Disk Fragmentation
is it a meme?
I use a defrag once every ~ 4months after I migrate about 500 GB from my local HDD to an external ext4 hard disk.
Is this a positive practice or just snake oil because ntfs is shit. I should have transformed the whole drive to ext format but I dual boot, even though I spend very little in windows, but I didn't have enough storage to migrate all the data on the drive when I first installed linux.
Defrag is not snake oil, but ntfs is indeed shit.
>>55012243
Is ReFS a thing yet, and does anyone actually use it on Windows Server?
How fucking long is it gonna take for Microsoft to replace NTFS someday?
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/hh848060(v=vs.85).aspx
>>55012263
>Windows Server
isn't that an oxymoron
>How fucking long is it gonna take for Microsoft to replace NTFS someday?
they already anounced a new fs with windows longhorn 15 years ago. so i guess never since they have no good developers left.
>>55012263
>microsoft is going to replace NTFS
>apple is going to replace HFS
>companies that primarily market to tech illiterates will improve their technology instead of their UI animations
lol
>>55012212
people are still using HDDs in 2016?
>>55012347
>isn't that an oxymoron
Explain how. It's a viable server OS, especially since PowerShell is now a thing and nearly everything can be managed in the commandline now.
>longhorn
Sad day, then. They announced that shit THAT long ago?
>>55012347
I will take your bait.
Windows Vista (i.e., WinNT to Longhorn tech) was an example of scrapping a shit-tonne of stuff under the hood. It may have been a flop, but it had a shitload of internal changes (such as an overhauling of the Windows security model) that laid the groundwork for Windows 7.
If your logic is true, why didn't Microsoft just make Windows XP look shiny and not mess with anything under the hood?
>>55012404
I do. Getting Terabytes worth of storage for da cheap is great. I only use the SSD for my OS partition or stuff I need to load fast, like Photoshop and Steam games.
>>55012442
>Explain how. It's a viable server OS,
nah it's a joke. windows 2000 was an ok server OS back then, but everything after it is a joke.
>why didn't Microsoft just make Windows XP look shiny and not mess with anything under the hood?
but thats exactly what they did
even windows 8.1's kernel shared a lot of the broken code from windows nt 4.0
>>55012456
What do you need terabytes worth of storage for?
>>55012566
>Joke
I see. Sorry. Haven't been in the mood to tell jokes apart from shitposters because the lines are so blurry sometimes.
>Other stuff
Got any reading materials so I can learn more? I'm curious.
Also one thing I learned about Windows' code being kinda ass is that (aside from having to support legacy shit - the lifeblood of why people still use Windows) is because of Windows kernel development culture.
Rather than explain it I'll just pastebin some shit.
http://pastebin.com/wXKnMnTF
>>55012660
Database dumps/backups and hentai.
>>55012212
>I use a defrag once every ~ 4months
i do it once a week, git gud.
>>55012263
>ReFS
had some issue the last time i checked a few years ago, never followed up on it.
>>55012684
I do it every 3 to 4 days
>>55012667
>Got any reading materials so I can learn more? I'm curious.
just look up on bugtrackers/vuln trackers about windows kernel exploits
currently they only state window vista up to windows 8.1 (maybe 10, haven't checked them for years), because xp and 2k aren't supported anymore, but when you look at bugs from back then when they were still supported they all affected windows xp/2k up to windows 7.
>>55012705
the default windows defrag does it once a week, never felt a need to change it
>>55012566
>windows is shit except for nostalgia
i love this meme
windows is shit, period. it's worse in every application except running vidya gaymes and other programs only written for windows.
>>55012728
What about people who deploy IIS / ASP shit? Everyone in the enterprise -- if they're not using Java -- seems to go for that.
StackOverflow also runs on Windows servers.
>>55012728
i said _back then_.windows 2k was ok when it was still relevant and linux back then was barely useable. debian before sarge was bad, the "desktop" version of redhat was replaced by fedora core which was unusable from 1 up to at least version 5, and don't even get me started on mandrake and the other joke distros.
>>55012660
porn
>>55012728
>Windows is shit
>Except for applications developed for Windows
>Which is the entire reason Windows exists, to run Windows applications.
Wew lad.
>>55013126
I already addressed this in >>55012677
Defragmentation makes a hell of a difference, this same drive used to max out at 18MB/s sequential.
>>55014861
How much RAM did that machine have? Because my disk is HORRIBLY, horribly fragmented (lack of space to sufficiently defrag), but the disk doesn't really get hammered.
I have an insane amount of RAM, and so while bootup or cold boots of apps are slow, all reads and writes generally go to data cached in RAM.
Ok OP, let's have a science lesson. Defrag *always* helps sequential writes, especially with hard drives (compared with SSDs). Imagine your HDD's mechanical parts searching for your files. If it could just go read in order, it would be way faster that scanning from one side of the disk to the other.
>>55012212
The Apple MacBook Pro with Retina Display doesn't have this problem.
>>55015143
>>55015901
I hate Apple as much as the next guy, but to be honest he's right. The Apple MacBook whatever doesn't have that problem because it uses a better filesystem.
>>55015960
It has more to do with the SSD than the pile of shit that is HFS.
>>55015960
DUH IT USES A JOURNALED FILE SYSTEM DUMBFUCKING NIGGER
>>55015960
Apple macbook can use any OS/FS
I've been using Defraggler, but it's slow as molasses and doesn't seem to defrag anything. Is there a better defrager?
>>55015960
>it uses a better filesystem.
>>55016485
i don't use windows but what about the default windows one
>>55016541
I just checked, and apparently the Windows defrager has been scheduled for a weekly defrag without me knowing.
What's strange is that the Win Defrager says I have no fragmentation while Defraggler says I have 20%. I don't know what to believe.
>>55012212
you don't have to defrag linux filing system
they solved it -- defragging is a hangover from th past -- microsoft is stuck in the 90s. They can't deal with anything because their entire code base is a mess
>>55012728
>http://pastebin.com/wXKnMnTF
message --- any video game worth it's salt will bypass anything it can within windows
windows has nothing to do with video games
>>55012347
At least they're not BSD users, who proselytize ZFS yet conveniently forget to mention that it uses tons of RAM and has irreversible performance degradation due to fragmentation once you reach 85% or so disk usage.
>>55017164
Doesn't ZFS exist to bridge the gap for people who don't have the features ZFS provides in their machines' chipsets? Sounds like ZFS is a good stop-gap for people who need its resiliency but don't have the dosh or means to do what it does in-hardware.
At least that's what I heard when I was at a Red Hat-sponsored conference a while ago, and I'd imagine those people know their shit.
>>55017224
It's hard to know what precisely they were talking about without more context. Maybe they were talking about ZFS's RAID options, but these days software RAID is an incredibly common feature no matter what filesystem or operating system you're using.
>>55017590
Yeah, the conference was a while ago so I only remember fragments of it. I think they were saying it was only great back in the early days when that stuff wasn't widely available. And overall I think their sentiment was disdain for it.
>>55012263
I have been using ReFS on a mirrored storage space on Win8 and Win10 and so far it has worked fine but since its just media storage it's not like I'm asking anything demanding from it.
And I don't believe ReFS is planned to replace NTFS, its lacking a bunch of features NTFS has that Windows requires for a boot disk so its only for storage use. It's getting some new features to help with virtual hard drives but not the stuff it needs to be a windows boot disk.
>>55016595
>What's strange is that the Win Defrager says I have no fragmentation while Defraggler says I have 20%. I don't know what to believe.
Both are correct in a way.
Defraggler is going to aim for no fragmentation whatsoever and all your files will be contiguous.
Windows built in defrag only defragments files less than 64MB due to serious diminishing returns of making larger files fully contiguous.
Windows auto defrags when the computer is idle.
>>55012442
Yeah, which is the reason the went right back to the XP codebase after that for 7, because it was a fucking mess.
>>55012212
It's a legitimate thing on Microsoft file systems running on hard drives. Basically since the data is stored on rotational media you're subject to rotational latency. This means that if a file is split between tracks, for example, and the head cannot reach the next track quick enough it will have to wait for a full rotation. Ssds don't have this problem because they have no moving parts to wait for. There is an increased latency fetching from another chip but it is so small that it is far from being the bottleneck in the system.
>>55012660
photography and backups of said images
source: a /p/hotographer
