There's lots of historical re-enactment and martial arts projects, but what about historical simulation? Are there any systems or games, whether traditional table top or video game, that are realistic simulations of historical combat, warfare, economics, or politics?
No
too much "human factors" like irrationality, insecurity, vengence, etc etc.
>>1102215
>historical combat
Red Orchestra series, Verdun, WW2 Online, etcetera.
>>1102215
The closest I would say are Paradox series, more so Victoria (economics/politics seem fairly realistic) and the warfare of Hearts of Iron.
Incidentally, I have always dreamed of re-enacting the lifestyle of a Legionary for a year in some appropriately sized unit
>>1102215
>realistic simulations
Google around "historical agent based model". ABM is the academic term for the kind of game-like, individual level model you seem interested in.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4094840/
"On agent-based modeling and computational social science"
http://informs-sim.org/wsc12papers/includes/files/con269.pdf
"An agent-based model of the battle of Isandlwanda"
>>1102581
Absolutely top shelf response, friend. Thank you.
>>1102581
>http://informs-sim.org/wsc12papers/includes/files/con269.pdf
>"An agent-based model of the battle of Isandlwanda"
This is really cool. I almost want to try it out myself. The algorithm doesn't seem too complicated, and as long as the numbers aren't much higher than 10,000 I bet even a toaster could run these simulations pretty quickly. Any /his/anons got some ideas on a battle or skirmish worth simulating, or maybe some agent rules or tweaks?
>>1103175
It'd be a pretty nifty /his/ + /g/ project. We could vote on a simple but well documented battle, hash out a few rules and objectives, and even change some things to explore some alt-history or explore different tactics.
>>1103175
>This is really cool. I almost want to try it out myself. The algorithm doesn't seem too complicated, and as long as the numbers aren't much higher than 10,000 I bet even a toaster could run these simulations pretty quickly. Any /his/anons got some ideas on a battle or skirmish worth simulating, or maybe some agent rules or tweaks?
Hey hello, I posted that. I'd point out that the pure agent-based approach is really best suited to battles with little central coordination. Otherwise you have to explicitly model the commanders and so on.
The Battle of Trafalgar has been used in recent military literature (eg http://www.dodccrp.org/files/Alberts_Power.pdf) as an example of effective self-organized action. I see someone made a model for it (http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/articleDetails.jsp?arnumber=1231440) but it looks like it's only online behind paywalls.
>>1103489
Neat. I'll be spending a weekend or two reading up on this. I'm a CS major with a big history interest, but I never really found an outlet to combine both interests outside of light modding for TW/Paradox games.
I wonder if modeling commanders would be all that hard, since the Battle of Isandlwanda paper models three different agents instead of two - the British, the Zulu, and the British native troops, each with different rules. I haven't tried this out of course, but I can't help but think commanders and officers (and bannermen and other unique actors) would be hard to incorporate. They could just have their own separate data structure, and computational time might even be improved if an agent didn't have to search through an entire army for adjacent agents every time step and instead just searched for adjacent agents within a distinct group organized by an officer (and then have officers act according to their proximity to both their own soldiers and other officers leading other units).
>>1102215
Probably murdering someone in period gear.
>>1103510
>>1103489
For example, the Battle of Trafalgar simulation I gather treats an entire ship as an agent. One could theoretically treat a commander and his unit the same way. Just as the ship agent abstracts the actions and decisions of a ship captain, his officers, and his crew, why not do the same with a regiment of foot soldiers? Only, instead of just declaring a whole regiment a simple agent, treat it as an entire object class of agents all making decisions within their own context to make an ultimate decision as a regiment.
>>1103510
> Neat. I'll be spending a weekend or two reading up on this
Netlogo https://ccl.northwestern.edu/netlogo/ and the models it comes with are probably the most compact introduction to ABM
>I wonder if modeling commanders would be all that hard
Some relatively simple commanders would surely be possible but, you know, tactical genius is probably a little out of bounds.
The approach is also even better suited to modeling economic activity, as far as human behaviors go.
>>1103522
> One could theoretically treat a commander and his unit the same way
Right, picking scales is one way to do it. I was assuming you meant still at the full individual level.
Dwarf Fortress generates neat little histories for any world you play in - including wars, significant people, towns, events etc. Even shit like books written by wizards and stuff. Not super realistic, but really neat.
>>1103524
>Some relatively simple commanders would surely be possible but, you know, tactical genius is probably a little out of bounds.
From what I understand, tactical genius is usually planned out ahead of time with orders given to field commanders who perform their part in the plan exceptionally well. Trafalgar for example was well planned out before the engagement, so spontaneous moments of tactical excellence would probably be too rare to worry about just yet.
Then again, a greedy algorithm applied randomly to agents and commanders to pursue glory might work out here, resulting in either moments of brilliance or utter collapse.
Thanks again, mate. It's been a while since I had a project this interesting to study and attempt.
>The approach is also even better suited to modeling economic activity, as far as human behaviors go.
And there's an excellent idea to attempt some Medieval economics simulation.
I think i just stumbled upon an actually worthwhile /his/ thread.
>>1103546
> From what I understand, tactical genius is usually planned out ahead of time with orders given to field commanders who perform their part in the plan exceptionally well
Yeah, but it can only be planned so well and eventually the commanders will be improvising.
>And there's an excellent idea to attempt some Medieval economics simulation.
There's so much of this stuff I want to work on someday when I have more time. Plagues and exploration seem like two others that would be really amenable to the method at an abstract-enough level to not need tons of research.
>>1103546
>And there's an excellent idea to attempt some Medieval economics simulation.
Have a working economy that a player agent can have fun with in a sandbox context and put that shit on Steam. Add a wolf waifu for good measure.
>>1102215
There have been military simulation games available since the 50's.
Go to Noble Knight Games, they have thousands of hex/map games from every era.
Check out Board Game Geek for endless threads on war simulations.
The Campaign for North Africa is pretty intense, I've been told
>tfw 1500 hour logistical simulation with 2 Commander-in-chiefs with 4 sub-commanders each, managing with a three - volume rulebook, and giving Italians extra water supplies to cook their pasta
>>1104538
But which are the most realistic, and why?
>>1102215
Hegemony is pretty good.
