There is no reason to pick GNU/Linux over BSD
>>55626538
What bsd
>>55626538
>working drivers
>non-pants-on-head package management
>native software that's not garbage
Also, the linux compatibility layer on freebsd is a piece of shit. Better than nothing, but not by much.
>>55626568
Drivers are just as good as GNU/Linux on ThinkPads and Macs. Shit hardware is shit hardware.
>>55626617
>Drivers are just as good as GNU/Linux on ThinkPads and Macs.
Except for the fact they don't exist, you mean.
>hardware used on 95% of machines, including macs, is shit hardware
>that's why it works perfectly
>despite not working
You belong in the looney bin, mate.
>>55626538
>>55626538
i can barely see this
>>55626647
>he's never used BSD
I disagree.
BSD is for productive people and genuine Unix hackers.
But Linux is better for gamer kiddies who see their computer as a dedicated media consumption machine and never go beyond configuring the color scheme on their tiling wm and feel superior to Windows/Mac users because of this.
The latter demographic (AKA 80% of /g/) can stick with Linux. We don't want them.
>>55626552
either freebsd or openbsd
also
>Die you degenerate Macfag
>>55626841
"Linux people do what they do because they hate Microsoft. We do what we do because we love Unix." -Theo de Raadt
GNU/Linux has support for a lot more stuff, even open source, that doesn't work on *BSD yet. This applies to drivers, programming languages, and games alike. I use Arch, Debian Stable, and OpenBSD depending on what is best suited to a particular task.
>>55627240
>GNU/Linux has support for a lot more stuff, even open source, that doesn't work on *BSD yet
>This applies to drivers
Yea, tell that NetBSD
>programming languages
Yea, why would you want propietary stuff that only runs on embedded Systems built for NASA Satelites?
>and games alike
Thats gamed mostly to the mainstream Plattforms such as Consoles and Windows, and therefore, its no real valid Argument
>>55627339
NetBSD supports fewer architectures with binary packages and up to date compiler toolchains than Debian does.
>programming languages
Things like Go and Node.js and Rust are necessary for some exciting major projects like cjdns, ipfs, and Servo. I actually migrated a server from Illumos back to Debian because that was easier than getting Mattermost working on Solaris.
>b-but you don't have gaem
I personally have over fifty games installed on Linux, have no Windows machine, and have not bought a console since the Wii. Native Linux games, emulation, WINE, and old consoles are enough for me.
the games argument is really retarded considering that no one ever specifies what they mean by it
are we talking about open source games of which there are plenty of on both sides? are we talking about steam on linux (lol)?
>>55627399
openbsd has more officially supported ports with binary packages than netbsd, which is kind of sad
as for the old compiler toolchains, blame either the old platform or GPLv3
____ has no games!
____ has no drivers!
No one uses ____!
Notice how the same shit was always thrown at Linux. These are not valid arguments, they're all shallow insults. BSD is a much more stable, much more free system.
>>55627522
let's not forget that guy who insists no one cares about BSD and flips the fuck out every time he's shown proof of otherwise
GPL/linux users are literally this autistic
Just use what works for what you need at the time. Get all the OSes installed if one is better than the other at the task you need to perform.
Jesus you kids have nothing to do all day.
>>55627730
This.
I'm fucking tired to read all day the same shit.
VMs exists and multi-boot exists. Use the OS you need in the moment you need.
>>55626538
>Native compatibility for Linux programs
/Thread
>>55627800
>he uses proprietary linux programs
top kek
>>55627808
>being a freetard
hows unemployment?
>>55627817
name me one proprietary linux program that you use for your job
no, there's no photoshop for linux
>>55626538
>buying a mac
>using anything other than OSX
literally why
I'll use BSD once there's a GPL licensed BSD
Not using a cuck license system
>>55627859
>>buying a mac
literally why
I've been contemplating the possibly of switching from Linux.
What BSD should I try and what should I expect?
What are the main differences to Linux?
>>55627869
im sure this thread was made to attract you and it actually worked
>>55627888
>What BSD should I try and what should I expect?
openbsd is the most newbie friendly, ships with X and 3 WMs (only 1 of which is actually good unless you actually like TWM and FVWM)
>What are the main differences to Linux?
-decent documentation
-the userland is part of the operating system, so if you have to report an issue with cat for example, you only really have to specify your OS version and branch
-great separation of third party programs under /usr/local or /usr/pkg if its netbsd, i ran into too many linux distros that just shoved everything under /usr
>>55627869
>implying GPL isn't by definition cuckoldry
Ayy hol up, you aint even tryna share dat code bruh, nee sum fuggn' GPL aahaha
>>55627888
PC-BSD is the most Ubuntu-like BSD for jump right in use. Lets you pick a DE on install too
>>55627937
Not him, but
What about PC-BSD? I tried that a couple of years ago but got a bit fed up of having two package systems at the same time. Did they and FreeBSD finally get their act together? Is OpenBSD saner regarding that?
>>55627985
>ubongo
>>55627947
GPL people are literally the niggers of the FOSS world.
They never, EVER stop intruding everywhere and they always complain when people bitch at them for it.
>>55627997
You're talking about ports and binaries?
You don't really have to use both. Every BSD has that system in some way or another.
But the OpenBSD devs recommend that non-devs stay away from the ports and just use the binary package manager, so there's that. Ports are what builds those packages eventually, it's mostly a dev facility.
>>55627998
They're the reason everyone started saying Open Source instead. Total marxists
>>55627998
Don't forget when they "bless" projects and then subsequently smother them.
>>55628005
Kinda, the whole pkgng + pkg + ports + appcafe jazz
>>55627985
>ubuntu-like
That's not an advantage
>>55628035
Oh yeah, right. PC-BSD has an additional package manager.
I think FreeBSD now is down to two methods of managing programs, since pkgng is a replacement for the pkg_ tools.
>>55627227
Or we do what we do because the kernel never stops working.
It's a well maintained and relied upon code base with lots of people.
"Because they use it" is a valid argument in sysadmins world since with more users comes more fixes, bug reports, and community support/docs
>>55628051
Do you think you could do a quick comparison of pkgng vs whatever OpenBSD has, or point me to it?
>>55628095
They're functionally very similar.
The main, only really big difference I can think of is that pkg is a big C binary while the pkg_ tools are all separate perl scripts.
I'm an OpenBSD user but I'd argue that Perl is a poor choice. It IS known as the scripting language that's "easy to write, hard to read" after all.
You can compare them here:
http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/src/usr.sbin/pkg_add/
https://github.com/freebsd/pkg
>>55628095
>>55628143
Oh, and I should add that if you're going to use OpenBSD, nvidia/broadcom hardware will not cut it because both of those companies suck.
>>55627842
Vmware
> he uses windows or apple in any professional capacity
>>55627998
GPL people are the french revolutionists of the FOSS world
>>55628380
>french
So I'm right, they're niggers.
FreeBSD > OpenBSD
>>55628396
In server environments, maybe.
>>55627522
>not valid
>Linux adoption rate 2%
>99% of that is servers because it's free lel
kek
>>55628407
>because it's free
the internet is unix dumbfuck
>>55628407
that's why linux users laughing at us is funny
>>55628414
Eat shit nobody gives a shit about servers except the pajeets paid to maintain them
>>55626538
LXC containers, stable virtualization with KVM with working PCI passthrough, non-retarded package management, cgroups, pulseaudio, Snaps/Flatpakare, docker are enough reasons. Also the driver situation is ridiculously bad even for open source friendly companies.
Outside of ZFS for SANs and routers most people who use BSD are either neck beards or commies who have no real work to do than to fap over their init system
>>55628457
>being this much of a redhat shill
>>55626538
I hate GNU as much as you,
but there is no reason to hate on the rest of the Linux distributions, that are actually decent
Gentoo in particular
>>55628450
how is high school these days?
>>55628465
Eh? Also I forgot to mention that Alpine Linux is pretty similar to what BSD gives you. Should be nice for small netbooks. Also power management and drivers will actually work LMAO
>>55628457
>real work
you mean fixing multiple vendors shit rather than just admitting unix is the only sane solution
>>55628515
>Alpine Linux is pretty similar to what BSD gives you
>>55628526
their installer is pretty much lifted straight from openbsd
it's one of the most sane linux distro there is imo
>>55626841
oh man, a group of hipsters among a larger group of hipsters. when you people grow up, youll realize few people using a flavor of unix be it linux or bsd based ever even thought about things such as microsoft hate or game support.
as for reasons to pick linux, support is the biggest reason, and the fact it is the defacto unix operating system today. and its licenced for copyleft instead of a cuck permissive license
>>55628630
>hipsters
oh its you again, bsdfag
>>55627842
I use VMware and Synology DSM.
Could someone redpill me on FreeBSD and how it compares to Linux?
>>55629075
Windows:Linux = Linux:BSD
>>55629075
read the second part of this >>55627937
there's also more, but it's really a "love it or hate it" kind of deal
>>55629075
Take the most tedious and "hackery" parts of maintaining a linux-install and multiply by 5.
Netflix is a contributor to FreeBSD
>>55629143
I'm probably gonna take a look at it then.
>>55629172
so is apple and sony
b-but wait i thought that all companies were evil!
>>55629172
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP_bKvXkoC4
>>55629182
i think it's a very good thing. listen to Gleb. he's a rational guy
>>55629186
>>55627859
OS X is a steaming pile of shit. Not as bad as Windows, but still pretty fucking bad.
>>55627874
The hardware is great. Not only do those laptops last for years if you take good care of them, they're also thin and light and look nice. I've really enjoyed all of the Apple laptops I've owned. The hardware is overpriced as fuck so take a look on ebay. Used 17 inch Macbooks are being sold for around $100-300 now.
>>55629201
>OS X is a steaming pile of shit. Not as bad as Windows, but still pretty fucking bad.
you've never even given it a fair go. your opinion doesn't matter because it's a steaming pile of unsubstantuated shit.
>>55629201
>apple hardware
>good in any shape or form
sure, maybe 10 years ago
>allows proprietary software
literal cucks, into the trash it goes
>>55628086
>the kernel never stops working
>the same kernel that is unable to recover from audio driver crashes
>the same kernel that is unable to recover from video driver crashes
>even Windows and Mac don't crash when the audio/video drivers crash
>as a matter of fact, this issue was solved in 2003 by every OS other than Linux
This is why Linux users are retarded. Just stop deluding yourself and admit that the Linux kernel is garbage.
No BSD hate here, i just dont really wanna use a system that i have to build from base up like debian minimal / arch / gentoo, and from what i know BSD.
I know this is a great thing to do because you really have what you want/need and configure it how you like.
But on the other hand the thing that really impressed me on linux, ubuntu 8.04 or mandriva back then is that i had a simple installation process, at least as simple as windows's, and no real configuration afterwards.
Of course this changed after i had to install nvidia drivers or remove acceleration with configs etc, but still the out of the box experience was at Windows 10 level years ago.
I mean it would be cool to have a super optimized system on my laptop that boots in a few seconds and works great for browsing internet/libreoffice/some media us, but i don’t think the time spent on tinkering would be worth it.
>>55629226
i'm a BSD user but isn't the linux kernel partly modular now?
>>55629231
openbsd is so easy to install, you can almost literally mash the enter key at the installer and still get a X desktop
>>55629249
It has kernel modules but driver crashes can still kill the kernel.
On my laptop Linux 4.5 and above crashes on boot if I start the computer with headphones plugged in.
>>55629212
I've been using it for work since Snow Leopard. It used to be way ahead of its time. Now it's falling behind in many ways. Yosemite and El Captain are absolute abominations. I've had to revert back to Mavericks just so I don't have a buggy, unstable loo of horse manure on my desk. Ubuntu works much better on my Mac.
>>55629214
The newest Macbook I have is from late 2014. I haven't really used anything newer but I can tell you that the iPhone build quality has gone down the shitter over the last year. I repair iOS devices and remove iCloud locks for a living. The iPhone 5s was the last decent mobile device they made.
As a new Linux user, are there any significant advantages in switching to BSD? I'm not exactly a power user.
>>55629365
the ecosystem is tighter, and the license allows you to make money and commercial products that you can sell, or give away from free to companies who will make money with it. the GPL is a minefield for that stuff
>>55629257
both openBSD and freeBSD install look to me like scripted arch installs, and the efect is the same - i have to manually install all the packages i need for my daily use. And those are packages that literally 90% of desktop users need so i see no reason to do it manually.
Sorry if this triggers you but i really see no reason to do so if i have a working debian/ubuntu/fedora install.
FreeBSD has many noteworthy features. Some of these are:
Preemptive multitasking with dynamic priority adjustment to ensure smooth and fair sharing of the computer between applications and users, even under the heaviest of loads.
Multi-user facilities which allow many people to use a FreeBSD system simultaneously for a variety of things. This means, for example, that system peripherals such as printers and tape drives are properly shared between all users on the system or the network and that individual resource limits can be placed on users or groups of users, protecting critical system resources from over-use.
Strong TCP/IP networking with support for industry standards such as SCTP, DHCP, NFS, NIS, PPP, SLIP, IPsec, and IPv6. This means that your FreeBSD machine can interoperate easily with other systems as well as act as an enterprise server, providing vital functions such as NFS (remote file access) and email services or putting your organization on the Internet with WWW, FTP, routing and firewall (security) services.
Memory protection ensures that applications (or users) cannot interfere with each other. One application crashing will not affect others in any way.
The industry standard X Window System (X11R7) can provide a graphical user interface (GUI) on any machine and comes with full sources.
Binary compatibility with many programs built for Linux, SCO, SVR4, BSDI and NetBSD.
Thousands of ready-to-run applications are available from the FreeBSD ports and packages collection. Why search the net when you can find it all right here?
>>55629444
Thousands of additional and easy-to-port applications are available on the Internet. FreeBSD is source code compatible with most popular commercial UNIX® systems and thus most applications require few, if any, changes to compile.
Demand paged virtual memory and “merged VM/buffer cache” design efficiently satisfies applications with large appetites for memory while still maintaining interactive response to other users.
SMP support for machines with multiple CPUs.
A full complement of C and C++ development tools. Many additional languages for advanced research and development are also available in the ports and packages collection.
Source code for the entire system means you have the greatest degree of control over your environment. Why be locked into a proprietary solution at the mercy of your vendor when you can have a truly open system?
Extensive online documentation.
And many more!
>>55629444
>>55629456
it is for these reasons why os x runs better than windows on the same hardware
>>55629467
actually for benchmarks its usually the other way around.
But running better than windows is not really an achievement. If by running you mean working without getting slowdowns from some background applications/services.
I currently use fedora for development and university coursework (my CS department uses RHEL). It seems like most of the arguments for BSD in this thread are ideological. Are there any real practical benefits to, say, OpenBSD, that would make it worth switching to from Fedora?
>>55629578
documentation and sane defaults
documentation in openbsd is so good that i'm pretty sure anyone could set up a good firewall while reading ONLY the man pages
>>55627522
>more stable
Nope, I never had a Linux system refuse to boot after an upgrade.
>more free
I don't care about the freedom of megacorps.
>>55629654
nice anecdote
you see, i also had plenty of times where a linux system refused to boot after an upgrade
>>55629662
i had one yesterday. but it seems i accidentally the whole kernel upgrade and had to do dpkg --configure -a so i guess it was a user error.
other than that i had linux refusing to boot because of an nvidia driver but i didnt knew i need to set up dkms for new kernel versions.
Other than that , in 8 years now i have never had a linux install fail to boot without me fucking something up seriously
>>55626568
BSD package management is objectively god-tier relative to Linux. The shitty clone Gentoo uses is funnily enough the best package manager on any Linux distro.
a
>be me
>create 25GB partition for FreeBSD.
>already made it ext4 so I don't have to inside their partitioner (not sure if iven it has that feature)
>doesn't recognize it
>apparently you can't install it on logical partition
>reboot to GNUx
>fix partitions, leave 25GB unallocated
>boot FreeBSD
>manualy enter few partitions (it has weird partitioning system but i've figured it out back then)
>Write 20GB
>it changes it to 1TB
>tfw i have only 500GB HDD
>must've been a bug, i try to write changes
>input/output error
>mad at this point
>change it to automatic mode
>it detects unallocated partition
>piece of shit sets it up to 1TB again
>i/o error again
>gives up
Why would anyone use this piece of shit except for philosophical reasons?
Gentoo installation was 10x easier than this crap.
>>55631030
>BSD
>ext4
hope this post wasn't serious because i stopped reading right there
>>55631047
Then I changed to unallocated fag.
Do you know everything at your first try?
>>55631062
No, but I make sure to be informed before jumping in blindly, which you didn't do.
>>55631077
Anyways, do you know possible reason why did it do that?
I glanced at their documentation after unsuccessful attempt, but I didn't find anything related.
>>55631092
maybe your hard drive's fucked
>>55631106
It works well with GNU/Linux and Windows m8.
>>55631112
well then it seems to be a very rare bug because i googled it and i can't find anything about it
better tell the freebsd people about it because someone else might run into it
>>55631062
>Then I changed to unallocated fag.
do you even know what you're talking about?
>>55631219
Yes, it didn't let me partition in advance.
my dvb-t usb doesn't have firmware on bsd :^(
>>55627842
Terascan (SeaSpace Corp.)
Telespace (Edge Electronics)
Tellicast for EUMETCast (EUMETCast/Tellique)
FreeBSD is the ONLY one true operating system for servers, embedded, and desktop.
>Prove.
>Me.
>Wrong.
>>55632215
Read >>55631030
>>55632215
FreeBSD Deployment Statistics
While FreeBSD does not gather deployment statistics, having statistical information available is essential. Please consider installing the sysutils/bsdstats package, which collects hardware and software statistics, helping developers understand how to best focus their efforts. The information collected is available at the bsdstats.org website.
>While FreeBSD does not gather deployment statistics
>FreeBSD does not
>does not
>gather deployment statistics
CONFIRMED FOR NON-BOTNET
>>55626538
Sure thing, mactard
except hardware support, decent power mgmt, video games, easier out of the box compilation support for downloaded source tarballs, faster overall performance
sure, why use linux, switching to bsd right now
