If Hitler listened to his generals and left Berlin when the soviets attack, what would be their next plan?
>>1018395
>their
The Nazis or the Soviets?
>>1018399
Oops. I meant the Nazis.
They probably would've betrayed him and surrendered to the brits/americans.
>>1018402
They probably would have tried to surrender to the Americans. Hitler allegedly had a plan to fall back to some fortress in Bavaria, but I'm not sure if that ever would have actually gone through and in the end the only difference would be that Hitler blows his brains out near Munich instead of in Berlin.
>>1018395
getting caught
>>1018395
He shoots himself slightly later?
Or maybe if we're really lucky he has an epic meltdown in front of the Jury at Nuremburg
>>1018420
Russia's a big country.
>>1018444
>epic meltdown in front of the jury in Nuremberg
>tfw we're in the universe where we will never see that
Not even a stormfag but I would triple my college debt to see that
>>1018444
What would be a good ironic execution for Hitler? I was thinking shot by a communist Jewish girl, but that seems a little too on the nose.
>>1018461
>You will never watch Hitler dissolve into a blubbering mess as he is confronted with the sheer depth of his failures
It'd be the that scene from downfall BUT IN REAL LIFE
Would he have been tried and hanged, or shot in the back of the head and dumped into the ocean like Osama bin Laden? That's the real question.
>>1018480
Probably drowned or cremated after execution to prevent anyone defiling his body just like Bin Laden
>>1018478
>Hitler's face when the prosecutor points out that he was defeated by two cripples, one leading a nation of communists and the other leading a nation of decadent mongrels
>>1018488
>88
perfect reply
perfect gif
perfect post
>>1018468
Killed like Kosher beef, then made into sausage and used to feed Auschwitz survivors
>>1018447
Fuck you
>>1018642
Hey buddy I think you got the wrong door. Nuremberg is two blocks away.
The Alpine redoubt turned out to be just propaganda so he'd be forced to flee to Munich or Norway. There were around 500,000 men still in Bohemia and southern Germany, and another 200,000 in Norway.
>>1018715
Make that one million men in Bohemia and 400,000 in Norway. Why did Hitler remain in Berlin and then shoot himself when he had 1.5 million men still combat capable? Berlin was defended by 40,000 children and old men, there was no hope of stopping the Soviets. He should have withdrawn to Munich, or at least recalled the Bohemian and Scandinavian armies to Germany to defend Berlin. He was basically dying by the end of the war though. An account I read a few years ago put forth the idea that he was too fragile to escape, and that the stress of it would have killed him anyway.
>>1018736
Berlin was defended by almost 1 million of regular troops, plus the Volksturm.
>>1018736
>at least recalled the Bohemian and Scandinavian armies to Germany to defend Berlin.
How are they supposed to get there, teleport behind the Red Army?
>>1018766
>Nothing personal, Josef
>*unsheathes Mein Kampf*
>>1018770
I think there would be a lot less hero worship of him if everybody got to see the delusional quivering mess of a man that he was by the summer of 1945
>>1018488
So wonderfully poetic
>>1018766
There was still a route open from Berlin to Bavaria through Saxony and Denmark.
>>1018764
I was talking about the city centre, but even those troops wouldn't have stood a chance. If he had brought in the Bohemian and Scandinavian armies, the German forces would have at least equalled the Soviet forces. The Germans still had nearly three million combat ready troops, but rather than bring them together for a last stand defence of the Reich, they split them between three fronts.
>>1018764
Soviets had 9 million.
America had 12 million with more to mobilize, total air superiority, and nukes in their pocket.
Would it have mattered?
>>1018811
The Soviets had 16 million. The Allies had 90 divisions, while the Germans had 240, and the Soviets had over 300
>>1018823
>The Allies had 90 divisions, while the Germans had 240, and the Soviets had over 300
numbers of divisions are meaningless, troop numbers are important
that's a lot of guys right there
They would hand him to the soviets and have him hanged like Mussolini.
>>1018823
Right, and the Soviets conscripted 30 million.
But a lot were dead by 1945, or not combat effective.
America had lost less troops in Europe by then then Germany lost in the first months of invading Russia.
They had a huge population to draw on.
They had a massive advantage in tanks and air power.
They had nukes.
Nothing was going to stop them.
Also, how do you get the troops in Norway home?
It's like saying "why did Japan surrender, they had so many troops in China!?"
>>1018736
Scandinavian army was pinned down by the Allies Navy, which would have just sunk it all.
Besides, withdrawing the rest so fast would have just turned into a rout. Kraut armies were already fragile, and such a massive retreat would have easily been smashed by Allies/Soviets and transformed into a massive and unsightly slaughter on the road to Berlin. Plus the logistics of moving those troops, even with theoretical great discipline, would have been all but impossible.
>>1018764
The end of the Luftwaffe sealed Berlins fate. It doesn't matter how many men you have in an urban combat scenario when the enemy will just bomb you into submission.
Plus, lack of armored vehicles and artillery would have turned Berlin into a German bloodbath.
>>1018835
The Soviets had 16 million men under arms at the war's end. The Germans were able to support their troops in Norway right up to the end of war, so they must have still had some form of transport available. There were a lot of German ships anchored in the Baltic.
The Allied forces in Europe never outnumbered the forces the Germans had available in total. The issue there was that 80% of the army was fighting in the east. The Germans had no more than. 40 divisions in the west, while they had over 200 divisions in the east. If Russia was not in the picture, the Allies would have never gotten onto the beaches at Normandy. That's the problem with fighting a two front war though. Hitler was advised against it, but did it anyway.
>>1018909
I won't even make arguments about combat readiness, by your own numbers its 28 million (not including the British), versus 3 million tops.
America fought a two front war too.
>>1018937
There really wouldn't be any need to do so.
>>1018909
>The Allied forces in Europe never outnumbered the forces the Germans had available in total.
That doesn't sound right, the USSR alone conscripted 29 million men during WWII. Unless the Germans had literally 3/8 of their population in the army, I don't see how German forces could have even outnumbered Soviet forces alone, let alone Soviet, American, British, and French forces.
>>1018995
It's 20 million for Germans and 34 million for Soviets.
But situation is not so simple. Soviets lost major territory (68 million people) while Germans had allies and volunteers from occupied territory.
Overall Axis had the numerical and even industrial advantage, plus technological advantage.
They failed to use it properly, even though Germans employed slave labor a lot.
>>1018826
>numbers of divisions are meaningless
This. A division could supposed to be 15000 guys maybe it could be 10000 guys. And that's just on paper.
>>1018662
I'll show you who's the boss of this gym.
>>1018468
>execution
Keep him alive and healthy. The man is a piece of living history.
Keep him in and out of interviews for the rest of his life.
>>1018395
crashing this reich
with no survivors
>>1019356
>I said Allied forces, not Soviet forces.
......what?
>>1019364
The British had a cell prepared for him in the Tower.
>>1019445
The Western Allies.
What is your issue?
>>1019034
>even industrial advantage, plus technological advantage
no
>>1018395
I wonder what would be the status of holocaust denial today if Hitler himself testified at Nuremberg?
>>1019463
the same
you had no one deny it at nuremberg irl
why would one more head honcho going against the denialists zany beliefs switch the warped clockwork in their brains?
>>1019452
Man, he should've surrendered to them then. Fuck the soviets.
Imagine a world with hitler commentary?
>>1019457
>almost entire Europe under occupation
>not industrial advantage
>>1019453
>the Western Allies
Oh, that makes more sense. It's just weird to say "Allies" and expect people to know that you're excluding the Soviet Union, it's like saying "Real Madrid" and not including Ronaldo.
Probably just sit someplace sunny and chill while those sweet pretty Nazi girls and women were getting repeatedly gang raped back in Berlin.
"Beats blowing your own brains out."
>>1018395
he'd escape to south america like he did and live happily ever after
>>1019502
half of france, norway, central europe and a chunk of eastern europe
vs.
british empire
soviet union
us of motherfucking a
>>1019507
I thought most leave the Soviets out because they withdrew from the Allied council after the war, and weren't originally in it with Britain and France.
>>1019526
That's including India though, which wasn't a huge factor in the war. Germany was never going to invade England outside of building a huge navy, but it came close to starving the English out of the war. If Germany had built a proper navy with carriers, England would not have lasted.
>>1018937
International outrage?
I mean how would the Soviets or the rest of the Allies react to an America that just waves its nuclear dick around.
From what little i know, didnt Hitler have plans for gurellia warfare to take place around Prussia?
>>1019478
>no one denied it at nuremberg
Right, except the highest ranking nazi on trial (goering).
>>1018395
Crashing the nazi party with no survivors.
>>1018395
crashing this Reich
>>1018395
crashing his plan with no survivors
>>1018811
Soviets actually had 25mil
>>1018835
>They had a massive advantage in tanks and airforce
T34/85 vs Sherman... I think not
P51 vs Yak-3... I think not
>>1018642
Was getting shitposted part of your plan?
>>1018995
Soviets are not allies
>>1019445
Soviets are not allies, they are their own side
>>1018826
The most ridiculous thing is when people compare Soviet Armies to American Armies.
>>1018909
> If Russia was not in the picture, the Allies would have never gotten onto the beaches at Normandy.
Why do people think Naval Invasions can be countered by sheer numbers?
basically the most he could have done was get down to munich or a area around the alps. Maybe a cavern system and just hold out there for a few more months..thats about it though.
>>1019533
And if Britain had built a giant army, they would have crossed the Rhine in the first week of the war.
>>1022974
Soviet army could hhave crushed Americans in 45
>>1018468
I once read an alt-history short story about Hitler's execution in Moscow that made me laugh.
>Hitler is led out into Red Square in chains
>Cheering crowds gathered, soldiers lined up, Stalin presiding over the whole thing
>While walking to the gallows, Hitler realizes it's too short
>Noose is put around his neck but he's still just standing on the ground, with no trapdoor to fall through
>Nothing happens
>Hour passes, then two
>Hitler still just standing there like an asshole with a noose around his neck, looking around at the crowd and slowly going crazy
>Soviet soldier shoots him in the knee without warning
>Almost falls, but catches himself
>Realizes that if he loses his balance and can't stand, he'll "hang" himself and die
>Forced to stand on his bleeding, shattered-kneecapped leg
>Still just waiting, wondering when the next shot is coming...
>>1019492
I really can't imagine a worse fate than being Hitler, forced to watch the world become what it has become. He'd have probably died at the very height of the hippie era.
>>1022995
They might have been able to crush our army, but we could have dropped the atom bomb on every Soviet city without fear of reprisal.
It's a damned shame that we didn't use the bomb a bit more when we alone had it.
>>1018395
>We didn't had Hitler sighing Third Armistice Compiègne Wagon
>>1018395
>>1018402
>what would be the nazis plan
Damage control. Try to surrender without losing too much land.
I imagine it would have ended up worse for western germans, since as it is they got good treatment and were given bags of dosh to be the poster boys for capitalism just in front of the soviets.
