What do you guys think about John C. Lilly's theories (ECCO, human biocomputer), or sensory deprivation tanks in general? Is the brain really reliant on a set of metaprograms?
>>53987977
He was a huge inspiration to me and is one of my heroes. Totally changed my way of thinking. However he's so out of the box that some of it was bound to be retarded. ECCO is a neat idea and makes way more sense than say, angels in Christianity but that's just the thing, he kinda created his own scientific religion and like all religions it's kind of bullshit. Really got me interested in Buddhism but mostly for the philosophy. It's funny because his human biocomputer idea is spot on and is pretty much what most of science believes these days, that is that human brains are just biological computers running programs that are written by other programs that were written by our DNA, just like our other biological functions. That was spot on, then he had to go and mix in his spiritual bullshit to cope with the fact that his existence will end when he dies. Same reason all religions exist.
The isolation tank is an amazing idea that is VERY old but he simply refined it. I'm going to try one soon but it's like $60 bucks just for an hour session... This dude also invented the ECC (NOT ECCO) or electroencephalogram which measures brain activity.
His craziest invention by far was his brain electrodes though. Very mad-scientist esque. He refined the technique for stimulating regions of neurons with a thin wire embedded in the brain. The hardest part obviously is doing it all without causing damage. He even patented the wave form (Lilly wave) that was most effective. He was stimulate neurons milimeter by milimeter throughout the entire brain and see what the reaction was. These days they're doing it with fiber optics and genetically modified neurons in rats that contain a die that reacts to light but they wouldn't have that today without lillys research. If you've ever watched and enjoyed the Matrix or Ghost in the Shell, this stuff is for you. Like Sigmund Freud, he laid the groundwork for others but is now ridiculed for his other crazy ideas.
>>53988208
Thanks for the informative post, anon.
I'm also going to try a 'float' session soon. Have you read 'Programming and Metaprogramming in the Human Biocomputer'?
>>53988304
Yes I have! That and "The Scientist" are the only ones I've read by him so far. Pretty crazy shit. The Scientist is more of an overview of his whole life or as he says "a meta-physical autobiography".
>>53988208
Craziest part about the brain electrodes is the story where he isolated individual sections of neurons that controlled orgasm, ejaculation, and erection. He gave the monkey a button that it could press to give itself an orgasm without ejaculation or erection. It was set to give a delay of 3 minutes after each press. The monkey pretty much sat there pressing the button again and again until it got sick from not eating. He tried to "reprogram" the monkey to be normal again but he pretty much short circuited the most basic and powerful reward system in the brain. Like a drug addict.
>>53988417
He also made a donkey (or something like that) walk in a straight line across some mountains by wiring a compass to it's brain. Sorta like those remote control cockroach kits you can buy online I guess. My god how far we've come. I've seen videos online supposedly leaked from isreali labs showing remote control monkeys doing basic muscle group movements by command.
>>53988417
I wonder if that's possible to do for a human...
>>53989068
If it works on a monkey, the answer is almost certainly yes. I wonder what kind of crazy workaholic you could turn a person into by making them come when (and only when) they get shit done.
>>53989470
women already do that with men
some get so browbeaten they lose all sex drive
>>53987977
He' my hero too, reading his books is like having a personal conversation with him. I've learned a great deal and it still influencing me in many ways. Lovely post OP
>>53988208
having an Isolation tank for personal use has been my dream for many many years now. Its a great experience if you havent tried yet, a 10/10 experience IMHO. I get drawn into the idea of replacing my comfortable bed for sleeping with one of these... wonder if its possible, the amount of time youll be freeing up to do other shit would be amazing
>>53987977
cetaceans are sexy
>>53989852
Apparently dolphin vaginas feel much better than a human's.
>>53989879
I intend on finding out. It is my only purpose in life.
This is now a dolphin pussy thread.
>>53989892
On that note, I've heard the same thing about horse pussy.
I bet Lilly fucked a few dolphins in his time, or at least thought about it.
>>53988417
so to isolate the sections, somebody had to jerk a monkey of multiple times?
>>53989976
Nah none of that nasty farm animal pootang.
But those dolphins though.
>>53990041
Don't monkeys jerk themselves off all the time?
I have this theory that the majority of the population would bang a dolphin if they had the opportunity and could do so in secrecy. It's actually a discrete psychological phenomenon inherent to our species.
>>53990093
I wouldn't doubt it.
Just like most women would love to be fucked by their dog.
>>53987977
Joe Rogan is that you?
>>53990271
Rogan is a fucking twat. I can't stand him.
>>53990376
>public figure who advocates the use of DMT and isolation tanks
Perhaps, but he still comes out on top in my book for those reasons alone.
I've only read Eye of the Cyclone. A lot of interesting ideas, but pretty off the wall. His bits on trying to communicate with dolphins, with float tanks, with his experiences at a South American "guru" retreat, his ket use, his brain research...a very prolific figure.
>>53990710
I thought it was Center of the Cyclone. Center of the Cyclone just flows better.
He basically single-handedly ruined the field of interspecies communication.
>>53990787
Why ruined? I had the impression that he was a pioneer in that field.
>>53990815
Lilly was brilliant, no doubt. However his theories went a little far out there towards the end. In the beginning he did more than anyone else for interspecies communication and was a pioneer for it. His reputation later on and his failures turned the field into a joke.
There's a reason scientists today are horrifically objective in trying to establish and define communication with other animals. When you claim you can communicate telepathically with another species via LSD and the isolation tank, it puts your credibility into question for most people. He also promised the world in terms of dolphin-human communication and never delivered.
bump for dolphin tang
>>53988417
i remember reading about that experiment, never knew who did it though, i need to check this guy out
>>53989068
Yep, actually people try to patent the technique (maybe using different pleasure neurons) as a method to relieve addiction to drugs, but the FDA denies it every time and thinks it would create it's own powerful addiction and that we also aren't quite ready to control that in a reliable way, bio-technologically speaking.
>>53989068
>>53992436
Also there is a back nerve stimulator some dude was making to block pain signals and ended up making women orgasm really hard. That's getting trials because it isn't wired straight to the brain and seems/is safer.
>>53989817
I'm not sure the whole "one float hour sleep replaces 4" thing is entirely true. It may be more refreshing than a 1 hour nap, but biologically it doesn't work that way and you still need 8 hours sleep everyday.
This is heading into /x/ territory.
Check out second order cybernetics, its seeing a resurgence lately. Gurdjieff was another who though of the body as a machine early on.
>>53989852
She never fucked the dolphin or jerked it off. So may people pervert her study even though it's all hyperbole. She just said she teased it enough to get it to stay interested and ease his sexual tension enough to not try to rape he (dolphins try that sometimes)
>>53990041
What? no. He stimulated that group of nerons and the monkey climaxed. Next one over made it get hard. Next one over made it ejaculate. Next one over might have twitched a thigh muscle or something. He mapped the whole fucking brain.
>>53990710
I can't wait to read that one. All his books are on my to read list.
>>53987977
He was an amazing dude. I think some of his theories were silly but he was still amazing.
>>53992488
Don't forget that, as a fact, the brain needs some time to process shit. Being in a more relaxed environment can reduce it, but not so much.
>>53992515
actually she did jerk it off. That's documented.
not that there's anything wrong with that. Or that it should even matter.
>>53992773
Exactly. The brain needs time to relax, as does the body. And dreams also play a complex role in our though processing, and you don't get the same types of dreams and brain wave states during regular sleep as you do in a float tank. I read somewhere about two distinct types of dreams, types where you replay memories, and types where you creatively make up completely new scenarios out of random junk in your head. Both serve a purpose and evolved for a reason. The state you enter in an isolation tank only normally happens for about 5 minutes as you drift off to sleep. I believe it's called theta state. It's neat and has benefits but it's not all you need.
>>53992902
Citations? I've looked and have only found her talking about petting the dolphins belly and stuff to make it happy. It definitely got boners and tried to fuck her but everything I've read says she didn't stroke its penis.
>>53993017
I think in the book itself? Somewhere towards the end. They were pretty transparent about it.
I misspoke, she didn't jerk it off, she just let him rub off on her when his arousal interfered with their lessons.
LSD, isolation tanks, dolphin sex, ghost in the shell, this thread has it all baby!
>>53993435
*John C. Lilly has it all
It's too bad he had to leave us. He died doing what he loved, well kinda. He was trying a drug he hadn't done before and went to bring his wife her keys before his trip started. But the new drug kicked in fasted than he anticipated, and he crashed his fucking bicycle so bad that he died in the hospital a week later. I can just picture him cycling down the sidewalk at an unsafe speed laughing like a maniac before his old ass hit the side of a car or something.
Is it ironic that he died the way Hoffman first tripped, riding a bicycle?
From his wiki article
>He was a researcher of the nature of consciousness using mainly isolation tanks,dolphin communication, and psychedelic drugs, sometimes in combination.
Whew boy, I'll be looking into him a little more.
>53993564
But he didnt died from that trip with pcp and he actually had a couple of near death physical experiences...
Is Programming and Metaprogramming in the Human Biocomputer: Theory and Experiments a good introduction to him? I wanna start with his more normal ideas before diving into all the crazy spiritualism
>>53993706
I would suggest that you drop some acid first, anon.
It will help you learn about yourself.
Not even memeing.
>>53993734
ketamine brah
>>53993734
No worries, I did acid and schrooms multiple times. I took about 10g of schrooms once and I'm planning on taking DMT one day. Now answer the damn question
>>53993734
>acid without a spirit guide
Yeah nah. Unless you're already inclined to that sort of thinking, you'd just be going in circles and DUDE WHOA SWIRLY
>>53993818
yep, human biocomputer was the first book i read by him and I knew i was hooked up from there, others ive enjoyed was the quiet center and a rare one called The dyadic cyclone... hope that helps!
>>53993818
DMT was an extremely transformative experience for me. Good luck to you, anon.
>>53993831
Yeah, I forgot about that. My mentor taught me a lot, so I knew what to do when the time came. Sometimes it pisses me off when I see people just use psys recreationally without respecting their power as an entheogen. I try not to sperg out about it, but I think they should be aware of it before using the substance.
>>53993616
Yea the PCP trip just put him in a coma for two weeks right? It was some other drug that I'm not aware of that he was on when he crashed his bike which killed him a week or so later.
>>53993706
I wouldn't say it's a great introduction to HIM but it's a great book about his LSD research. I'd recommend reading his autobiography "The Scientist" first.
What's this? A good thread on /g/? I must be dreaming.
>>53993568
Yea he actually had an isolation tank in a room above a dolphin tank, and had a two way microphone/speaker set up between his tank and the dolphins tank while they both tripped on acid. No wonder he kept that shit secret while he did other research.
>>53993953
Another time he finished a isolation tank + ketamine sesh and then hopped in the hot tub after, thinking the ketamine had worn off. The hot tub made him pass out and he drowned for a bit before his friend "got a weird feeling" and went to check on him. While he was drowning was his first visit by the ECCO or Earth Coincidence Control Office. They said " This is the ECCO, we've arranged a coincidence to demonstrate our power and help you continue your evolution." or something and that's when he came up with the ECCO, after his buddy dragged him out of the hot tub and performed CPR on him.
This guys shenanigans also inspired (partially) The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy. He's referenced in a ton of stuff if you're looking, which I always am.
>>53992508
Thanks for the name drop, twas new for me. Interesting dude Gurdjieff was.
>>53994149
yeah man and another dude you should check out is Franklin Merrel-Wolff, jhonn c lilly considered him a mentor and a big influence... his books are our of this world literally, you can see how lilly got many ideas from him
>mfw this thread
Holy shit, this guy is awesome. Ive been interested in consciousness nature and brain "circuitry" for a while and will definitely read more about this man and his books. Some things do indeed sound /x/-ish but interesting and worth studying nonetheless. I dont know how I hadnt heard of him before. Thanks for this, /g/.
>>53993945
It's an entheogen regardless of them being aware. All is god all is good.
PROTOCOL_07
>>53990451
What's so special about the dmt experience, and how can it improve me? Not looking for just a high, here.
>>53999079
You're not going to get a good answer to that here. Go do some reading.
