Was Dunkirk considered a victory or a defeat for the Brits?
This question came up in a /tv/ thread because of the upcoming Nolan movie.
>retreat
>lose ground
>victory
What do you think?
>>1203325
To be fair, it was a nice propaganda victory for the Eternal Anglo, but over all it was only 300,000 men.
Soviets lost 500,000 at Smolensk pocket for example and they still won.
>>1203325
Dunkirk was a massive defeat and retreat. It was only glorified for propaganda as the British 'cut their losses'.
>>1203325
Defeat, obviously. But it could have been worse, I suppose. Brits were masters of propaganda in those days.
>>1203363
>implying even Russians cared Russian lives.
>>1203325
To lessen a defeat through skill is an achievement.
>>1203325
Thanks for the replies.
The /tv thread was split between a military defeat and "he who fights and runs away..." responses.
But that board is full of retards so I thought I'd ask the board that actually might know what they're talking about.
Nolan could have an animation of a series of arrows emblazoned with swastikas moving across a map of northern Europe pushing back a series of Union Flag-patterned arrows, to the point were the latter are driven to the Channel and over, at which point the British arrows continue to harry their opponents, who are reduced to nipping back at them, each in turn. The sequence could have a memorable song playing over the top.
>>1203325
It was a defeat. The "victory" was that it was as orderly a retreat and withdrawal as they could manage. The worst outcome would have been having the entire force surrounded and killed or captured like the Germans were at Stalingrad.
>>1203462
Yummy yummy yummy I've got love in my tummy.
>>1203325
Massive defeat but it while it was a military victory for Germany it was a massive military blunder and strategic defeat for Germany as they could have knocked England out of the war.
Hitler believe it was a showing of good will to the British as he wanted peace and an alliance against communism. However, Churchill was a classic british guy and wanted a balance of power in Europe and Germany was too close to hegemony. Also, his career lived or died by success in the war so 'losing' by peacing out after Dunkirk would have made him as a big a pussy as chamberlain in the public's eye.
The British didn't really win WWII though. The empire was dismantled and they have been a minor power in Europe ever since.
The USSR and the US came out huge.
Dunkirk - humiliation on a grand scale. The French soldiers at least had a good reason for being there, betrayed by the French officer class who should all have been executed with the liberation of France.
The Brits had no such excuse. Defeated by a numerically far inferior Wehrmacht.
But nothing could be as bad as
kesserine pass,Three times the American marines turned and ran from the Africa Korp who were short of ammo. The Germans were calling across - was ist das sheiss Tommy. Eventually the Brits and Commonwealth troops had to put machine guns before the Americans to stop them from running a fourth time.
>>1203479
>kesserine pass,Three times the American marines turned and ran from the Africa Korp who were short of ammo. The Germans were calling across - was ist das sheiss Tommy. Eventually the Brits and Commonwealth troops had to put machine guns before the Americans to stop them from running a fourth time.
8/10 you'll get a lot of bites with this.
>>1203565
Hopefully people will stop at
>numerically far inferior Wehrmacht.
The greatest tactical retreat since George Washington
>>1203325
Who the fuck says it was victory
>>1203479
>Defeated by a numerically far inferior Wehrmacht.
Tell me about Gerd von Rundstedt. Why does he wear the cross?
>>1203325
Dunkirk itself was a victory, but the British have lost the battle for France.
>>1203363
If those men were lost, Britain would be totally fucked.
>>1204519
France lost the battle of France, because their leaders were retarded.
Crushing defeat spun into a feel-good victory by the eternal Anglo propaganda apparatus
This is like asking if Vietnam was a victory or defeat for the US
>>1203325
It was a defeat but the Anglos used their deceptive Jew powers to say that it was a victory.
The French were the real heroes of Dunkirk
>>1204190
The OP on the /tv thread was speculating it would be a revisionist history movie.
>>1203325
Tactical loss, strategic victory.
>>1203478
WWII was a hollow victory for the British. On paper they won but their economy was trashed and the remainder of the Empire was disbanded except for Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and some shitty islands that are now independent and just print the queen on their money. They lost almost all of their world prestige and weren't able yo financially support their allies in Europe as they always had historically. Fortunately the US stepped in with the Marshal plan to take their spot.
Given all that I wouldn't call them a "minor power" they still spend the second most on military(behind France but not by much) and have the 3rd largest population(once again, behind France but not by much) with Germany in first in the EU but with a very old population. I think they're a regional power, nothing major but they aren't exactly as weak as many people think.
>>1203325
Hitler just let them run away bacause he was hoping for peace treaty with GB.
>>1203478
It wasn't a show of good will on Hitler's part, his panzer divisions needed time to rest, refit and refuel. His tanks were running low on both fuel and ammunition and the crews were exhausted. They'd outrun their infantry too and the counterattack at Arras (although it was a failure for the British and French) was enough to make some German commanders hesitant to press the attack for fear of their flanks being exposed.
Also in answer to OP's question it was a defeat but it could've been much much worse. I'm British and I've never been taught that it was a victory. British propaganda had a field day with the story of the 'little boats' but you can't hide a defeat like that.
>>1206778
>luftwaffe
