>Christians will defend this
Also: I just love how you supposed to "love your enemies", but you're always offensive, shitposting and telling others how they'll go to Hell.
Are you like pic related?
Are you a "good person"?
>>1208240
Very few Christians will defend this actually.
Being repulsed by sinners is nothing wrong with it, same as there is nothing wrong with being concerned for the eternal souls of sinners.
>>1208252
You don't sound like a good person to me.
Do your love your enemies?
Also: I didn't say I'm not a Christian, by the way.
Why do you think I wrote "Christians" and not "Christcucks" in OP, hm?
What I'm trying to say is, Christians on 4chan are very agressive.
God is love.
Many of you / us sound hypocrite.
Maybe many of these so-called Christians are just "memeing"...
True believers would never act like this (or like in OP's pic).
>Being repulsed by sinners is nothing wrong with it, same as there is nothing wrong with being concerned for the eternal souls of sinners.
Pic related.
>>1208240
>First and second panel
Anyone who's read the Bible knows that Jesus and Paul pretty much worship the poor
>Third panel
Once again, Bible says not to gossip
>Fourth panel
WILL SOMEONE THINK OF THE GAYS?!?
>fifth
Pretty sure it says to treat animals nicely
You're an idiot if you made this
>>1208240
>mfw I know about 5 """"Christians"""" who act exactly like this image irl
>mfw I have no face
>>1208327
I think it's talking about the belief that no matter what you do in life, if you believe in Jesus you're going to heaven.
>>1208240
>This bitch clearly do something that are considered as sin in Christianity.
>True Christianity.
>Implying this is not made by progressive cuck.
Good works and compassion are the only ways to worship and honor any god worth the title.
There have always been hypocrites, and they exist regardless of their faith or lack thereof.
>>1208421
At last! A true Christian!
It's good to know that they still exist.
God bless you, brother!
>>1208432
Thanks, but I'm more of a lapsed Irish Catholic/agnostic. Just my observation.
>>1208401
>>1208414
> “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
>And Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly, I say to you, only with difficulty will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.”
>>1208240
I'm a christian, and while I can't defend it, because I don't believe in modern Evangelical interpretation, I take very literally Paul's words in Romans 3:9-20, which many conveniently overlook, I apologize that christians are humans, prone to misunderstanding and vanity.
I'm sad what modern christianity has "become", a bunch of "sinless beings making choices to have themselves saved". It's not how I view Jesus' message and sacrifice at all.
>>1208240
God needs his dues
Dogs aren't people
Homosexuality is a disease
Fatness is unhealthy
Poor people on the streets are there by choice
Mexicans chose to clean our shit in shitty conditions
>>1208463
9 What shall we conclude then? Do we have any advantage? Not at all! For we have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under the power of sin. 10 As it is written:
“There is no one righteous, not even one;
11
there is no one who understands;
there is no one who seeks God.
12
All have turned away,
they have together become worthless;
there is no one who does good,
not even one.”[a]
13
“Their throats are open graves;
their tongues practice deceit.”[b]
“The poison of vipers is on their lips.”[c]
14
“Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness.”[d]
15
“Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16
ruin and misery mark their ways,
17
and the way of peace they do not know.”[e]
18
“There is no fear of God before their eyes.”[f]
19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. 20 Therefore no one will be declared righteous in God’s sight by the works of the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of our sin.
>>1208470
Edgy
>There are """"Christians"""" out there who will defend capitalism
Loving Every Laugh.
>>1208470
>Poor people on the streets are there by choice
Shiggy diggy doo.
>>1208482
>Christian are Anarchist meme
>>1208483
>implying there aren't homeless shelters
>>1208489
>Christians aren't anarchists.
Well they aren't because Christ is King, but for all materialist things considered they ought to be practically.
>2The congregation of believers was one in heart and soul. No one claimed that any of his possessions was his own, but they shared everything they owned.
>>1208482
>Jesus would condone rampant centralized materialism
Stop
>>1208470
Hi there, Satanist.
How's your day?
>>1208506
>They're just choosing not to be in homeless shelters
That's not how it works, bro.
The number 1 reason why homeless people live on the streets is that shelter is simply limited. Whilst things like drug addiction making shelter not an option for many people happen as well, it's very un-Christian to just shrug your shoulders and go "lol, their fault".
>>1208514
No, but he would condone communism.
>>1208514
>Jesus would condone the rampant decentralised materialism of this era
He didn't seem to be a big fan of merchants, anon.
>>1208520
>it's very un-Christian to just shrug your shoulders and go "lol, their fault".
Why? A Christian can help while also realizing it's the person's fault he became poor (if it really was his fault in the first place)
>>1208514
>>1208522
Jesus (God) condones all forms of government because He makes them and places the people in charge. Romans 13:1-7
" Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.
6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor."
>>1208529
I wasn't trying to convey it's wrong to decide something is their own fault, I was saying it's un-Christian to just shrug your shoulders at the problem because of that - as in just disregarding the situation all together.
As anon was effectively defending in saying
>Poor people on the streets are there by choice
In his post on why the lady in the comic did nothing wrong.
>>1208529
>Why? A Christian can help while also realizing it's the person's fault he became poor (if it really was his fault in the first place)
See you in Hell, fellow sinner! ;)
>>1208531
>For rulers hold no terror for those who do right
Paul back at it again being a retard.
>>1208531
>Christians who interpret Romans 13 as advocating support for governing authorities are left with the difficulty of how to act under tyrants or dictators.[58] Ernst Käsemann, in his Commentary on Romans, challenged the mainstream Christian interpretation of the passage in light of German Lutheran Churches using this passage to justify the Holocaust.[66] Paul's letter to Roman Christians declares "For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong." However Christian anarchists point out an inconsistency if this text were to be taken literally and in isolation as Jesus and Paul were both executed by the governing authorities or "rulers" even though they did "right."[58]
>Jacques Ellul, a French philosopher and Christian anarchist, notes that the final verse of the Book of Judges (Judges 21:25) states that there was no king in Israel and that "everyone did as they saw fit".[7][8][9] Subsequently, as recorded in the first Book of Samuel (1 Samuel 8) the people of Israel wanted a king "so as to be like other nations"
>The gospels tell of Jesus' temptation in the desert. For the final temptation, Jesus is taken up to a high mountain by Satan and told that if he bows down to Satan he will give him all the kingdoms of the world.[15] Christian anarchists use this as evidence that all Earthly kingdoms and governments are ruled by Satan, otherwise they would not be Satan's to give.[16] Jesus refuses the temptation, choosing to serve God instead, implying that Jesus is aware of the corrupting nature of Earthly power.[17]
>>1208536
What do you mean.
>>1208546
I mean rulers brutally executed Jesus despite doing nothing but total righteousness.
And basically every one of the apostles, and eventually Paul himself. That quote is one of many great examples of Paul's prolific Roman pandering.
>>1208541
There are two different things here, though. One is "obeying the laws". The other is "advocating support". They seem the same, and in practice often are, but they are not two fully overlapping principles.
If my nation says, "Gays can get married", it does not mean I should suddenly become gay and get married. I am "under a different yoke" than those who advocate for gay marriage and my responsibility is to God, not to my own conscience and decision. The government is saying, "do not discriminate against these people and their contentions", which, you know, makes sense.
>>1208555
But he was executed for heresy?
Do you think you could be so bold as to proclaim yourself God and not be struck down?
>>1208565
Was He not right to do so? Of course.
So then the Roman rulers did in fact do terror unto someone for only doing what is right.
>>1208565
>to proclaim yourself God
>>1208240
I can't even understand what's going on in this comic.
>>1208470
>>1208568
The Sanhedrin, actually. Pilate tried three separate times to get Jesus off the hook but the Sanhedrin threatened to start another revolt if Jesus wasn't executed and then willingly accepted responsibility for his fate as Pilate literally washed his hands of the affair. He also had "Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews" on the plaque, which should tell you how enthused he was about being a catspaw.
>>1208240
girl In the comic is a qt
>>1208713
>He also had "Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews
That's because he was literally trying to become king of the Jews, like the other Messiah claimant Simon Bar Kovhka
>>1208713
He still sentenced him to death.
You can't just wash your hands of giving someone the death penalty and say "Lol not my problem", contrary to what Roman shills try to say.
A true Christian doesn't sin. If you are TRULY saved you stop sinning, you turn away from darkness and strive towards to the light. So the person in the comic is not a Christian
>>1208687
>woman gives a shit about others
>she gossips
>she hates others
>she's a hypocrite
She thinks this is all ok, she's a good Christian and prayer can justify everything.
Basically she's a bad Christian and a sinner.
>>1208240
But Protestants aren't Christian.
>>1208327
>implying conservative Christians give a shit about needy people
Not all Christians follow the Bible to the letter.
>>1208730
>So the person in the comic is not a Christian
No, she's simply a fucked up Christian.
Just think about all the mafiosos who killed many people, committed crimes, "tried" all sins... and then went to church and prayed.
>>1208722
Pilate put it on there because that claim was exactly why the Sanhedrin demanded to have Jesus killed in the first place. He wasn't too happy about what he'd done.
>>1208723
I'm not absolving the Roman authorities of all blame, but it could also be argued that unjustly executing one man to prevent a war from breaking out is a reasonable if unpleasant choice to make and at any rate the Sanhedrin knowingly and willingly accepted responsibility for Jesus' death at the time of sentencing. Villifying Pilate for being a man caught between a rock and a hard place is just petty.
>>1208531
>Pauline texts
>Jesus
>tfw Christianity has gone this low in IQ rates
>>1208783
>Are you a "good person"?
No, I'm just a sinner.
I don't need lefist webcomic artists to remind me that they're not better than me.
>>1208240
>just praying to God to get rid of sin
>Proddies will defend this.
Anyways, half the time it's just build up of people talking rad shit, and it just peaks, you know? Like when people start talking shit, you're gonna get hit. That's just nature, and God would understand.
>>1208290
>Why do you think I wrote "Christians" and not "Christcucks" in OP, hm?
Because you didn't want a backlash of people trying attack you.
>>1208432
But generally only Catholics include good works. Are you saying that other branches are not christian? Just curios.
>>1209210
>implying they aren't christian
Catholic is the True Church.
>>1208290
>religion teaches that all human beings are inherently sinful
>members of religion are sinful
>this somehow invalidates the religion
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the 4th and 5th pictures.
>>1208741
Oh I'm sorry, but protestants broke away from the Church. They aren't Christian.
>>1209213
Please now is not the time for that one.
>>1209240
We always have time to discuss why it's the true Church.
>>1208240
Why rely on 4chan examples for your impression of good Christianity actually lived out? No one could truly say that they act like a perfect Christian all the time. If you want to see what our idealised model of someone who does what it takes to be a good Christian is, look at the Saints.
>>1208401
Sola Fide embarrassed once again
>>1208741
Incorrect
>>1208482
>Jesus was a communist
>>1208528
>selling shit in his Father temple
Yeah no shit, would you be upset if you had faggots trying to peddle goods in your house?
FAITH not WORKS
Roleplayers and cathocucks gtfo
>>1209311
>no work
So you should just sin all your life and because you follow the right Church you can go to Heaven? Eat shit protestcuck and shill for Israel like the good goy you are.
>>1209311
Faith implies works since any works comes from faith itself.
Too bad if you are gonna go and end up like the OP's pic which describes Protestantism nicely
>>1208240
John 7:24
Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.
Your move fedorafags.
>>1208240
we do love you, that is why we take the time to give you good wholesome healthy constructive criticism
>>1209343
>loving people of different religions faith
>>1208482
>Anabaptist who believes in polygamy and believes in prophets detected
>>1208290
>When I finished Carlyle’s French Revolution in 1871, I was a Girondin; every time I have read it since, I have read it differently – being influenced and changed, little by little, by life and environment ... and now I lay the book down once more, and recognize that I am a Sansculotte! – And not a pale, characterless Sansculotte, but a Marat!
>t. Mark Twain
Yeah, this is a guy I'm going to take political and philosophical advice from.
>>1209238
Everyone who has a personal relationship with Jesus as savior is a Christian. We are not "churchians", we are Christians.
>>1209490
>Everyone who has a personal relationship with Jesus as savior is a Christian.
That's Martin Luther bullshit boy.
>>1209490
Explain this loser
>>1209562
I don't see a loser there. Maybe I should explain this comma.
>>1209588
No, he see's the loser. The loser is you.
>>1209500
That really bothers you, doesn't it...
Well, thankfully the Catholic church is nothing like it was in Luther's day.
>>1209591
The loser is me and he sees me, huh. That's something else. Anyone want to play charades?
>>1209593
>Well, thankfully the Catholic church is nothing like it was in Luther's day.
You mean the state?
>Deriving morals from an immoral piece of ancient literature
>>1209621
>said the atheist
>>1208240
A real Christian wouldn't defens this. I don't. They're the fskest people and don't deserve to wear the cross if they act this way. Now go find some hypocrisy of a religion that adherents would actually defend.
>>1209624
How do atheists obtain morals from an ancient piece of bloodthirsty literature?
>>1209703
>How do atheists obtain morals from an ancient piece of bloodthirsty literature?
By there parents who read the bible.
>>1209716
Are you saying atheists kill people for picking up sticks?
>>1209729
>Are you saying atheists kill people for picking up sticks?
I'm saying atheists are amoral pieces of shit that breaks laws that are minor but not major ones like murder and trying to see which way is less resistant
>>1209716
What about countries like Japan, then?
>>1208736
This desu
They're a mockery towards everything Christ stood for.
>>1209748
>What about countries like Japan, then?
They follow the laws and customs of the country.
>>1208531
Our Lady of Fatima literally complained that "Russia would spread its errors". Considering she is in heaven and delivered a message from God, I am pretty sure Jesus wouldn't condone communism
>>1209745
>I'm saying atheists are amoral pieces of shit that breaks laws that are minor but not major ones like murder and trying to see which way is less resistant
In other words you have completely given up on making a coherent point in favour of shitposting that you can't back with evidence.
Have you got a shred of statistical evidence atheists are more likely to commit murder?
>>1209745
>what is secular morality
If anything, the idea of not doing X because the guy up there will throw me in hell and make me suffer forever seems like false morality to me.
>>1209768
>In other words you have completely given up on making a coherent point in favour of shitposting that you can't back with evidence.
I don't gotta back shit, man. All I'm saying is that godlessness isn't a good thing.
>>1208240
Only Protestants do that shit. They're cultists who hijacked Christianity to suit their own ends.
>>1209772
>>what is secular morality
A load of phooey because it just replaces Christian morality and tries to trim the "inconvenient" shit from it.
>>1209780
>I don't gotta back shit, man
Which says pretty much everything about you and your worthless assertions.
>>1209795
I mean, if we wanna play that game we can talk about the godlessness of communism but that seems drab and boring.
>>1209780
>I don't gotta back shit, man. All I'm saying is that godlessness isn't a good thing.
You can't just say that without proving your point, how will you convince me? Don't you want to save me from burning in hell? Be a good person.
>>1209789
>trim the "inconvenient" shit from it.
Which is what Christians do frequently with the bible. Oh wait, you guys were just "interpreting" that particular verse in a different way, weren't you? My bad.
>>1209803
This is just incoherent. You make one claim, that gets shot down, you make another, that gets shot down so it's...
>b b b b b b but gommunism.
>>1209819
>Be a good person
No, it's be a good person and own up to your mistakes and realize that no one is perfect and that at the end of the day if you're truly sorry God will forgive you through the priest.
>Which is what Christians do frequently with the bible. Oh wait, you guys were just "interpreting" that particular verse in a different way, weren't you? My bad.
I'm not a protestant you fag.
>>1209838
>Didn't read the part of the Bible all followers of Christ are priests.
>Thinks an orthodox convention espoused by Romans is the only appropriate way to love and respect Jesus
Good times. We've come far.
>>1209825
>I mean, if we wanna play that game we can talk about how many Nazi soldiers had "Gott Mit Uns" written in their belt buckles and how Hitler believed that he was acting in accordance with the will of God.
>>1209864
>Thinks an orthodox convention espoused by Romans is the only appropriate way to love and respect Jesus
Better than the bullshit Martin Luther put in.
>>1208240
"You have to love homophiliacs to be a good person." Do you need help?
>>1209915
"Love your neighbor as yourself".
>>1208240
Not a good person
The only acceptable panel is the one with the gays
Everything else is one of those "i go to church every sunday therefore nothing i do is wrong" christians who are overopinionated and ultimatly not very faithful.
>>1209962
>You should literally be okay with faggots being faggots
>>1209962
I'm not wanking off my neighbour unless he pays me.
>>1209968
Are you racist too?
>>1209975
Of course.
>>1209975
I'm not a big fan of nigs, mostly because they ruined Detroit.
>>1209979
What an example of morality, the bible really is something to live for huh.
>>1209968
I am literally okay with the faggots being faggots. I'm also okay with the muslims being muslims, the liberals being socialists and the stoners being great consumers of hostess and nestle products. It's not my problem.
>>1209864
By contrast, many recent studies of the Greek word pistis have concluded that its primary and most common meaning was faithfulness, meaning firm commitment in an interpersonal relationship.[14][15][16][17] As such, the word could be almost synonymous with "obedience" when the people in the relationship held different status levels (e.g. a slave being faithful to his master). Far from being equivalent to "lack of human effort", the word seems to imply and require human effort. The interpretation of Paul's writings that we need to "faithfully" obey God's commands is quite different from one which sees him saying that we need to have "faith" that he will do everything for us. This is also argued to explain why James was adamant that "faith without works is dead" and that "a man is saved by works, and not by faith alone", while also saying that to merely believe places one on the same level as the demons (see James 2). The "new" perspective argues that James was concerned with those who were trying to reduce faith to an intellectual subscription without any intent to follow God or Jesus, and that Paul always intended "faith" to mean a full submission to God.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Perspective_on_Paul#Faith.2C_or_faithfulness
>>1210006
But it is a problem, it's a fucking sin.
>>1210002
God gives man dominion over the animals.
>>1210017
You're a living sin from the point of view of a couple hundred different religions, too.
Thank god we don't live in a theocracy, amirite?
>>1210037
>You're a living sin from the point of view of a couple hundred different religions, too.
Fuck'em. My religion is right and they can fuck off.
>Thank god we don't live in a theocracy, amirite?
I wouldn't be living in that country if it wasn't my religion then.
>>1210011
Thanks, opinion from wikipedia. It's so nice discussing this with you. Now, if I'd only been stoned half to death, left to die in the road a couple times and subsequently imprisoned during periods of traveling with my personal physician, I could truly see the world as an inspired person. However, I can't, and that's probably ok. I have my eyes, and those eyes see everyone with a relationship with Jesus as a Christian, you know, a Christ-ian, not a Paul-ian, or a Bible-ian, or a "what-you-fucking-think-I-should-be-ian".
>>1210054
>4 academical journals cited
>opinion
Prot logic 101
>>1210054
So that means you can sin all you want, but at the end of the day, if you just pray to God you can be saved? Yeah, no.
>>1210017
Well, if that's a problem, you sin, too. Only one being on this planet has been sinless, and it ain't you, pal.
Pointing out the dumb shit everyone else does, this diversion or deflection, might make you blind to your own trespasses, but you're gonna be really sore when you come to realize, you ain't fooling God.
>>1210079
If grace is big enough to save you, it's big enough to save me. How about that.
>>1210082
Grace is a big guy.
I'm actually starting to like protestants listening to this guy. Are their more like you?
>>1210080
>Pointing out the dumb shit everyone else does, this diversion or deflection, might make you blind to your own trespasses,
No no no, don't get me wrong, I'm a fucking sinner. But don't tell me I'm in the wrong for pointing out the sins n others.
>>1210082
No. Christ died on the cross to save you, and you can't put in a little fucking effort to do anything to be truly forgiven?
>>1210095
Is there something I should do to improve on Jesus' perfect sacrifice? Are you taking something away from or limiting His power?
>>1210082
You are not answering the question
>>1210103
>Jesus the credit card
This is the shittiest religion ever
>>1210103
>Is there something I should do to improve on Jesus' perfect sacrifice
No, I'm saying he did work to save all our asses and you sit here, and you just pray. Just pray. Not doing anything else. He did work. You did not. If you want to be forgiven, you must do work, you must earn the forgiveness of God, not doing any sacrifice no, but dammit doing literally nothing but praying to God doesn't help shit.
>>1210046
Oh no, you would likely be living in that country because that would be your religion. You just are Christian because you've been born in a christian majority country, with christian parents. If you were born in a muslim country, you wold be a muslim.
>>1210123
Uh yeah, no shit.
>>1210105
“Faith is a living, daring confidence in God's grace, so sure and certain that a man could stake his life on it a thousand times.”
>>1210122
Who says I do nothing? You?
pff.
>>1210128
The problem is the act of faith entails commitment and obedience to the Messiah especially in Paul which entails the need for works that flow from such.
Your definition contradicts Paul and the Early Christians
>>1210135
That's your belief like it or not. You deny the act of works or that anyone should actually act.
>>1210135
>Who says I do nothing? You?
Praying and assuming you'll be forgiven is nothing.
>>1210141
Your interpretations insist your actions get you to heaven, and that's specifically not what Paul said, junior.
>>1210127
Doesn't that seem strange to you? All those people who never had the chance to become christian are going to burn for the whole eternity in hell. Isn't that a bit unfair?
Believing what you do puts you in heaven puts you in the position of that decision maker, and you ain't it.
>>1210155
>All those people who never had the chance to become christian are going to burn for the whole eternity in hell. Isn't that a bit unfair?
No, they had the chance. Unless we're talking about the spiritually ignorant (unbaptized children, tribal that were assumed to be good people but because they never heard of Christ) they go to Limbo, the others go to hell for not converting, and to me, (not endorsed by the Church, just an opinion) our hell is there Heaven.
>>1208290
Why do you type like a retard?
>>1210167
>Limbo
I missed the limbo class in Bible study. Care to refresh my memory?
>>1210174
>I missed the limbo class in Bible study. Care to refresh my memory?
Okay mister wise-ass, where do the dead babies go? It ain't Heaven because they got sin.
>>1210189
Nonsense. Jesus died for them, too.
>>1210167
God should know exactly why a certain person didn't feel convinced enough to turn into a christian, if so why is that person going to hell?
Is he going to punish someone who wasn't able to believe in something because of a lack of reason to do so?
>>1210194
Jesus died to free the people from Hell, opening the door to Heaven and giving us a way to be forgiven. We still have original sin, it will never go.
So now, where do the dead babies go? It isn't Heaven, so now this must logically assume they must go to Hell, but that isn't so, because what type of sick fuck would send babies to Hell?
>>1210207
>God should know exactly why a certain person didn't feel convinced enough to turn into a christian, if so why is that person going to hell?
Because the faggot wasn't convinced.
>>1210153
Paul agrees with me and I had shown through citing academical sources to back me up.
>>1210219
>Because the faggot wasn't convinced.
Well but that's not his fault.
>>1210229
>Well but that's not his fault.
It is his fault.
>>1210207
Quite frankly, we don't know who actually goes to hell, do we?
In the end, it is God who decides. If you believe in him as a wise, merciful God, then trust that he is both wise and merciful and knows every person better than we possibly could. It's not our job to judge who goes to hell or heaven. It's our job to be kind.
>>1210231
Can you start believing that the earth is flat right now, just because it is written in the bible, or because a priest says so?
>>1210214
You don't know what hell is. You read English translations wherein "all sheol" and "all gehenna" is "all hell" and you haven't taken 5 damn minutes to learn the difference. Jesus, speaking Aramaic and/or Hebrew never once spoke the vernacular word "hell" while He was on earth in the Levant. You're not goinf to frighten me, like some ignorant child, with threats of "hell". You don't get it, you don't care to get it, you got nothin with it.
Jesus suffered death and was buried. He descended into.. where ? Sheol. Now you know.
>>1210242
Belief is different from faith, m8. Ot sounds strange, but faith isn't based on logic or reasoning. This is why faith and love(agape) are always written as two sides of the same coin. Both are illogical. Both are a choice you make, even against your better judgement.
>>1208240
>not helping the dog
what kind of sick fuck is she?
>>1210239
Then why does your religion preaches that this and that will get you in heaven, and this and that will get you in hell?
>>1210225
Your academic sources are biased, and my point wasn't what someone thinks, it was sarcasm about the fact you didn't say what "you" think. If you just "think" what you're being indoctrinated, fine, I think you're keen and great that way, but the misunderstanding everyone should think and understand as "those people" is fucked and wrong.
>>1210260
You didn't have a question worth answering in that to which I replied. The answer would be (empty set).
>>1208252
>Being repulsed by sinners is nothing wrong with it
Everything is wrong with it. When you are repulsed by a sinner you are repulsed by Gods creation and God himself.
Even if you ignore a central idea of Christianity (that we are all sinners) you are already in a wretched place.
>>1210270
So babies that are not baptized go to hell. Protestants everyone.
>>1210262
the pastors want to control you
>christfag here
Christianity is as much of a brainwash as all the other ones, just not as many radicals
i hate the organized part of it.
i believe you have to have a personal relationship with god, not some retarded "hey guys i went to church on sunday and sat for an hour to listen to a guy talk to me about god" none of that shit sticks
>>1210262
As guidelines for the individual. We learn what pleases God and what displeases him, but the two aren't mutually exclusive. What if a usurer uses his gains to feed thw poor? I believe every abrahamic religion also clearly preaches God's mercy and his "I can do what I want"-tier autonomy. This is why he alone is the judge of the day of judgement.
If God creates physical laws and breaks them to do miracles, why wouldn't his mercy be able to break divine rules?
>>1210277
No, I said Jesus came for them, too.
>>1210286
>But there's no proof of God.
And I have in God.
>>1210288
>still have original sin
>go to Heaven
Fucking paradoxical shit right there.
>>1210286
>god is intolerant
Explain?
>>1210293
I believe what I think it's true, and what I have reasons to believe in. If God can't cope with that, and will send me to hell just because I don't think the way that he wants me to think, then he is intolerant.
>>1210312
The question is, if you don't believe in God, why do you feel you have rights over him? Specifically, why do you feel entitled to eternal bliss and reward for doing... nothing, or perhaps even opposing him? What do you think is a fair compensation?
>>1210291
Oh, you haven't heard the half of how I disagree with mainstream. I don't believe we go to heaven when we die, but we go and sit and wait for Jesus' coming, then all the saints "rise up" and we go together.
How you like me now?!?!
See, I'm not only in this for my heavenly reward, pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. I'm certainly hoping I'm one of the elect, but you know, to me, doing it, believing in it, because I think I'd get something in return sounds kinda selfish. I do it, because I love and respect what someone did for me, because it's the right thing to do. I believe that. You should, too.
Stop worrying about "if you're going to heaven" or what the fuck other people do and just start caring about people, in a real way. Treat them like humans, give them dignity. If they treat you like crap, so be it, you were treated like crap for the right reason, and you'll be ok. All this shit here passes anyway.
>>1210329
Your views are largely in agreement with mine, mate, and I'm muslim. Peace be upon you.
>>1210335
Thanks, you, too.
>>1210329
>I don't believe we go to heaven when we die, but we go and sit and wait for Jesus' coming, then all the saints "rise up" and we go together.
We aren't Jews.
>he still won't admit that Children go to Limbo so they don't get punished by being born but not having the true grace
>>1210321
>Specifically, why do you feel entitled to eternal bliss and reward for doing... nothing, or perhaps even opposing him? What do you think is a fair compensation?
I don't think anything because I don't believe in that, I'm just pointing (what I think are) inconsistencies in your belief, so you can perhaps think about it.
Also, it's the same with you guys, if you understand that not everyone have the same belief as yours, why do you feel entitled to judge who is going to hell and who is going to heaven?
>>1210343
>We aren't Jews.
because Jews believe in Jesus or His second coming.
>>1210263
No one's saying that. You can't even bring in any academical sources to the table and dare act all arrogant towards me? Fuck you asshole. Unless you got scholarship or knowledge of the Biblical text in Greek and Hebrew, shut the fuck up
>>1210357
That mindset that we shall be judged on the end of days is Talmudic, a Jewish lie.
>>1210361
Is that you, ha-satan?
>>1210350
As a muslim, I don't know who's going to hell. The qur'an has given me indicators of what pleases God and what displeases him, but it also has me recite the al fatiha 17 times a day, which states that God is the most merciful and wise and the "sole owner" of the day of judgement.
To imagine that I can judge over people is tantamount to me setting myself besides God as a divine judge, and quite frankly, I fear God too much to do so.
>>1210375
Don't let the secret get out that real Muslims are more forgiving and humane than 75% of the Christians in the world. 700 Club will go bankrupt and Creflo Dollar won't get his jet planes.
>>1210361
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miOWJ4rKb_g
Life ain't your little game, junior.
>>1210385
>Don't let the secret get out that real Muslims are more forgiving and humane than 75% of the Christians in the world
>buying into the protestants are Christian meme
>>1210385
I'd rather let the secret out that most of the "christian world" right now is under the heavy burden of immense wealth, which makes it very hard to be very religious or spiritual. When the muslim world came into money (umayyads), it quickly descended into racism and nepotism as well.
Money corrupts us all. Muslim and christian alike.
>>1210395
You don't even know what Paul said and can't even provide citations retard
>>1210400
Well, from the standpoint of Christ giving money is good. All acts of charity are good, but being forced to pay into it isn't good, because it must come from the heart to give money.
>>1210413
Ephesians 2 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh[a] and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
>>1210417
If any that simply shows the need for works which is stated right at the end. Good job idiot
>>1210416
But I have a theory about why giving money is good. The more you have of it, the harder it is to part with it. There are countless instances, you might have experienced it yourself, where people who are absolutely broke share the last little bit of food or money they own.
Compare this to having to give your last 1000 bucks to charity. Money weighs on us, man.
>>1210385
>Don't let the secret get out that real Muslims are more forgiving and humane than 75% of the Christians in the world.
Tell that to your women.
>>1210430
That's what you read there, huh. Well, that's really something.
>>1208470
The Sabbath was made for Man, not God.
We were made to be Good Stewards of Creation.
Their is nothing inherently immoral about homosexual attraction, only acting on it is considered immoral and a blasphemy against God's gift of sexuality and marriage.
And gossiping/mocking like a bitch is immoral.
Poverty is inherent to humanity but the poor must still be cared for and loved.
Injustice against the wage-earner is a sin that calls out to Heaven for vengeance.
>>1210439
Too bad. The passage doesn't say no works. It simply says that Jesus is important and that without him no one can be saved. It doesn't say do nothing imbecile
>>1210431
>Money weighs on us, man.
That it does, because money is a concept of capitalism, a godless system for which anyone can survive, anyone can sink.
I just think, personally, that money just exists, it's concept, and that greed, greed my good Mehmet, is what rots the people, not the money itself.
>>1210457
It seems to say, pretty explicitly, you are not saved by your works, but by God, so no one can say they're doing it better than someone else.
Pretty much everyone agrees Paul was the "saved by grace" guy and James was more implying on the importance of performing the works, but hey, you do things how you see fit.
And look, it doesn't mean I'm saying "don't do good things". That's an asinine take from what I've said. I said your works don't save you, Jesus saved you. God loves obedience. If you're just doing what you want to do, and apologizing later, He knows if you're being genuine. Who could believe in a God who can't tell the difference?
I'm tired of this. I don't even believe you or a couple others are even Christian at all, but trolls. I've been asked, I witnessed, and I'm done for now. I hope you find someone who helps you more.
>>1210496
False. The passage says nothing about works not saving. If any it already says you need it just that you cannot boast of it since such wouldn't save and would be pointless without Christ. So too bad this entails works being factored as well as part of faith which in Paul's own usage entails obedience. That entails actions, effort and work. Too bad. Your view is not of Scripture or of Paul and the entirety of the Church Fathers show this
>>1210552
It's because they subscribe to sola scriptura
>>1210434
>Tell that to your women.
I will. Women do what they are told in civilised societies.
>>1210572
Oh yes, just like how you do what you're told by your dictator god. How very humane, forgiving and civilized.
>>1210572
>Women do what they are told in civilised societies.
But all that breeds is contempt.
>>1210524
u just dont think ur god is powerful enough so u have to help him forgive u. its ok, not all have a god with amazing grace. whatever u are maybe muslim or something it will be ok. just believe.
>>1210676
>God
>forgiving you without proving it
>be a child rapist priest
>go to heaven
wew
>>1210778
>child rapist priest
>heaven
Ahahahahaha no. They're damned to hell.
>>1210786
You can't say that for sure because "God works in mysterious ways".
>>1210812
>"God works in mysterious ways".
I mean, Constantine can pull that shit on ya and her bullshit "Oh I don't know" answer but I'm not her, and I can tell you, that the priest that diddles kids go to hell.
>>1210819
You must be really intimate with God.
>>1210845
>You must be really intimate with God.
I am not, I'm stating the facts.
>>1210819
Thanks, God. Nice to hear from you again. Will you be back shortly, then?
Protestants explain
The first clear attitude to emerge on the relation between Scripture, tradition and the church was the coincidence view: that the teaching of the church, Scripture and tradition coincide. Apostolic tradition is authoritative but does not differ in content from the Scriptures. The teaching of the church is likewise authoritative but is only the proclamation of the apostolic message found in Scripture and tradition. The classical embodiment of the coincidence view is found in the writings of Irenaeus and Tertullian.
These both reject the Gnostic claims to a secret tradition supplementing Scripture. Apostolic tradition does not add to Scripture but is evidence of how it is correctly to be interpreted. This tradition is found in those churches which were founded by the apostles, who taught men whose successors teach today. These apostolic churches agree as to the content of the Christian message, in marked contrast to the variations among the heretics. It is important to note that it is the church which is the custodian of Scripture and tradition and which has the authentic apostolic message. There was no question of appealing to Scripture or tradition against the church. This is partly because the apostolic tradition was found in the church but not just for this reason: the Holy Spirit preserves the church from error and leads her into the truth. The real concern of Irenaeus and Tertullian was not with the relation between Scripture and tradition but with the identity of ecclesiastical with apostolic teaching. Any exposition of their teaching on Scripture and tradition which fails to show this is to that extent defective. (A.N.S. Lane, “Scripture, Tradition and Church: An Historical Survey”, Vox Evangelica, Volume IX – 1975, pp. 39, 40 –)
Where is Sola Scriptura?
>>1210866
So we should murder people horribly, with torture and fire, for centuries, because the church is free from error. Got it.
Being a real christian is hard work!
>>1210898
>So we should murder people horribly, with torture and fire, for centuries, because the church is free from error.
Yeah, fuck'em. Maybe they shouldn't have fucked up.
>Being a real christian is hard work!
I know right, being the state is hard work.
>>1210898
You are not answering the argument.
Where is Sola Scriptura in the earliest stages of Christianity and in the Church Fathers?
Oh wait, it isn't there and the opposite to it is true!
serious question here from a secularist. lets assume your god is real, and his moral code is just and good. why is worshipping necessary? parents give us a moral code, as do many other people, but we don't worship them. so why is worship necessary
>>1211463
Because it is in moral code.
>>1211463
>so why is worship necessary
To prove to him.
>>1211476
>prove what to him?
That you love him.
>>1211481
so should i worship my gf and mom and dad too?
>>1210257
Dogs don't go to heaven
>>1211488
>so should i worship my gf
I don't know if I'd say worship you fucking masochist.
>>1211481
Isn't he omniscient? Why would he need worship as a proof of love if he already knows if you love him or not?
>>1211495
You need to prove to yourself that you love him.
>>1211467
> prove anything
> to omniscient entity
This is as unnecessary as it could be.
God knows already if you love him or not.
>>1211496
I don't need to worship something to know that I love it. Do you worship everything you love?
Do you love your mom? Do you worship her? If not, how do you know that you love her?
>>1211500
What if I am sure in my feelings?
Can I skip the prove phase then?
>>1211508
>Do you worship everything you love?
No, because to imply worship, it must be a God.
>>1211519
Then, you don't love your mom?
>>1211524
I love my mom, and I show it to her. That isn't worship you autist.
>>1211527
Gotta love you guys and your special pleading.
>>1211536
What are you talking about?
>>1211546
Do I have to show love for X, to prove it to myself that I love it?
>>1211565
>Do I have to show love for X, to prove it to myself that I love it?
But that's only in relation to God.
>>1211573
What?
>>1211586
Exactly. God is different than your mother.
>>1211601
"You see, this only applies to God".
That's exactly what special pleading is, you dunce.
>>1211612
No bully, at least I'm not trying to explain the trinity again.
>>1211619
>why should we HAVE to worship a god?
Because man sucks shit.
>>1211623
eh, i think we're actually not that bad. besides how destrctive we can be i think we're actually pretty compassionate, maybe even more so the latter, but just barely
>>1211623
thats not a valid reason to worship
>>1208240
Yea I sometimes do that, but I never hit post - I actually hit close or delete message, because I also feel bad for making someone feel sad.
>>1211496
what does that have to do with being moral? if that is a part of gods morality then his morality sounds flawed if it caters to his sense of ego
>>1208327
The poor which Jesus usually helped had some spiritual life, most of the times they came to Jesus without knowing who He was but felt a strong spiritual power, also most of the poor were jews just like today you would help a poor christian but don't help a poor alcoholic, a sinner or member of another religion.
I would help if it stays in my power anyone - but when I can play my help - like organizing a meal for poor people - I prioritize defavorized and poor Christians over other religions.
>>1211656
we're talking about morality, there is no such thing as proofs, just what we think is beneficial and to whom
