Can someone on /his/ enlighten me on the history of anti-Jewish sentiments and why they've historically existed? It seems like me a ethno-linguistic minority like Jews have always been blamed as a scapegoat for Western problems.
Why?
The Bible says you shouldnt loan money with interest, so Im pretty sure thats why Jews were the moneylenders in Europe
>>422788
they were bankers
plus they stabbed jesus in the back
>>422788
"They (the Jews) work more effectively against us than the enemy's armies. They are a hundred times more dangerous to our liberties and the great cause we are engaged in. It is much to be lamented that each state, long ago, has not hunted them down as pests to society and the greatest enemies we have to the happiness of America."
Source: Maxims of George Washington by A.A. Appleton & Co.
As the American colonies rose in revolt against political oppression occasioned by the attempt of Jewish banking houses in Europe to consolidate their economic foothold in the New World, no man among the Founding Fathers was more alert to the designs of international Jewry than that shrewd elder statesman of the American Revolution, Benjamin Franklin. Perhaps Ben Franklin's most damning indictment of Jewry was contained in his famous prophecy at the Constitutional Convention of 1787 in Philadelphia. In one of the most anti-Jewish utterances of all time, he declared:
"I fully agree with General Washington, that we must protect this young nation from an insidious influence and impenetration. That menace, gentlemen, is the Jews. In whatever country Jews have settled in any great number, they have lowered its moral tone; depreciated its commercial integrity; have segregated themselves and have not been assimilated; have sneered at and tried to undermine the Christian religion upon which that nation was founded by objecting to its restrictions; have built up a state within a state; and when opposed have tried to strangle that country to death financially, as in the case of Spain and Portugal.
>>422788
They were kind of assholes that thought they were better than everyone, and because of that they were treated like shit.
OR they were treated like shit so they became assholes that thought they were better than everyone.
I don't know which came first
>>422904
hey dickbag, a solid 30 seconds of googling found that washington quote as fake.
here's something washington ACTUALLY said, to the jews of newport, ri in 1790:
The Citizens of the United States of America have a right to applaud themselves for giving to Mankind examples of an enlarged and liberal policy: a policy worthy of imitation. All possess alike liberty of conscience and immunities of citizenship. It is now no more that toleration is spoken of, as if it was by the indulgence of one class of people that another enjoyed the exercise of their inherent natural rights. For happily the Government of the United States, which gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance, requires only that they who live under its protection, should demean themselves as good citizens.
May the Children of the Stock of Abraham, who dwell in this land, continue to merit and enjoy the good will of the other Inhabitants; while every one shall sit under his own vine and fig tree, and there shall be none to make him afraid.
>>422904
oh, and another 10 seconds shows that the franklin quote is fake. go eat a bag of dicks you shitbag bigot.
>>422788
>Jews have always been blamed as a scapegoat for Western problems.
Basically. Even after the Black Plague occurred Jews were blamed for the problem and persecuted.
>>422788
Typical Xenophobic cultures that insert themselves as a minority into another culture are seen as pests at best, subversive enemies of the state at worst.
When you blatantly don't want associate with the wider culture around you, and or refuse to abandon or soften your personal beliefs, then of course you're going to be see as outsiders.
Mormons have pretty much experienced the same thing.
>>422884
Knowing how the Romans treated those who tried to usurp their authority, they made the right choice. Carthage was one hell of an example in those days.
Jews are viewed and view themselves as a foreign element in Western civilisation, because they are.
This used to cause Westerners to exclude them, but it also causes Jews to more or less consciously try to destroy any elements of Western civilisation that they feel foreign to and can't understand or belong to, meaning anything that structures the West, be it Christian religion, European traditions, ethnicities, or nations. Sometimes they do it out of overt hatred, other times out of a well-meaning and honest belief that these things are superfluous and harmful. This is why Jews usually quite naturally support deconstruction movements, from Trotskism to neoliberalism.
You could say each side is somewhat justified in resenting the other. However there is a temporal asymmetry. While antisemitism has effectively disappeared since WW2, Jewish anti-Western deconstruction has only grown in intensity in that time.
>>422788
A lot of times they were the only minority around to scapegoat
>>423121
>This is why Jews usually quite naturally support deconstruction movements, from Trotskism to neoliberalism.
This is a fallacy based on the assumption that all Jews are proponents of neoliberalism and were proponents Communism. Sure, historically there have been prominent Jewish leftist, however how come you don't ever mention the prominent Jewish rightists (e.g. Rothbard, Rand, Friedman, etc.)?
Jews (Ashkenazi, Sephardi, Mizrahi, etc.) are not a monolithic people.
Hadrian, Vespasian, and Titus did nothing wrong
>>422788
Keep themselves to themselves in their own enclaves (disregard that it was illegal for them to live anywhere else).
Married amongst themselves and accumulated wealth within their enclaves (disregard it was illegal for them to marry anyone else)
Wore strange clothes and had odd customs (disregard it was illegal for them to dress like christians)
Stereotypically worked in roles that made a lot of money without needing alot of physical effort (disregard it was illegal for them to work most other trades)
Prominent bankers and alot of people owed them alot of money (people lending you money when you need it is a bad thing apparently).
>>423328
Pretty much this.
Discuss TE Lawrence
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't part of Hitler's antisemitism due to most of the communists from that era being Jews?
We're taught that Jews were just a convenient scapegoat and were targeted to get their money but it seems it would be hard to live through the 20s and 30s and not see the Bolsheviks as a Jewish power grab
>>422788
usury is a sin between jews
but from a jew to a non-jew, it's a-okay
>>423328
Literally this
>>423517
So doesn't that mean that Jews give each other interest-free loans? This is something you never hear about
>>423533
It's considered a mitzvah, a good deed pleasing to Hashem.
Giving interest free loans to other Jews, I mean.
>>423510
Odd sexual fetishes
>>423515
It was mostly, IIRC, due to Jews being blamed as the primary culprits for the stab in the back theory as to why WW1 was lost.
To be honest, I don't remember if this did or didn't have any impact with communist allegations.
>>422788
Jewish rejection towards adaptation to other cultures, while having a pretty weird culture themselves. Add to this other reasons often connected with this jewish ilationism.
The first recorded case of "anti-semite" violence happened in Achaemenid controlled Egypt (because they were collaborators). Nothing to do with "they killed muh lord".
>>422788
Jews owe their allegiance to themselves, and no one else.
They infiltrate secure "tolerant" nations with one goal, exploitation for their own personal gain. They shit all over the customs and norms of said secure nations, and are always a divisive element.
They are a poison, and deserve to be evicted from every non-Jew nation and forced to live among themselves in Israel.
>>423283
Probably because they're the minority (of a minority) or out of the country. It's not hard to go to a leftist news media site and conveniently the anti-west shit is usually written by a Jew. And the major media outlets that peddle them are headed by Jews...
>>423619
shut it down!
>>423328
Yeah but you gotta pay it back and that's horrible.
>>423617
I forgot to mention the source, a very interesting book where the author puts the source of anti-semitism as we know it in Hellenistic Egypt (but with a pre-hellenic background as I mentioned it). It shows reasons reminiscent of modern judeophobia and other modern xenophobias. It's SCHÄFER, P. (1997), Judeophobia: Attitudes toward the Jews in the Ancient World, Harvard University Press.
Another interesting reading for a later period is: -SIMON, M. (1986), Verus Israel: A study of the relations between Christians and Jews in the Roman Empire (135-425), Oxford University Press.
>>423646
Prove me wrong, motherfucker.
Jews are a scourge to ANY society they infect, and while I don't agree with murdering them, like the NAZI's, I sure as hell support deporting them and forcing to live among themselves.
>>423646
Nixon said the same thing, though. They're Jews first and Americans second.
For a country considered a melting pot of different ethnic backgrounds, and one of the most nationalistic states on earth, this is a pretty massive declaration
>>423664
And what makes Nixon an authority? Being a president doesn't make you an expert in everything. That said, I can't imagine any group who shows preference to their own. Jewish or not.
>>423672
That said, I can't imagine any group who wouldn't show preference to their own*
>>423659
*tips stahlhelm*
>>423672
He's not an authority but criticism of Jews is often dismissed as the crazy ramblings of an outsider. With Nixon saying it you've got the president of the united states agreeing with general suspicions about Jews in America.
>>423662
Didn't think so.
>>423680
>He's not an authority
Then why should I listen to him? Especially when he tried to illegally wiretap his opponents?
What I think is most interesting about antisemitism is the theory that they are trying to destroy ethnic identity through multiculturalism
The interesting thing is since everything they preach applies only to non-Jews, if they succeed, they'll have destroyed every ethnic identity but their own
We'll end up in a world full of identical brown people with no ties to their history...and Jews, almost unchanged for thousands of years
>>423684
>Then why should I listen to him?
>appeal to authority
Seriously? I thought /his/ would be better this.
>>423664
This.
Irish, Italians, Poles, Germans, French, ALL considered themselves "Americans" and assimilated.
Die Juden? FUCK no. They never will. They will always be Jews first and foremost, and will ALWAYS be parasites on the societies stupid enough to harbor them.
>>423680
Nixon was also hilariously paranoid to the point that it cost him the office.
>>423693
I see third and fourth generation of all of those still call themselves by that ethnicity, too.
>>423684
You're ignoring what I actually said
>>423690
What do the jews have to gain by other people race mixing? Why would jews be filling european countries with muslimes to create a musim majority if those states would then just be hostile to Isreal?
Is it just easier to blame kikes for everything instead of trying to rationalize why the world is the way it is?
>>423697
And I saw countless of those motherfuckers serving in the military, but I can count the Jews I served with on one hand.
Fuck Jews.
>>423690
Jews racemix the most statistically speaking though
>>423697
I fall into two of those ancestries, and have had family here for generations. It's true, for the most part we are Americans first, Italian, etc second. We kept parts of our culture and we still have pride in it, but we are American first.
When my Italian side of the family came here, we kept our culture, but when they had kids, they made damn sure they learned English first and assimilated. The German side was exactly the same. Every Irish I know is exactly like that too.
>>423693
I worked with self identified Irish/Americans and Italian/Americans who's families got here in the 1800s.
>>423709
I can count the number of Jews I've seen on one hand. Maybe you barely seen Jews serving because Jews are a really small minority. And again, does it really shock you if people of similar backgrounds sticking together?
>>423697
It's a loose affiliation, though, and it's basically meaningless outside of an excuse to get drunk on St Patrick's day. There are no communal practises associated with American ties to ethnicity.
You don't walk into a party and go network with someone who is vaguely French from four generations lost. Jews will seek each other out and build links based on their shared heritage.
>>423721
It's a bad thing when Jewish controlled industries (Academia, Media) seem to be creating a hostile atmosphere for white men
>>423721
>Or if that is even a bad thing.
When it means the Jewish lobby has the influence to send our country's shekels over to Israel because
>muh greatest ally
While they don't do shit for us (and actually just shit up our relations with the middle east, specifically Iran), it literally is a parasitic relationship with Jews.
>>423776
On this, if Jews want to protect their own ethnic identity then that's 100% fine
The problem is when they use their power to damage other groups. And it does feel like that's what is happening. They've taken star wars, one of the cornerstones of white american culture, and turned it into a romance between a black man and a white woman.
We're so far gone we're not even allowed to question that. It's verboten to call into question whether the hero of white fantasy should be a black man, and it's considered fringe and crazy to call into question whether that is ultimately because a Jew is in charge.
You hear Jews say "never again", then act as if that means they're destroying the capacity for whites to ever act to harm them. And we're so far gone as a society we can't say anything about it because we'll get fired from our jobs.
I suppose we should be thankful that the Jews find us useful enough to even let some of us work
>>423776
Sorry about that. I was almost taking you seriously.
>>423805
Yup, now we just went into full silly people territory. I do hope you're not the same Anon as the one who's talking about how jews view themselves as jews first and americans second, because now talking about how there's a need to define a piece of media as white first [whatever that's supposed to mean], american second is hypocritical as all hell.
>>423806
Are you saying that there is not a hostile atmosphere for white men at the moment? That the current discourse is not that white people are evil for colonialism, and that the modern world should reflect white people giving back to rectify their history? What about the narrative that all positions of power are held by "old white men" and that we need to do our best to fix that, since old men white having power is innately bad? What about the narrative that it is impossible to even be racist against whites, since racism is privilege + power?
Do those things not exist?
>>423805
You're retarded if you think Star Wars is a white fantasy.
>>422788
The excuse has most often relied on criticizing the insular yet willing to spread nature of Jewish culture. People show up in your town and trade together, get together, usually shun outsiders, etc. Easy to see why that's been the most common excuse for anti-semitism.
>>423821
That is potentially a fair criticism if it weren't for the fact that Blacks do (and are encouraged to) view themselves as separate
You can't ask a black man to think of himself as american first and black second because that is denying them their identity
>>423283
>Rothbard, Rand, Friedman
>prominent
>rightists
Do you even know what you're saying?
>>422788
There was always animosity of one ethnic group against another everywhere.
But then in Europe, Nationalism happened and the Czechs wanted a Czech state, the Germans wanted a German state, the Italians wanted an Italian state, and there weren't enough Jews concentrated in any one place to make a Jewish state.
So anti-Jewish sentiment grew, and peaked in most places in 1890-1920.
Germany was an exception and it dragged on until WWII.
>>423823
Not him.
Not really. There are some that do that and others don't. That narrative isn't nearly as big as you are acting like. The impossible to be racist narrative isn't even popular anymore.
90% of the time you hear about people doing this its met with a mob of people calling the people doing this retards. Noone portrays these narratives as positive things.
>>423823
They exist, and are not at all mainstream thought, but fringe [albeit very vocal] groups that have found resonance which certain sectors of the media. There's a fine line between a call for representation and a call for reverse prejudice, I agree, but I don't think we're reached, or are at any risk of reaching, a point where social policies are directly preaching the outright suppression of values of this or that ethnicity. The point is, there IS a hostile environment in the US to white people, but that is not condoned by neither the government nor social norms, who instead have equality, as a guiding principle. When said claims for equality turns overzealous is usually when problems arise, but these overzealous moves are driven by the mob rather than guided policy [I'm still counting media as "mob", since it's privately owned]
>>423852
>>423857
I take this point but is there actually even a mainstream narrative anymore?
You're right in that what seems to happen is that some fringe group will do something stupid and everyone clicks into overdrive in an effort to call out their stupidity.
But shouldn't there be an overarching narrative shared by the common people that isn't just a reaction to idiots? If there is, what is it? And who is doing it?
>>422788
Because Jews are culturally and genetically well-equipped for white-collar professions and when you combine that with the fact that they're voluntarily a perpetual outgroup because of their religion and traditions and have strongly kept up the tendency for nepotism/cronyism/etc. present in any tribal society it's pretty damn easy to understand why they're perennially disliked. They're invariably Jews first and [insert ethnicity/nationality/etc.] second no matter where or when they are so they're never trusted and just by their traditional patterns of behavior they end up looking (if not acting) like some sort of sinister cabal.
>>423864
I'd be very wary of any narrative. I think the best way change should happen is out these discussions we keep having over things and have a position just slowly rise to acceptance. Whenever you have one position pushing its way to power I just can't help feeling that breeds conflict and resentment and reactionaries more than we already have.
>>423864
I define mainstream narrative as whatever it is that the government tries to adopt in its policies, since wether we like it or not the state is the heart of a nation and so its policies and guiding principles are supposed to be based on the values it wants its citizens to follow.
And as far as I know, government policy seems to be based on equality; no prejudice, either based on ethnicity, gender, religion, what have you. Whenever there are government programs specifically aimed at certain ethnic groups, in the US or otherwise, they seem to be more focused on uplifting and giving them the means to establish even footing with the rest of the nation rather than actually promoting the values and culture of said race as superior. You don't see, for example, any govenrment policies based on "let's take money away exclusively from white people to repay black people for slavery". And I do believe this position of equality between peoples first is a belief that is shared by most.
>>423910
Yeah, I don't think that this is undemocratic. For example, Gay marriage only became the law when it was clear american's supported it.
It seems like while the government does push things, its pushing things the public by and large supports.
>>423910
Incidentally, touching on what I said here >>423829, I disagree that there's a call for black people, or jews, or what have you, to view themselves as separate. It doesn't seem to me as a matter of "remember to view yourself as black first", but instead "remember to view yourself as black too". Because some people seem to believe it's important to artificially keep alive traditions of a completely different continent in the distant descendants of people who've been forcibly ripped from said continents centuries before.
>>423922
>eah, I don't think that this is undemocratic. For example, Gay marriage only became the law when it was clear american's supported it.
Americans did NOT support faggot marriage.
It was overturned in states that actually had CITIZENS and not Jew courts make the decision.
>>423937
Hopefully you are not claiming that every state that voted on the issue has had its citizenry overwhelmingly opposing gay marriage, and the only reason it passed was because of closed door dealings. If you are claiming that in CERTAIN states it was the case where the majority of the population opposed it and that said states that opposed it were overruled by a majority of states that didn't, then that's a completely different matter, touching more on the peculiar elements of American politics.
>>423937
Actually around 60 percent of Americans support it.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/117328/marriage.aspx
>>422788
Because when jews have arrived in cities they often owned or operated businesses that took advantage of people. Some were more reputable than others but throughout the middle ages they were widely known as cheaters and untrustworthy because of what the moneylending businesses did. This also carried over to trade guilds where jews would harass christian businesses or guilds. They also were trading competitors and would often resort to shaving gold off coins or outright fraud to make money. In short they did everything everyone else did but it is percieved that they do more of it due to culture.
Fun Fact- Jewish expulsions from various cities were used to rootout corruption so a monarch could fill the vacuum left behind by jewish businesses, namely in europe, North Africa, and east asia
>>423805
The white man who came up with this white man's fairytale sure has no problem with the art imitating real life.
>>422788
Hey OP i actually bring you with a decent answer, instead of random /pol/acks getting triggered and spouting 14/88
The first book ever written, that i know of, about the ebil joos is the Martin Luther "On the Jews and Their Lies", Hitler used to make references to it.
But the first anti jewish propaganda came from the Holy Inquisition, or even earlier, since in 1391, thanks to Ferrand Martinez, there was a pogrom in Valencia.
The Spanish Inquisition was stronger, but i know more about my own country inquisition, Portugal.
The jews in Portugal were the most important scientists from cartography to astronomy/astrology, they were educated, they were important king counselors, and some were merchants. They had more influence over the King's decision than the Catholic church, during Henry the Navigator reign, while jews wanted the Portuguese kingdom to keep exploring for new land, the catholic church were for the holy war and wanted to keep fighting against the moors (muslims) in North Africa.
Since everyone in the country was catholic, and the king legitimacy came from the church, even though the king was sympathetic to the jews he had to side with the church. Plus Manuel the first married a Spanish from the aragon and castile related to the dynasty of the catholic kings which was against jews and had already expelled the jews. Therefore, he purposed to the jews to convert to christiany or they would have to leave the country. Only the most rich and influential jews got to escape, most of them went to Amsterdam, there is still a portuguese synagogue in Amsterdam today, and a small minority went to Brazil.
After that the Portuguese Empire started to fall, thank you Anti Semitism and Catholicism, you ruined my country forever.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_the_Navigator
>>423953
And you're surprised when a bunch of gay marriage supporters conduct a "poll" and confirm their position?
That's not how reality works, anon.
>>424200
Poll after poll shows that. And why do you think gallup supports gay marriage? Did they suddenly start supporting it in 2013?
you have no leg to stand on. There are no polls that show what you are saying. Gallup is a very respected name and retards like you are the ones denying reality.
>>424200
People like you live in an imaginary fantasy world where you constantly have to create paranoid little conspiracy theories to support your own opinions.
>>423515
I would assume that its just like today, he saw them as plotters who had a conspiracy against western culture, or rather germanic culture and people, ideology builds a frame upon which one can construct a whole world view, so its quite easy to fall for them and only people who are critical thinkers get out again.
>>425566
based double dubs
>>423283
>prominent Jewish rightists (e.g. Rothbard, Rand, Friedman, etc.)
What the fuck are you talking about, those are neoliberals.
The point is that whether they're "left" or "right", Jews always gravitate towards (and usually create and lead) movements dedicated to the destruction of Western structures, traditions, and values.
