Is anyone here excited about the new Tesla?
IMO it really seems as that within 10 years all the new cars will be electric. I couldn't have imagined this two years ago, but this is starting to be very likely.
Yes I'm very excited. But I think the whole Tesla hype is a bit exaggerated, I mean Tesla makes good electric cars but they aren't the only ones able to make good electric cars. By the time the Model 3 is delivered I bet there are several other alternatives with similar specs and similar price.
It's definitely inevitable that EVs are the majority of the market pretty soon. Here in Norway are already over 20% of all new cars sold electric, we've seen it coming for several years already.
Meanwhile OPEC still claims that EVs will only be 1% of cars on the road by 2040. Pretty baffling, they've got their head in the sand.
>>54271404
>By the time the Model 3 is delivered I bet there are several other alternatives with similar specs and similar price.
Yeah, they also made all the plans and other info public so that anyone could make them. However, they have a name built up and a network of charging stations which is set to grow rapidly within the next few years. If I buy a new car it's going to be electric, and it's going to be a Tesla.
>>54271229
Yeah, booked one. Looking forward to getting it.
Is the range really gonna be 215 miles? If so, that'd be GOAT. Currently get about 80-90 miles on my Leaf.
>>54271404
> Here in Norway are already over 20% of all new cars sold electric
Wow, really? Here in Slovenia they teach us that it is impossible to go electric because reasons.
>Meanwhile OPEC still claims that EVs will only be 1% of cars on the road by 2040. Pretty baffling, they've got their head in the sand.
Yeah, that sounds like home to me.
>>54271708
Good news, Musk says it's minimum of 215 miles.
Which country do you live in?
Where do you charge you leaf?
you people disgust me, you seriously go outside?
LEAVE MY FUCKING BOARD REEEEEEEEEEEEE
>>54271744
Yeah, but I'd like to know if the previous models also lived up to their promises. I've heard great things about them from friends of friends and I thought I'd give it a go.
>Which country do you live in?
Murrica
>Where do you charge you leaf?
There's a complimentary charging station owned by a small company about a mile away. They deal in solar panels so they put up a free charger for EVs. There's also one at my work, I use that whenever it's not being used by someone else.
Otherwise, I charge up at home.
They make the least reliable cars on the market, prone to failures and faults.
People buy them due to massive government subsidies.
It is nice to see that someone came up with a semi viable coal powered car however.
I don't even drive and I want one. My work has a few charging stations that they don't charge anyone to use. So basically free gas. With a Model 3 and free charging at work the thing would pay for itself in like 5 years, if that.
>>54271229
literally don't care until i have an electric rally car
>>54271229
>all
no but we might actually have some affordable options.
they need to be full size cars though no one makes it up the hill in a chicago winter with a prius.
>>54271229
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-14/hong-kong-teslas-linked-to-more-co2-emissions-than-gasoline-cars
You either have hydroelectric or nuclear to power your electric cars, or you are in for a good surge in emissions.
Oh, sure, you can modernize your coal based power plants. It's taking 20 years for Germany, good luck doing that in the next 10 years for the US.
You want to subsidize both "renewable" energy AND electric cars? Good luck with that, i bet your government will run out of it's people money before the Earth runs out of fossil fuel.
>>54271812
>They make the least reliable cars on the market, prone to failures and faults.
source?
>a semi viable coal powered car however.
Oh, yeah, because you can just find so fucking many cars going from 0 - 100 km/h in less than 5 secs using cheap ass electricity having everything necessary for autopilot costing around 35 k$ with 5 star safety
At the end of the day it's easier to make an electric car than the clusterfuck of idunnowhat needed to drive an internal combustion engine.
>>54271911
dem fuckin batteries yo
got to spend $12,000 on a new one every 8-10 years
manufacturing batteries is the farthest from "eco friendly" anyone can imagine
we need nuclear cars damn it
>>54271708
Was thinking about importing Leaf from US but it ended being too complicated.
Are you happy with it?
I have big bad diesel truck but would really like EV for daily commute, 20 miles a day through horrible stop and go traffic. How is acceleration from stop? Can it outrun average shitboxes to 60?
Batteries are the key to everything, and they still aren't there yet.
Teslas have a massive pack of totally ordinary 18650 lithium rechargeable batteries that weighs north of 1100lbs. If energy density of lithium chemistry batteries doubled over night we could get twice the mileage for that 1100lbs~ or we could cut that immense weight in half for roughly equal mileage. Suffice it to say that we would prefer not to have 5000lb sedans on the road, if only for the sake of making acceleration easier on battery drain.
Personally I'd really like an electric bike, but real world mileage on them is beyond shit tier.
>>54271960
supposedly, the cost of batteries will be going down in the meantime, so 12k$ in 8 - 10 years is BS
I'm looking forward to it, but just because of the fact that it's advancing electric cars. They would be great for a commuter car to work or for errands around town.
My issue is that I walk to work. Usually when I do drive it's 200-300 miles at a timento visit family or friends, and realistically I wont be interested in any electric cars until I could go at least 500 on a charge to match what my car can do on a tank of gas. Not to mention filling up a gas tank takes a few minutes, where charging could take hours, and that gas stations are everywhere already, but charge stations are not.
>>54272029
Grandpa here.
There where talking the same about LCD panels like it would never be possible to manufacture them in quantities and at low cost.
>>54272062
You can just rent regular car those few times a year when you'll need extra range.
>>54271404
LOL
>OPEC has their heads I'm the sand
That's a pretty accurate statement
>>54272017
I'm pretty happy with it, considering that I don't go out of the town that often. Everything I do is within 30 miles of me, so if I charge to full before I head out (12 hours at home on 120 volts, 3-4 hours on at a charge station on 240 volts), I'll be good til I come back. The problem arises when you have to drive around a lot, which might end up happening when you get drunk with friends, but usually I just ride with them.
The acceleration is pretty good. I haven't measured it, but it can go from 0 to 40ish pretty quickly. 40 up takes more time, but I've pushed it to around 90ish before without too much hassle. It can outrun shitboxes, but you might have to give it some push to go past more modern cars.
>>54272062
>where charging could take hours
The supercharger fills up some 70% in half an hour. So you can take a short coffe/sandwich break from driving and you're good to drive for two hours or so. And Tesla 3 has supercharger capability built in serial.
All in all, Elon Musk had really done his homework
>>54272099
And their dicks in a goat.
>>54271960
Yeah and you have to change your headers, motor mounts, and probably transmission. Not to mention combustion engines are the hardest thing to maintian, constant oil changes and smog checks.
I know people with priuses from 2002 to 2006 and all are still running.
I doubt tesla will have any issue with their batteries, there model s rarely do, and if there is an issue you have a great warranty through tesla.
Your just nit picking anything you can think of to convince yourself you are right.
So, to Sum up tesla 3
>Range above 215 miles
>5 star safety
>Autopilot
>Stop and fill for 30 mins - drive for over 150 miles (superchargers)
>Cost of 35k$
>Close to 400 thousand preorders in a week (all the Ford models sell at 200 thousand monthly)
Am I missing anything?
>>54272103
Have 240V and 380V three phase at my place (slav europe) so that's not a problem. I really don't care even if it takes whole night to charge. Range is not a problem, 90% of my commute is 30 miles a day or less and I also have a truck and GF's car at disposal.
As for acceleration I just want ability to pull in front of traffic from stop light, guess if it can keep up with cars in US it'll have no problem with shitty small diesels everyone drives here.
Problem is Leaf is not available here, there's company that imports them from US but there's no warranty or any kind of support from Nissan. Only EV model sold here is Mitusbishi Miev which is too small for me and is super expensive.
>>54272230
I heard about people going to the US and buying cars there personally and then taking them to my slav europe country by boat.
>>54272029
>will be going down in the meantime
If they are subsidized they will NOT go down.
>>54272062
That is the major drawback of electric cars imo.
But oil and therefore gasoline are limited. We simply can't go on like this forever and at some point you have to accept that this way of life is over.
>>54271955
I don't know about "least reliable car on the market" but Consumer Reports did go back to their review and downgrade Tesla because of widespread issues with the Model S. Additionally the early deliveries of the Model X have been plagued by problems.
>>54272217
>five star safety
it hasn't been tested yet so not sure where in your ass you pulled that out of
>>54271404
>Here in Norway are already over 20% of all new cars sold electric, we've seen it coming for several years already.
Isn't it cold in norway?
Or do you all keep heated garages?
don't you think it's more of a waste of energy to spend it on heated garage?
until i can recharge them in 5-10 minutes, they will continue to be left to only vehicle used to drive a couple miles a day to and from work.
>>54272257
>If they are subsidized they will NOT go down.
Subsidies are just a stoopid thing politicians do to make them feel good in their tummy. The same politicians shoved the entire western hemisphere onto gasoline instead of having it develop the electric cars.
Yes, the gasoline stations we use were a tremendous investment.
The cost of batteries will go down even if some governments decide to subsidize them as the world is not yet just a single government.
https://www.google.si/search?q=price+of+batteries+chart&rlz=1C1_____enSI525SI525&espv=2&biw=1680&bih=935&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj797j1yLHMAhWBVhQKHQ8ICPMQ_AUIBigB#tbm=isch&q=price+of+batteries+kwh+chart&imgrc=uxqU_vd5uQdgmM%3A
>>54272441
>it hasn't been tested yet so not sure where in your ass you pulled that out of
He had this speech that you can find on youtube where he was talking about the fivestars, but the NCAP didn't test it yet. Maybe he made it up entirely or maybe Tesla tested it themselves.
>30 minutes to charge
>people don't seem to realize that the more these cars are adopted, the longer lines are going to become at charging stations
People have to wait at gas stations now and the average time for a fill up is like 5 mins at most. 30 minutes? If tons of people have these cars it's going to be a problem.
>>54272497
I can't charge my gasoline car in 5-10 minutes, so I don't know what you're using. My gas station and the ones I often use is waaaaaay too crowded for that.
Electric charging stations meanwhile, can have a lot of charging places as it's a low cost compared to the gasoline charging spot.
I'll buy into electric cars when I can get 500 mile range, under 30 minutes for a full recharge, low weight and no limp mode due to overheating in the track.
>>54272574
the limiting factor for gas stations isn't pumps, it's the fact that cars take of X amount of space
>>54272566
It's cheaper to build a charging spot for electricity than for gasoline. So yeah, we should expect to see more free spots on stations.
>>54272574
what the fuck is wrong with your brain?
how many people do you see plug their electric car in for 10 minutes to have a full charge at the end?
you are limited to a 300 mile radius with these things.
>>54272179
And when something does go wrong, will the consumer be able to fix it themselves or will it require a dealership visit?
>>54272539
IIHS testing can only be done by vehicles that they purchase themselves. Manufacturers cannot send them test vehicles to eliminate possibility of falsifying results. An employ has to go out to a random dealership and purchase a vehicle on their own, then bring it back for testing.
Tesla's new car hasn't undergone that process yet. Any crash test figures they're mentioning are internal or made up.
>>54272616
I don't believe Tesla even has a fully functioning Model 3 yet so they're almost assuredly made up
>>54272589
Nah, it's pumps. Pumps cost a lot of money to build. This was generally done by governments around the world one after another. It's such a huge investment, these stations, that some agree that the western govermnets themselves will not simply want to discard them and eventually start encouraging people to use gasoline cars.
>>54272179
>Hardest thing to maintain
>oil changes
>smog
maybe you should go back to /o/ with all the other underage kids to fit right in
>>54272217
Facts, not marketing buzzwords
>>54272642
dude what planet do you live in? do you even know how gas stations work?
>>54272607
There is nothing wrong with my brain. You're just having difficulties following the conversations. The gas pumps I use always have a line and I have to wait for two guys to fill up, go to the cashier and pay. The process of refilling my tank often takes over 15 minutes. This is because the number of pumps at crowded gas stations is still kept low because they are expensive to build. Do you understand now.
Electrical charging spots are much cheaper that gasoline ones. Tesla built a fuckton of them just for fun. This is why it is expected they will generally not be as crowded.
Look at the picture and tell me how long it would get you to fill your car in this place....
>>54272633
They have several prototypes. After the speech they went for a ride.
>>54272674
How is that not facts?
What the fuck is wrong with some of you people!??!?!?!?
Are you all petrolium engineers or shilling fucking sandy goatfuckers!?!?!?!?
>>54272589
most gas stations could fit a few more filling spots easily. Just do an image google search.
https://www.google.si/search?q=gas+stations&rlz=1C1_____enSI525SI525&espv=2&biw=1680&bih=891&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiXxeakzrHMAhXCxRQKHfGgBgIQ_AUIBigB#tbm=isch&q=gas+station
>>54272725
>posts a gas crisis tier picture in some shithole country
>BUT ELECTRIC CHARGING IS FASTER! THEY ARE EVERYWHERE!
you know what is everywhere? gas stations. you know what your picture does? give a zero representation of how the real world works
you know what is NOT everywhere? electric charging stations.
who cares how crowded they are? if ONE car is there that takes up just as much time if not more, and since you are relying on taking routes tesla thinks you will take, you are still fucked
try again
>>54271229
The only problem with electric cars is that there worse for the environment. It actually takes more energy to produce electricity at a power plant and send it to a charging station than it would be burning gasoline.
Most of the electricity in areas is generated by coal. Especially rural locations. And coal is way worse than gasoline.
>>54273509
https://youtu.be/_psP-XrGO9U?t=25
>>54271911
>>54271960
Unfortunately nuclear cars will probably never be a thing. Too much danger involved in crashing and refueling. It would be cool to see "gas stations" powered by nuclear power tho.
>>54273564
What is this?
Why don't you just put the generator in the car then. That would be a revolutionary idea wouldn't it.
>>54272179
Repairing bad battery on Prius is trivial thing since it's fully modular and you can get individual cells on ebay for like $20.
>>54272574
Way too crowded? Even when I go on a fuckin 800km ride from Basel to Hamburg during a crowded day I maybe wait 4-5min before refilling. And Refilling takes maybe 2-3min. As long as you can't swap batteries in electric cars instantly they are not capable of doing long journeys. City and close trips yeah. Why would you buy a >60k car that can't even take you properly on a skiing trip (implying you dont want to travel 3 days?)
>>54271854
I've wondered, how can those be free? Electricity has to be paid
>>54273673
>Why would you buy a >60k car that can't even take you properly on a skiing trip
Couldn't care less about that few special occasions a year.
You can always rent normal car if charging along the way is too much hassle for you. (or borrow one from friend, use gf's, use your offroad toy in my case etc.)
>>54273637
Does that carry over to Tesla and other components of the vehicle?
>>54271404
I think what made Tesla different is that they made a good looking electric cars, you compare the Nissan leaf (a fucking leaf) and a Model S and you couldn't bribe me to drive a leaf
>>54273816
Tesla batteries are one giant sealed slab, you can't open it without damaging it.
Inside of the mammoth slab is a bunch of 18650 batteries sitting in a coolant. Not user accessible to say the least.
>>54273673
Recharging takes about 20 to 30 minutes and most current cars reach between 300 and 700 km.
But if you live in hamburg you are fucked beyond repair for using a car anyway.
>>54273816
I've teared Prius battery apart with friend and it was easy job, only problem battery being heavy so it's 2 person job.
>>54273877
Man that doesn't look that bad, looks like spot welded cells. The problem is obviously weight, you'll need forklift to take that thing out.
>>54273988
That thing is the entire underside of the car. You have to lift the car off of it.
>>54273673
>800km without taking a single break, no toilet, no food, no nothing.
I see we are different.
>>54274077
Yeah I'm relatively poor euro slav and for 800km I'll fly. I doubt many euros drive that far in one take unless truck driver or something like that. Europoors will do it maybe once a year to get to adriatic coast for summer vacations.
>>54271404
Norway is also one of the richest countries, im sure pajeets (which will be the majority by 2040, sorry little dick white bois ;)) will barely start seeing cars by then.
>>54271229
Currently I own a P90D and am currently waiting for my Model X to be delivered for the wife. I put down 1k for the Model 3 but I'm not sure if I really want one or not...still trying to make up my mind.
>>54273877
>opens all patents
>wont let us easily fix battery pack
god damn it musk
>>54272847
>How hard is it to install an electrical outlet?
vs
>How hard is it to build a gas station?
>>54274813
Oh boy, an electrical outlet that takes 12 hours to charge!
And considering there are people in this thread that literally don't know how gas stations works, I wouldn't put it past you to think its difficult.
The FACT remains, until batteries can be charged in minutes, the cars are not useable for anything other than low mileage commutes.
>>54271229
I don't mind that that model doesn't have a front grill. But why was it necessary to leave a huge blank template where a grill would be?
Looks like shit and I can't imagine it helps aerodynamics.
Otherwise love the Tesla from what I know about it.
At all the malls over here there's a few electric charge spots. Do all of these electric vehicles have the same charge port or do they just include the different tips?
>>54272179
>and if there is an issue you have a great warranty through tesla.
The warranty does not cover capacity, and only last 8-10 years.
You're still going to be paying 4x as much as a Prius battery.
musk as already trippled the price of 18650 batteries, you think him owning a "mega plant" and virtually becoming a monopoly will help costs?
>>54273574
>Too much danger involved in crashing and refueling
crashing no, refueling yes
you realize toshiba makes shed sized nuclear plants that literally cannot melt down right? They last about 15 years before all material is consumed or something like that.
obviously that tech is too large/heavy for a vehicle, but it could eventually work.
Its typically used in auto plants, i think hundai did a big promotional thing years ago where they have a factory in the middle of a forest powered by these things, virtually noise free and animals still live around the plant)
the public is simply too afraid for it to happen.
nuclear powered gas stations sounds like a really fucking good idea to help with all the extra power we need to supply electric vehicles, these Toshiba plants would fit right in perfectly.
Hopefully betavoltaics can produce "real" energy in a few years, this might change the world of consumer nuclear energy.
(harvesting energy off the actual beta particles emitted, rather than nigger rigging it like a steam engine)
daily reminder x-ray opera glasses are a federal crime
a law was put into place to calm the public down when we discovered xrays, and after hundreds of people were getting sick from lead underwear poisoning. Along with hysterical women complaining men were seeing through their clothes.
our fear can stop more technological advances than religion itself.
>>54274851
>The FACT remains, until batteries can be charged in minutes, the cars are not useable for anything other than low mileage commutes.
almost 400k orders in the first week making it the largest launch of any product, ever....
>>54275023
and? that has nothing to do with what i said.
>>54275023
400k orders out of 7.125 billion people. They should have just improved the infrastructure of america so we can travel on trains and subways and not have to have any cars
smmfh
>>54275002
>you think him owning a "mega plant" and virtually becoming a monopoly will help costs?
When you produce MORE of something, the price goes DOWN.
Nevermind the elementary school theory about how monopolies defloured innocents across the globe. No one in the history of mankind was able to abuse the people through a monopoly. It was good theory for pedagogical macroeconomy, but that's it. If you set up a huge factory making something while everyone else makes very little of it you will only be able to drive the price down. If you try to drive it up people would just buy from the competition. This is why monopolies have never, in the history of mankind, be able to abuse the population in a free market.
If you have a state run economy it's different. Each state company has a monopoly, the standard is shit, the prices are high, the quality is terrible and only the selected few get all the products they want.
>>54271911
That's because China mostly uses coal.
Coal should be outright banned. Oil is less bad and natural gas is actually not bad at all. We can wait to stop using those.
>>54271229
Go back to your fucking containment board, faggot.
>>>/o/
>>54272725
Dedicated pooping street
>>54273865
>A fucking leaf
Kek'd
>>54275138
/o/ here, keep these "muh progress" fags off my board please.
HYDROGEN
Y
D
R
O
G
E
N
>>54275163
Fine, lets just send them to >>>/trash/
>>54273684
Its dirt cheap to charge up. About 1 dollar will charge the battery to full from completely dead. Many businesses offer it so customers will stop in, workplaces dont want to nickel and dime their employees.
>>54275060
I was trying to point out that it's obviously not just for short mileage commutes over 200 miles with one fill is no joke. Stopping for half an hour after you had gone for over 200 miles is a ok for most people.
Not everyone needs to drive something like 700 km in one day. I have owned a car for over 10 years now, have even gone on vacations with it but I've never needed anything like the shit some anons describe ITT.
Also, if every now and then you have to take a loooong trip you could just rent a car.
>>54275060
Largest launch of any product. Ever. In. Fucking. Ever.
And fuck iPhones.
>>54275201
>$1
that is not how energy works you fucking idiot.
>>54275266
>Largest launch of any product. Ever. In. Fucking. Ever.
its just the latest iteration of some expensive junk car. Its not a real launch
>>54275266
yeah, that magical 30 minute stop then means you have stop again in 1 1/2 hours. and that is only if you are going the magical route that they placed the stations on. even IF there are station in the first place
you lost you fucking shill. do some fucking research next time
>>54271229
I'm only excited because, while it clearly is a stupid purchase, the amount of people buying it is funding the development of future electric cars that will one day not be stupid purchases.
Currently, battery technology is nowhere near the point where it's a good investment. Hell, the people who think they are getting a value are simply stealing money from other tax-paying citizens via subsidized "incentives" to purchasers and companies who do "eco-friendly" stuff (even though it isn't eco-friendly, it's a coal-powered car, and due to electricity waste as it goes through the long wires, it's not even especially efficient coal-power)
In 20 or 50 years when we can grow a nevada-sized chunk of biological solar cells and bio-batteries in the desert, then electric cars will actually be even a little bit eco-friendly.
The tesla 3 is not even close.
>>54275124
tesla is litearlly buying every single battery he can get his hands on, theres been some roumers hes even buying them from amazon.
When ever single battery pack takes 7-12000 batteries compared to some competitors 1-300
its going to be hard to saturate the market.
>>54275495
2 years ago an 18650 on amazon was about $5 they now run $15-25
>>54275307
Man if EV doesn't suit your needs too bad. Fix your life in a way that you won't have to take 1k miles trips or just stay with gas car.
>>54273509
The efficiency of the motors used in an EV are on the order of 95% while most gasoline engines are around 20%. Not to mention the massive amout of energy needed to extract, refine, and transport the fuel. Wells to wheel CO2 emissions from gasoline cars are nearly an order of magnitude higher than a 100% coal powered EV.
yeah maybe when they have muh advances in battery technology
tesla is just an investor-scam meme at this point
>>54275307
>you have stop again in 1 1/2 hours
The fuck is wrong with you?!?!?!? So I drive for some 220 miles, then stop for half an hour and then get upset that I can only do another fucking 200 miles?!?!?!? That's supposedly a problem?!!??! Doing 400 miles with a half an hour stop?!??!?!
How the fuck do you drive? Do you never stop, ever? Your passengers must be all nagging and you just keep on driving and driving. Fuck. After one, or maybe two hours I want to take a break. Most people I know take breaks.
>and that is only if you are going the magical route that they placed the stations on
FFS we all built the fucking gas stations everywhere thanks to fucking Saudi/CIA shills owning the fuck out of this world. That is why petrol stations are everywhere. Electrical refills will be built soon and refilling wont be a fucking problem.
there's sand in your buttcrack you goat fucking petrolium engineer
>>54272847
The big difference though is that the only place to refuel a gasoline car is at a gas station, while the vast majority of EV charging is done at home. You only need to use a quick charger if you are driving long distances. The demand for EV quick charging therefore will be much less than gas stations and we can get away with having fewer of them.
>>54275289
1 dollar buys you 20 kWh of energy at 5 cents per kWh. 20 kWh is the usable capacity of current 100 mile range EVs. Where did i fuck up the math here?
>>54275653
400 miles at 75mph is only 5 hours and 20~ minutes of road time.
If I were driving that I'd only have to stop once or twice for gas, and those stops wouldn't be very long. 5 hours isn't a very long drive.
>>54271229
No, because I don't want to drive a botnet.
I'll stick to based AE86 senpai.
>>54275612
>Wells to wheel CO2 emissions from gasoline cars are nearly an order of magnitude higher than a 100% coal powered EV.
That is not true though. It might be better to run a power plant and an EV, but the emissions from a coal power plant cannot be an order of magnitude lower like that.
>>54275653
>Electrical refills will be built soon
keep telling yourself that, even with a 30 minute burst charge that makes no sense. so what, you sanction 3 times the space because vehicles have to sit there and wait 30 minutes?
and then what if its full? you just sit there jerking off waiting for a stall to open to THEN spend 30 minutes?
the logistics make no sense, and that isnt even taking into account the electrical infrastructure needed to put that many high amp outlets on one location. but if you are the person who said that it only costs $1 to fully charge a dead battery i wouldnt expect you to understand jack shit.
>>54275713
>5 hours isn't a very long drive.
lol americans
just fly man
>>54275747
Coal plants have efficiencies of up to 40% compared to the 20% of a small combustion engine.
>>54275495
From what I have seen the cost of batteries had gone down in general. AAA batteries have become cheaper.
>>54275512
the 17$ is a 4pack.
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dphoto&field-keywords=18650+
But yeah prices of some producst might have actually been going up in some cases. Welcome to quantitative easing.
>>54275798
says the guy who thinks gas stations have expensive pumps put in by government
>>54275747
Its an order of magnitude lower because of how much more efficient you use the energy. Transporting the energy via the grid is more efficient than hauling it by truck and train, electric motors are 3 or 4 times as efficient as gasoline engines. It takes 6 kWh of electricity per gallon of gasoline just in the refining process. If you consider every gram of CO2 emitted from extracting it from the ground to moving a vehicle an equal distance, its around an order of magnitude difference
>>54275713
Average commute is 30 minutes for americans.
If you cant see the benefit of a vastly safer, lower maintenance vehicle then maybe you aren't the market.
>>54275713
>5 hours isn't a very long drive.
I just......... Can't.
I'm a European. If I drive for 5 hours I go through 4 different countries with 4 different languages.
>>54271229
>Lithium batteries are more hazardous to the environment that regular emissions
>you still have to make electricity to power it
And these are better than current cars how?
>>54275895
And how many of those have in place a charging station that can do a 30 minute burst?
>>54275901
Instantaneous torque.
Fewer mechanical parts to maintain.
Significantly safer.
>>54275747
That's true. If my calculations are good Tesla that runs on 100% coal generated electricity has co2 footprint of small euro diesel car.
It's still not bad tho.
>>54275872
Average commute has literally nothing to do with your stupid hypothetical.
>>54275895
I drive 5 hours between my place in MN and my land in ND regularly. I commute over an hour each way to work daily.
Many of Europe's nations are the size of some small states, your entire land mass is a joke.
love the god of the gaps argument which is applied to ICE cars vs. electric cars.
>CAN I DRIVE FROM NEW YORK TO MACHU PICCHU WITHOUT CHARGING 30MINS? NO? WELL, FUCK ELECTRIC CARS
>>54275835
>>54275851
OK, guize, now;
- firstly, an order of magnitude means it's 10 times greater. The order of magnitude has to do with decimal place
- secondly burning coal is the most CO2 intense way of burning anything. If for example you would be burning methane the CO2 would be lower by one half as compared to coal. IDK about gasoline specifically but I guess it's close to that. The reason is that coal is pure carbon and burning it produces energy only from the oxyadtion of carbon. Whereas other things like gasoline also have hydrogen atoms and they bind into H20 which also releases some energy so that all the energy doesn't directly come from producing CO2.
Not that I care that much about the CO2 meme
>>54275895
Also, if I wanted to take a longer trip I would just rent a car or borrow something gasoline powered from a family member. You shouldn't think like you're locked onto your vehicle. Families have different types of cars and they swap.
Overkill for a commuter car. I'd prefer something like pic related, with 100km -150km range for a third of the Tesla's weight, range and price.
However big car companies wont offer it ever because if they succeeded with it they would automatically hurt their own core business.
>>54275901
Not that many, ofc, but I think they will soon be almost as common as regular gas stations. I wouldn't go on a very long trip with my car anywhere. I have a car, but I flew to UK while visiting and rented a car over there.
Tesla 3 might not be the best for your taste but it fully covers anything I ever wanted from a car.
>>54275976
wasn't my hypothetical, but my point was that its more than sufficient for most Americans for most driving needs.
>>54276069
>will soon be almost as common as regular gas stations
Don't think so since there's no need for it. 90% of EV mileage will be done on electricity charged at home,
>>54275976
the 5 hour drive will def not be doable by an electric car alone for some time, but the 1 hour to work would, since you could probably charge both at work and at home.
It may be a hassle, but you save a fuckton of money on transportation.
>>54276159
Musk said Tesla will be building many more shortly. Something like doubling within one year. And that's just one company. Apple is starting.
>>54275989
Im serious about the order of magnitude. Producing gasoline uses electricity too. in the refining process alone, it uses 6 kWh of electrical energy to produce 1 gallon. So if the average EV goes 4 miles per kWh, this is 24 miles worth of electrical energy. The average car goes around 24 miles per gallon. So examineing just one small step in the process we can already demonstrate that gasoline cars will emit much more CO2 and waste much more energy to go the same distance
>>54275976
>commute over an hour each way to work daily
Funny thing is despite my office being only like 7 miles away it also takes me an hour to get there.
It's ideal scenario for EV car. I drive diesel as DD, borrowed Prius for few days from a friend and I got double the mileage despite Prius being bigger car with auto trans.
>>54276242
Refining process itself has only about 80% efficiency.
Not to mention extraction, transport, distribution and so on.
Coal is mostly fed to power plant directly from open pit mine and there's very little overhead in the process.
>>54276242
mind = blown
>>54271404
OPEC is wrong, but I'd say 10-20%.
You can't buy an electric car unless you have your own private, closed garage space to charge it up.
This fact will not change, and the availability of private, closed parking spaces for everyone will not improve as time goes on - real estate prices grow faster than overall inflation and real estate wealth gains are the only source of wealth inequality growth in the world.
It's a toy for the rich, nothing more.
>>54276540
you can't buy an internal combustion car if you don't have a crude oil well and refinery in your backyard. It's a toy for the rich, nothing more.
>>54276654
An internal combustion car can be filled up in 2 minutes
>>54276670
An electric car can be charged in 30 minutes. Your time is worthless anyway.
>>54276540
Its costs over 10 cents per mile to drive an internal combustion engine car, and between 0 and 2 cents per mile depending on if you use your own electricity or free public charging. Internal combustion engine cars are toys for rich people.
>>54271229
>induction motors
>no motor cooling
>no inverter cooling
>fuck huge gear ratio
>traditional spur/helical gearset instead of planetary
>open differential
>differential integrated into drive unit
>unacceptable build quality
>no artificial noise
>literally a textbook car with no innovations besides drivetrain and clever marketing
>>54276695
>you only have to spend 30 minutes per day at your nearest gas station!
>>54271229
Well the cars run GNU/Linux so that's enough for me.
>>54276782
Or you park, go to work/ eat lunch/ take your wife's son to the game, and your car is magically fueled up by the time you come back.
>>54276782
>per day
How far away do you live from your work?
You can get from and too work without any issue, charge it at home while you sleep.
And when you do go on a roadtrip, you can charge it in 30 minutes. so you might have to plan your trip, so you eat anyway, but that is part of the "joy" of owning such a car.
>>54276066
Or even better
>>54274226
>im sure pajeets (which will be the majority by 2040, sorry little dick white bois ;)) will barely start seeing cars by then.
You realize India manufactures cars right now, don't you?
And don't believe the bullshit population projections, they change their story every year
>>54277142
Indians have 4 inch dicks tho
So for the trip from Phoenix to San Diego:
>Spend a couple minutes to refuel in Yuma
vs.
>Pray no one else is using the charging station station when I get there
>Get lucky and only have to twiddle my thumbs for 30 minutes
>Get unlucky and have to twiddle my thumbs for even longer than that
Electric cars are a meme perpetrated by faggots in the bay area and people on the worst coast who can't comprehend the idea of things being spread out.
tesr
>>54272466
>>54271718
Yes it's cold in Norway, and the terrain is mountainous. Bad conditions for EVs. Yet they work great for most people anyway. You don't need a heated garage, modern EVs work fine even in sub-zero temps, just with a bit lower range.
I don't understand why other countries aren't seeing even close to similar EV adoption rates. Especially small and flat countries like Denmark or the Netherlands could be 100% EV today and there wouldn't be any trouble at all.
>>54276429
I think that's still a huge underestimate. It's 25 years from now, a LOT can and will happen. Most cars might even be fully autonomous by that time.
>>54277585
Because other countries don't have 99% of their electricity from hydropower for instance. Or they don't get massive subsidies from their state for purchasing an electric car. Or they are too poor to buy Teslas. Or there aren't even any (attractive) electric cars available on their national market. In many cases even all of these reasons at once.
>>54277325
So you pay 5 to 8 times more for every mile to drive your gasoline car in comparison to an EV, and are forced to spend 10-15 minutes refilling every 300 miles, compared to the 30 seconds to plug in every 200 miles at home, then you think its a huge pain in the ass to wait an extra 15-20 minutes the rare times you need to travel far enough to use a fast charger. I think youre the one twiddling your thumbs more often than an EV driver on average dude. And paying excessively more to do so
>>54277325
You would have to stop for 30 minutes anyway. If you are able to drive that distance without a food break or stretching your legs, you are an exception. I'd personally have to stop multiple times for sure. I wouldn't lose any time doing the trip in an EV versus an ICE car.
Besides, even if someone does manage the extreme feat of driving that in one sitting, I think they'd still appreciate that the trip in an EV would be free. You might potentially save time in a gas car, but it will cost you so if you really wanted to save time you could have just taken the plane or something instead.
>>54277585
Aren't mountains an advantage for EV?
When you go downhill you charge the battery, right?
Anyways, here in the Netherlands everything depends on tax laws and subsidies - which change all the fucking time.
Couple of years ago hybrid was the most economical.
Last it it was full electric.
I think now it's either hybrid or petrol.
You can't just buy a car you like, you have to do complex calculations to avoid paying shitloads of taxes.
>>54277886
You don't charge the battery on the way down as much as you use going up. Regeneration is only like 10% efficient.
>>54271229
I want to buy one, but I'll have to wait either for used models on the secondary market, or the price will have to drop sub 20k
>>54277791
10 minutes every 2 hours is good.
30 minutes every 2 hours is retarded.
Not being able to drive 3 hours in one go is also retarded.
So far only Tesla has enough range.
>>54277908
>Regeneration is only like 10% efficient.
Really?
That's hardly even worth it.
>>54277786
>10-15 minutes refuelling
Fuck dude, what are you doing at the pump, offering handjobs to all takers? Takes me 2 minutes to fuel
>>54277968
That's the only thing you refute? Seems like you missed the point of his post
>>54271229
Electric economy of scale is nice but I'm not a fan of cars that depend heavily on software for operation.
>>54275136
Germany is switching off its nuclear power plant just because they plan to use more coal power plant. And that's not a 3rd world country.
>>54278045
also the "Tesla is a throwaway car" blog post is pretty persuasive
http://syonyk.blogspot.com/2016/03/is-tesla-building-throwaway-cars.html
>>54278053
they're on their way there
>>54277965
For the Leaf its rated at around 40% efficiency, which averages use of the disk brakes and regen brakes. 10% would be accurate for very hard braking where the disk brakes are used more. If you slow very gradually and use as much regen as possible it will be close to 60%.
Just make a car that runs on piss and methanol
>>54277968
If you include the time it takes to drive out of your way to the gas station i dont think its unreasonable. You dont need to take that detour with an EV on a regular basis.
>>54272217
>215+
Projected
>5 star safety
No tests performed yet. Won't be for a while.
>Autopilot
Projected. This seems likely.
>superchargers
Infrastructure isn't quite 'there' yet, but would be cool.
>cost of $35k
Projected, after incentives, no guarantees here.
>400k preorders
Cool as fuck IMO. Piques interest of investors and sets EVs up as a viable future. Pre orders don't guarantee sales however, and Tesla is likely not going to deliver 400k units in the first quarter, probably not the first year. These early adopters likely aren't going to buy a new one every couple years, so unless you can change the minds of the holdouts sales are going to dip hard. Rushing this many 'budget' vehicles is likely to cause numerous issues leading to a hit to public image, and scaring investors and the public away.
All in all I think it's a good step, but it's gonna take a miracle to make it through unscathed. If other automakers step up their offerings then EVs have a lock IMO. Personally I'm still hoping for hydrogen fuel cells to take off.
>>54271789
I've never seen a Tesla here in Richmond, VA. Where do you live and what kind of job do you have that other people also drive Tesla? Are you some kind of faggot who works for Google?
>>54277215
Seems you're rather familiar with Indian dicks
>400,000 'preorder' with only 1k down and can refund the 1k whenever they want
>full details of disappointing tesla comes out, while at same time public learns how polluting coal power and rare metal battery manufacturing are
>400,000 refunds, tesla company collapses, totally bankrupt, and without a market of scale, those "35k" vehicles would each cost 200k, so the entire line is cancelled.
The hype-bubble collapse is imminent.
>>54278045
>I'm not a fan of cars that depend heavily on software for operation
So about every car made in the last 30 years?
>>54271404
I guess 20% of all new people will be muslim too
>>54279628
Normie drivers don't give a shit about coal plants and lithium mines
>>54279684
to be fair, there is a difference between a car with obd and a bluetooth radio for your phone, and a car that has a fucking sim card.
>>54279538
Not him but in southern California you literally cannot go more than 5 minutes without seeing a tesla, and much less than that on the freeways. They're incredibly popular because with the tax credits it's really not much more expensive than a well-optioned 5-series or E-class. Of course the eco-friendly thing is trendy there too and the average income is quite high so that helps as well.
I go to college in Atlanta and here too you quite a few teslas, though not as many as nissan leafs or plug-in priuses.
>>54279796
Anon I don't think a sim slot failure will keep a modern car from running
>>54279538
They're all over Toronto
>>54271229
Our model S is bretty good, funny thing about the auto drive though is it feels like the car is going to crash when it stops at lights because of the waiting to press the breaks.
Though when you considering whats really going on the car must have estimates for not rear-ending the car infront down exactly while what you may be used to is just some irrational level of caution natural for the amount of error it is easy to make on the road.
>>54272117
If I get an EE degree will musk let me slave at his offices for 15 hours a day?
ITT: fags can't accept the electric revolution destroyed earlier by advances in explosion engine vehicles during the world wars
>>54274751
Yeah he should just let that impending lawsuit wonderland be unleashed.
>>54279684
>>54279796
>>54279814
yes I realize lots of cars depend on low level software to run but not every car needs to boot up an OS to pull out of your driveway or be remotely disabled in the middle of the highway
>>54273619
are you a retard?
>>54279538
I've seen exactly one here in St Louis in the almost 2 years I've been here. Seen a few Leafs.
>>54279628
What rare metal? Lithium is the third most abundant substance in the universe, dude.
>>54271762
papa bless
>>54271678
yeh just not the $200,000 tesla. I'm waiting for an affordable one
>>54279883
EE, CE, SE, anything like that and you can work for tesla.
>>54281804
But does it exist in abundance on Mars? That is the question for Tesla.
>>54273865
Yeah wtf man. Why do environmentally friendly cars (except Tesla) have to be so fucking ugly? Leaf, Prius, Volt etc. Even the Model 3 looks kinda weird with that smooth front grill. Why can't they make a normal looking car that just happens to run on electricity.
It's almost as if OPEC sandnigger sheikhs are bribing car designers to design the ugliest possible thing they could that would still pass by management.
>>54271404
OPEC is starting to fall apart. They'll be irrelevant in 10 to 20 years.
>>54283340
One one hand I see what you're saying, but on the other hand it's pretty silly when you think about it for EVs to specifically try to look as much like traditional cars as possible even if it has no function or even lowers function (adding weight, drag etc).
Once we get over that phase cars will look drastically difference now that they don't need a huge engine or gearbox or cooling system etc in the front. In the future I think most cars will look something like this. It looks ridiculous but it's really better: very low weight and space footprint, great view with tall windows, simple and cheap to manufacture etc.
>>54286536
Now this is progress. A car made specifically for Faggots.
>>54272566
I think the idea is that right now, that those people who can already afford an EV, also own their own house so they can charge their car in their garage overnight and thus have no need to visit a gas station any more.
For large cities where people live in flats, this does of course not work but I could see power chargers coming up on the sidewalks in living areas where people park on the road.
How that cost is shared will have to be solved, but it doesn't seem insurmountable.
Here in Hamburg, Germany, we already have a few chargers randomly put up, and some companies as well as the government's offices have chargers on their parking spaces.
>>54275124
> >you think him owning a "mega plant" and virtually becoming a monopoly will help costs?
> When you produce MORE of something, the price goes DOWN.
> Nevermind the elementary school theory about how monopolies defloured innocents across the globe. No one in the history of mankind was able to abuse the people through a monopoly. It was good theory for pedagogical macroeconomy, but that's it. If you set up a huge factory making something while everyone else makes very little of it you will only be able to drive the price down. If you try to drive it up people would just buy from the competition. This is why monopolies have never, in the history of mankind, be able to abuse the population in a free market.
You use monopoly and competition in the same line of argumentation. Either you do not know what a monopoly is (or what competition means), or you're just an idiot.
>>54278053
They don't plan on using more coal. The only expanding part of coal usage in Germany is near berlin (lausitz) and there will be a huge demo against it on may 13.-16. you should go to. I know I will.
>Diving down freeway
>truck ahead flicks up a small rock
>windshield gets chipped
>ENTIRE TOP OF CAR NEEDS TO BE REPLACED.
>>54279538
Saw a few in Starnberg near München.
![920_pd1961638_1[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/hHo0ixO.jpg "920_pd1961638_1[1].jpg")
>>54288909
thats what they said when modern windshields came out
>>54271404
I think in terms of the world 1% is a good estimate. Just look at the map of Internet usage in the world and you'll see what I mean. I think for Europe and America 10% is possible
So, what happens to the batteries if the Tesla gets into a serious crash? Is the driver gonna fry like the car thief in the original Robocop? What about battery disposal too?
>>54280478
Do you have any idea how much shit gets coded these days? The amount of code in a car is staggering.
>>54271229
>IMO it really seems as that within 10 years all the new cars will be electric. I couldn't have imagined this two years ago, but this is starting to be very likely.
Honestly OP, I wish you would dream bigger.
It is exactly the things that you cannot imagine or you find difficult to accept even in dreams that will come true.
As for EV cars, yes they are the future.
Even if making batteries for them is 'dirty' it still ends up being an overall positive effect.
A single coal plant is much better for the environment than all the ICE cars it will replace.
People don't understand just how much CO2 is being emmited from driving.
Take for example the F150 and the Ram Diesel
>Indeed, the EPA estimates 439 grams per mile of CO2 emissions for the Ram, and a slightly lower 407 grams per mile for the F-150.
Almost a pound per mile !
>>54271229
>buy this electric car running on 20 year old laptop battery tech you goy!
>>54289859
>confusing 18650 form factor with the technology behind it
>>54289879
>confusing using adding fuses and proprietary BMS + fan as innovating
telsa is the apple of cars
>>54289344
Pretty sure batteries can be recycled for their materials
>>54289924
>Apple of cars
>all patents are free to use
>"iPad" in the car runs Ubuntu
>>54275002
>nuclear powered gas stations sounds like a really fucking good idea
kek'd
>>54272652
>tfw from /o/
>tfw /g/ probably knows cars better
I used to be famous, now I'm a nobody again. But it's okay, this place is better.
>>54289636
yes. I also know my car can not be remotely disabled.
>>54292477
Treequinox?
>>54292728
No. Before he started crashing his subaru.
>>54272062
>Not to mention filling up a gas tank takes a few minutes, where charging could take hours
Based Tesla back at it again with the battery swaps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5V0vL3nnHY
>>54292824
GTP?
>cars with networked computers
Adama was right.
>>54292912
I'm not a goober and I predate those two by like at least 2 years.
>>54288860
>they don't plan on using more coal except for this place that they're planning on using more coal
>>54271229
I am. I'm saving up and hopefully in 8 years i can have my own Tesla. By then my Toyota Camry would be within its last legs to warrant a replacement.
>>54275080
>so we can travel on trains and subways and not have to have any cars
You actually WANT to use trains and subways? Goddamn they're awful
>>54293761
They're only awful when they're neglected because only gross poor people use them and everyone else is expected to own a private deathcage.
Public transit in first world countries is far from awful.
>>54279628
Except 400,000,000 is a hell of a non-interest loan, even if half refund, they could have invested it and gained capital, as well as used that to produce product that people will eventually buy.
>>54293855
I use public transit in a first world country and it's garbage.
>>54293875
Sounds like you were mistaken about being in a first world country.
>>54289344
Electric cars are far less likely to catch on fire than ICE cars. The battery is very well protected. IIRC the Model S received the highest ever score in some mandatory safety test which of course includes serious crashes from all angles.
And li-ion batteries are very recyclable.
>>54293968
>England isn't first world
>>54294001
It isn't.
>>54294106
Please, tell us where you think public transit is good in the entire country.
>>54294276
>entire country
Japan
>>54294300
Japan is LITERALLY not a first-world country.
>>54294315
Actually, disregard this post, I'm a faggot.
I haven't actually experience transit in Japan.
It was pretty good in China, though.
>>54294331
>China
DEFINITELY not first-world
>>54294355
Yeah, I know, it was just a side-thought.
>>54279883
I bet those companies hire literally anyone who is good at math
>>54272725
Where the fuck do you live? I don't even remember the last time I was in a gas line, and I live in Phoenix and was in downtown LA last month.
