What exactly made feudalism obsolete from a practical point of view?
Also, are there any countries that still had/have a (neo-)feudal system post-industrialization?
Plague
Suddenly the serfs had the merchants and nobles by the balls
automation
most communist countries ironically enough
>>1186436
When you think about it, the plague was kind of a reset button.
>>1186431
>Also, are there any countries that still had/have a (neo-)feudal system post-industrialization?
Japan and Korea to an extent.
>>1186444
Isn't (Italian) Fascist Corporatism closer to feudalism?
Also, why can't a sort of feudalism function in a predominantly urbanite society? There were plenty of cities and larger towns in feudal societies.
>>1186460
In what way? I was thinking maybe more along the lines of the Saudis, although I must admit that I haven't researched it.
>>1186460
Intredasting.
To what extent?
>>1186466
Fascist corporatism is more akin to very early capitalism, in that burghers had a system of guilds and such that was largely confined to cities where corporatism would like to adapt something similar to the entire nation.
>Also, why can't a sort of feudalism function in a predominantly urbanite society?
Because all your serfs will move to the city like historically happened and then we'll be right back to square one.
>>1186491
>akin to very early capitalism
And what about merchant republics, did they function in a similar fashion even before that?
>all your serfs will move to the city
But why is feudalism tied to agrarian serfdom? The distribution of power comes from above, so to me it seems that even if serfdom itself(which is indeed a traditional key defining element of medieval feudalism) would be abolished, the castes above could still function. A noble is a glorified regional administrator with dynastic succession.
Something to think about:
The Russian Federation under Vladimir Putin may be proposed as an example of a modern feudal society. Essential to this society is a form of subordination ("vertical of power") where informal personal dependences exist in the hierarchy. Posts at lower level are assigned in exchange for material obligations that are based on payoffs extracted from the fief, and for loyalty, whereas higher ranks provide protection from weak civil institutions (legal system). Subsystems may span several echelons, e.g. from street policemen through the highest police and political ranks.
(Parliament chambers) are composed of deputies handpicked by the Kremlin, one need not strain oneself to imagine how these super-rich people acquired their offices. They pay “up” with both lucre and loyalty, and they are protected “down”—a hallmark of feudal social exchange.
The castes, in principle, are completely traditional:
1. LORDS. Mainly these are Putin's inner circle from the notorious "Ozero" group, the elite of the special services and the church.
2. BARONS. The middle branch of power-holders.
3. THE BOURGEOISIE. A weak and dependent class, privileged in relation to the ordinary people, and an object of exploitation with limited rights in relation to the "favoured". ...
4. ORDINARY PEOPLE. Without any rights....
(Author presents examples of legal impunity of "barons" with respect to crimes against ordinary people.)
Whereas the ranks of "lords" and "barons" are mostly (up to 70%) filed by ex-KGB officers, the image of a "police state" does not fit best. The society is structured around voluntary corruption links.
>>1186431
At least in England, the growth of enclosures started pushing serfs towards urban centres for jobs, along with general stripping back of power from the nobility following the War of the Roses.
Feudalism as a system gave very little power to a monarch and so the historical shift away from it can be seen as just a long historical trend of centralization.
>>1186538
>And what about merchant republics, did they function in a similar fashion even before that?
In the city itself I would imagine so.
>But why is feudalism tied to agrarian serfdom?
Because that's basically what feudalism is.
>The distribution of power comes from above, so to me it seems that even if serfdom itself(which is indeed a traditional key defining element of medieval feudalism) would be abolished, the castes above could still function. A noble is a glorified regional administrator with dynastic succession.
Power simply never comes from above in an age where the police are barely better armed or trained than the people.
Power comes from economic bargaining power and popular acceptance, if city-dwelling burghers make the overwhelming majority of the money and the people are free to move to the city away from their lords then any "feudalism" would be purely symbolic since the nobility would be powerless.
If they tried to exert their power in anyway they would get guilllotined by the infinitely more powerful bourgeoisie within a week.
>>1186542
Some people claim that post-Soviet Russia was anarcho-capitalism to some extent. Maybe this modern feudal society is the direct consequence of it? Or is it more because of the large military complex without work and crime?
>>1186431
Feudalism was never made obsolete because it didn't exist. :^)
>>1186431
>What exactly made feudalism obsolete from a practical point of view?
The closed field plantation system, ala Barbados & Poland.
Feudalism never ended, we just changed some nouns.
>>1186431
Sark got rid of their feudal system just a few years ago.
