In Christianity, is Earth considered a punishment or a gift?
>>358798
A gift.
>>358799
Please elaborate.
>>358798
A gift, along with dominion over all living things
>>358798
Why did god create earth if he intented to let the humans live in eden?
>>358798
Punishment, obviously. Why do you think so few Christians are environmentalists?
>>358803
Eden is of this earth. This was intended to be paradise, but by rejecting God's plan we made ourselves suffer.
>>358798
Depends on the branch. 90% of them prefer gift wv tho.
>>358807
So the paradise is on earth? Why do we ascend to heaven then when we die? Isnt heaven paradise?
>>358800
The very essence of God, that is the combined Act of all things, is gifting. It's the individual "turning his back on God," who transforms every moment from a gift to a curse.
>>358799
>>358802
>>358811
>>358814
Explain this then (Genesis 3:17-19):
>17 And to the man[b] he said,
>“Because you have listened to the voice of your wife,
> and have eaten of the tree
>about which I commanded you,
> ‘You shall not eat of it,’
>cursed is the ground because of you;
> in toil you shall eat of it all the days of your life;
>18 thorns and thistles it shall bring forth for you;
> and you shall eat the plants of the field.
>19 By the sweat of your face
> you shall eat bread
>until you return to the ground,
> for out of it you were taken;
>you are dust,
> and to dust you shall return.”
>>358812
>Why do we ascend to heaven then when we die?
we don't. those are catholic lies
>>358832
If there's no reward then why obey God?
>>358837
>because of you
go on
>>358836
Gee I dunno, out of love?
And there will be everlasting life, but it will be here on Earth
>"the meek shall inherit the Earth "
>>358836
>no reward
that's not what i mean. it states in the bible that we go into the heart of the earth to await the second coming of christ.
but also the point is to return to god. the reward isn't a 'reward' per se but just the general state of being when with him. eternal life, eternal joy, etc
>>358840
Adam and Eve were expelled from Eden because they didn't obey God. There's no reason to believe that they would've been kicked out if they did.
>>358849
>general state of being when with him. eternal life, eternal joy, etc
I always wondered, how close is Dante's idea of paradise with actual christian theology? Because his paradise is actually rather terrifying.
>>358856
Right. So their expulsion (from paradise to an earthly existence) was a punishment.
?
So god created humans weak (not being able to resist temptation), then forces us to be well (even if he could have created us well), and punishes us for failing to do so, and yet people pray to him! Feels like Stockholm syndrome to me.
>>358863
Paradise was an earthly existence, m8, otherwise Gid wouldn't have needed to pyt cherubs at the eastern entrance to stop them from wandering back in (Gen 3:24)
>>358873
fucking gid
>>358864
feels like you don't know what you're talking about
>>358864
The only way to make people impervious to temptation would be to make us without free will, and beings without free will can't really love. We wouldn't be made in God's image.
>>358878
Kek
>>358873
Even if it were literally supposed to be on Earth, there is a difference between a leisurely life of fruits and a life of toiling a cursed ground of thorns and thistles by the sweat of your face.
I can't see how that isn't a punishment and frankly despite everyone saying "it's a gift" in this thread nobody has offered any evidence or argument as to why that would be the case.
>>358904
So, Earth srarted with a nice part (Eden) and a not-so-nice part (everywhere else). God put man in Eden as a gift, under the condition that they follow literally one rule: don't eat the fruit from this one particular tree. They didn't follow that rule,because they didn't trust God and thought they were better off following their own reasoning rather than following God's command. God said: "You want to do things your way? Fine." and kicked them out. Millennia later, we're still doing things our way, though several of us have figured out that were better off chossing God's way rather than our own.
>>358933
Forgot to get to the point
tl;dr
Eden was a gift. The rest of earth was also a gift (because it beats not existing at all), but not as good,specifically because we lost God's blessing. Once we get it back, followers of God will get the nice gift again.
>>358969
>bescause it beats not existing at all
I'd argue with that.
>>358883
Yeah but why did he make the serpent to tempt us?
Like it's not like we knew any better.
>>358812
God made it no longer paradise and then made heaven for him to live on and after Jesus died on the cross he opened up heaven for the good people to go after we die
>>358883
perfect beings would choose the right thing every time even if they had free will
>>358861
How so?
>>360479
Adam and Eve is simply a parable for the nature of temptation.
You're life is good and everything is alright. However, you are tempted to experience certain pleasures (whatever they may be). While going through with these pleasures, you feel good. Afterwards, however, you soon realize that the high was only temporary and has left you worse than before.
The forbidden fruit can be applied to anything: sex, harmful drugs, glutenous ways, sloth, etc.
>>358798
There was a creed of, well, kinda gift during medieval times.
It was believed that God wrote two great works through which one may understand him. On was the Bible.
The other was the world. This was the motivation for medieval bestiaries*. Knowing the creatures He created also meant deciphering the symbolic and moral lessons that they were suposed to be.
*despite the name, they included plants and minerals as well.
Earth was a gift but Eve acted like a typical woman and had to ruin everything for Adam because he had too much fun.
The man should've just sucked his own dick after sacrificing a rib so God could make his waifu real.
Eve ate the apple like a sandy vagina and then God said fuck it and made everyone on earth mortal and God drowned them all so a fresh generation of Jews could take the land and rob people of their diamonds and right winged movies.
>>358800
>>358798
>>358807
>>358803
According to bible, God created earth yet they never mention why.
I've become fond on the interpretation of Eden as the life o men before self-awareness, a true paradise.
When man and woman ate from the fordibben fruit of knowledge they became self aware, and started to feel shame, fear, pain and dead effectively being casted away from paradise.
Getting self awareness was the original sin.
Yet hope remains, in a covenant with god.
a test
>>362363
>Getting self awareness was the original sin.
>>358904
>evidence
It's all a metaphor, family, you make shit up to suit your needs.
>>358812
heavens a waiting room so to speak. at Jesus return, he revives the dead and we all live on a perfected version of earth ruled by Christ.
>>362383
just paraphrasing the bible message m8, no need to get angsty
>>362448
I'm just upset that people actually believe that shit and think it's something worth praising.
>>362454
I cant believe anyone believes that life is meaningless and without purpose, how fucking empty and sad can your life be.
>>358798
>Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them.
-1 John 2:15
>>362509
The world is not synonymous with "earth". "World" is an English translation of cosmos, which means order or age in Greek. The term "earth", or Gaia, is never used negatively.
"God saw all that he had made, and it was very good."
"For everything God created is good."
Everything we possess, even our very beings, even the words I use to express it, is a great gift from God.
>>358798
>a punishment or a gift
These are different words for the same thing. Blessing and curse.
It's a blessing put towards our coming journey as individuals whom live among one another.
A gift in that we aren't expected to return an equal measure but a punishment in that we cannot conceivably sow without an expectation of irreducible cost. As a blessing it both treats us to an immediate "understanding" but at the cost of the realizations that come in tow within that understanding.
>>363575
What a crock. A blessing and a curse can be one in the same but are not necessarily one in the same.
You are too young, my sonfu. Keep lurking. Dont be so quick to apply when devoid of a neutral standpoint. "But she said" will never be enough.
>>363785
They are objectively the same, the only difference if one's subjective judgement of it.
>>362363
And that's why I strive for that life. A simple life of existence. It's hard to in this world, but if I find a small paradise where I can, I would.
