Was he a leftist?
Not in Marxian terms, but in Enlightenment terms, yes.
I believe he actually did sit on the left side in the french parliament during his ambassorship
Define "leftist"
>>1371507
Hypocrite
By the standards of the times he was a radical leftist. He strongly idealized and supported the French Jacobins for instance.
The Declaration of Independence was a radical document at the time it was written.
>>1371276
This. Liberalism of this sort was pretty radical, especially before the French Revolution.
The American Revolution was weird, because it was led by radical idealists but made possible by slaveholders who wished to become as legitimate of an aristocracy as the peers of England.
I've heard that only around a third of American individuals supported the revolution, most of them being liberals around New England.
>>1371276
I'd say even in Marxian terms, he was more leftist than most of the founders; he was an opponent of establishing a central bank as he thought it would lead to tyranny of bankers and merchants, and he was generally resistant to giving centralized power to the federal government. Of course, his acceptance of slavery wasn't remotely leftist, but he gave a fairly half-hearted defense of it, so he probably realized it was wrong.
>>1371271
Yes however being a leftist meant something radically different in his time
>>1371593
Jefferson opposed slavery, he just didn't press the issue for fear of alienating slaveholders from supporting the Revolution. He didn't free his slaves, but that was because Virginia law made that very difficult to do outside of a will (and Jefferson did free them in his will), and because he wanted to ensure they could get by on their own (he had them all taught trades).
>>1371610
I remember reading that Jefferson's original draft of the Declaration of Independence claimed that King George sponsored the slave trade and called it "abominable". I thought Jefferson also wrote those that black people were better off as slaves? It sounded like he wasn't very invested in the argument to me, which is why I figured he realized it was hypocritical to own slaves but that it was such a powerful institution that he was forced to accept it and somehow justify it.
>>1371507
Promoting equality over inequality
>>1371624
He wasn't invested because he was worried it would drive away slave owners from supporting the Revolution, and also afterward he did not want to fracture the union.
I'm not defending Jefferson as some modern liberal: while he was president, he tried very strongly to have the Indians genocided, but he didn't have the authority. But he was opposed to slavery, he just didn't want to scare off slave states, which would possibly have happened since his words carried a lot of weight and if he strongly pushed for the abolition of slavery, they would have seen it as meaning it could quite possibly happen.
>>1371643
Also because, you know, it was his income
>>1371624
>I thought Jefferson also wrote those that black people were better off as slaves
People thought that black folk and white folk could not freely coexist. They thought that the annihilation of American Indians was proof that separate races could not inhabit the same space, even if they were segregated from each other, due to humans being inherently tribalistic assholes. They figured that free black communities would be terrorized by whites and vice-versa until one group was destroyed by the other.
>>1371649
No, he could easily get by with wage labor in place of slave labor.
>>1371768
Probably not since he was perpetually in severe debt.
>>1371642
Liberty, not equality, was Jefferson's motivation for supporting independence because he was smart enough to know that with the former would naturally come the latter. Nowadays sadly we live in a world where people demand equality at the expense of liberty.
>>1371779
That didn't actually impact his lifestyle, it was almost completely collected from his property upon his death.
>>1371768
Then why didn't any Southern planters do that?
>>1371757
Nah, Jeff just hated black people. He thought Native Americans were savages but wanted to extend citizenship to any who adopted Western customs
>>1371837
Greed
>>1371842
He thought blacks to be inferior goofballs, but he certainly didn't hate them.
>>1371768
That required a ton of money to even consider. Robert Carter III, whose grandfather was one of the wealthiest men in the colonies, is the only planter I can think of who emancipated his slaves without descending into crippling debt. He left his plantation for Baltimore and died not long after so I don't really know how it ultimately affected his finances, but I do know a number of his 12 kids were somewhat upset that they wouldn't be inheriting their great grandpa's fortune.
>>1371926
Wasn't owning a slave essentially like having a large car loan? They had mortgages attached to them, were securitized, etc. My impression is that it would be like being a trucking company and suddenly giving all your cars away when you have a loan for $35,000 each on each of your fleet of 50+ trucks. You wouldn't just have a lower standard of living, you would go bankrupt immediately and be living on the street.
>>1371610
>and Jefferson did free them in his will
no he didn't, he only freed his slave children. He gave the rest of his slaves to his white children. Jefferson may have been uncomfortable with slavery on a philosophical level but he was an ardent southerner and would've never put abolition above the interests of the south. He even became more apologetic towards slavery later in life condemning abolitionists and endorsing the spread of slavery into the southwest.
>>1372372
TJ was over $100,000 in debt when he died. IIRC Virginia passed laws after 1800 that obligated masters to provide for their slaves' ticket north / to Liberia if they freed them, which wouldn't have been feasible for someone in such massive debt.
>>1371271
Not even close, he was a true classical liberal and would be considered a "libertarian" today
>>1371569
Yeah he was a leftist little bitch and praised Jacobins and insulted Napoleon all day but when Napoleon offered him Louisiana he suddenly ignored the constitution and signed the deal without the authority he needed.
Idealistic but really his actions make him more right wing then you'd think.
>>1371593
>Leftist
>Resisted giving power to the federal government
Those things don't add up laddo
>>1372857
pre-marx left refers to libertarian ideology and right wing refers to traditionalist/monarchist.
>>1372857
Leave this board and never come back Ameritard
>>1372857
Right-wing back then meant High Tory, left-wing meant being against state church and being favor of republicanism and liberalism.
>>1372711
Classical liberalism was radically leftist
