What was worst? being part of the USSR(like the baltics) or being a "independent" country in the eastern block(like poland and bulgaria)
>>1323438
Latvia in 1938 had the 10th best economy in Europe, a few hundreds behinde Norway.
Latvia in 2016 is barely Greece and Portugal level and its economy is ruined and will never return back to its potential as one of the best in Europe.
This is the effect of a USSR "liberation"
>>1324077
That's not what this thread is meant to discuss.
>>1324077
>This is the effect of a USSR "liberation"
Or being lazy fucking bums for whole 25 years after the collapse of USSR.
>>1324110
It is though. Being forcibly made to be a part of the USSR was as you can see worse than being independant with a puppet government.
>>1324111
>imports 300k russians
>the offspring of those 300k russians now do nothing, but vote for a literal communist party who keeps drowning the capital and leeches off the government without even trying to integrate
Sure, please tell me about how we're lazy bums, when you know nothing about the country.
>>1324077
>10th best economy in Europe
>The EU is currently made up of 28 states.
You flew too close to the sun Latvia..
>>1324154
Shits just sad, we made stuff like bombers and so on and then the red plague came over the border.
>>1324157
Okay I'm sorry, I was being sarcastic but I'm now I'm actually surprised to see how many countries you were better than. Even ex-empires like Spain, Austria and Italy!
>>1324166
We couldve still had potention post USSR and we were rebuilding, but the EU closed all of our factories when we joined in 2004. We joined for better trade and fell into a trap. They even took our currency which was stronger than the dollar and euro without a referendum
>>1324174
Potential
>>1324111
A lot of the politicians that were in power during the final years of the USSR are still atleast marginaly in power today, their influence and lack of competent leadership during the last few years in general has led us to where we are.
Also they mayor of our capital is literaly a Kremlin puppet who publicly stated that Russia did nothing wrong in Ukraine.
>>1324157
So Lithuania was always shit?
>>1324174
Surely your govt did that not the EU? The EU doesn't have the power to do those things afaik. At least technically it doesn't, I mean.
>>1324194
Would you have kept an impossibly incompetitive factory open? We would have needed to subsidise them more and more to keep them afloat. They were a relic from a time when our small economy was a part of the huge USSR economy.
The problem imo is that there was no strategy to effectively replace them with anything.
>>1324183
Lithuania wasn't an independent sovereign state at the time.
>>1324200
Also this. Now we just export wood and wood products.
The biggest no from is that they took away our lats
>>1324111
>>1324174
> dindu nuffin
> NOT OUR FAULT!
> COLONIALISM HAS DESTROYED US
can't make this up
>>1324211
How was being neutral and trying to avoid the war our fault? The soviets broke the NAP not us
>>1324211
Do russian schools actualy teach people that the USSR never occupied the Baltics before Barbarossa and just occupied us as part of the liberation?
I've always wondered if there's any truth to this myth.
>>1324216
Yes. RF openly denies that there was a genocide, deportation and ocupation.
>>1324229
And if you couldve read the thread, youd understand that its not being "lazy bums"
>>1324234
It is not ME who derailed the thread with their asshurt blaming USSR, EU, Russians and Martians while going WE WUZ ECONOMY AND SHIET
>>1324229
As i said, the USSR and being part of a large economy for 50 years wrecked us, but our incompetent leadership has held us back from effectively recovering.
Our politicians had no long term plans except the one party that is expanding Russias influence.
We haven't had a competent president who isn't a dumb puppet since 2007
A Strategical regional development plan was developed only 3 or 4 years ago.
>>1324239
The OP asked what was worse being a part of ussr or having a puppet commie gov. I didnt derail anything, i explain how being a part was worse
kys
>>1324246
Also a lot of the rich people and politicians in power gained their wealth through shady and illegal means in the 90's when it was the wild wild west here.
And the cheka bags are still closed so we aren't sure who was a soviet collaborator to this day, that's how powerful the old guys are.
>>1324254
so you are literally angry because your corrupt leaders didn't allow you to hang collaborators by their guts on streets?
is that REALLY your unironical response to "what were you doing all these 25 years BESIDES blaming others?"
>>1324260
No, it's not about hanging, it's about not trusting opportunists who only enter politics to further their personal wealth and power.
And i'm not talking about bribe taking and being a bit corrupt, it's being an incompetent asshole who doesn't care about his countrys future.
And i'm not trying to imply they're all Russian - in fact most of the incompetent and toxic people are Latvian opportunists.
A lot of the post-soviet countries are shit now because they don't have the financial backing of the soviets anymore.
Hell, Cuba was pretty nice too when the Soviets were pumping a shitton of money into it.
>>1324276
>A lot of the post-soviet countries are shit now because they don't have the financial backing of the soviets anymore.
Delusion
>>1324283
>our source of money for the last 40 years is gone
>"what, what do you mean we gotta make the money ourselves? We never learned how to do that"
Yeah that totally wouldn't lead to shitty economic practices
>>1324286
Youre talking like the soviets plan wasnt to make the puppet states economically dependant on them in the first place.
>>1324276
there is a meme notion among modern Russians is that post-soviet countries got it too easy because after the collapse Russia alone has become the inheritor of USSR's international debt
>>1324292
how much did the USSR spend on nonrussia bloc infrastructure
>>1324260
>Sucking Russian cock this hard
Latvians are based and their country was pretty sweet before the red army raped everything east of the Spree
It takes a long time to rebuild and it's even harder when the generation in charge are largely cucks to a foreign nation
>>1324327
thanks buddy
>>1324326
depending on state of the republic in question
if it is some backwards central asian republic which was pulled from literal feudalism into somewhat civilised society -- basically everything starting literally from building cities
it it's a more developed country like Latvia here -- some factory here and there
tehcnically USSR should have been making "russia"/"non-russian" distinction that with the whole "everyone should be equal" maxim
however some republic got preferential treatment, like caucasian due a huge historical representation at the upper echelon of party
>>1324360
>should
* should NOT
>>1323438
From what heard from parents and others, people in USSR had it worse than satellite countries. Even visiting relatives in Soviet Union was biurocratic nightmare.
USSR: inner passport needed to visit relatives next town
Hungary: can travel to commie country once a year, Western country once every 4 years
choose
>>1323438
Being a soviet republic. Bulgaria and Poland weren't flooded by russian immigrants
>>1324229
Estonia has recovered really well. You clearly know nothing about the baltics beyond the memes
>>1324522
Well i don't see Estonians going "we dindu nuffin, not our fault" so i guess YOU did good
>>1324540
Then that evidence is even more damning if anything
i am not comparing them directly it's just arguments used here reminded me of Eddy's weak-ass defense
>>1324552
How exactly is the evidence even more damning?
If anything it just shows you a big influx of Russians damage the economy and your chances of building it up.
>>1324533
You don't know much about Estonia either
>>1324556
yes, my friend
It's totally ebil russians who destroyed your will to rebuild and poisoned your wells.
Them and collaborators.
All them devils.
[spoiler]listen to yourself[/spoiler]
>>1324561
Tell me then, how is that chart just more damning if anything?
>>1324561
It has only been 25 years.
25 years in which we had to turn our soviet dependent economy into a seperate one.
Can you please provide examples economies of a similair size which have done much better than Latvia in this time period?
Are you denying the detrimental influence that the USSR had on Latvia both economicaly and socialy?
>>1323438
Depends which Republic and which Warsaw Pact state. Belarus and the Baltics were better places to live than the rest of the USSR, and East Germany was better than the rest of the Pact.
>>1324595
You mean like every single former Soviet country, barring the Ukraine and Moldova, has managed to do? Some even better?
>this poor retarded soviet shill
>>1324339
Anytime bro. I even like Russian culture and history but I can't stand this kind of short sighted view point on history's worst abomination (the USSR)
>>1324619
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14489883 try this info bro
>>1324750
So, added about sixty percent to their economy. Belarus has done better.
Plus, a lot of this data is outdated desu.
worst part of the cold war without a doubt was being part of one of the sponsored dictatorships in africa or asia, independent of which side sponsored it
Like, i know people there still blame communism for why Poland is still shit, but seriously, just as an example look what the USSR did in 27 years, it went from a feudalistic, poverty ridden & war torn country that's people had been subject so social and economic divide for millenia to the most powerful country in the world with vast agricultural and industrial capability that was battling off a much more technically advanced enemy to retake half of Europe.
Like, surely if communism could do that in such a short period of time, the much better system of capitalism could have easily made things twice as good in these 27 years post communism?
You could go to a government owned shoe repair business or just see a guy who repairs shoes.
At least in commnunist poland private enterprise was never banned and you were free to do it - the government shat on these in a major way with taxes and legislation but there were private self made millionaires in Poland in the seventies already - the state tolerated them and they were maintaining low key profiles.
Also one other thing - organized crime disappears under communism due to the massive infiltration apparatus the state maintains. It was safer on the streets back then than it is now.
>>1325128
>this is what commieshits believe
>>1324608
it was amazing and only mentioned the good things about it. They were telling me that everyone had to work and those who wouldn't, they would be forced. The pay was shit, but they didn't mind it since they lived happily.
Funny thing is that Lithuania, like other Baltic countries, was the most richest country in the USSR.
>her grandmother obv lived most of her life in USSR
>says "everything was better in USSR
>streets were safe at night
>everyone got an education
>everyone had a job
>everyone got healthcare
>says she misses USSR and everything's shit now
>>1325128
Hmm one does it by murdering lots of people though
>>1325128
Nigga, Russia had all the people and resources that needed to be rearanged to work, the smaller countries however couldn't "just make it work" because the resources they used to get from the rest of the USSR just weren't there anymore. They had to make it as new players in the western markets and shift the focus of their whole economy in a very big way.
I think it was probably worse being in one of the satellites; given that they were puppets of a foreign power, they probably required more surveillance and coercion than the Soviet metropole. For instance, based on what I've read, East Germany was a paranoid police state where one in four people were informers for the government. The further removed the satellite states were from central Soviet authority, the more mointo ring was necessary to prevent a revolt.
