Was the mutual population exchange a mistake?
I find the ethic cleansing in Anatolia to be a total tragedy. What would that region of the world look like today had Greece managed to secure this land before it was scrubbed of Greeks? What would a modern day Turkey look like with virtually no Western coast?
>tfw the city that straddles the Bosphorus isn't called Constantinople
Step aside gr**k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SP3CF6YBU_8
>>399716
The greeks fucked up by invading anatolianif they didn't turkey would still have a sizable greek minority to this day.
>>399716
It wasn't a mistake. It was either that or continued extermination and neither the Greeks, the now communist Russia or the world would do anything about it, so you might as well salvage what you had left and get rid of muslims.
What actually was a mistake was thinking Turkey was civilized and would follow its treaties and thus exempting Greeks and muslims in Thrace and Imbros-Tenedos from the transfer, who the Turks pogrommed the shit up as soon as they got the chance.
>>400304
Just like those Armenian and Assyrian minorities, am I right?
I've been to the villages of Imbros and Tenedos, the last places in Turkey which the Greeks had survived in. The Turks had forced them out over the course of the 20th century through discriminatory polices, there's not much there but graves, weeds and feral goats. Even 50 years after the genocide the Turks just couldn't let it go, they're barbarians.
>>400328
Well if the armenians didn't side with the russians then it probably wouldn't have happened.
>>400373
>>400417
Why did the ottomans do it then ?
>>400424
Remove Armenians and you remove Armenian nationalism. Remove Armenian nationalism and you remove claims on "your" territory.
>>400439
The armenians were one of the most productive and respected minorities in the empire the government wouldn't have done it if there were any alternatives.
>>400467
Like deliberately ridiculous taxation, confiscation, etc? They did that too. But as long as Armenians lived there, they'd demand an Armenia, and that was the problem.
From the perspective of Armenian liberation, which most people would sympathize with, "muh Russians" is a bullshit pretext. It's like massacring Kurds because of "muh PKK" or something like that. While PKK, the Russians and Armenians posed a genuine threat to the Turkish state and territory, few people see the Turkish cause as just because it operates on the logic of "I happen to rule here and if you disagree you're a terrorist". Few fall for that typical Turkish technical nonsense.
The nail in the coffin for your memes is that the Turks went after any sizable minority that posed a threat to their territory. They continued to pogrom and dissolve communities they didn't like long after WW1 and Russians.
>>400304
>serves them right, they trusted an anglo
>>401122
Not any anglo though it was perfidious albion doing what it does best
>>400586
You forget about the turks loving there and don't tell me that the armenians didn't do anything because they also had their fair share of ethnic cleansing done on the muslim populace .
>>401187
*Kurds
>>399716
without the population exchange there would always be a threat of a Yugoslavia type situation and respective countries could always lay a claim to each other's territories based of ethnic communities residing there.
a population exchange was not ideal but the best outcome for preventing future conflict.
Also, Greece was resolutely defeated ..after starting the war
>>400373
Do Turks actually believe this?
>>400373
t. urk
>>401897
Then tell me why you think it happened, I just hope tht you are not so stupid to think that the armenians were deported because they were christian or something like that.
reminder that genocide Is the bi-product of a civilized society, which realizes that exterminating the threat, to none, Is the most effective cause to futher peace.
>>403079
it is one civilized society's reaction to another, greeks and armenians look almost exactly the same as turks, they could have simply converted to islam and moved to another town
praise be to the defector, the person who realizes that there is no point in ethnic or religious loyalties and simply adopts whatever the dominant culture is, the native american who assimilated and ended up owning land (and slaves), the celt who was romanized and became a merchant as trade was opened up, the indian who participated in the opium trade, the nazi officer who knew the war was lost and absconded to Argentina with all the gold and valuables he accumulated under a fake identity
they are superior and more intelligent, importantly they are more moral and ethical knowing that progress is the way forward not futile self-sacrifice
>>403118
agreed, the thing is the OE is pretty shit at those assimilation things, theres also the fact that those minorities are still very arrogant from their past greatness and stubbornly refused to assimilate.
>>399716
I agree. The 20th century was a massive clusterfuck of various genocides, violent or otherwise
The destruction of Greek communities in Asia and Turkish communities in the Balkans is particularly tragic. I'm also sad that the Crimean Tartars, Lebanese Christians, and various Asian Jewish ethnicities are essentially extinct.
>>403135
Jews moved to Israel. There was no genocide involved heh heheh heh hhh.
>>400373
And if T*rks weren't uncivilized retards who couldn't govern for shit and let Kurdish bands run rampant across Western Armenia the Armenians wouldn't have rebelled.
>>403079
Turks should've just converted to christianirty desu.
>>403046
le I must unite all ottoman empire under one identity autism
>>403118
spoken like a true cvck, you did a pretty good job at romanticizing it
still getting cvcked doesn't always work (especially when it's a massive and simultaneous act of conversion of a group of people), pretty sure plenty of Jews and Muslims in Spain converted but were still persecuted for generations to come
>>401187
A coup d'état staged by officers in the Ottoman Third Army based in Salonika removed Abdul Hamid II from power and restored the country to a constitutional monarchy. The officers were part of the Young Turk movement that wanted to reform administration of the perceived decadent state of the Ottoman Empire and modernize it to European standards. The movement was an anti-Hamidian coalition made up of two distinct groups: the liberal constitutionalists and the nationalists; the former were more democratic and accepted Armenians into their wing whereas the latter group was more intolerant in regard to Armenian-related issues and their frequent requests for European assistance.[36]:140–1 In 1902, during a congress of the Young Turks held in Paris, the heads of the liberal wing, Sabahaddin and Ahmed Riza Bey, partially persuaded the nationalists to include in their objectives ensuring some rights for all the minorities of the empire.
>One of the numerous factions within the Young Turk movement was a secret revolutionary organization called the Committee of Union and Progress (CUP). It drew its membership from disaffected army officers based in Salonika and was behind a wave of mutinies against the central government. In 1908, elements of the Third Army and the Second Army Corps declared their opposition to the Sultan and threatened to march on the capital to depose him. Hamid, shaken by the wave of resentment, stepped down from power as Armenians, Greeks, Assyrians, Arabs, Bulgarians and Turks alike rejoiced in his dethronement.
>We will have a new democratic government guys
>Lol JK we Proto-ISIS now
But anyway, there were a number of Turkish officials who refused to follow orders and warned Armenian populace (mostly around Lake Van ). Armenians have a list or something of those people.
