I was trying to do some research on the north african jews who allied with the muslims in invading spain. after the muslim advance in spain halted the non muslims that had come with them decided to keep going and carved out their own fiefdoms in france. two of those fiefdoms were ruled by powerful jewish tribes and they lasted centuries. they were so brutal that the people living in france had to ask the muslim caliphate in spain for help more than a few times.
and if someone knows of other non muslim tribes that did not stop with the muslims in spain and continued into europe that would be good too. since there were christian and pagan tribes among them as well.
African history threads and Jewish history threads are the worst kinds of threads so this should be fun
>>524664
>after the muslim advance in spain halted the non muslims that had come with them decided to keep going and carved out their own fiefdoms in france. two of those fiefdoms were ruled by powerful jewish tribes and they lasted centuries. they were so brutal that the people living in france had to ask the muslim caliphate in spain for help more than a few times.
>>524664
Sauce?
>>524740
in the west the jews dominate. so much about jewish history and customs is known to even people who have never met a jew in their life. and yet, no one seems to know about the jews tribes that carved their little feudal fiefdoms in europe and south asia and also central asia. one would think that with all the scrutiny paid to islamic invasion of spain more people would know about these people invading spain and then moving further into europe and ruling over modern day french areas for centuries. yet for all the books written on jewish history, it is very difficult to find information on these jews who were powerful oppressors. it is almost as if someone has made sure that this is deliberate. my request in this thread is a true challenge to any european history buff.
>>524763
>>524763
i have read little bit about this in some book and other places. but that was as long time ago. it is not easy to come across this information. many years ago some french guy on an internet forum spoke of a book written in french about this. but i do not know more. i have made this thread to find out more.
>>524793
It's really ok to post your asshole. I'm sure the mods won't mind.
The current media story line is that the Spanish, in a fit of blind religious fanaticism, cut off their noses to spite their faces by kicking out the clever and enterprising Jewish community. Having heard these tearful tales over and over again, history buffs could be forgiven for thinking that only mass insanity could have led Spaniards to commit such an enormous gaffe. Jews, today’s spin doctors insist, were the cultural and economic backbone of Spain, the most educated and verbal segment of the population. Only greed, envy, ignorance and Christian bigotry could possibly explain this act of pure folly. once again, a peaceful, unoffending people were driven out into the cold because of the heartlessness of their wicked neighbors. But that is not the end of the story! As is almost always the case, there was a price to be paid for persecuting the Jews. The price for Spain, according to the Jewish version of history, was its decline and fall, following the loss of so much Jewish brainpower and the economic and cultural benefits which Spain’s rivals, Portugal and Holland, received from swarms of Jewish refugees.
>>524816
usual, when it comes to Jews, the story they tell is, shall we say, at variance with the facts. Fourteen hundred and ninety-two was the year Spanish civilization took off like a rocket. Within a century or two, Cervantes was writing Don Quixote; Velasquez was painting his incomparable portraits; Calder6n was writing his brilliant plays. it al most seemed as if the presence of the Jews had kept Spanish culture under wraps and their forced removal unloosed tremendous bursts of artistic, literary and economic energy. (Might it be possible that the same unshackling of cultural forces would produce similar results if the Jews left the U. S.?) In A History of Medieval Spain, Professor Joseph F. O’Callaghan provides us with perhaps the most scholarly and precise treatment of Spanish history in the time between the Arab conquest and the moors’ surrender of Granada.
>>524820
The reasons for the woefully poor showing of the Visigoths vis-A-vis the Arab invaders had to do with treason in high places. As O’Callaghan remarks, “Certainly the Jews and others who had suffered under Visigothic rule welcomed the invaders as liberators and collaborated with them.” As O’Callaghan also points out, perhaps to avoid endangering his academic standing, the Jewish renegadism was justified by the “disorder” of the Visigothic Kingdom. The re-conquest of Spain started in the rugged mountains’ of Asturias in northern Spain. There a Visigothic knight, Pelayo, refused to bow down to the Muslims and won the first battle in a 700-year-war between Islam and Christianity. The Reconquista, as it is known, was a glorious era in the history of the West. A proud and fierce people would be tried and tested in a thousand battles. The Jews, as is their custom, quickly burrowed into the Arab fabric of Spain. Generally preferring Muslim to Christian overlords, the People of the Book were allowed to practice their religion without interference and became key elements in Muslim society. it need hardly be added that the Christians who had suffered from Jewish moneymen in Visigothic times, came to loathe them more than ever in Muslim Spain.
http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2010/08/26/spanish-history-lesson-when-jews-took-the-arab-muslim-side-against-white-europeans/
With the victory ofTariq ibn Ziyadin 711, the lives of the Sephardim changed dramatically. For the most part, the invasion of the Moors was welcomed by the Jews of Iberia.
Both Muslim and Catholic sources tell us that Jews provided valuable aid to the invaders.[26]Once captured, the defense of Córdoba was left in the hands of Jews, andGranada,Málaga,Seville, andToledowere left to a mixed army of Jews and Moors. The Chronicle ofLucas de Tuyrecords that "when the Catholics left Toledo on Sunday before Easter to go to theChurch of the Holy Laodiceato listen to the divine sermon, the Jews acted treacherously and informed theSaracens. Then they closed the gates of the city before the Catholics and opened them for the Moors." (Although, in contradiction to de Tuy's account,Rodrigo of Toledo'sHistoria de rebus Hispaniaemaintains that Toledo was "almost of completely empty from its inhabitants", not because of Jewish treachery, but because "many had fled to Amiara, others to Asturias and some to the mountains", following which the city was fortified by amilitiaof Arabs and Jews (3.24). Although in the cases of some towns the behavior of the Jews may have been conducive to Muslim success, such was of limited impact overall. The claims of the fall of Iberia as being due in large part to Jewish perfidy are no doubt exaggerated (Assis, pp.44–45).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Spain
here is something about the north african jews at the time of muslim invasions.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Morocco
one thing to note is that there was a powerful jewish tribe in north africa, most probally acting as proxy of the romans, that almost defeated the muslims. the muslims were given refuge by the followers of arianism, which allowed them to regroup and attack. the folllowers of arianism were at war with the romans and allied with the muslims. there were other allies of the muslims as well. after the jewish tribe was defeated they became allies of muslims and invaded spain. but the jewish tribe was not content with stopping in spain and decided to go further into europe. there were two jewish tribe in the muslim armies. and once when the caliphate had enough of the complaints about one of the jewish fiefdoms they even asked the other jewish to teach the first one a lesson.
I have found more about the warrior tribes of jews and how they helped muslims invade spain.
here is a link to the PDF for the book by Shlomo Sand called Invention of the Jewish people.
http://www.rafapal.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Shlomo-Sand-The-Invention-of-the-Jewish-People-2009.pdf
read the chapter titled
REALMS OF SILENCE:
IN SEARCH OF LOST (JEWISH) TIME
