I'm interested in Colonial Africa. Specifically German and Portuguese colonies. How did they operate compared to the Belgians and French?
>>339989
We (portuguese) already had a long foothold on the coninent before other countries, so we quickly and effectively occupied the rest of the territory without much resistance from the natives.
We also developed the colonies with infrastructure, although keeping the natives with a low level of eductaion, at least in the early times.
Guiné was a fucking jungle with little resources, but had a good coast. Angola had natural resources out of its ass, and Moçambique was farms central.
Hydrothermal energy, railways, schools, ports, roads, etc were all built, especially on Angola.
Generally we, exploited the land and treated the natives better than what was usual.
Regarding the german colonies, I don't think they had much time to do anything with them.
>>339989
German East Africa was.... an oddity; I believe it was the best run of all the colonial regions. It was also the only German colony to meaningfully resist occupation during WW1.
The long and short of it is that the German administration in East Africa took the "White Man's Burden" and "Mission to Civilize" at face value. The quality of education in the region dropped significantly after administration shifted to the British.
>>340099
Fuck the Anglos
They ruin everything good and sacred
>>340099
...so you gonna ignore the genocide in Namibia and the racist laws that prevent intermarriage?
>>340297
>RAYYYCIIISSSMMM
I have no qualms with laws that prevent intermarriage within the realm of German folk. That's what they had decided on to secure their nation.
>>340040
Comparitivly Europeans are saints compared to what the Chinese are doing today.
>>340116
sigh
Jealousy begets hatred I suppose
>>340297
>>340099
Weirdly enough Namibia today is one of the most well off African nations, it's on the level of development of some poorer Eastern European nations (which is I guess poor but still rich as fuck by subsaharan African standards). I have white friends who live there and the blacks are generally very nice to them and don't express the kind of rabid anti-white hostility as they do in say, South Africa or Zimbabwe.
Picrelated is their capital.
>>340297
Comparatively, there was little racial violence in German Africa, especially in Togo. The genocide in Namibia is a misnomer since it was a mutually martial interaction. Its only called a genocide because of how woefully one sided the event was.
>>340333
No for sure Togo did well, last Christina's I was speaking with a Togolese. They were still colonizers who did horrible things to natives but their presence being so small they had limited ability in all out war.
>>340329
Look into disparity in wealth and land ownership
There are the returnees of African descent who came back from East Berlin to Namibia that were adopted into the German speaking population since as far as they were concerned they were completely German.
>>340307
It wasn't theirs, they were colonizers.
Also it was a genocide, at first there was war and then came their surrender which didn't stop the killing.
>>340352
>implying pieces of land belong to certain ethnic groups
So I guess the Herero people should fuck off from Namibia too considering they only arrived in 17th century and displaced the original Khoisan people?
>>340352
The laws were to seperate between Germans and Natives yes?
I have no problem with it. Nobody should, that is their decision.
>>340603
Indigenous my ass, the Herero arrived a mere hundred years before the whites. Get the fuck out with your tribal bullshit.
>>340603
And?
This is during the age of right of conquest.
I don't see any problem with laws preventing the racial mixing between Germans and Natives.
Why do you have a problem with it?
Because they are occupying land they must mix with a less developed people and destroy their identities?
>>339989
Portuguese African colonies were pretty much dogshit. Loads of slavery/exploitation, less building roads, hospitals, "civilizing" efforts. Portugal did better in Brazil.
Germans weren't in the game too long, so its hard to judge them. Somewhat similar to Boers in South Africa; became really good at jungle warfare but still lost the colonies in WWI.
>>340040
Now I feel bad. I've read too many Britbong histories who always shit on Portuguese colonies.
>>340040
Maybe I'm ignorant to it but Mozambique and Angola seem to be among the best functioning African states while the Congo is one of the worst. This seems consistent with the idea that colonialism set back Africa as a whole since the countries that had more benevolent colonial governments generally turned out better.
They're indigenous and mixed race
>Only the pastoralist Himba and Herero stand out due to high frequencies of particular L3f and L3d lineages; the latter are also found in the neighboring Damara, who speak a Khoisan language and were foragers and small-stock herders. In contrast, the close cultural and linguistic relatives of the Herero and Himba, the Kuvale, are genetically similar to other Bantu-speakers.
http://biorxiv.org/content/early/2014/02/18/002808
Gtfo please :3
>>340639
I don't believe they were less developed, their trajectory was different and they had already incorporated western language, weaponry and folkways into their repertoire via Baster and other Saffer groups.
>>340706
They were quite literally less developed, it is a measurable thing.
Why does this make the destruction of two cultures viable and acceptable?
Because I fail to see it.
>>340690
>Mozambique
>best functioning
Literally what the fuck?
>GDP per capita $650 (one of the poorest countries in the world)
>corrupt as fuck
>ran to the ground by communist retards who literally adopted a fucking Kalashnikov into their flag
>>340040
I've heard good things about Mozambique. It's nice to know that not everyone made a complete mess of Africa.
>>340724
Well shit idk where I got that impression
To be fair tho an AK in a flag isn't necessarily obscene considering swords and cavalry on flags have always been popular
Obviously that's besides the point
>>340724
>>340730
>harbored terrorists destroying the two greatest states in Africa.
>>339989
Portuguese colonies are commie shitholes now.
>>340715
I define things differently from you then I guess or we just use different rubrics and by no means do I feel difference is reason to genocide an indigenous population.
>>340690
>Maybe I'm ignorant to it but Mozambique and Angola seem to be among the best functioning African states
>Blood Diamonds and Civil Wars: The Country
>Best functioning in Africa.
>>340738
Uganda is doing fine though, Anon.
>>340776
Uganda is a shithole.
>>340776
what about kony 2012?
>>340776
>having an unironic cannibal as a president for 10 years
>15% muslim
>poorer than dirt
And then there's this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Rebel_groups_in_Uganda
I wouldn't be able to find a bigger shithole in Africa if I tried. Or maybe you're tied with Liberia, that's as far as I'll go.
>>340826
Rhdoesia never lost a single engagement and is recognized as a Rhodesian victory as the state transferred power to the Zimbabwe-Rhodesia government first before the war was over.
You don't get disparities like this and claim you "won".
Rhodesia changed because of British sanctions and Portuguese stopping support.
>>340848
>Ndabaningi Sithole
Well he and his buddies turned the country into a s(h)ithole alright.
>>340869
>doing better than Rhodesia
Well it's hard to do worse than a country than is 404 for the last 30 years but Uganda somehow managed to achieve that.
Also where in the hell did I mention Rhodesia to begin with, strawman much you cannibal fuck?
>>340861
Left is Rhdoesia ya dingus
>>340881
>Well it's hard to do worse than a country than is 404 for the last 30 years but Uganda somehow managed to achieve that.
Yeah. Uganda managed to not collapse. One of the many reasons it is better than /pol/'s husbando.
>>340918
Rhodesia didn't collapse. Faggot.
>>340897
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ndabaningi_Sithole
You have no clue what you're talking about you retard.
Also Zimbabwe-Rhodesia =/= Rhodesia
>>340920
Oh, so it has political continuity now?
Then Rhodesia lost a war with Uganda. How does that feel?
>>340925
It covers the entirety of the Rhodesian conflict.
Zimbabwe-Rhsoesia lasted what, like a year?
Did sithol switch sides or something because the left is very clearly Rhdoesia.
>>340931
Rhodesia didn't collapse.
It dissolved. You're the same Butthurt nigger that says this all the time.
Go live in Uganda or Zimbabwe if you think they are so great.
>>340935
>Rhodesia didn't collapse.
>It dissolved.
Playing literal word games here.
>Go live in Uganda or Zimbabwe if you think they are so great.
You're the one who thinks Zimbabwe's so great my friend. Why not go live in Rhodesia?
>>340935
>Did sithol switch sides or something because the left is very clearly Rhdoesia.
Zimbabwe-Rhodesia was the country created by the internal settlement and was 100% led by blacks. Read up:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_Settlement
>apartheid
If it worked and made beter life for both sides possible. Why was it abolished?
>>340918
>muh Rhodesia, muh /pol/
I didn't mention Rhodesia with a single post until you brought it up and started beating the strawman like a retarded motherfucker. Go eat your kids or whatever the fuck you Ugandan retards do for fun.
>>340939
Dissolved and collapsed are two completely different things. One just doesn't benifit your historical misrepresentation.
Also
Zimbabwe isn't Rhodeisa so stop shitposting.
>>340978
>Dissolved and collapsed are two completely different things.
>Zimbabwe isn't Rhodeisa so stop shitposting.
What are you talking about anon? Rhodesia never collapsed. They won the war.
>>339989
You have to research that on your own since a lot of bias will come into play here by fellow posters.
>>340652
Germans did some pretty fucked up things as well.
>>339989
>baaaased Ethiopia
>>340690
Are you retarded? Angola, even with the mount of diamond and oil money they have, is one of the worst countries in Africa.
They managed to destroy almost all of the infrastructure the portuguese left when they gained independence, then got engulfed in a big civil war (which was just a cold war proxy war, after all). There's nothing there even today, exception being Luanda, the capital.
Mozambique is really poor too, because, as I said, the entired country relied on farming and had a low amount of factories, and suffered from civil war.
Also, most of black intellectuals (except those that were among the revolutionaries during the wars of independence) fled to Portugal proper, starving the countries further from brains.
>>340949
Because it was actually very oppressive and miserable for the victims of apartheid (read: the blacks). It's just that no one anticipated that South Africa would turn into what it is today after it was abolished.
>>342597
>no one anticipated
How deluded you are.
>>340317
>Comparitivly Europeans are saints compared to what the Chinese are doing today.
That's complete and utter bullshit. The chinese are bad but not nearly as bad as the Euros were.
I think the Congo has the most interesting history of all the colonies desu
Read about the portuguese colonial war.
Angola along with south africa in 60-70's we're probably the best countries in africa.
There was no racial discrimination in portuguese colonies with Salazar's rule. Alot of black angolans fought for Portugal in this war.
But then the commies, international pressure. We couldnt hold into them and revolution happened here in portugal too.
Search Lourenço marques on youtube if you want to see more.
Angola was considered not a colony, but a province of Portugal.
>>339989
>South Africa separate from the UK
BOER DETECTED
>>342975
What do you think is interesting about it? Aside from cut off hands. Well, I suppose Europeans traversing dense jungles and hostile terrain facing dangerous tribes is interesting.
Traveling around Africa, Mozambique seemed like the country where colonialism had the deepest impact (which makes sense, since IIRC it was the longest colonized). Portuguese seemed more widely spoken (on a daily basis) than did the European 'lingua franca' anywhere else. The culture and the food had a discernible latin flavour. Colonial architecture was widespread unlike anywhere else in Africa (although in most places in a very sorry state of repair).
>>343570
Mozambique was our colony that had less historical revisionism and monument destruction once they were independent.
Not like those angolans that are deeply butthurt.
>>343579
Mozambique definitely went through a radical post-colonial phase. The street names in Maputo are hilarious (Marx, Mao, Lenin), as is the flag. Pic related I found randomly walking down the coast.
Isla de Ilha de Mozambique is in such a state of disrepair it won't be there at all before long. Locals live in these amazing ancient colonial buildings until they collapse due to zero upkeep then just fuck off. Anywhere else it'd be a MASSIVE tourist draw and these buildings would be selling for million each.
>>343608
Never said it didn't.
They went full commie.
>>340603
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irredentism
On a related note, would anyone care to speak about the Belgian Congo? I always hear that it was horrific but I know dogshit little about it
How much whiteness remains in Africa, culturally?
Are there traces of western thinking in African countries today?
>>341474
Not sure about their other colonies, but they were pretty terrible in Southwest Africa. And not just the
>let's turn all nonwhites into second class citizens and throw them in desolate "reservations"
That South Africa did.
There were full-blown concentration camps, poisoning wells, and pushing natives off into uninhabitable desert to die.
>>343712
What exactly is cultural whiteness?
But it's probably a lot.
>>340690
Somalia had one of the most benevolent colonial governments of them all, Italy poured a massive amount of resources into it in an effort to teach the Somalis how to properly pour cappuccino and whatnot. The effects all of their colonization had was to destroy the old tribal system but when the new order left there was nothing to replace it which is why its been such a spectacularly failed state.
Interestingly, Somaliland, which is the northern half of Somalia and was a British colony is much better off than the rest of the country because the British didn't give a fuck about it and left things as they were.
>>343740
Protestant & catholic churches?
>>340724
well now that the civil war is over things are getting better
its was also recently declared to be free of land mines after an exhaustive decade long effort
>>343033
that's putting it a bit lightly, don't you think?
you lost the wars because the death toll became so high that people refused to be drafted and literally overthrew the government so they wouldn't have to fight in endless unwinnable wars anymore
colonialism as a concept was dead
>>343770
Except Portugal won the war? (In Angola and Mozambique, Guiné was their Vietnam)
They gave them independence AFTER winning the war and driving the communist revolutionaries into a corner.
>>343753
When I was on >>343608 trip about two years ago shit all-of-a-sudden started up again in the middle of the country (a few dozen killed iirc) and I got stuck for about a week. When I eventually got through the army was everywhere and I could see shot up / burned out vehicles from the fighting near the Zambezi bridge.
>>340948
>100% led by blacks
not really. armed forces were still white commanded and national service wasn't extended to the blacks, so the reservists were also white by an overwhelming majority. Also, Smith and the RF till held some kind of advisor roles if i remember right.
>>340307
>I can't believe someone would talk about RACISM in a thread about COLONISATION
cunt
>>343979
Yes, commies v1 and commies v2 had a hissy fit.
>>342597
>make africans rule a country
>it turns to shit
Surprise surprise, who would have thought
>>342604
By all means everyone expected Mandela to be another Mugabe. Just look at what he was imprisoned for - it wasn't bullshit treason charges, it was tens of thousands of counts of bomb making. He was a terrorist just like Mugabe was, and given that tensions in South Africa were far worse than Zimbabwe ever got, everyone expected Mandela to go the Mugabe route and completely fuck the country.
Instead, he worked to make amends. Sure Zuma's pants-on-head retarded and the ANC is full of problems, but it's a miracle South Africa didn't turn into another Zimbabwe.
>>340329
>Zimbabwe
