Were there ANY actual female warriors?
Let's take a look at the most common feminist power fantasies
Joan of d'arc - armored cheerleader
celtic women - every time they led armies they got BTFO
shield maidens - it's true that they were mentioned in the sagas BUT women were fucking forbidden from owning weapons and going on raids in norse society they are on the same tier as amazons and speking of which
amazons - didn't exist
Boudica - another celt bitch who did fuck all
>>1195875
I've been told teh Amazons were based on Scythian warrior women. Is it truth or was it a meme?
>>1195875
>Joan of d'arc - armored cheerleader
You know how I can tell your British?
>>1195875
Scythians.
>>1195883
The fact he spelt armoured like an American?
>>1195883
>You know how I can tell your British
You know how I can tell you're an idiot?
>>1195902
>You know how I can tell you're an idiot?
You know how I can tell you're a cuck?
>>1195875
Onna bushi.
>>1195883
Found the french cuck lmao
>held the banner
>that's it
women couldn't own weapons in France so the paintings with her bravely fighting in the front line are as real as the ones showing giants and dragons she was a bitch, cunt, whore and a delusional mentally ill slut
fuck you
>>1195875
I can't provide you with any examples, but if you're interested in that topic you might want to read up on David Adams' article "Why There Are So Few Women Warriors." You can find it online, here's the summary:
>Cross-cultural methodology suggests that women are excluded from warfare not so much because of sex differences in aggressiveness or strength, but instead because of a contradiction arising from marital residency systems that arose, in turn, as a function of warfare. Under conditions of internal warfare war against neighboring communities sharing the same language) many stateless cultures may have adopted patrilocal exogamous marital residency (the bride comes from a different community and comes to live with the family of the husband). Under these conditions the wife is faced with contradictory loyalties during warfare, because her husband may go to war against her brothers and father. It appears that women have been excluded historically from warfare in order to resolve this contradiction and protect the security of the warrior husbands. This explanation is supported by other findings that women do fight as warriors in certain cultures in which warfare or marital residency rules are structured in such a way that the contradiction does not arise.
So if you want to look for female warriors, you need to look up societies without patrilocal exogamous marital residency.
>>1195875
amazons do exist, but they're short squat ugly little hispanics who deliver their boy infants to neighboring tribes to raise
>>1195875
>Were there
There are now. Why so mad?
>>1195877
We have found scythian women buried with weapons. It doesn't prove anything, we also have also babies and children buried with weapons and they clearly did not fight. It's a symbol of status.
But people likes to believe greek memes.
>>1195937
>There are now.
They just happen to not serve in combat duty.
>>1195891
>>1195877
Not Scythians, Sarmatians. Herodotus and a few other greek historians describe their way of life and society with detail. Apparently women fought together with the men, and could only retire from fighting when they got married, which could only happen after they killed their third men.
Recent burial findings later proved the greek accounts to be atleast somewhat truthful, with atleast a few noblewomen being found with battle wounds/scars
Another occurence of historical warrior women are the Onna Bugeisha of japan, which we do have good documentation of since they happened to exist well into the 1800s
There are a few women who have pretended to be men and then were found out, but you're asking about female warrior societies or something?
>>1195947
Sure they do. Those Kurdish women are btfo ISIS, for example.
What is even the point of this question? Of course the answer to "were there any [in all human history]" is going to be yes.
>>1195947
But some do.
>>1195954
Thanks for clearing that up.
>>1195919
>This explanation is supported by other findings that women do fight as warriors in certain cultures in which warfare or marital residency rules are structured in such a way that the contradiction does not arise.
And man fight in those societies despite the conflicting loyalties?
>So if you want to look for female warriors, you need to look up societies without patrilocal exogamous marital residency.
Any example with both things? Genuine curiosity.
>>1195934
Amazonians are indian not hispanic.
>>1195875
>What happened to girl power? Australia's national women's soccer team the Matildas lose 7-0 to an under FIFTEENS boys' side
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3609949/Matildas-lose-7-0-Newcastle-Jets-15s-Rio-Olympics-warm-up.html
There never were female warriors because women are physically inferior to men.
>>1195954
Several greek authors consider the sarmatians to be part of the scythians.
>>1195980
Several greek authors were fucking little boys and thought there are gods living on the mountain. Greeks were a meme.
>>1195915
>women couldn't own weapons in France
Citation needed.
>>1195875
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ActionGirl/RealLife
>>1195947
Lyudmila pavlinchenko
>>1195980
Not quite, they were related but had different languages and customs. The sarmatians in fact were the ones who displaced the earlier scythians.
Not common throughout history. Female bodies are just inconvenient for warfare, and i'm fairly sure that societies that used female warriors didn't use them because they were practical but for other reasons such as religion etc.
>>1195982
True but precisely because of this "scythians" was a meme term and vague enough to englobe the sarmatians.
Boudica lmfao,
Why oh why did the Celt men follow her
>>1195996
Yeah with the Sarmatians, it was really more of a cultural/religious custom than anything.
>>1195985
General/Leader =/= Soldier, warrior
>>1195968
>And man fight in those societies despite the conflicting loyalties?
Why would you care about your mother/father in law?
Lol, retard.
>>1196000
Celt ''men'' were cucks. Literal cucks.
>>1196003
You did read the list, right? It's made up of plenty of women who weren't leaders.
>>1196006
Why would the women?
>>1195996
Not really. I can't think of many religions that endorse females doing anything other than the norm. Most warrior women came from societies that could afford to have them.
>>1195996
This is true. The Aztecs for example only used a particular group of women who were companions to warriors. They were kind of prostitutes and participated in state ceremonies. And other than that they fought only in times of desperation during a siege. Theres a humorous story of the Aztec attack on Tlatelolco. The women of Tlatelolco defended themselves by getting naked and squirting breast milk at the Aztec warriors.
>>1196009
Seutonis only has two legions! We can take him!
Oh fugggg run
>>1196010
Yeah, but with several that were solely leaders of a country/generals.
>>1195968
I don't know from the top of my head, but it's in the article. It gives examples for sure. As far as I remember the problem doesn't arise for men in the same way as it does for women for structural reasons.
However it's important to note that women don't replace men as warriors in those societies.
Also the theory the article brings up is supported by current trends in western society. Patrilocality and internal warfare are not a thing here anymore and what happens? More and more female soldiers.
So that alone should blow OP out, but I'm assuming he was looking for reasons why there shouldn't be female warriors in the first place.
>>1195975
>there's a difference
>>1195915
>She declared that, on her departure from Vaucouleurs, she wore the habit of a man, and carried a sword which Robert de Baudricourt had given her, but no other arms; and accompanied by a knight, a squire, and four servants, she reached the town of Saint Urbain, where she slept in an abbey.
>She said she had a sword which she took to the town of Vaucouleurs. She added that when she was at Tours or Chinon she sent for a sword which was in the church of Ste. Catherine de Fierbois, behind the altar; and immediately it was found there all rusted over.
>Asked how she knew that this sword was there, she answered that the sword was in the ground, rusted over, and upon it were five crosses; and she knew it was there through her voices, and she had never seen the man who fetched it.
>Asked what blessing she said or asked over the sword, she answered that she neither blessed it herself, nor had it blessed; she would not have known how to do it. She loved the sword, she said, since it had been found in the church of St. Catherine, whom she loved.
>Asked if she had her sword when she was taken, she answered no; but she had one which had been taken from a Burgundian.
>Asked where this sword was, and in what town, she answered that she offered a sword and armor at St. Denis, but not this sword. She said she had this sword at Lagny; and from Lagny to Compiègne she had worn the Burgundian's sword, which was a good weapon for fighting, excellent for giving hard clouts and buffets (in French "de bonnes buffes et de bons torchons"). But she said that to say where she had lost it did not concern the case, and she would not answer now. She added that her brothers have her goods, her horses and swords, as far as she knows, and other things worth more than 12,000 crowns.
>women couldn't own weapons in France
>>1195977
>There never were female warriors because women are physically inferior to men.
>There were never female warriors
Your whole point falls apart there.
Uncommon as they were, this is false. Women in general have a different physicality from men, but that didn't stop dedicated women from soldiering where they were able to.
>>1195875
>implying Joan wasn't a brilliant leader and artillery specialist
>implying she didn't fuck half of europe with her cannons
/r9k/ pls go
>>1196052
Retarded fucking french propaganda written by a bunch of surrender monkeys
>we wuz female warriors and shiet
they wuz whores and sucked fat british cock on daily basis that's a fact
lol misogynists
>>1195875
>Joan of d'arc - armored cheerleader
butthurt frogs inbound
>>1195954
Wow a post that actually isn't full of shit. Well done.
Also
>hur they didn't do shit
Just because they got BTFO by powers greater than themselves doesn't mean they didn't exist. You can argue the extent of how much fighting Boudica actually did but she did exist and she did lead a rebellion.
>>1196080
hoped she fucked a lot of men as well. but she's a lesbian ain't she. most of the cool women in history are.
>>1196083
>transcripts of her trial
>French propaganda
>>1195875
Women naturally dislike risk and danger because of their reproductive role
Whatever odd historical exceptions there may be, a normal healthy minded female will seek to avoid combat
>>1195883
He said Joan of D'arc. Only a yanktard speaks like that, frogtard
>>1195875
Several people have already brought it up, but Female warriors were not uncommon in Kamakura japan. They became more infrequent as war spread into the warring states, and even more so as the Tokugawa imposed a Neo-Confucian social hierarchy.
>Joan of Arc - Armored Cheerleader
She led the troops into battle and suffered injuries. That is not a "cheerleader".
Gráinne O'Malley was a successful clan and pirate leader, she was able to meet to meet the queen and strike a deal.
>>1196206
Ching Shih was a successful Chinese pirate leader who managed to get full amnesty, retire with her treasure, and open a gambling house.
>>1196163
This is wrong.
>>1196230
Not him but it actually isn't.
Testosterone makes humans more brash, risk-taking traits that an "ambitious" person would have, valuing high risk-reward situations.
This is also the reason why when men become fathers their testosterone production lowers
On a more recent note
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_Witches
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyudmila_Pavlichenko
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dahomey_Amazons
>>1196251
Yeah it is. Sociobiology and biological determinism was BTFO over 40 years ago for exactly that reason. You can't explain social phenomena away with
>muh genetics.
Correlation doesn't equal causalization.
>>1196228
She was also a Zheng. A prominent Fujian-based Pirate Clan. She took over her Husband's operations when she croaked, hence her popular nickname (Ching Shih => Zheng I-Sao => "Widow of Zheng.")
Most famous family member being Zheng Cheng'gong, Alias "Koxinga." who fought the Manchus ferociously and BTFO the Dutch in Taiwan.
>>1196080
Eh. She was a good leader but you need to admit that she is propped up by the fact that she is a woman. I've had this discussion too many times on /his/ but:
>Siege of Orleans
French victory, the French outnumbered the English 2:1
>Battle of Jargeau
3000 v 5000, French Victory
>Battle of Meung-sur-Loire
French victory, French had more soldiers than the English
>Battle of Beaugency
French victory
>Battle of Patay
French victory that has been credited to Joan of Arch even though she arrived late and did not play a part in the actual victory.
>Siege of Paris
French failure. French had 10 000, the English 3000
She won most of her battles, but none of her victories were particularly impressive. She almost always outnumbered or equaled to her enemies.
>>1196279
But it's not genetics, it's hormones. You're retarded if you think that hormones don't affect the way we think and act.
>>1196281
Wish I could find a book on the subject, Chinese pirates. It's hard enough to find anything that isn't romanticized to all hell, let alone piracy in the pacific.
>>1196186
Menstruation is not an injury.
>>1195875
>shield maidens
Yes they existed, but only for defensive purposes. When the men were off for years at a time raiding distant shores, the women would be left alone and needed to be able to defend their homes and children. They never went on raids and they weren't real warriors, just militia.
Comparing them to the Vikings is like comparing pic related to the Marines.
>>1196315
She sustained an arrow to the breast in the battle of Orleans, and continued fighting.
Later, in the unsuccessful attack on Paris, she suffered a serious arrow wound to the thigh.
>>1196279
I can go on google right now and find literally 100s of contemporary articles and studies on the psychological differences between men and women.
>>1196261
Whenever I read anything about Lyudmila Pavlichenko, I get this feeling of that Navy SEAL copypasta.
>I have over 300 confirmed kills kiddo
Same thing with the finnish guy.
>>1196316
>yes they existed
some source would be appreciated
>>1196294
No one denies that biology doesn't affect human behaviour you fucktard. But that doesn't mean it's sufficient as an explaination. Maybe take a dictationary and look up "determinism" sometime. But let me guess you would rather continue to call names.
>>1196352
>calls someone fucktard
>d-don't call me names
lmao
>>1195875
>amazons - didn't exist
They did, and its the only example of common place female combatants. It presumably happened because they were horse archers and avoided melee, they just shot and rode away.
>>1195980
They are two large related groups.
>>1196083
>american_attempts_history.jpg
>>1195958
Those Kurdish women work mostly doing logistics, medical work and communications.
>>1196350
Can you be an asshole somewhere else? OP opens his premise asking for information, but already evinces his bias. Now rather than changing this bias when confronted with evidence to the contrary like any sane person, he instead sticks his fingers in his ears, or like you, becomes a condescending prick. You are everything that is wrong with this board, so do slink back to the egotistical hugbox you came from, you shallow individual.
>>1195915
That's alot of unhealthy anger.
>>1195958
they are more of a deadweight if anything
>>1195958
A literal propaganda campaign to elicit sympathy. Women have straight up never been warriors. It is much less plausible the farther back you go: obviously there are no women who can fight with the average man hand-to-hand. (No, your Ronda Rousey can't beat up a six foot, 185 pound man, get over it.)
>>1196034
Hispanics are Spaniard and people in Spanish speaking countries with their cultural heritage. Indians are native to this continent and have a completely different culture. A lot of people in latin america fall somewhere in between this and identify as either or. Or they will claim their own culture like latino, mestizo, ladino etc.
>>1196424
Actually different people, but pretty funny.
>>1196060
>Women in general have a different physicality from men, but that didn't stop dedicated women from soldiering where they were able to.
Women aren't inferior to men, but they are definitely athletically—and intellectually, for that matter—inferior. Women aren't designed for conflict, although they obviously serve a very important role in society.
>>1196261
All of those are highly unsubstantiated. The Night Witches in particular are basically admitted Soviet propaganda.
>>1196437
>women have straight up never been warriors
This is objectively a false statement made from a stance of skepticism rather than fact.
The Dahomey Amazons are factually known to exist. The Onna bugeisha are well documented from as recently as the Boshin War and stretching back into legend. There are confirmed warrior women among the burials of steppe people like the Sarmatians.
>>1196469
You mean they DIDNT crawl along the wings of planes in flight, to manually rotate the propellers to get them working again?!?!
>>1196522
>There are confirmed warrior women among the burials of steppe people like the Sarmatians.
What do you mean by 'confirmed'? Please do remember that being buried with weapons =/= you were a soldier.
I don't know about warriors, but there were occasional female generals. IIRC for some reason Central and Inner Asian women sometimes had a lot of power or outright led armies in the field. There are some scattered stories of it happening in Chinese history too, such as Lady Hao of Shang and Liang Hongyu. Mulan is completely made up though.
Boudica just has to be the biggest failure in military history. If she was a man named Boudiceus she would be either be relegated to Santa Anna or Antiochus III level of laughingstock, or completely forgotten.
>>1196352
>No one denies that biology doesn't affect human behaviour you fucktard
That's not the point. The question is how much does it affect . But hormone etc do have an affect, and thus dismissing >>1196163 as being entirely wrong is unreasonable.
>But that doesn't mean it's sufficient as an explaination
It depends. On some areas it may very well serve as a reasonable answer, and especially on gendered issues when the opposing answer usually is "a sexists conspiracy spanning the entire western world is the reason why.."
>determinism
No one was being deterministic. People generalize when discussing things because adding "some" and "most of" in front of every sentence gets tedious and is inconvenient.
>>1196537
20% of the sarmatian warrior graves had female skeletons dressed for battle with weapons and the bones showed wounds consistent with weapon scarring.
>>1196279
>men are biologically stronger, faster, smarter, with higher stamina and pain threshold
>FUCK YO DETERMINISM !!!
Kek. Everyone accepts that a fat white manlet won't play basketball at the same level as LeBron James but suddenly when it's women vs men they're magically just as capable as men even though they're infinitely inferior biologically.
>>1196522
>The Dahomey Amazons are factually known to exist.
Look on Wikipedia: there are like three sources. Are you saying nobody has ever lied?
>This is objectively a false statement made from a stance of skepticism rather than fact.
You know why contact sports are separated by gender? With male hormones and other advantages that modernity grants women, you would assume we would have that super woman who can compete with the boys by now. We don't; we never will. There is no better time for it to happen than now, yet it doesn't... because it's asinine and based on an ignorance of both mental and physical biology and sexual dimorphism.
>>1196604
Women aren't inferior. Women are just less intelligent and less athletic. They still are great at facilitating social connections, providing support and companionship and nurturing children. Women hatred is even gayer than not realizing women are athletically and intellectually inferior.
>>1196621
>companionship
This is a blatant lie, hence why no man is ever interested in a woman if there's no sex involved. Even fully bisexual men will tell you that a boyfriend is much better thing to have than a girlfriend.
>>1196621
>women aren't inferior, they're just not as good as men
also known as being inferior dumbshit
>>1196621
Women as a whole, in statistics, arent as physically robust, and intelligence being a factor at all is debatable. Saying women only women are superior at social connections is pretty bullshit considering most diplomats were men.
Women as a whole are usually less athletic, an individual woman has the potential to be exceptionally athletic.
>>1196611
>Wah I don't like your sources but I have no way to actually discredit them
Nice try but if you don't actually have anything to say don't bother.
>legally sanctioned modern sporting competition is the same as war in antiquity and pre industrial ages
>war is solely based on hand to hand combat, entirely eliminating the idea of ranged warfare or horsemaship
Nice strawman faggot. I just provided you three actual recorded cases of women warriors. Either give a credible source as to why they should be discounted or fuck off. We aren't here to talk /sp/ bullshit.
Juana Azurduy commanded an independist army against the spanish in Bolivia/north of Argentina. She went to battle while being pregnant. General Belgrano gave her his sword.
>>1196637
You have to be a real man to get a woman to actually act like a woman and not constantly shit test you. A woman who respects you, though, is one hell of a companion. They have a spontaneity and naivety about them that is very attractive.
>>1196642
If you measure by abilities, then yes, all great proclivities are held by men. You have to look beyond that, though. Women are mothers and nurterers. Men can't replace the feminine touch.
>>1196647
>Saying women only women are superior at social connections is pretty bullshit considering most diplomats were men.
Anyone truly great at something is going to be a man, that's just the way genetics works out. Women aren't inferior, though, they just serve very different functions.
>>1196681
Okay, asshole, you're going to have to pick one
>men are completely in every way better than women
or
>women aren't inferior
You're proposing a literal contradiction.
>>1195875
How is your relationship with your mother?
>>1196700
Freud no one cares about your mommy issues
>>1196651
>Nice try but if you don't actually have anything to say don't bother.
Just because sources exist doesn't mean the stories are real. Sources don't mean something is valid, it is just a reference to where you can find the information. A lot of the claims about women warriors are ridiculous, and I feel they should have to provide concrete proof instead of just using third-person sources. To put if bluntly, just because something is sourced doesn't mean it has any credibility to discredit.
>Nice strawman faggot. I just provided you three actual recorded cases of women warriors. Either give a credible source as to why they should be discounted or fuck off.
I'm not even going to bother. The claims about those women are preposterous, and basically admitted propaganda. I'm not going to waste my time on your shit sources.
>>1196712
Were here for your mommy issues, Oedipus.
>>1196681
I wasn't talking about "shit tests" or whatever dank broscience meme you fuckers at /r9k/ believe now. Women are absolutely abysmal companions and you can only have water cooler shit debates with them.
>>1196693
Get a woman. You won't feel she is inferior to you if she is attractive enough and has a feminine personality, I promise. As far as accomplishing mental or physical tasks in the real world, men are obviously vastly superior in every conceivable way. Women aren't designed for cerebral or physical tasks, though, so it's a bit much to call them inferior for something they aren't designed to do.
>>1196714
>Again, wahh I don't like your sources so I'm just going to ignore them because that works for my argument
Kek stay shook, faggot.
Calling on any extant powers of introspection - how many of you are able to view your comments in the light of possible emotional bias, perhaps related to feelings of frustration or failure concerning your interactions with femalekind? Enough to make you go through the trouble of writing up a message on an anonymous imageboard, seeking validation and imagined communality? Anyone?
>>1196733
Sources don't mean shit. Sources don't work like that. It isn't correct until proven inccorect. A source just tells you where the information was derived from. I can go find a book on UFOs right now and find plenty of sources—sources that are probably hard to outright discredit, as well. This doesn't make most UFO books any less asinine. Your sources' claims are in conflict with observable reality, which hasn't shown any heroic women warriors.
>>1196726
>Women are absolutely abysmal companions and you can only have water cooler shit debates with them.
Believe it or not, intellectual conversations are a lower form of connection than a male–female one. A general trust, respect and concern for one another is a mutually beneficial relationship.
>>1195875
Yes.
>>1195883
>>1196181
hes british.
>who did fuck all
its limey for "who did nothing"
>>1196762
>trust, respect and concern for one another
>women
Lesbian marriages have twice higher divorce rates than gay marriages and a much higher domestic violence rates as well.
>>1196714
Not the anon you're arguing with, but why wouldn't there be women who fought? When your home is invaded and you're a women, would you sit there and watch your children murdered and get raped, or would you pick up a spear and at least take as many as you can before they got to you?
Maybe that's me hoping that when push comes to shove, a women would try to fight as hard as a man, but then again I could be an idiot who gives women to much credit.
>>1196793
>When your home is invaded and you're a women, would you sit there and watch your children murdered and get raped, or would you pick up a spear and at least take as many as you can before they got to you?
Women were captured as prizes. Men have evolved an instinct to protect women who aren't even part of their group. So in that sense, they would just be assimilated by the conquering group instead of killed, particular young virginal women.
>>1196762
I already said if you can credibly disprove said sources, you are more than welcome to. In fact I encourage you do so. Actually find any academic source that can disprove proven records and cases of women warriors.
So far you haven't. You've just been rambling on about how sources can't be trusted and that people are liars because they don't side with your argument conflating modern sporting competition is somehow indicative of war fighting in history.
Again, I've posted several cases of confirmed warrior women in history. You have yet to cite a single credible source as to why they should be disregarded from somewhere other than your own ass.
>>1196779
Compelling, but I disagree with you for no real reason of my own other than the fact that I hate women.
>>1196083
You're a fucking idiot. Kill yourself
>>1196833
t. assblasted female
/r9k/ threads like this are pure cancer
Don't satisfy their virgin rage with replies.
>>1196838
Is called a joke, retard. Lighten up.
>>1196732
Saying a woman isn't inferior when she is literally by every definition lesser than you but also happens to be sexy just means you think with your dick.
And you generalize too much. There are women out there could beat and rape your average neckbeard if they so wished.
>>1196732
>being this vagcucked
>>1196874
There are, but they're not on 4chan now are they? ;^)
Onna bugeisha are known to have existed from classical times to pretty recently, they are a pretty well documented part of japanese history, also we have the names of quite a few of them.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onna-bugeisha
Also it isn't the weapons that prove sarmatian women fought in battle but the fact that, unlike norse and other women who were also buried with weapons, shey show consistent signs of battle scars and weapon inflicted injuries.
>>1196890
Considering it's an anonymous imageboard, you'll never know.
>tfw alpha female reading this thread
>>1196898
Does it make me a horrible person that I actually prefer women who are more aggressive and violent, because I don't have to worry about protecting her because she can do it herself.
>>1195943
>Babies with weapons
Never heard of it, got any source?
>>1196923
It kind of makes you a beta cuckold.
>>1195943
Babies could probably fight better than women. Male babies that is.
>>1196874
>Saying a woman isn't inferior when she is literally by every definition lesser than you but also happens to be sexy just means you think with your dick.
Raising babies, support roles, companionship, etc. Women have a different function, not an inferior one. It only looks inferior because it is more passive.
>>1196937
So you're saying that because I want a women who can beat the shit out of someone by herself, I'm a beta cuckold? All I thought that would make me was lazy, because I don't want to do all the protecting and fighting myself.
>>1197003
I don't go on that shit board, it's full of PUA straight losers top to bottom.
>>1195954
>nd could only retire from fighting when they got married, which could only happen after they killed their third men
I'm a tiny bit sceptical about this to be honest. I can't imagine a society like that keeping up with its rivals' population growth rates. Did this pertain to every woman? Or was marriage some formal stuff that wasn't a requirement to having children?
>>1195915
600 years later, bongs still mad
>>1197546
This is according to Herodotus account, which may have been exaggerated, as most ancient accounts are:
>"Their women, so long as they are virgins, ride, shoot, throw the javelin while mounted, and fight with their enemies. They do not lay aside their virginity until they have killed three of their enemies, and they do not marry before they have performed the traditional sacred rites. A woman who takes to herself a husband no longer rides, unless she is compelled to do so by a general expedition. They have no right breast; for while they are yet babies their mothers make red-hot a bronze instrument constructed for this very purpose and apply it to the right breast and cauterize it, so that its growth is arrested, and all its strength and bulk are diverted to the right
shoulder and right arm."
Again, that might've been exaggerated by the greeks, but evidence shows that atleast a sizeable portion of women were indeed fighting battles in sarmatian society.Regardless if said custom was true or not.
>>1195875
Gozen, European wives during castle raids, that lady who's always painted firing a cannon, lions.
>>1197746
Gozen is cited in that onna bugeisha link, she was the most famous, but far from the only one.
I believe the Mughals had a number of female bodyguards for their female nobility, that they formed their own military unit under their own command and even took part in battle against the British.
>>1195875
If we're talking only ancient, no idea. If we count modern, than lots of guerrilla, communist, and spy forced use women soldiers.
>>1197779
Mauryans had an all female guard for the emperor too, though it was mostly symbolic.
Has a woman EVER defeated a man in fair combat in recorded history?
>>1195958
Kurds are more or less keeping to themselves. The main brunt of the opposition to ISIS are the Shi'a militias and Assad govt.
Mongolian women participated in the conquests and raids of the mongols, Khutulun is a famous example.
>>1198604
Tomyris, Queen of the Massagetae is credited of having killed persian emperor Cyrus the Great.
Also check the Onna Bugeisha, The female soviet fighters and the Sarmatians posted early on this thread.
>>1196813
Yeah they just sit idly by waiting for theit children to be killed before them and then be raped and enslaved by th invader. Totally logical
>>1196563
The question of this thread is if there were any female warriors. The answer was no because women "naturally" avoid combat. This statement had no evidence to back it up and goes against current scientific consensus. Correlation does not equal causality.
>It depends.
No it does not. I am not an expert in that field, but as far as I know there are no aspects of culture where a entirely biological explanation was deemed "reasonable" by scientific consensus. Sociobiology was completely BTFO, just like Human Ethology. The superorganic does not follow the laws of the organic and accepting biological explanations for culture shows a lack of understanding of social science.
The conspiracy argument goes both way, as can be seen in this thread. Feminism is a conspiracy to defy the "natural state of things." It is the classic is/ought fallacy. Because there were few women warriors in the past, it is supposed to be that way.
It comes down to this: Are there natural laws governing human behavior? If there are, they are not biological ones. Women can be warriors, despite their biological weakness. So the laws are social ones. And if there are social laws then any biological explanation falls flat.
>>1195875
Historically there have been, and some have been noted for their prowess as swordswomen
Often what gets under everyone's nose is that "men are physically stronger than women" and get triggered.
And while this is certainly the case, one has to analyse the way in WHICH these women fight.
Strategy and tactics play as much importance in a battle as physical prowess does.
Often what might make a woman an effective fighter is utilising her naturally small size and flexibility to her advantage.
It isnt common for women to be the same height as men, and although there have been women soldiers fighting on the front line with men, some of those veterans have regretted the choice.
That's why you have women's only special forces, a bit like the olympics.
But I digress. Yes, women can fight, but not often in the way that men can due to certain physical advantages and disadvantages.
>>1195875
>Has there ever been any [social group][profession or position of authority] in [extremely broad and none specific peroid in human history]
Take a guess, dumbfuck.
>>1196315
She took an arrow to the chest and stepped on a caltrop, causing an injury. She probably was beat/tortured when captured and was burned alive. How high do you have to be to not recognize any of these as an injury?
Op is a faggot
>>1195909
This
>>1196424
By that logic any gender who dies in combat is a deadweight.
>>1196838
Do you really think there aren't misogynists in 4chan? This place is the home of /r9k/ for god's sake, it's not hard to imagine some of that sourness spreads onto other boards.
>>1198604
>has the pope ever been catholic?
>>1195875
Retard alert
>>1196437
>Talking out of your stupid ass
Gtfo and take your silly edge with you
>it's a tumblr vs 4chan thread
Is this thread /r9k/ or /pol/?
It's hard to tell.
>>1195875
>amazons - didn't exist
Pleb. Stopped reading here
>>1199693
More like a retard vs. historian thread.
>>1199697
Neither
>>1195875
>female warriors
>feminist power fantasies
Pick only one OP. All these were historical facts way before feminism even existed. They were cherished even by conservative and religious people. Sure some things were exaggerated and some are myths.
And feminists don't actually care about female warriors, or history, or knowledge in general.
>>1195875
Losing battles doesn't mean they weren't warriors, anon.
There was this Mongol fighter. I can't remember her name, but she said she'd only wed to the man who could wrestle her. Any men who was willing to try was to giver her a couple of horses and no man ever succeded.
The tv show Marco Polo shows a romantisized version of her, when she's fucking hot and pretend to lose so she could marry the man she wants.
If you include modern warfare, then there's Roza Shanina and plenty of others female soldiers in WW2.
>>1195919
How does this explain the after war rape by the victors?
>>1197730
They definitely fought, but the shit that Herodotus wrote there sounds like the greek equivalent of an urban legend.
>>1196009
Not you again, your not going to be posting pictures of Cernunnose again and suggest he was suppost to be the cuck rather than the one doing the cucking.
>muh horns
>>1195875
Amazons were sarmatian women who cauterized their right breast so that their bow arm would be stronger.
On a related note, the Sarmatian understanding of biology was somewhat lacking.
>>1199408
NO. [social group] has *never* been a part of[profession or position of authority].
I don't even need sources, as I have been omnipresent throughout human history.
>>1195875
Yes there have been many, it's just that besides the famous exceptional examples, most were only recorded in passing, or not at all, as the vast majority of soldiers never distinguish themselves to the note of history.
For example, there is little written about the military career of Mary Read, because she was just a common soldier, no Joan d'Arc or anything, and we'd probably know nothing of her at all if she had not become a pirate later on. The same will be true of the vast majority of female soldiers, who will be equally faceless and unknown as the vast majority of male soldiers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Read
Once gunpowder became commonplace, the need for irregulars to engage in hand to hand fighting became significantly reduced, so women became just another pool of manpower for militias, guerrillas and partisans. And then of course you have modern examples, such as the Soviet sniper battalions comprised largely of women, both out of necessity and aptitude. World War 2 alone is full of examples of female soldiers.
Some of the famous examples are no doubt exaggerated power fantasies, feminist or otherwise, just as famous male heroes are male power fantasies. In reality, the vast majority of soldiers, of both sexes, are soldiers out of necessity, whether for money, safety, or to protect their homes, so you'll never hear of them, as they'll never do anything exceptional, and they'll just go about living their lives as ordinary people.
Spartan Women seemed pretty badass from most greek accounts but never fought in battle that much.
Few chicks in the American Revolution I think
Beside the ones already listed can't think of anything else major
>>1198646
>Tomyris, Queen of the Massagetae is credited of having killed persian emperor Cyrus the Great.
Cool. Though leading an army is part of the issue, I was thinking more along the lines of physical combat, not leading an army of men and then simply dispatching a tied up king kneeling on the ground.
>Also check the Onna Bugeisha, The female soviet fighters and the Sarmatians posted early on this thread.
God made men and women but Colt made them equal... I was more thinking about ancient history.
Are there any female soldiers in history with an established kill count?
I'm a grill and I punched the shit out of a boy once in elementary. Get fuck'd, cucks.
>>1195919
This strikes me as over-thinking circlejerkery
Thinking about it rationally and dispassionately, women are:
>at best physically sub-par melee fighters, less combat-effective than the old men and young boys used in militia levies of last resort
>The only members of the tribe/polity capable of birthing new warriors/labourers
It makes very little sense to put them in combat except in utmost desperation because their primary value to a war effort is in reproduction, particularly when hand to hand combat and thrown missiles are the primary methods of fighting, and when manpower-replacement can make the difference between survival as an independent political entity, and subjection and enslavement by outsiders
>>1195919
>Cross-cultural methodology suggests that women are excluded from warfare not so much because of sex differences in aggressiveness or strength,
Proofs? If you look at any aspect of a melee, the lack of weight and power in most women would absolutely be more than enough reasoning, you don't really need some social justification for that exclusion. take the perfect average of medieval male physiques, have him charge at the perfect average of medieval female physiques and you'll see the woman send flying.
>>1201705
>Proofs?
Read the article.
>>1201683
>science is over-thinking circlejerkery
Thank god we have rational thinking people with common sense like you to explain things instead. You might want to call the leading universities of this world and tell them they can close down their social science departments, because clearly, if they just look at things rationally and dispassionately the answers will come themselves.
>>1201979
I'm very tired, could you quickly point to the explanation why the fact that women absolutely would not, fundamentally function well in physique based warfare isn't sufficient reason for them not to participate?
>>1201673
Split the hair enough times and you won't have anything left.
>just as planned
>>1202001
>Split the hair enough times and you won't have anything left.
I thought it was quite clear from the OP that he meant physical contact warfare. sure, you can weasel around the question a ton and then, when the question asker has to clarify a few times, you can say he's splitting hairs. It's a bit silly, it gets no one nowhere. OP could have been more specific, but then, you could be less daft and maybe less antagonistic too, I don't think OP had an agenda, so hair splitting is hardly relevant.
>>1201676
Did you make him scream and cry? Because if you did, you're my kinda of grill (I like watching people get hurt).
>>1202034
To be completely honest I just accidentally hit him in the head with an iron rake.
I felt terrible and ofc he screamed and cried and never came to my house again
>>1201673
Sarmatians are from ancient times, and Onna Bugeisha existed since ancient times as well.
Also IIRC Tomyris killed Cyrus in a duel or something though they were on horseback so w/e
>>1195957
It's hard to say if there were really only "a few" women who disguised themselves as men to fight in wars. You can find examples of them in most pre-20th century conflicts (more thorough medical examination at enlistment ending that)- and that's ultimately only the ones who were eventually found out, either during their service or at some later point. The actual number is really unknown.
>>1198604
There's no such thing as "fair combat"
>>1202356
Neat.
>>1201996
The fact that they do participate in warfare.
>>1202643
One on one with roughly equivalent weapons is fair combat. How is two guys fighting with swords not fair?
>>1201676
Women mature far faster than boys, but level out sooner while boys continue to develop to be more than twice as strong. You have proven nothing.
>>1202356
I thought someone else killed him, and all she did was desecrate his body afterwards.
>>1203829
I've proven mastery of spears.
If a man and a woman look equally strong/muscular, is the man nonetheless likely to be stronger?
>>1203935
What do you mean by "looking equally stronger" ? They can be said equally strong if they have the same overall performance, meaning they run, lift or weigh roughly the same things
>>1203935
The fuck are you talking about? The average man has 54% higher upper-body strength and 20% higher lower-body strength than the average woman.
>>1203935
Yes, absolutely. Bone density and testosterone.
If the guy had three same hormone levels it would still take about two years for that to level out, but it might never.
It's also not even close. It's like a kid fighting an adult
There were a few.
>>1195915
Damn, Chadsworth. You really need to calm the hell down.
>>1197730
This shit sounds made up but I hope it's true. Sounds fucking badass.
What is the best government system, /his/?
>>1204277
Ignore this comment, I missclicked.
>>1195915
Reminder that the Normans were French and that English is basically mispronounced French.
>>1204293
English themselves are mispronounced French. Their genes don't express correctly
>>1195875
Yo what the fuck is she wearing?
> killed in action aged 20 in 1945
> 62 confirmed kills, 12 of them are snipers, all of them are nazi males
>>1204311
She bright like a shooting star.
>>1195919
>Cross-cultural methodology suggests that women are excluded from warfare not so much because of sex differences in aggressiveness or strength
Hahahahahahahahahaha
>>1204311
fucking camper force the men to do all the work.
The Dahomey warriors were pretty cool
Women as competent soldiers only became practical with the development of firearms. Even so they werent common.
>>1196329
>she got meme injuries
alright
>>1204685
Since they look like a man, it doesn't surprise me if they fought like a man.
>>1196970
>I want a women who can beat the shit out of someone by herself
Maybe other women but she has zero chance against men that arent total faggots
>>1195875
Yes women did fight but only very rarily and almost always when the situation was very dire.
You dont put women into the field because they simply cannot compete with men on any level. The odd exception does not disprove the rule.
>Female warriors are PURE fantasy
Aethelflaed, eldest daughter of Alfred the Great of England, was known as the Lady of Mercia. She led troops against the Vikings during her father's reign and was responsible for the construction of many fortifications. Her military achievements helped her brother Edward the Elder in his Kingship. She died 918 in AD
At the battle of Bravellir between King Harald War-tooth and his nephew Ring, three women, Hethna, Visna and Vebiorg led companies on the Danish side
Rusilla fought against her brother Thrond for the thrones of both Denmark and Norway.
Sela was "a warring Amazon and accomplished pirate"
Stikla ran away from home "preferring the sphere of war to that of marriage"
Alvid also ran away from home and became leader of a group of male and female pirates.
Gurith, Alvid's daughter, also took part in a battle to help her son Harald after her husband was killed.
Source for those 8: "Women in the Viking Age" - Judith Jesch - Boydell Press - 0 85115 278 3
Salaym Bint Malham "with an armoury of swords and daggers strapped round her pregnant belly fought in the ranks of Muhammad and his followers".
Urraca, Queen of Aragon became ruler of Leon-Castile in 1094 when her husband died. She remarried in 1098 and then spent 13 years at war with her second husband, Alfonso the Battler, to protect the inheritance rights of her son by her first marriage. She led her own armies into battle
Matilda, Countess of Tuscany (also known as Matilda of Canossa) was born in Northern Italy in 1046, learned weapons skills as a child, first went into battle at her mother's side in 1061 defending the interests of Pope Alexander II. When her stepfather, Duke Godfrey, died in 1069 Matilda commanded armies. She led her troops personally, and wielded her late father's sword. She spent some thirty years at war in the service of Pope Gregory VIII and then Pope Urban against the German Emperor Henry IV. She married twice, but had no children.
>>1206925
The Order of the Axe (orden de la Hacha) was founded in 1149 by the Count of Barcelona, to honor the women who fought for the defense of the town of Tortosa against a Moorish attack
Petronilla, Countess of Leicester took part in her husband's rebellion against Henry II in 1173. According to Jordan Fantosome " she was armed in a hauberk and carried a sword and shield".
A Papal Bull of 1189 prohibited women from joining the Third Crusade, Because of the numbers participating inthe 2nd crusade. Queens Eleanor of Aquitaine, Eleanor of Castile, Marguerite de Provence, Florine of Denmark and Berengaria of Navarre are known to have gone on Crusade.
Nicola de la Haye was in charge of Lincoln Castle when rebel barons and Louis, son of the French King Philip beseiged it in 1217. She was the daughter of Baron de la Haye, hereditary castellan of Lincoln. She successfully defended the town against several rebel raids and was made sheriff of Lincolnshire in 1216.
The Order of the Glorious Saint Mary was founded in Italy in 1233, and approved by Pope Alexander IV in 1261. It was the first religious order of knighthood to grant the rank of "militissa" to women. The Order was suppressed by Sixtus V in 1558.
In 1297 the Countess of Ross led her own troops during William Wallace and Andrew de Moray's battles with the English.
Isobel, Countess of Buchan: (A.D. 1296-1358) Isobel MacDuff left her husband, the Earl of Buchan (Taking the finest warhorses with her), to fight for the Bruce, a cause of which her husband did not approve. The earl went as far as to issue a warrant for her death. Captured by Edward and taken to England, the countess of Buchan was imprisoned in a small cage for four years. She afterwards retired to convent life.
>>1206926
Jeanne de Danpierre, Countess de Montfort: (Abt. 1300 - 74). (also known as Jane, Countess of Montfort) During the defence of Hennebont (in which she'd had the misfortune to be besieged by her & her husband's enemies), she wore armour, rode a warhorse, and sorted out the defence of the city by observing the enemy from the walls. Jeanne also mobilised the townswomen to defend the ramparts with makeshift missiles. She broke out from Hennebont at the head of 300 horseman, during a French assault on the walls, and successfully fought her way to Brest. She later returned with 600 additional men to reinforce the town. Later that same year, she is reported to have taken part in a sea-skirmish off Guernsey; wearing a suit of armour at the helm of her ship, and wielding a sword.
Jean Froissart's Chroniques describes Jeanne 'with a very sharp sword to hand, fighting with great courage'
Isabelle of England: (A.D. 1285?-1313?) Daughter of Phillippe le Bel of France, wife of Edward II of England. She took up arms against her husband and his supporters. When Edward III came to the throne, he forced Isabelle to flee to Scotland, where, during the ensuing war, she travelled with a defending troop of like-spirited women including two sisters of Nigel and Robert Bruce (Christian, Lady Bruce and Isobel, Countess of Buchan). Against this troop of noblewomen, Edward issued a formal proscription, and captured and imprisoned several of them. Isabelle he forced to retire to a convent life "lest she try further conquests".
>>1206928
Black Agnes: Lady Agnes Randolph (A.D. 1300?-1369?), wife of Patrick the fourth earl of Dunbar and the second earl of March. In her youth, she fought for the Bruce, but is better remembered for the later defense of her castle. In 1334, Black Agnes daughter of the great Randolf, earl of Moray, successfully held her castle at Dunbar against the besieging forces of England's earl of Salisbury for over five months, despite the unusual number of engineers and elaborate equipment brought against her. After each assault on her fortress, her maids dusted the merlins and crenels, treating her foes and the seige as a tiresome jest.
Agnes Hotot, (A.D. 1378? - ?). The coat of arms of the House of Dudley shows a woman in war helmet, dishelved hair hanging out, and her breasts exposed, commemorating a female champion. In the fourteenth century, Agnes Hotot's father quarreled with another man and agreed to a duel with lances to settle the affair. Upon the appointed hour, Agnes's father fell seriously ill. Agnes put on a helmet and disguised her sex, mounted her father's horse and set out for the tourney grounds. 'After a stubborn encounter,' Agnes dismounted her father's foe. When he lay on the ground, "she loosened the stay of her helmet, let down her hair and disclosed her bussom, so that he would know he had been conquered by a woman."
Pope Boniface VIII wrote several letters in 1383 in which he mentioned Genoese ladies who were Crusaders.
>>1206931
"From Petrarch to Cardinal Giovanni Colonna. 23 November 1343
Of all the wonders of God,'who alone doeth great wonders,' he has made nothing on earth more marvelous than man. Of all we saw that day, of all this letter will report, the most remarkable was a mighty woman of Pozzuoli, sturdy in body and soul. her name is Maria, and to suit her name she has the merit of virginity. Though she is constantly among men, usually soldiers, the general opinion holds that she has never suffered any attaint to her chastity, whether in jest or earnest. Men are put off, they say, more by fear than respect.
Her body is military rather than maidenly, her strength is such as any hardened soldier might wish for, her skill and deftness unusual, her age at its prime, her appearance and endeavor that of a strong man. She cares not for charms but for arms; not for arts and crafts but for darts and shafts; her face bears no trace of kisses and lascivious caresses, but is ennobled by wounds and scars. Her first love is for weapons, her soul defies death and the sword.
She helps wage an inherited local war, in which many have perished on both sides. Sometimes alone, often with a few companions, she has raided the enemy, always, up to the present, victoriously. First into battle, slow to withdraw, she attacks aggressively, practises skilful feints. She bears with incredible patience hunger, thirst, cold, heat, lack of sleep, weariness; she passes nights in the open, under arms; she sleeps on the ground, counting herself lucky to have a turf or a shield for pillow.
continued...
>>1206933
She has changed much in a short time, thanks to her constant hardships. I saw her a few years ago, when my youthful longing for glory brought me to Rome and Naples and the king of Sicily. She was then weaponless; but I was amazed when she came to greet me today heavily armed, in a group of soldiers. I returned her greeting as to a man I didn't know. Then she laughed, and at the nudging of my companions I looked at her more closely; and I barely recognized the wild, primitive face of the maiden under her helmet.
They tell many fabulous stories about her; I shall relate what I saw. A number of stout fellows with military training happen to have come here from various quarters. (They were diverted from another expedition.) When they heard about this woman they were anxious to test her powers. So a great crowd of us went up to the castle of Pozzuoli. She was alone, walking up and down in front of the church, apparently just thinking. She was not at all disturbed by our arrival. We begged her to give us some example of her strength. After making many excuses on account of an injury to her arm, she finally sent for a heavy stone and an iron bar. She then threw them before us, and challenged anyone to pick them up and try a cast. To cut the story short, there was a long, well-fought competition, while she stood aside and silently judged the contestants. Finally, making an easy cast, she so far outdistanced the others that everyone was amazed, and I was really ashamed. So we left, hardly believing our eyes, thinking we must have been victims of an illusion.
>continued still further
>>1206934
The story goes that Robert [of Naples], that noblest of kings, was once sailing along these shores with a great fleet, and, tempted by the stories of this woman, he came ashore at Pozzuoli only to see her. This does not seem very likely, since, living so nearby, it would seem easier for him to summon her. But perhaps he landed for some other reason and was eager to inspect this great novelty. He has a very curious mind.
Let the tale-tellers bear the responsibility for the truth of this story, as of many others we have heard. For me the sight of this woman makes more credible not only the tales of the Amazons and their famous feminine kingdom, but also those of the Italian virgin warriors, led by Camilla, whose name is celebrated above all. For what hinders us from believing of many what I could hardly have credited of one, if I had not seen it? And that ancient Camilla was born not far from here, at Piperno, at the time of the fall of Troy; while our modern girl was born at Pozzuoli. I wanted to give you this report in my little letter.
Farewell and Prosper."
>Source: "The Voice of the Middle Ages in Personal Letters 1100-1500" Edited by Catherine Moriarty ISBN 1 85291 051 8, Lennard Publishing.
>>1206936
Queen Margaret of Denmark (1353-1411) led her armies against Swedish and Norwegian forces.
From "Treasure of the City of Ladies" (1405) written by Christine de Pizan : "We have also said that she [the baroness] ought to have the heart of a man, that is, she ought to know how to use weapons and be familiar with everything that pertains to them, so that she may be ready to command her men if the need arises. She should know how to launch an attack or to defend against one."
Jacqueline of Bavaria, Countess of Holland, Hainault and Zealand (1402-1437) led her army to relieve a seige at the city of Gorkum.
Margret Paston took charge of the defence of her home in her husband's absence both before and during the Wars of the Roses. She asked him to send crossbows, poleaxes and iron spikes as well as more domestic items in a letter in 1448.
Isabella I of Castile (1451-1504) was married to Ferdinand of Aragon. She was heir to her half brother Henry IV of Castille and inherited his throne in her own right in 1474. This led to a war with supporters of his wife's allegedly illegitimate daughter, Juana. Later in her reign she and Ferdinand attacked the Moors and drove them out of Southern Spain. Isabella wore armour and led her army in the field, she also planned strategy and organised the supplies and field hospitals. Her importance to the army was illustrated by the fact that her illness after a miscarriage while she was in command of an army at Toledo in 1475 gave her enemies a respite.
Margaret of Anjou (1430-1482) was a leader of the Lancastrian forces during the War of the Roses. Her armies defeated the Duke of York and the Earl of Warwick.
(though it is noted that Margaret was commanding from the back in several of the battles)
>>1206937
A group of 350 women constructed and defended fortifications for the Protestant Garrison in Guienne, France in 1518
Ameliane du Puget, the governor's daughter, led a troop of women who broke a siege at Marseilles in 1524 during a war between the King of France and the Constable de Bourbon. They dug a mined trench known as the Tranchee des Dames which became the modern day Boulevard des Dames.
Hernan Cortés' army in Mexico in 1521 included Spanish and Mayan women some of whom fought with the army.
Beatriz de Pardes was a nurse, but on occasion fought in the place of her husband, Pedro de Escoto.
María de Estrada was noted for her valor at the battle of the bridges on the noche triste.
Lilliard led the Scots at the Battle of Ancrum in 1545 She killed the English commander but was killed herself later in the battle.
Graine Ni Mhaille (1550-1600) was an Irish princess and pirate, also known as Grace O'Malley, and commanded a large fleet of ships. She petitioned Queen Elizabeth I of England regarding her various territorial claims, and the two met in 1593. Despite her own officers' reports that Grace was attacking English navy, shipping and coastal towns, the Queen accepted Grace's claims.
In 1568, two sisters, Amaron and Kenau Hasselaar, led a battalion of 300 women who fought on the walls and outside the gates to defend the Dutch city of Haarlem against a Spanish invasion.
>>1206939
Marguerite Delaye lost an arm fighting in the battle which lifted the siege of Montelimar in 1569.
In 1584 a group of Dutch and English volunteers recaptured the city of Ghent from the Spanish. One of the volunteers was Captain Mary Ambree.
Tomoe Gozen captured the city of Kyoto in Japan in 1584 after winning the Battle of Kurikawa. She was described as being a strong archer and excellent swordswoman.
Dona Catalina de Erauso of San Sebastian left a nunnery in 1596 and travelled to Peru where she became a soldier of fortune. She used sword, knife, and pistol, and fought in battles and in duels. She died around 1650.
Madame de Saint-Belmont disguised herself as a man and fought a duel against a cavalry officer after he ignored a letter she had sent complaining of his discourtesy.
During the English Civil War Queen Henrietta Maria was actively involved in King Charles' campaigns and marched at the head of one of his armies.
King Charles issued a proclamation banning women who were with the armies during the English Civil War from wearing men's clothing.
Lady Ann Cummingham led a cavalry troop of men and women in the Battle of Berwick on June 5, 1639
The Scots Army which marched on Newcastle in 1644 during the English Civil War is reported to have included "women who stood with blue caps among the men" as regular soldiers.
In 1645 a Royalist corporal captured near Nottingham during the English Civil War was found to be a woman.
>>1206942
Christian 'Kit' Cavanagh (or Davies), better known as "Mother Ross" was one of several women who served as dragoons in the British Army. She fought during the 1690's at first disguised as a man and later openly as a woman.
Anne Chamberlyne dressed in men's clothing and fought in a six hour battle against the French on board her brother's ship in June 1690. She died in childbirth in1691.
A ballad written in 1690 by seaman John Curtin describes a woman who was discovered disguised as a man in the crew of the 72 gun vessel "Edgar".
A gentlewoman petitioned the Queen (Queen Mary II) for payment for serving on the ship "St Andrew" dressed in men's clothing and taking part in a battle against the French in the summer of 1691.
... and the next one on the list deserves an entire post all of her own....
>>1206943
Julie d'Aubigny (1670–1707), better known as Mademoiselle Maupin was born in 1670 to Gaston d'Aubigny, a secretary to the comte d'Armagnac, the Master of the Horse for King Louis XIV. Her father trained her in dancing, literacy, drawing and fencing. While in her teens she became a mistress of the Count d'Armagnac and through him was introduced to court.
d'Aubigny gathered a reputation in Parisian courts, and fought duels with young aristocrats. She became involved with an assistant fencing master named Serannes.
About 1688, when Lieutenant-General of Police Gabriel Nicolas de la Reynie tried to apprehend Serannes for killing a man in an illegal duel, the pair fled the city to Marseille, where d'Aubigny and Serannes gave duelling exhibitions, sang and told stories in inns. When duelling, d'Aubigny dressed in male clothing but did not conceal her gender.
Eventually, she grew bored of Serannes and became involved with a young lady. When the girl's parents put her away in the Visitandines convent in Avignon, d'Aubigny followed, entering the convent as a novice. There she stole the body of a dead nun, placed it in the bed of her lover and set the room afire to cover their escape. Their affair lasted for three months before the young lady returned to her family. D'Aubigny was charged in absentia with kidnapping, body snatching, arson and failing to appear before the tribunal. The sentence was death by fire,
continued...
>>1206945
continued
Escaping from Marseille, d'Aubigny made her way towards Paris, while also embarkingon a career as an opera singer. In Villeperdue, she fought a victorious duel against three squires and drove her blade through the shoulder of one of them. The next day, she asked about his health and found out he was Louis-Joseph d'Albert Luynes, son of the Duke of Luynes. The next evening, one of his companions came to offer the duke's apologies. She went to his room dressed in female clothing and subsequently they became lovers.
After Count d'Albert recovered and had to return to his military unit, d'Aubigny continued to Rouen. There she met Gabriel-Vincent Thévenard, another singer, and began a new affair with him. They continued together towards Paris. In Marais, she contacted Count d'Armagnac for help against the sentence hanging over her. He persuaded the king to grant her a pardon instead.
In Paris, D'Aubigny began to use the name Mademoiselle Maupin, and eventually joined the Paris Opera. Several years later D'Aubigny once more became a professional duelist, when she fought three noblemen during a court ball around 1693, she fell afoul of the king's law that forbade duels in Paris, and fled to Brussels.
She later reconciled with her husband and lived with him until his death in 1701 or 1705. After she retired from the opera in 1705, she entered a convent in Provence, where she died in 1707.
>>1206949
M. Cesar de Saussure of Lausanne Switzerland writes an account of a fight between two female gladiators using two handed sword, sword with dagger and finally sword with shield in 1720
Mary Reed (or Read) and Anne Bonnie (or Bonny) were sentenced to death for piracy in 1720.
Phoebe Hessel (1713-1821) was born in Stepney and joined the army at the age of 15 served for many years as a private soldier in the 5th Reg't of Foot (or Northumberland Fusiliers) in different parts of Europe including Montserrat and in 1745 at Fontenoy.
Ann Mills was British dragoon who fought on the frigate Maidstone in 1740.
Jean (Jenny) Cameron of Glendessary raised 300 men and led them to the raising of the Jacobite standard in Scotland on 19th August 1745
And though not an actual combatant, this one makes you wonder how interesting their marriage was:
Lady Anne Macintosh (also known as Anne Farquharson of Invercauld and Colonel Anne) was married to the Laird of Macintosh who supported the Hannoverians during the Jacobite rising in Scotland in 1745-6. Anne sided with the Jacobites and raised several hundred men to fight for them, although she never led her men into battle herself. At various points both she and her husband were captured and were released into each others' custody...
>>1206950
Lady Lude fired the first shot of the Jacobite attack on Blair Castle, Scotland. This was her own family home and had been taken over by the Hanoverians.
Lady Margaret Oglivy and Margaret Murray (or Fergusson) accompanied their husbands who were officers in Bonnie Prince Charlie's (Prince Charles Edward Stewart or The Young Pretender of Scotland) army in 1745-6. Mrs Murray is reputed to have been directly involved in seizing horses and money for the army.
(source for those ones: "Damn Rebel Bitches - Women of the '45" - Maggie Craig - Mainstream Publishing - 1-85158-962-7)
Hannah Snell dressed as a man and called herself James Gray. She served in a regiment of the Royal Marines and fought at the siege of Pondicherry. In 1750 she revealed her secret to her comrades and was granted a lifetime pension. She died in 1791.
Source: Hannah Snell, The Secret Life of a Female Marine" - Matthew Stephens - Ship Street Press - 0-9530565-0-3
DEBORAH SAMSON (sometimes mis-spelled "sampson")
In October of 1778 Deborah Samson of Plympton, Massachusetts disguised herself as a young man and presented herself to the American army as a willing volunter to oppose the common enemy. She enlisted for the whole term of the war as Robert Shirtliffe and served in the company of Captain Nathan Thayer of Medway, Massachusetts.
For three years she served in various duties and was wounded twice - the first time by a sword cut on the side of the head and four months later she was shot through the shoulder. Her sexual identity went undetected until she came down with a brain fever, then prevalent among the soldiers. The attending physician, Dr. Binney, of Philadelphia, discovered her charade, but said nothing. Instead he had her taken to his own home where she would receive better care.
source: http://userpages.aug.com/captbarb/femvets.html
>>1206951
Margaret Corbin (or Cochran) helped with the artillery during an attack on Fort Washington. In 1779 she was awarded her a pension for her heroism.
Mary Ludwig Hays McCauley served alongside her husband, John Hays, in the Pennsylvania State Regiment of Artillery for seven years.
In 1771 Naval seaman Charles Waddall was found to be a woman when she was being stripped for a flogging.
(source "Female Tars" - Suzanne Stark - Pimlico - 0-7126-660-5)
In 1775 Jemima Warner took her deceased husband's place in the ranks during an American army expedition into Canada led by Brig. Gen. Richard Montgomery and Colonel Benedict Arnold
Angelique Brulon - awarded the French Legion of Honor. She defended Corsica in seven campaigns between 1792 and 1799. At first she fought disguised as a man, by the time her gender was discovered she had proved so valuable in battle that she was allowed to remain in the military fighting openly as a woman.
Mary Anne Talbot (1778-1808) was a drummer in the army in Flanders in 1792 and a sailor on the "Brunswick" where she was wounded in action in 1794. She used the name John Taylor
Mademoiselle de la Rochefoucalt, a noted orator, rallied royalists and led guerrilla actions against the republican forces. She died in battle during the French Revolution.
Catherine the Great led rebels in a successful coup against her husband Tsar Peter of Russia. She wore a soldier's uniform and directed the tactics of her various wars up until 1796.
A report in the Naval Chronicle in 1807 describes a woman using the name of Tom Bowling who had served over 20 years as a bowswain's mate on a man-of-war.
and lastly, since the 20th C is packed full of records:
Edith Garrud opened a dojo for jujutsu close to Oxford Circus.She trained a group of "fighting suffragettes", the bodyguard unit for Mrs Pankhurst.
>>1206198
>You dont put women into the field because they simply cannot compete with men on any level. The odd exception does not disprove the rule.
I believe this is an exaggeration. Today you can see women competing in HEMA (historical european martial arts) and sometimes winning tournaments without looking like Brienne of Tarth. The majority of them have a physical disadvantage to overcome, but they are not inherently worthless. They just need more training than most men, I guess, to balance strength with skill. Matt Easton from the youtube channel scholagladiatoria has a few videos about how skill can beat strength.
That doesn't however change the fact that female warriors have always and everywhere been exceptional. But the physical reasons are I think only part of the question. Child soldiers do exist after all. And there are many situations in which weaker troops can defeat much stronger ones because of superior tactics or discipline. The english archer was theoretically a joke against a fully armoured knight in close combat, yet in Agincourt they could resist the french assault.
Amazons were real. They cut off one of their breasts so that the they could strengthen their bow arm.
I don't have any proof to back this up. I read it on Wikipedia a long time ago, but there's no way the Greeks just made it all up.
Or maybe they did. I don't know. Thanks for reading my post!
>>1195875
>Were there ANY actual female warriors?
There's female warriors right now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tm0uzPCMOLM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZhrk9wyfH4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=av1nDHQZoPY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hj6XR5_LJ0o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybcsRbhnpnc
>>1195875
>Joan of d'arc
kek
also captcha: du croissant
It's a rare thing. Take the Marine tests for example. A staggering amount of the women that tried out failed, and it wasn't just physical. Which I'll also point out is not just raw strength. Men have fought as the main weapon for thousands of years.
>>1196970
>I don't want to do all the protecting and fighting myself
You're not fighting alone, your fighting for your heart you imbecile.
Fighting for someone, especially someone you love is about far more than physical prowess.
If my wife was Operator tier, could bench 350, and knew Karate, I would still stand in front of her in a fight. It's what men do.
ITT: post images that trigger OP
>>1195875
Amazons (Scythians)
/thread
>>1195943
They will not cut off one breast if they are no going to use a bow frequently.
revisionists pls
>>1196083
lol, you're saying her trial is propaganda?
wew son, you mad.
>>1195875
Those African women in Dahomey who kicked the asses of abusive males should count for something.
>>1196347
>>
>some source would be appreciated
ask the bulls
>>1196437
I mean on the whole yeah but there are individual women who did plenty of fighting. Wang Yi took up a bow to help defend her home against Ma Chao's attacks againt Jicheng and likely participated in her husband's various attacks against him until Ma Chao was driven out.
>>1196083
>surrender monkeys
Spot the person who only pays attention to meme history.
I don't even like the French and this "surrender monkeys" thing pisses me off.
>>1196290
This is true, but she was propped up by propaganda to inspire the troops and eventually lead to being one of the greatest martyr's of all time. Even if she isn't the best warrior, her actual role(Intentional or not) in winning the 100 years war cannot be understated.
>>1195875
Chañan Curi Coca was an inca warrior woman, she fought bravely in the battle for the city of Cuzco and led the defense of the district of Chocos Cachona against the invasion of the chanka army when Cuzco was just a small kingdom. She belonged to the Inaca panaca(clan) allegedly founded by Mama Guaco and it had a dynasty of women chiefs, they possessed the eighth ceque(a huaca organization system) of the Contisuyo in Cusco, with 15 huacas(shrines) under their control at the time of the spaniards arrival.
After the inca-chanka war the tanancuricota huaca, a pururauca huaca, was made in her honor, the pururauca were the stone warriors who helped in the war against the Chankas, it was the main huaca of the Inaca clan.
Mama Guaco, a more mythical rather than historical character, she was one of the main leaders of the Inca people when they were looking for a place to settle, it was said that in the inca conquest of the cuzco valley she killed and ripped an enemy warrior then used his lungs like a trumpet, it caused great fear among the inhabitants who probably thought they were being invaded by a cannibal tribe of amazon.
>>1210626
Could you rewrite that in english please?
Do we seriously need this fucking thread every day? Christposting is more constructive than this.
>>1195875
In feudal Japan women sometimes became warrior Samurai or ashigaru. Though most women that are mentioned used a yari. Women *somtimes* fought the Romans supposedly, mostly Germanic tribes
Plutarch mentions barbarian women wielding axes and swords when desciring the Cambri and Teutones
>>1195875
>female
>warriors
hahahahahaha!
the examples posted here are just meme history m8
>>1195875
We're talking about billions of people over all of human history, there were at least a few.
>>1196083
>pre 20th Century France
>surrender monkeys
sure, they're shit now, but France was essentially THE military power of mainland Europe till' the Germans got their shit together.
>>1196923
No. Who likes passive fragile women when women who take their lives into their own hands exist?
