701508
>You will never ride west in the 훤 Imperial Army atop your prized mammoth gunning down dirty Finns with your resonance bowcaster.
>>701546
Why even live?
>>701526
We europeans.
One of my country's province's(and the independent state that shares the same origin) founding story(this happened in the middle ages) is basically "Dude climbs down the mountain to hunt an auroch. Dude kills auroch after some trouble. Dude decides this is a nice place. Dude settles region, and uses the auroch's head as heraldry."
It's not that long ago. Last one died in the 1600's. And a feral cow has the same behaviour.
>potential for interesting discussion about domestication
>turns immediately into white supremacist wankery
Racists are honestly the most boring people on this board. Don't you guys EVER get tired of this discussion?
>>701407
That's just cows you fucking idiot, people nowadays barely menage to herd buffaloes.
>>701453
>Dangerous, but workable
is that why cows all trace their lineage to like 15 examples which actually implies great difficulty and not an inevitability
>>701407
No we didn't. A single people somewhere in the middle of Asia domesticated some aurochs, and the rest of the old world just bought and bred that stock while killing off the wild ones they couldn't domesticate around them.
>>701570
They have a fatwah regarding spreading their holy mission to other boards, they see /his/ as a "Holy Land" that they must retake.
>>701560
Nothing in that story talks about domesticating an auroch
>>701570
white people are justly proud.
You need a lot of food surplus before you can move on to tame large mammals. Normally that food surplus comes from developing cereals. By the time Native Americans developed maize, all those creatures were extinct.
That is why South Americans managed to domesticate the llama. Originally few peoplelived in the Andes, so the animals there had a healthy population by the time people with knowledge of horticulture started climbing the mountains to explore.
Also, note that an ice age ended soon after the arrival of the first NAs, so the American fauna had to deal with both the climate change AND this new superpredator. Nearly all failed the test.
>>701625
Are they also so much purer than the common, vulgar, weak, licentious crowd?
>>701440
wrong kind of indian. We're talking feather ones, not the dot ones
>>701625
Pride is one thing. Turning every single discussion about domestication into White pride/ non-white bashing is autism-tier fixation.
>>701560
You're taking personal credit for something that happened in the Middle Ages?
>>701635
Quia peccavi nimis
>>701570
Don't you ever get tired of arguing against "le ebil racists" on a mongolian painting board?
>>701644
It's not autistic to realize things that are obvious and comment on them.
>>701663
This is fucking /his/. Go back to fucking /pol/ you fucking moron. Adults are trying to have a discussion.
>>701633
/thread
>>701668
>Adults are trying to have a discussion.
I'm trying to get a Hellfire sing-a-long going, idk wtf your'e trying to do.
>>701655
Who said anything about evil? Derailing discussions isn't evil, it's just really annoying. 'muh aurochs' is pretty much just the flipside of 'we wuz kings.'
>>701625
>justly proud of their their inevitable comeuppance
Not every animal can be properly tamed, that's why. They also lacked the food production to have specialists invest the time into domesticating many animals instead of having to eat them right away.
>>701689
>Not every animal can be properly tamed
Theoretically they can they just might not be worth it.
>>701667
>Oh well I guess you can keep thinking it's totes easy to tame wild Aurochs.
It's not easy, but Gesner’s Historia Animalum in 1602 describes them as kinda shy and not super aggresive, except if the calves are nearby.
So kinda like feral cows and horses.
And we've been taming those for a long time.
These are the actual animals man would encounter in North America.
>>701697
Well that's great, still though, 15 genetic ancestors. That's almost as inbred as dogs.
hey guiz, what's goin on in this thread?
>>701663
Commenting on obvious things without regard to context and social cues is exactly autistic behavior.
>>701708
>All of man's ancient domestication achievements were accidents by people with incest + bestiality fetishes
>>701714
>context and social cues
Spooks
>>701732
Considering domesticated animals tend to be pretty inbred, yeah. I think the only exception are horses and cats, could be wrong though.
>>701746
Cats are:
a) really easy to tame(african wild cat);
b) was more of a mutual relationship of various cats interacting with human societies;
c) interbreed a lot with ferals and wild specimens;
>>701477
He's talking about the actual Indians in India, not the ones in America
>>701791
stop enumerating things...or...enlettering, w/e.
American horses survived until at least 1800 BC in the Yucatan peninsula. Unless you're willing to propose that horses were somehow imported 2600 years before Cortez brought them onto the mainland, of course. Then again, we "know" that horses went extinct in 8000 BC because, apart from a few easily ignored finds (such as those in the Yucatan), that's the last time we see them en masse in the fossil record. The same way we "know" when anything went extinct in prehistory: of the 12 specimens of X found, the last lived ~year Y, therefore of the millions of X that lived none lived significantly past year Y. Despite the fact that any archaeologist could tell you that the fossil preservation of megafauna is a rare event (excluding mass floods, volcanic eruptions, &c.), the ever vocal conservatives of the scientific community press such dates as an absolute truth, rather than a general guide to our current understanding.
There are pre-Columbian depictions of horses in N American petroglyphs and C American art. There are Spanish accounts of wild horses and equestrian societies on the mainland, long before Juan de Oñate established his herds. Despite the "big dog" myth, many of the native tribes had complex and unique equestrian terminology, which wouldn't have been developed so quickly and thoroughly if horses and related culture had been entirely new (no other non-equestrian peoples have accomplished such a feat of culture and linguistics).
The "big dog" myth arises from the Siouan language family – the ancestors of these peoples lived in the eastern woodlands, and only recently expanded into the plains during the post-Columbian population collapse. While later on they would spread across much of the plains and become synonymous with the "plains indian", they were not native to the region where horses would have been.
>>701384
>domesticating giant sloths
Are you outta your goddamn mind?
Look at that fucking thing goddamn.
>>701560
Europeans did not domesticate the aurochs. Aurochs were domesticated in the Middle East and India.
>>702080
Mesopotamians were pure blooded, blue eyed blond haired germanic nords before the islamian invasions. Don't you know ?
>>701813
But those are not domesticated. Google taming vs domestication.
Lions have been tamed as well. There are no domestic lions.
>>701981
Take, for example, the Pawnee language:
>aruúsaʾ – horse
>asaáki – dog
Much of the complex equestrian terminology is derived from the root asaá-, but not all – and the word for horse is native.
There is a proven sprachbund among the languages of the plains, especially in borrowing of culture-specific terms from the more influential tribes. The Siouan peoples became the most numerous, and because they occupied much of the Mississippi basin they became the major trade power. Because of this, most of the influence was unidirectional, in this case from Siouan --> Caddoan (Pawnee). The "dog" equestrian words match perfectly with their Siouan equivalents.. overlying a substratum of unique native terminology that has been partially obscured by this influence.
The problem with all this is, where are the American horses? The tarpan (the European wild horse) survived until 1909, despite constant and increasing hunting by humans for many tens of thousands of years longer than those in the Americas. Exploding mustang populations in the deserts of the West show that climate change could hardly be the culprit.
We know where the North American horses went, at least – colonial and later American policy dictated the destruction of a village's livestock upon being dispersed, including dogs and horses. Their horses were from first contact described as having curling coats, and in fact such a breed still exists, the American Curly Horse. This breed was developed from three strange feral horses, bred into a normal herd. Their coat grows in a corkscrew pattern, they shed their manes seasonally, have five lumbar vertebrae and rounded hooves, and are able to subsist unaided in the desert. These traits are also found less commonly in the herds of native American tribes, and absent outside of the continent (with the exception of some central Asian breeds, shown to have developed a curly pelt independently).
Not definitive proofs, but hardly a fringe theory.
>>701407
>no excuse
>content
pick one lardass
>>701681
Berbers and Chinese could have easily come up on top on the world domination race.
>>701570
If you ever bothered to look into this question yourself (ie spend a couple minutes on /pol/) you would know that they have abandoned their lives to post this shit on 4chan.
So no.
Ancient large mammals look so goddamn cool
>>701384
They didn't have horses yet. The Spaniards accidentally brought them over. The first ever type of Native Americans in what would be America were were the ones in the plains. This is basic knowledge.
>>701407
>all these people replying to bait
>>702280
It was literally a meme a month ago ffs
>>701625
>all white people should be proud of something they had no control over because some people who look like them did some good things
Your argument will never make sense.
>>702305
It was pretty much the first /his/ meme.
Some /pol/tard posted it so I kept reposting it in the thread and people kept biting the bait even though it had already been posted.
>>702519
>tfw you were in the thread where this meme originated
It's like seeing your children growing up. Brings a tear to the eye.
>>701667
>/his/, he had a source, I didn't save it. Was I supposed to?
Was it this?
http://www.pnas.org/content/103/21/8113.full
>The available genetic and archaeological evidence points to at least two major sites of domestication in India and in the Near East, where zebu and the taurine breeds would have emerged independently. Under this hypothesis, all present-day European breeds would be descended from cattle domesticated in the Near East and subsequently spread during the diffusion of herding and farming lifestyles.
>>702529
>tfw
>>702529
>It's like seeing your children growing up. Brings a tear to the eye.
I was in that thread but the worst meme birth I ever witnessed was
>Designated
It was like watching a stillbirth being possessed by an Australian demon. Wasn't even the best meme material in that thread.
>>702106
>Genociding an animal
There's literally nothing wrong with this.
>>701560
Fucking șoldovean. De la noi sau de peste prut?
>>702810
btw I found that paper after 2 minutes on google, didn't know about it prior to that thread.
>>702829
>forced memes are literally australian demons
You know there were similar megafauna elsewhere right? Including Europe?
>>701526
White people you retard this is 4chan
>>701625
What have you ever done?
>>701620
If you think that's a criticism you are wrong.
>>701440
>Elephants.
>Domesticated.
More like Tamed, and even then every month you have news about one going berserk.
>>702098
Germanic or nord no, but the Persians and lots of horse nomads had plenty of blondes and red heads (the Pechenegs and the Kipchaks, Iranians, Scythians, Saka, Tocharians), and the Sirians, Lebanese and other semitics of the Area were pretty pasty with brunette hair, they antecesores are the ones than populated with the discovery of Agriculture nearly all Europe (the Basque could be one of the remnants of the language those guys talked). Actually the Nordics and in a lesser measure the Germanics are mainly Crogmagnons than mixed with the Arians some thousands of years ago (the Aesir/Vanir for the Arians/Natives cultural groups).
You do realize that the taming in ARK isn't realistic
>>702135
>Horse native to North America with luxurious curls
Take your cryptozoology nonsense back to /x/ you loon.
>>701384
Yeah anon why don't you tame that 6000 lbs beast?
>>705578
>what are pitbulls?
>>701384
paraceratherium and amphicyon were extinct m8
wooly rhinoceros never existed in america
>>707657
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbian_mammoth
>>707657
Shit I read that as mammoth
>>701384
>taming an animal that died out 23 million years ago
>>701440
>Indians DESIGNATED elephants
Fix'd
>>708081
Heh
>>701384
Dude animals are metal as fuck
>>706914
Pitbulls are bread for fighting and are usually raised by shitstain owners. Also theres 1000x pitbulls to elephants in captivity so of coarse theres gonna be more attacks.
Most of the big animals of the Americas were dead in a few human generations of first settlement, since they were totally naive of humans. You can't domesticate an extinct animal.
The animals of the old world otoh evolved alongside humans, so knew to be wary of us and how to deal with us. So they were around alongside humans for long enough for us to domesticate them.
It's all about time and energy.
Domestication was never worth it to the Amerindians. Excepting the mountain niggers in the South with their llamas and alpacas.
