It spread all the way to Indonesia and had a big influence there, and obvs there were many people who converted, but why is India still majority Hindu?
>>1308882
I remember reading a book about a dude who traveled to different muslim countries including Indonesia. I don't remember the name but I could check it. But long story short: Islam in south east asia is relatively young and it grew stronger thanks to external threats and occupation. Islam was held as a tool of cultural resistance against europeans.
You can understand perfectly why in India this couldn't happen, with the muslims being invaders themselves.
Mughals eventually went DUDE SYNCRETISM LMAO. Although it's an understatement that it didn't take off. One in six Indians is a Muslim
>>1308882
Islam has hundreds of millions of followers in the subcontinent, so I don't think you can say it didn't take off. The question why India isn't completely Muslim has to do with the organized nature of Indian Hinduism/Sikhism that developed parallel with the arrival and establishment of Indian Islam, thereby compartmentalizing these religions along ethnic and class lines. Islam became the religion of some tribes, Hinduism the religion of others, and they diverged from there. In the north Islam centered around the Turkish aristocracy. In the east Islam became the culture of the Bengal tribes of the delta. In the south Islam became the religion of merchant colonies from Arabia and Africa, and in the west Islam became the religion of several Pashtun, Sindh and Punjab tribes.
>>1308882
Most muslims live in the Kashmir, Bengal and Pakistan area. Even after the split, like 10% of India's population is muslim, which says a lot. Muslims had a lot to ground to cover when it comes to converting everybody, so they did pretty well considering.
>>1309027
They had several centuries more to convert those other areas. Also Timur massacred a lot of christians.
>>1309027
India was more like several different countries than the one (or two) enormous bloc today. You could say then that the majority of one province or region converted, like in Pakistan, while they didn't elsewhere. What happened in Persia and Anatolia was that the native aristocracy aligned themselves culturally with the incoming Muslims, became Muslims, then defined what it was to be Muslim, then finally diffused this culture to the masses, their own people who did the same (in the cities at least). This doesn't seem to have happened with India because of the Mughals whose self-image of their dynasty revolved around being a leader of invading warriors, meaning the native Indian Muslim population already there were also subjects and outsiders like the Hindus themselves, though to a lesser degree of course.
>>1308882
I think the more interesting question is why Christianity didn't.
>>1309054
Thanks.
>>1309072
An Indian convert to Islam could reasonably expect to enter Muslim society, whether as an administrator or as a merchant like them. But an Indian hoping to convert to Protestantism couldn't expect to be accepted by British society. Catholicism had more success I believe.
>>1309072
The only christian rulers that stretched such a large area were the British. And their rule only lasted a century and some. They couldn't convert that many people in such little time. Portugal converted a lot of Indians but Goa wasn't that big. Islam's presence on the subcontinent has been on a much larger scale and more pro-longed, practically since Islam's conception. Also what >>1309092
said.
>>1309278
India has an older history in India than Islam though.
>>1308882
Probably something to do with the muslim conquest of India
Because its very difficult to convert a hindu ibto something else. How complex need the answer be?
>>1309278
>Portugal converted a lot of Indians but Goa wasn't that big
It took them +400 years to get 20% of the population forcefully converted after much struggling. That is pretty much a failure considering how zealous the Portuguese were.
Way too much density to establish itself typically.
>>1309379
I'm trying to find all reasons.
Is Hindus not converting to other religions easily actually a thing? If so, does anyone know why?
>>1309391
Not particularly, its just compared to Mesopotamia, Persia, and Afghanistan, converting India was a lot harder. Do you really think some christian/Muslim/Buddhist conqueror could have converted all of China? No? Then why do you think they could convert all of India?
>>1309391
I would argue that hinduism is just more fulfilling on average. It also has an enormous variety in approaches and doctrines, from puranic folk tales to the vedas, mahabharata, devotional work, 50 flavors of tantra, and otherwise non-theistic representations of ones self as if the deities were tattoos or hogwarts schools.
Most conversions in history have occured for populations that were spiritually homogenous.
>>1308882
have you never heard of pakistan or bangladesh?
>>1309300
I meant christianity has an older history.
>>1308882
>India has lots of Muslims, concentrated in certain areas
>Indian Muslims split off into their own country from those areas
>why isn't India majority muslim
???
>>1309419
This seems like the most accurate answer.
Hinduism can appeal to everyone from illiterate rice farmers to hipster Westerners.
I honestly believe that Eastern religions and ideologies will easily outlast Abrahamic ones due to their more adaptable and spiritual approach that is vastly more adaptable to modern society.
Following the non-defined, self-discovery path of Dharma makes a fuckton more sense than following a rigid set of stone-age morals whose views on many topics such as sexuality are already throughly rejected by contemporary society.
>>1309391
>Is Hindus not converting to other religions easily actually a thing? If so, does anyone know why?
Its because of tradition, family and its roots in the places where islam came with sword and fire.
Plus a lot of muslims did was considered distasteful by the Hindus along with the sheer numbers of peoples, tribes, villages, towns and cities were just way too much, muslims had to frequently install hindu rulers and governors in captured and capitulated cities, the local economy and professions were all populated by hindus and the muslims learned more from hindus in the forms of art, civilization and urbanization, intermarriage between muslim men and hindu women cause their offspring to understand both cultures and create a syncretism which allowed Hinduism to remain and flourish with a superstrate formed under muslim domination, which eventually eroded due to constant wars against the Hindu warlords who frequently betrayed, raided and attacked the position of muslims, e.g Rajputs, Marathas, Ahoms etc,
Also it was not easy for the muslim clerics to disprove the hindu faith as it was so fucking vast and ever changing according to region that mostly sword and fire was sometimes the only option, this bred rebel movements which further undermined islamic rule and conversions.
>>1309442
All those long time Christians in India migrated there. Some muslims migrated to India but a lot of muslim conquerors have hit India. The Arabs, Persians, Afghans, Turkics(Uzbeks)
>>1309449
Even if we add Pakistan and Bangladesh the Subcontinent doesn't have a muslim majority though.
>>1309473
Islam traveled through the north of the subcontinent with the Mughal Empire and preceding invasions. While India may have hypothetically become a majority Muslim country, with the empires decline, the Raj and now hostile Islamic countries as neighbors following the partition, the opportunity has most likely been lost.
>>1309456
Maybe Buddhism, but Hinduism has hardly lasted outside of the subcontinent. If all the surrounding Muslim armies created a coalition converted the ENTIRE subcontinent.
>>1308882
you do realize 50%+ of ethnic indian/indic groups have been converted to islam right?
>>1308882
it took off in india big time and still represents a major minority religion. but also keep in mind that many muslims left to other neighboring countries in the aftermath of Britain's exit from South Asia.
>>1309485
>If all the surrounding Muslim armies created a coalition
The only great wars that are going to happen are Muslims killing other Muslims, like they have been doing since 7th century.
400,000 dead alone in Syrian Civil War between different Snackbar groups with little ideological differences. If nuclear proliferation spreads like I predict it will in the later half of the century, then that number would easily rise to millions. Muslims would rather destroy themselves than bandy together.
>>1309385
The Portuguese brought the inquisition to Indian Christians as well, since a lot of them adopted syncretic views like the Muslims.
>>1309485
hinduism isn't a religion of thought and is largely ethnocentric with many sects basically being private if not secretive. being a hindu is predicated on many things otherwise if you do not follow or are born into some dharma
>>1309507
I mean back then. I agree with you.
>>1309507
>Muslims would rather destroy themselves than bandy together.
“So before I was nine I had learned the basic canon of Arab life. It was me against my brother; me and my brother against our father; my family against my cousins and the clan; the clan against the tribe; and the tribe against the world. And all of us against the infidel.” (The Haj, p. 15)
They are mentally retarded as a religious group.
>>1309512
Clarification, it's a religion of thought exclusively for a select caste of people.
Imo if the Muslims went after the Brahmanical castes first they could have established control over the rest of the population's religious beliefs.
>>1309525
>Imo if the Muslims went after the Brahmanical castes first they could have established control over the rest of the population's religious beliefs.
Would have never worked as they considered the Muslims as Mleccha and unclean, and according to some of the folktales the muslims were bad to brahmins and the brahmins were worse to muslims.
>>1309531
t. pajeet
muslims literally taught you shitskins how to clean yourselves with water lmao
>>1309525
Brahmins weren't the rulers of India, they weren't the political elite or kings.
They were literally the Priest-class.
>>1309525
Saying that brahmins follow a religion of thought is also to say that you can just become a brahmin willy nilly by taking an oath like saying "allah akbar" or "jesus is my lord and savior" which is laughably absurd. Of course, plenty of corrupt "brahmins" have attempted to convince people of this in the past.
Hindu temples just aren't franchises, they're homes for brahmin families. You have to be born into it.
>>1309518
Arab=Muslim
Don't do that anon.
>>1309538
>t. pajeet
>muslims literally taught you shitskins how to clean yourselves with water lmao
Uh huh, sure. Whatever you need to tell yourself.
>>1309557
The attitude and culture is the same.
>>1309518
>They are mentally retarded as a religious group
Islam doesn't really have a future.
It either thrives by leeching off of successful secular societies, such as the UK. Or it devolves into religious infighting with different groups pushing their interpretation of 7th century barbarism. The most successful 'Islamic Societies' are ironically the least Islamic ones.
>>1309561
It's not unless you reduce and dissolve the meaning of the quote to the point where it can be applied to virtually everyone hindus included and becomes meaningless.
>>1309538
Uh k. Someone remind me how Bangladesh and Pakistan are doing?
>>1309574
they're muslim indians, still filth but at least they don't shit on the streets or drink cow piss
only good from india are the parsis and sikhs
>>1309565
You are probably right, but my personal views and what I say on here are mostly different things. I just hate online so I can love IRL.
>>1308882
Why were (are?) indian muslims so massive persiaboos?
>>1309599
I understand to some degree, but please go to /int/ for that like everyone. Get a proxy if they bully you with loo jokes.
>>1308910
Indonesia was Islamic before the Europeans came.
>forgetting about points in South Asian History where the subcontinent was ruled by Muslim dynasties
Please consult a history book or website before posting. Even Wikipedia will do.
>>1309602
High Islamic culture was always associated with Persian culture
>>1309625
Is that why Arabs are so constantly ass-pained by Iran?
>>1309617
Learn to read.
>>1308882
What is Pakistan and Bangladesh ?
>>1309636
Iran is basically the France of the middle east.
>>1309653
They don't surrender though.
Ayyrabs are the surrender-monkeys of ME. Qatar has already pulled troops from Yemen because they can't beat the Houthis when their troops turn and run every time they hear them coming.
>>1309612
The first time I learned Muslims and Hindus fight is from Slum Dog Millionaire, and I'm South Asian.
Seriously, I'm from Guyana, and generally speaking the Hindus, Muslims and Christians have always gotten along, some of my family members are even or were Hindus.
Maybe because their main adversary are the Afros kek
>>1308882
probably bcuz the indians dont like people with dark skin
>>1309771
All they do is sell drugs to foreigners.
No other group receives such vitriol. It is well-deserved, and even the Nigerians themselves passively admit it.
>>1309680
Neither does France outside memes t.b.h. it was the archetypical brave soldier nation of Europe before WW2.
>>1309799
France was the global bitchboy post-WW2 getting ayylmaoed in every continent by every race.
Never has an empire's decline been so cringe-worthy. Their memes are well-deserved.
>>1309812
Nah, they're second to Portugal, every colony they had left they lost in a one sided battle.
>>1309507
>>1309518
>>1309561
>"Lol muslims are so stupid and violent dude, it definitely has nothing to do with the fact that our countries gave the Holy Sites (along with billions of dollars annually and assured military protection) to the family who made a pact with ibn fucking Wahhabi."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_bin_Saud#Alliance_with_Muhammad_bin_Abdul-Wahhab
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman%E2%80%93Wahhabi_War
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unification_of_Saudi_Arabia#During_World_War_I
>>1309680
>They don't surrender though.
>what is anglo-russian invasion
>what is iranian coup of 1951
>>1309788
Indians grabbed two black women stripped them and forced them to take medical test because they thought they were prostitutes. One time in a zoo a black person was walking in a zoo when suddenly the speakers started to talk about an African being in the zoo.
Being African or black in India is fucked up because Indians project their insecurities hard in them.
>>1309834
>what is iranian coup of 1951
Iranians surrendering against other Iranians. WHOAHHHH.
>what is anglo-russian invasion
Surrendering against overwhelming forces who only want to buy your oil? WHOOOOAHHH.
People laugh at France, because fucking Poland lasted longer against the Nazis than French-''''''men'''''', this is despite having a roughly similar sized force, technology parity, and being forewarned of the attack. French will always be surrender-monkeys.
>>1309852
>Indians grabbed two black women stripped them and forced them to take medical test because they thought they were prostitutes
This sounds like Africans bringing aids into the country.
>One time in a zoo a black person was walking in a zoo when suddenly the speakers started to talk about an African being in the zoo.
Mean but funny.
Africans have done vastly worse things to themselves, other tribes, and other races. Africa is an extremely racist place. If you're white, you should try visiting places like Zimbabwe or Mozambique. They would probably outright lynch you.
were mughals descendants really nomadic tribes or mongols who married into arabs or indians?
i ask because sometimes in protrait they look like mongols and in others they look arab
>>1309872
Those women weren't prostitutes and yoy last semester makes no sense because I'm talking about how shit India is to any foreigner or woman.
>>1309881
They were an Uzbek/Tamerlane army so technically. They probably looked like Mongols/Uzbek-is
>>1309893
thanks
>>1309889
Indians love whites and especially white women though
>>1309889
Goa and New Delhi are packed with millions of foreigners and woman every year.
You can't say the same about any Sub-Saharan African country, especially Nigeria, due to the widespread racism and security concerns. Africans are Xenophobic as fuck, they make Japan look like a Liberal open-borders country. It amuses me that they would accuse any other country of racism.
Are Dravidians a spiritually broken race? Is this brokenness unfixable?
>>1309771
They literally worship a god called black skin. Krishna....
>>1309985
Who do you define as the 'Dravidians'?
The space-center, financial center, primary ports, primary industrial corridors, etc. are all based in South India.
The 'spiritually broken race' as the mutts in Pakistan who are eternally butthurt that they are incapable of conquering India or defeating the 'evil yindoos'. All they have left is terrorists and civilians getting killed by US murder drones, which they are powerless to stop.
>>1309994
blacks are more kallu, not kalo. also krishna was deemed dark like bottle green. shiva/kali etc. are black like cars are black
>>1309599
that's a great map, you racist poo-stepper
I just wish it didn't use a fucking globe projection or whatever
>>1310083
>blacks are more kallu, not kalo
Blacks are more stone but not leg? What the fuck language are you speaking? Hindi? Marathi? Bihari?
Dilliwalle peg mar chodainge?
>>1309998
>eating b8
But seriously the people who really care most about Dravidian identity are Tamils. The other 3 regions don't really give af from what I've seen.
