Disc Rot
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You are currently reading a thread in /g/ - Technology
Disc Rot
Heard about this and it sounded ridiculous
But then i went and checked a ton of cd's dvd's dvd-r's etc that I own and holy shit
An alarming amount of them have tiny pinholes like this somewhere on the disc where the data there is gone forever
feels bad men
>>54451625
>long blond hair
>glasses
nice
Go drink some more cough syrup, Sid.
>>54451625
You should've known. Burned DVDs only last about a decade if you're lucky.
>>54451706
i got a 100pack spindle of Phillips dvd+r about 5 years ago to archive videos i had
just went and looked at them in their cd binder and most of them have the pinholes
>>54451625
There is a better way to back up your data.
I know your feel OP. I lost many old mp3s from the napster era that I burned on cds.
they even have mold that eats CDs
>>54451854
>losing 96kbs mp3 rips
nothing of value was lost
>>54451625
That's what parity is for silly.
>>54451745
Actually the cheapest way to back up your data I've found is Crashplan. Especially if we're talking about terabytes of the stuff.
>>54451740
>using standard disc for achiving
You deserved it. Get M-DISC. They last up to 1000 years.
Is that really true?
So how the fuck am I going to back everything up now? is US B the only way?
>>54452032
M-DISC
http://www.ritek.com/m-disc/eng/index.asp
>>54452230
>>54451965
M-DISC is a meme.
By the time everyone works out that their claims were unadulterated bullshit, the company and the money will be long gone.
>>54452230
Stop posting anime shit
>>54451740
Phillips discs are made by designated shitting moser-baer or chinky cmc magnetics corp.
You bought shit discs my laddey
Sheiiit
>>54451625
you guys are retarded
all this is is the top part of the disc (label) peeled off.
>>54452295
The nasa thing seems legit
>>54451625
>cd's dvd's dvd-r's etc
What are those?
>>54452337
I used Taiyo Yuden and TDK TT02 discs back around 2005 and those ended up completely unreadable 5 years later as well. Most of them, anyway.
>>54452393
Celestial deity, divine video deity, divine video diety - reloaded
>>54452393
There are old school type of discs, they mostly used them in computers back in the 90s to store data. They are pretty slow and small by todays standards, but back then, they were orders of magnitudes faster than the cassette tape drives used in the 80s, the punch cards used in the 70s, and the magnetic-core memory you had to knit for yourself back in the 60s (back then, an IBM datacentre involved a room full of old ladies knitting wires and ferrite chokes together).
>>54452369
fucking this
>>54452369
which is where the data is you tool
the bottom of a disc is just plastic
the data is burned onto the backside of the cd face/label
I have CD-Rs that I burned in the early 2000s that still work fine today. I don't feel like digging them out, but they're Memorex CD-Rs and they're gold on top.
When CD-Rs got super popular, they started manufacturing garbage and I have no doubt that those CD-Rs went bad after a few years. I know there are exceptions, but the garbage CD-Rs tend to have rougher edges and are made of thinner plastic.
I still burn CD-Rs for retro gaming purposes, and my Taiyo Yuudens seem to work nicely. The plastic is nice and thick too, and the edges are rounded. They feel pretty close to factory pressed CDs.
>>54451625
>where the data there is gone forever
>Implying the drive doesn't have, by design, error correction and interleaving to not give a fuck if such a small amount of data on a track is missing.
>>54452578
>I still burn CD-Rs for retro gaming purposes
Well if you arent a total tool you probably still have the original iso on a hard drive anyway
so it doesnt matter what type of cdr you use you can just chuck them after you play the game
and cheaper quality media doesnt ruin the lasers of old game systems thats a fucking myth
>they knew about cloud computing 20 years ago and purposefully designed disks to rot away
>>54452506
0/10
I dug out the oldest CD I could find and slapped it into my notebook computer just now.
20 years old media. The disc still works. I may still have that old 4X burner somewhere and it may still work too.
You know it's old media when the dye is blue. Let me get a picture...
>>54452681
he's not wrong
for cd's the data layer is right under the label
dvd's are different, the data layer(s) are in the middle of the disc
>>54451886
>they even have mold that eats CDs
Who?
Still kicking
>>54452386
googling Mdisc and NASA yields nothing interesting
>>54451625
They laughed at me for buying Verbatim
>lol anon it doesn't matter what brand it is just get the cheapest
WHOS LAUGING NOW
>>54452789
Noice
>>54452774
the jews ofc
Remember when people used to benchmark CD-ROM drives? Before they called them "optical drives"
>>54452337
This
>>54452426
You probably stored them like shit, I got some Princo's from 2006 that still read fine
Fucking Princo's
>>54452601
Pretty much this, DVD error correction is somewhat hardcore
Specially since DVD's by design read with errors
The blu ray scratch coating should help.
OP, you can use DVDisaster to check the health of each disc and try to recover as much data as possible.
>>54452959
>coldplay
HAHAHA FAGGOT!!!!!!!!!!
>>54452032
>Is that really true?
Nothing lasts 5ever
>So how the fuck am I going to back everything up now? is US B the only way?
No, that's worse, HTL BD's are the best for cold storage right now, quality DVD's come second, like MCC ID Verbatim's
But neither is easy to find nowadays, most quality BD's are sold only in Japan and you have to import them, and quality DVD's are hard to find nowadays
>>54452578
>gold on top
That's literally a meme, gold has less reflectivity than silver
Though most gold media is usually from decent quality, unlike silver media
>>54452626
>and cheaper quality media doesnt ruin the lasers of old game systems thats a fucking myth
They're harder too read, which sometimes forces the system to do more re reads, which wears out the mechanism
Some shit CD-R's won't be read at all by some systems
>>54452959
The old CDFreak's forums might not be around anymore, but there's some of the old community at MYCE, some members still benchmark media and post their experience with modern drives
>>54453052
He probably can get a lot of stuff with DVDisaster, nice piece of software
>>54452749
>dvd's are different, the data layer(s) are in the middle of the disc
[citation needed]
>>54453134
>he wasn't around in the last format war
>>54452295
>/g/ says it's a meme
Better invest now.
>>54453099
>Bashing on music taste.
Suck my dick.
>>54453134
How do you wikipedia?
It seems like no one here is from the optical generation where everything came on a disc. Games, music, movies..
And you could copy them (mostly) and do whatever..
>>54453145
so if i scratch the top label part off of a dvd-r the data wont get fucked?
>>54453227
No, but it will be impossible to read, since it needs the silver layer to reflect the laser
>>54453227
Exactly. The data is sandwiched between 2 PC discs.
That's why DVD's are less likely to get disc rot.
>>54453227
that's right, doing that with a cd will fuck it though, and it's all on the top
>>54453237
the reflective layer is directly over the data layer
>>54453237
The reflective layer on a DVD is in the middle, not on the label as it is with CD's. You can scratch the label as much as you want and no damage to the data will be done.
>>54451740
>>54453052
So i checked one of the DVD+R's that had the most pinholes and this software reported no read errors
So i guess the pinholes arent a big deal
>>54453267
are the data and reflective layers totally transparent
some dvd videos i have you can basically see straight through them
>>54453804
layer 0 is partially transparent (to make it possible to focus on layer 1 instead)
naturally they can't be /totally/ transparent, as that would mean the laser beam won't be reflected back (required for reading)
without spinning them every once in a while, the rotational velocodensity goes down and you get bit rot.
>>54453891
I love this meme
>>54453306
Its possible the automatic error correction skipped that section when you initially burned the disk.
>>54452313
>manga = anime
What about blu rays? Will my collection be trash in a decade?
>>54453963
backing up/archiving data on blu rays is probably the best choice at the moment
they run about $1 each for a 25gb disc you cant get much cheaper than that for physical media
>>54454023
>implying tape isn't the best way to archive data
>Oh noes my Inuyasha and Love Hina XviDs
>>54454037
Tape drives are expensive as fuck though.
>>54453922
The retarded tripfag demonstrates his ignorance once again
The error correction corrected the error, derp, that's why it is reported as read, it doesn't skip anything, much less when burning, burning can't skip anything since it lacks any kind of look ahead
He could do a disc scan with Nero SpeedControl or Opti Drive Control, PIF and PIE should skyrocket at some points
>>54453963
As long as they're HTL BD-R's they should last at least a decade, and up to a hundred years, even in suboptimal conditions
HTL BD-R's have inorganic burning layers, they're much more resilient than the organic layers used in CD-R's and DVD-R's
>>54454058
The drives are, yes. The tapes not so much.
"Disc rot" or whatever the hell you want to call it happens mostly to poor quality media and double sided discs. I still have pressed discs from the early 90's which work fine. When I look at all of my burnt CD-R's, the ones that failed were cheap generics.
>>54454055
sigh
thats not funny
>>54454177
Pressed discs should last decades, they're completely different from burnable discs
I have some pressed CD's from the early 80's that rip fast and without errors in EAC, though I do have a few ones that were manufactured badly and have visible signs of degradation, though they do read fine
>>54454037
Tape is even worse. If you don't make 2 or 3 redundant copies you are dumb. If the TOC is destroyed, say goodnight to everything on there.
![22A1F345881182559992772190208_312da235bdb.1.5.17781008757068101400.mp4_snapshot_00.05_[2016.03.22_00.32.23].png](https://i.imgur.com/FkBFAjb.png "22A1F345881182559992772190208_312da235bdb.1.5.17781008757068101400.mp4_snapshot_00.05_[2016.03.22_00.32.23].png")
>>54452959
what year are you living in, dude
This is what I get for being a consumer bitch.
>>54454413
this is common with DVD's from the 1920's
>>54451625
Not gonna lie, when I first saw the thumbnail I thought the huge ass reflection of your camera's lens was the disc rot.
>>54452578
>have CD-Rs that I burned in the early 2000s that still work fine today.
CD-Rs are not DVD-Rs. When I went through my archive CDRs a year ago, most discs were fully readable (burnt circa 2001), except for one or two. The ones I kept on display in a binder had deteriorated so bad that around 2008 half of them were already unreadable.
DVDRs on the other hand, barely last more than a few years. The data layer on them just end up disintegrated.
>>54454640
It seems you're too retarded, read the thread and you might learn something about optical media
>>54452578
>I still burn CD-Rs for retro gaming purposes, and my Taiyo Yuudens seem to work nicely.
1. even the shittiest brand will work fine, as long as your retro consoles are in well kept shape and have a healthy laser that was professionally calibrated. And as long as you aren't a moron who burns at lowest speed because a guide from 1999 recommends so.
2. get an SD card reader for your retro consoles. Every retro console that used CDs and is worth playing on real hardware already has one. Even the fucking 3DO has an IDE adapter.
>>54451670
>AmazingAtheist-core
>nice
Nah
>>54453107
>Some shit CD-R's won't be read at all by some systems
That's the systems fault.
Calibrate the laser and it'll read everything fine.
I have a Sega Saturn here that can read a disc that was cracked in half.
>>54453227
>so if i scratch the top label part off of a dvd-r the data wont get fucked?
No, that pic only applies to factory pressed discs. DVD-Rs and CDRs both have organic dye under the label; scratch that off and you are fucked.
>>54454650
>It seems you're too retarded, read the thread and you might learn something about optical media
Where exactly in the thread does it say that DVDRs are more reliable than CDRs? Because my point was that they aren't; and that the way you store them also affects their longevity (my CDRs that died faster were exposed to more sunlight).
>>54451625
I have been burning discs since the mid 90s and over thousands of them I have never once seen this.
It is widely blown out of proportion.
>>54452959
Hmm, I'm willing to give this a go. Got any non-faggot suggestions for benchmarking software?
>>54454819
Your DVD-R's didn't last because you bought the shittiest ones you could find, holy fuck are you retarded?
I had HDDs and flash cards die on me before, and thankfully I had disc backups. I have a few cheap discs that are rotten, but they're like 1 in 50. Beats losing everything at once. My BD-Rs from 2010 are perfect to this day however. I had 3 HDDs die during this time, now I backup to both extra HDDs and BDs.
>>54454848
Nero SpeedControl is the ol' good classic, it's continuation is OptiDriveControl, both work just fine
There's qpxtool if you're on *nix. and PlexTools if you have a Plextor drive
>13TB of anime
>No Backups
I Fear the Day.
>>54454913
Get Crashplan, or even Backblaze
>>54454835
i used to archive skate footage to DVD and have lost a shit tonne of clips due to rot. So i moved them to my mac hard drive, way safer.
>>54452832
that's always the case. If you want something that will last the maximum amount of time money typically means better quality.
I have a box of these which I have been saving for special occasions. What should I burn tonight, anon?
>>54451911
Actually the cheapest way to back up your data is Google Drive. Especially if you have a Uni account.
>>54454992
Source? GDrive doesn't give you unlimited storage, or it does nowadays?
>>54454722
>1. even the shittiest brand will work fine, as long as your retro consoles are in well kept shape and have a healthy laser that was professionally calibrated. And as long as you aren't a moron who burns at lowest speed because a guide from 1999 recommends so.
Care to elaborate on this? As a kid, anything I wanted to last I always burned at medium speed (Whatever was inbetween the slowest and fastest settings the drive allowed), and stuff I wanted to be quickly accessible / didnt give a shit about I`d just burn at max speed.
>>54454996
ON PNG
N
P
N
G
Would storing shit in an airtight, lead lined box that's been flooded with argon make it last forever?
Also, what was that storage strategy where you make two identical discs and it uses the good parts of each disc to make a good image?
>>54455001
Not him, but my uni Drive gives unlimited storage. Otherwise, I think the limit is 30GB.
Although it does say X used out of 10.0TB, if you look into adding storage, it just says unlimited.
>>54455156
Eventually the atom's particles themselves will disintegrate.
Should have used M-DISC.
>>54455156
Nitrogen atmosphere is fine. It's just the oxygen you don't want.
But yes, that would keep data a very long time. Cool and dark.
It's radiation from the sun that's the most damaging in the medium to long term.
Cosmic rays are too rare to do major damage.
use tarsnap to back up your shit
>>54454413
>Metallica
Is that a music CD then? Pop it in a standard CD player and see if the audio itself is glitchy
>>54457690
Music skips mainly from half of track 4 and the entire track 5, the rest is read fine both on a decent cd player or decent optical drive on the computer.
I assume it's due to the massive "hole" and not so much all the rest of the dots.
This happens a lot on cds that are like pic related.
>>54451965
>Get M-DISC. They last up to 1000 years.
>up to
Nice weasel words. That statements means absolutely jack. It could rot in a week; so long as it doesn't last a day past year 1000 it's fulfilled that claim.
>>54451625
Who cares, we will rot away some day too. Everything is just like dust in the wind.
>>54453306
It can read around some small defects. Still you should read everything off it and burn a new copy.
>>54452386
Even if it does somehow last decades, consider this: Will you have a working Blu-Ray drive to read it in after 10-30 years? They're already disappearing from computers.
What would you do today if I handed you a 5.25" 320 KB floppy?
You will notice older YouTube or Pornhub videos are poor quality. Bitrot effects even electronic data and over the years videos have lost quality. The only way to counter this really is to recreate it entirely from the ground up but then you lose authenticity. This is why the movie industry does remakes of movies to try keep up the overall video quality of the production for future generations to watch and reproduce.
Bit-rot and rotational velocidensity are REAL issues. You stupid idiots took it in jest when we warned you years ago and are now suffering the consequences of your negligence and stupidity.
>>54451625
> not making a lossless copy as soon as you remove the plastic from the case
Fucking plebs.
My HD DVDs all have it :(
>>54458720
HD DVD was dead by the time it was released anyway.
>>54452369
This.
I have a couple of old CDs that were scratched on the other side, and are 100% readable, even with visible "holes" in the information layer.
>>54458962
(for reference, one was pressed in 1988, another in 1993)
>>54454037
>>54454023
>they run about $1 each for a 25gb
That's 4 cents per GB. Hard disks still come out the cheapest at ~2 cents per GB, and you don't have to split your shit into tiny portions and keep a catalog of what's on which disk. Tape drives are annoying as fuck for home use, and even enterprise is moving away from libraries to backing up to disk arrays. Restoring anything from tape is a pain.
If you're paranoid about bit rot you can run a surface refresh every 5 or so years and have your 0s and 1s good as new.
This thread inspired me to dig out my old DVD spindles and copy what I can to hard disks. Never know when I feel the urge to fap to 800x600 jpgs from karupspc or amkingdom again.
>>54458419
>What would you do today if I handed you a 5.25" 320 KB floppy?
i would buy a floppy drive off of ebay and read it
ez
>>54458419
I'd keep a drive if I had data archived on them.
>>54451745
If you are a retard that is.
Cloud storage is only good for documents and books, so you can fall back to something when you are out and about.
And mostly because you can that way rely on the free backup quantity.
However going beyond that and paying a subscription in the long term costs more than just buying a bunch of HDDs and putting them into an offline HDD encasing for backup,
and you don't have to suffer service fuckups or Internet Connectivity speed fuckups, or the service forcing subscription changes because they hold your data by the balls, or the inability to directly access your data at any and all times due to various circumstances.
Fucking idiot.
>>54458419
>What would you do today if I handed you a 5.25" 320 KB floppy?
I would laugh at you.
Though in fairness I do keep a 3.5" floppy drive, LS120 drive, Zip drive, Jazz drive, and Syquest drive in a box because I've used those in the past and you never know when one of those disks will show up.
>>54451625
/vg/ here we deal with this shit all the time with the first gen CD based games.
I lost a copy of Lunar the silver star(SegaCD) due to disk rot.
What's the worst is when someone opens a +200$ sealed CD game, just to find disk rot.
>>54451706
>Burned DVDs only last about a decade if you're lucky
Bull-fucking-shit.
Learn how to properly store your media.
>>54454892
>flash cards
>>54454413
pressed cd's don't rot, as they don't use color-altered dyes as in recordables, but a physically indented (pressed) layer of aluminium
the only way to get holes in a pressed disc is through physically damaging the top of the disc, you didn't take very good care of it
>>54454972
>my favourite bluray
>disc 1 of 60
>>54455156
Raid; random array of independent dicks
>>54461661
Redundant, my bad
>>54461661
>random array of independent dicks
Redundant array of inexpensive disks*
>>54456611
what happens when you leave your university?
retard
>>54451886
why don't you get a trip so I can finally filter you
fucking floens get your shit together
>>54452959
isn't the drive's rotation speed literally everything you need to know the speed?
>>54459303 here
So I popped in the first DL DVD and it looks like some videos are unreadable. They copied smoothly, there is data in them, but they lack any kind of header (I checked with a hex editor) and they don't open in any player. I'm not sure this drive can actually read DL, does that sound like this could be the case, or are the files just fucked?
>>54464567
If your drive cant read a dual layer DVD then it must be from like 1999
Literally almost all DVD movies released in the last decade have been dual layer (multiple audio tracks + special features take up more than 4.5gb)
Use DVDisaster
>>54453306
to scan the disc see what it says
>>54464567
did you decrypt them? or are you just trying to directly play the .vob's (without anydvd or similar running)
>>54464895
>>54464776
It's a data disk filled with video files, not a video disk.
Looks like exactly half of the files are fucked but the drive reports it should be able to read that disk.
I'll check with my work laptpop's drive.
>>54460415
>house burnts down
>All your data is destroyed.
>>54465007
>foot sucking videos
>dudes blowing what appears to be other dudes
I dunno if I'm just really lucky or something, but I haven't had a CD/DVD ever go bad on me. I still have backup CD-Rs I burned in 2005 and 2006, they all seem totally fine.
Welp it worked on the laptop.
Now I gotta set up copying over network as that one only has a tiny SSD.
>>54465042
It's from a russian femdom site that closed down several years ago and as far as I'm aware there are no complete siterips on the net.
Lots of M on F ass eating if that's your thing.
