Is there any reason for getting a ATX motherboard in 2016?
>>53980434
When you need enough space for your SLI/Crossfire.
Other than that, there is no real difference between the sizes.
>>53980434
micro ATX master race reporting
>>53980434
RAM slots, SATA ports, USB ports, M2 PCIe bays, etc.
>>53980434
You are going to install PCI-E cards other than the GPU.
Why is that one PCI slot smaller on the EATX compared to the ATX?
>>53980434
>mfw I accidentally bought a micro-atx instead of ATX because the website didn't describe it right
>buyers remorse intensifies
>>53980578
I think that's the M.2 pci slot for PCI SSDs.
>>53980434
Is there any reason not to? You don't live in a capsule hotel. An ATX midtower is not too big to fit on or under your desk.
No, BTX master race is where it's at.
>>53980518
/thread
>>53980590
mATX is usually a fair bit cheaper.
>>53980582
just return it
>>53980618
No return policy unless it's broken. Plus it's been like a year now.
>>53980590
The whole "mooom I need ATX" meme is the dumbest thing /g/ has come up with in recent times. You get an ATX board for the slots and possibly extra ports, typically for future expansion. But anytime someone posts an ATX board someone else responds with that braindead meme.
>>53980434
yeah
two GPUs in SLI/CF and one SAS/SATA controller for example
>>53980634
>been like a year now
pffts
>No return policy
why would you buy from a site that doesn't have 2weeks regret period?
>>53980587
You're not going to meme me.
>>53980636
/g/ is filled with braindead memes designed to make newfag even dumber
/g/ is just a bad joke
I like expansion cards and I want as many in my computer as I can get.
>>53980656
>>53980478
you can sli/cf on micro atx.
i doubt theres many here that need more ports than a itx board offers.
>>53980668
I live in Australia, refund laws are different. Every place is like that.
>>53980685
apart from a gpu or some expensive pci ssd please tell me what you have in your pc.
some proof would be nice as well.
>>53980434
>ATX
lol dude, they merged with AMD like 5 years ago.
>>53980711
>Completely ignores the controller card and the AC wireless card
>>53980722
that's shitty, in the EU we have 2weeks minimal regret policy, ofcourse you'll have to pay for packaging replacement and any damage to the product but otherwise you just send it back and get your money back no questions asked.
>>53980711
If you have the generic i5/970/16gb ram/256gb ssd/2tb hdd meme computer that everybody has in the speccy threads, you don't need more.
Some people have broader needs.
>>53980478
>>53980434
>>53980636
>Majority of case are built around the ATX form factor
>Saves only a moderate amount of space in relation to the features that are stripped
>Granted, I'm not familiar with modern boards, but in the past, this included extra phases, extra sata ports, etc.
>Despite the saved space, cases are still fucking huge since most manufacturers seem to love the dual-compartment design with the fuck-huge footprint
>You're hard-pressed to find variety for mid-to-high range boards, usually settling for something that sucks the least
ITX is vastly superior--anything that mATX can do, ITX can do better. Otherwise, just get an ATX, and never have to compromise.
>>53980434
Sure, if you use your computer for something other than a glorified gaming console and need additional interfaces, co-processor cards, or other forms of expansion to tailor your system to your particular use case.
>>53980587
>M.2 pcie slot
wut
that's just a 4x pcie slot. You can get adapters but that's not how m.2 works
>>53980744
>wireless card
top fucking kek kolcheck
>>53980434
is there any reason to use PNG over JPG in 2016?
Is it possible to make a super small gaming PC with a mini-iTX motherboard and a super small case? What would I be missing out on, just SLI and other expansion slots? Will the case burned down from overheating?
>>53980434
Look at the chart you posted, that's why
>>53980864
AC5300 is faster than gigabit, faggot.
Stay mad.
When I can fit my
>video card
>RAID controller
>NVME SSD
>10Gb network card
>sound card
into a smaller motherboard I'll consider downsizing.
>>53981041
You can fit a video card in it.
Everything else you said is unneeded.
Must...build...baby PC.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008RJQ3GQ/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B008RJQ3GQ&linkCode=as2&tag=vidgamwri-20&linkId=PX2MFQI6UTPFYORV
>>53981013
Sounds like you're the ones that's mad, lad. Speed doesn't mean shit if the connection drops every five minutes.
Stay butthurt.
>>53980676
Meme proof Nigger
What is the smallest, coolest looking mini ITX case that can fit an NVIDIA GTX 950?
>>53981105
>dedicated gpu
>anything less than mid-tower case
Just no. I built one of those shits years ago, never again. RAM overheats constantly and corrupts any file it touches.
Got a node 804 waiting for the next Intel chipset to switch to MATX
>>53980578
The EATX put more lanes on the x16 slots I think, the ATX one has x8 lanes in x16 slots.
>>53980434
Hardly. Few home users and gamers have any reason they should ever need more than what microATX or maybe even miniITX can offer.
microATX can still fit four RAM cards, can SLI two video cards, and can even fit one or two more PCIe cards.
miniITX's biggest sacrifice is that you can only fit two RAM sticks, not four.
There's not much reason to need many PCIe slots anymore:
* Specialized ports: we have USB now
* More USB ports: you should already have 6 or 8
* SSDs: use M.2 or SATA3
* Wi-Fi: use miniPCIe or M.2 or USB
* Ethernet: one built-in gigabit is good enough
* RAID: software RAID is good enough
* Audio: use integrated audio or a DAC
* SATA: 6 should be plenty for a desktop
Even SLI's usefulness is questionable for gamers. Consider it if you work on 3D stuff for an income.
If you need more for any of those, get a server or ten. You're probably dealing with a workflow that shouldn't go on desktops anyway.
>>53981118
>years ago
All the problems are resolved.
>>53981118
>years ago
>RAM overheats constantly
How many years ago? 20?
>>53980434
Micro ATX here only running one GPU
Its in a regular size atx full size case
>>53980722
What thats horseshit if i rang up PC Case Gear they would take it back straight away or just make up some bullshit how it doesnt work and say you want a refund/credit and buy something else.
For expensive stuff i never usually go anywhere else.
Delt with umart a couple of times but never for RMA
This thread has got me excited to build my next computer with mini ITX
>>53980578
There are four PCIe slot sizes: x1, x4, x8, and x16.
In OP's picture, the EATX example is the only board with a x1 slot
The others have mainly x16 with up to one x4.
>>53981228
God you're retarded.
>buy a tiny computer and a server instead of just buying one computer that's big enough to fit all your shit
how about no, faggot.
>>53981267
I read on their fb a while ago that a mum had ordered the wrong parts at her sons behest and wanted to return them. They refused. Funnily enough I saw the same parts being sold a couple of weeks later as "refurbished".
Oh, and I really want to do a baby build in the Fractal 202 Node
https://www.pccasegear.com/products/34470/fractal-design-node-202-case-black
>>53981013
Wireless latency is awful compared to ethernet
>>53980904
Cooler Master Elite 110, enough said
>>53981228
I was going to break this down and shit on it but then I re-read it and saw
>home users
and pretty much agreed with it, though I would still take at least a four-slot board to allow for the addition of upcoming interfaces like USB-C or a RAID controller to handle larger arrays for archival storage.
>>53981118
>ram overheats
Literally never seen this happen once
>>53981451
Buffered RAM runs pretty fucking hot.
>>53981331
>buy a tiny computer and a server instead of just buying one computer that's big enough to fit all your shit
Get whatever computer fits your needs. If your needs actually require filling all your card slots in an ATX desktop, you'd probably be better off buying server hardware.
If you're typically using 12 hard drives, dual 10-gigabit network controllers, a high-end $400 RAID controller, 20 USB ports, a couple of those $400+ Intel PCIe SSDs, or whatever other crazy setup you want, you probably shouldn't even be thinking about getting a desktop let alone a small one.
If you don't care about price, size, or power draw, why bother with ATX when you could have dual-socket Xeons?
If you just want something like 6 hard drives, even a miniITX board can still handle something like that, although you'd of course need a bigger case and a PSU that can handle it.
pcie slots.
mITX or mATX are totally fine for your average gamer build, but I wouldn't put them in a home server build or "workstation" where you might want that expandability.
but then once you get back into 'real' servers you probably want mATX or mITX because density is more important than expandability, as your server will be designed to do a particular thing for its entire lifespan (compute, san, etc.)
>>53981338
I'm kind of interested in that case. Do you know roughly what type of video cards would fit those dimensions.
>>53980434
>Is there any reason for getting a ATX motherboard in 2016?
Plenty.
Better component cooling leads to a more stable overclock, and/or longer component life.
More board-space for additional components (caps, resistors, etc) not only means more features (WLAN ports, more SATA ports/RAID hardware, More PCI-E Ports etc) but also means more stable power flow, and the capability to have higher-end components on-board.
More Board-Features (hardware on/off and reset buttons, LCD display for post codes, additional SATA/PCI-E slots, more fan-plugs, additional headers for USB/Serial/Thunderbolt, additional RAM slots)
More I/O usually. Aside from additional headers, you usually get more back-panel I/O for the same price.
There are still plenty of reasons, and as well, I find them to be just the tiniest bit more reliable long-term than smaller-format boards.
But if you're the kind of person whose gonna do a re-build every 3-4 years from scratch anyway, then that doesn't matter. Get yourself whatever you want.
>>53981446
>upcoming interfaces like USB-C
USB-C is still USB. Adapters are cheaper than an expansion card, though I can understand wanting it built-in.
USB 3.1+ might make more sense as a card if you really need the speed upgrade enough.
>a RAID controller to handle larger arrays for archival storage
I'm honestly curious: do affordable RAID controllers actually offer a noticeable performance improvement over software RAID nowadays?
>>53981064
Literally today built my computer in this case but the microatx version. So if you wanna crossfire or have 4 RAM slots you can do that too. Love it so far, was tricky to build in though but it was only my second build I've done, so would be easier if you're not experienced.
>>53981041
Sound card can be external, NVMe can be m.2, that leaves three expansion cards putting you in mATX territory.
>>53981451
I had an issue with a couple of DIMMs that would cause BSODs if they got too warm.
But that's just a sign of a manufacturing fault, your RAM shouldn't spit out errors running at any sane temp (ie under 100C). And if it does then RMA it.
>>53980434
>Fan on the Southbridge
>2016
Just fuck my shit up familia tobehonest
>>53981690
Hardware RAID controllers are generally explicitly not recommended these days. One, the performance increase they can provide, though it was significant back in the 90s, is no longer very large. Two, a hardware RAID card means that the filesystem doesn't know anything about the RAID layer below it. It's more of an advantage to manage the RAID in software so that a system like ZFS or btrfs can know what data is on what disks, which enables things like scrubs to correct bit-rot errors, or RAID rebuilds that only bother checking and recreating the parts of the disks that are actually used, instead of doing the whole thing blindly.
In any case, the affordable RAID controllers have never been true hardware RAID, they have always just been a little bit of firmware that passes the work on to the CPU. Real hardware RAID controllers with their own on-board processing power have always been expensive.
>>53980880
>is there any reason to use PNG over JPG in 2016?
JPG for photos, png for vector graphic heavy stuff you dork.
>>53981053
>Everything else you said is unneeded.
>for a normal dork like you maybe
>>53981690
>do affordable RAID controllers actually offer a noticeable performance improvement over software RAID nowadays?
depends on hardware combos
raidz2 (software zfs raid 6) is faster than raid6 where you have lots of RAM and a cheap raid controller.
raid6 is faster than raidz2 where you don't have much RAM and you do have an expensive raid controller.
The problem with the question is that you can't characterise a broad array of software and hardware combinations with different raid techniques and vastly different use scenarios.
>>53981689
>LCD display for post codes
In my day we had PC speaker beeps and they were good enough.
Why do we need some faggy LCD number display? Fuck, you could even just have a tiny 3/2 LED grid and provide as much debugging information.
>>53981790
he's kind of right.
internal sound card is dumb, get a USB sound card and get your DAC out of that EMI hellhole that is a modern computer case.
10gb network card. Is that to go along with your 10gb network switch? That costs thousands and thousands of dollars? Or is that directly connected to your server which is filled with more nvme ssds?
>>53981805
you're both full of dildos. The clear victor for displaying POST codes is 2 7 segment displays.
People that actually expand a lot but don't need server boards. gaymers can just use m-atx if they wanna run crossfire/sli gpus.
>>53980880
I don't know...
>>53981451
You know those gigantic heatsinks gaymen memory has? Back in the DDR2 days they weren't just for rice, the DIMMS got really fucking hot when overclocked. Even with the big heatsinks if you didn't have a fan pointed at them they could still overheat easily.
>>53981228
>Wifi: use miniPCIe or M.2 or USB
USB is Garbage, M.2 is slow and miniPCIe isn't available on most boards.
I'll take my PCIe x1 802.11ac 1900mbps card over a shitty m.2 867mbps card any day.
>>53981824
>The clear victor for displaying POST codes is 2 7 segment displays.
Why though? They don't even use 2401 different codes. They mostly limit themselves to numbers giving a maximum of 100 codes.
>>53981907
I'll just take my onboard gigabit Ethernet that can actually achieve gigabit speeds over your .11ac card that will be lucky to break 600mbit.
>>53981911
yes but you can't (reasonably) display 100 codes on 1 7 segment display can you now?
Combinations of segments don't count as a code if they don't represent an alphanumeric character.
>>53980434
I got an atx board thinking that I wouldn't probably need it.
Same goes for the 4790k I got, the 16gb ram and the 500gb ssd.
Now I'm running a windows vm with GPU passthrough for gaming and doing other shit on the host Linux. I have two GPUs and a TV tuner in my system. I've also populated all of the on-board sata ports and I'm looking for an SCSI card for a front panel lto drive.
Now I'm glad I got the hardware to expand on.
>>53980904
Ncase m1
>>53980434
stick to your smartphone dumbass
>>53981931
>Combinations of segments don't count as a code if they don't represent an alphanumeric character.
>>53982001
are you trying to imply that it is sane and rational for the pictured symbol to be used as a POST code?
Why is this a thread?
The reasons are in the specs.
Get what you need.
No one here knows what you need more than you do.
Jesus Christ.
>>53982057
this is a board that simultaneously believes there is no reason to have 16gb of RAM and believes that everyone should have 16gb of RAM, and can't stop posting about it.
>>53980760
>nvidia
lmao
>>53982067
mfw I have 32gigglybits of RAM
>>53981907
>M.2 is slow
M.2 usually offers PCIe and SATA3 protocols. It's faster than those x1 slots that full-size Wi-Fi cards usually use.
>miniPCIe isn't available on most boards
Recent miniITX boards more often than not have a miniPCIe slot which comes with a wireless card.
7 of the 8 Z170 ITX boards have Wi-Fi included.
12 of the 15 H97/Z97 ITX boards have Wi-Fi included.
All 19 of those boards use a miniPCIe slot and antennas on the rear panel.
>>53982067
this is also a board where different people have different opinions, how about that
>>53980766
>ITX is vastly superior--anything that mATX can do, ITX can do better. Otherwise, just get an ATX, and never have to compromise.
>tfw I have an ITX mobo and kick myself for not having 2 PCI
I fell for the meme
>>53982037
Yes. So long as orientation is in some way indicated it provides the necessary information.
>>53980434
I've got an mATX. I upgraded already once from a previous one which had only 2 RAM slots, now I have 4. Still want to upgrade case and mobo to ATX so that I can have that sweet M.2 slot goodness.
>>53980434
Because most come with only one x16 and only 2 RAM slots.
>>53982851
You got that wrong.
I think you meant mATX and mITX come with only one x16 and only 2 ram slots.
>>53982851
>only one x16 slot
This is only relevant for gaymen though, in which case you're on the wrong board and should go back to >>>/v/
Also, check how many fan headers you have. Fucking do. I bought an mATX case (Alea M50) and while it has 5 fan mounting points, my mATX moho only has 2 headers. One for CPU, one for chassis.
>>53980434
My dream is a m-itx with a fury nano desu.
>>53982774
You can get m.2 slots on mITX boards, I don't know why you would feel the need to upgrade to ATX just to get it.
>>53982884
That's what molex connectors are for bro.
>>53982931
Because M.2s are cheaper where I am. Also, ATX got more playing space than mATX and I want to move my GPU around for shits and giggles
>>53982940
I got those, 5 fans on 1 header. But it still doesn't give me the option to control the pressure directly. I can only take 4 of the same fan, hook it up 2 in, 2 out and hope. I could put 1 more 80mm on the bottom as intake, that would make it positive pressure, roite?
the whole aesthetic for tiny mobo with less features and ability is like the smartphone debate
if you really care about looks more than extra options and ability that's up to you
you probably wont use or ever need the extra features
but I do at least, so I'll be sticking with my ATX boards and enjoying it
>>53983079
>aesthetic of a tiny mobo
What is there? It's not really any different from the others.
The only ATX cases worth using are the double or tripple 180mm fan silverstone ones for air cooling or the big ATX cubes for watercooling Extravaganzas. Any other ATX case layout is obsolete.
>>53982993
>I can only take 4 of the same fan, hook it up 2 in, 2 out and hope. I could put 1 more 80mm on the bottom as intake, that would make it positive pressure, roite?
I wouldn't bother trying too hard to achieve positive pressure, cases aren't really designed to properly deal with it.
You could just install all fans as intakes, just don't install them in a way that would fight the air rising or the airflow generated by the other fans.
>>53983343
That's how I got it set up.
Front 180mm - 7V intake
Top front 140mm Noctua redux - PWM intake
Top rear 140mm Noctua redux (above CPU cooler) - PWM exhaust (same as the intake in top front)
Rear - 7V Arctic F12 exhaust pulling air that gets pushed through by CPU cooler
That's really how I have it.
>>53983343
Also, looking for a good, silent 180mm fan. Or should I get a 140 noctua and a 120 noctua and put the 140 in front instead of the 180 and the 120 in the back instead of the Arctic? I'd have all of them the same way they are now, it'd just have a slight positive pressure (front intake would do more than rear exhaust because of size difference). Would that work?
>>53983093
Tiny PC builds.
I recently shifted to Japan and I brought over my Haswell i7 that I'm going to transplant into a mITX build.
The good 97I boards are hard to come by now but I don't really consider that an issue, even 81I will do me sufficiently for several more years. It's not like Intel are planning a new architecture that'll actually substantially beat Haswell clock for clock in that time and I can live with SATA3 SSDs.
>>53983416
Well yeah, tinyPCs make something seem nice, I'm more for silence than tinyness. That's why I don't like mITX cases, not many have good cooling options.
>>53980711
I do need SAS controller to use LTO6 tape drive you bitchy fuccboi.
>>53980590
Tfw I use a microatx and a mid tower. The micro was way cheaper and I figured I wouldn't use all of the slots. Worked out pretty well ;)
>>53980851
lost my shit
>>53981149
>The EATX put more lanes on the x16 slots I think, the ATX one has x8 lanes in x16 slots.
That has nothing to do with the form factor and everything to do with DMI or the CPU
>tfw Z87 micro ATX with two R9 295x2
You CAN quadFire on a micro ATX
>>53980434
The most annoying thing is atx, in the end i regret atx and not m-atx.
Does m-atx generally refer to micro or mini?
>>53985129
Micro ATX
Mini is for ITX
>Mini ITX
>Thin Mini ITX
>Pico ITX
>Nano ITX
>>53985129
mATX is microATX. The common form factors for consumer motherboards these days are:
ATX
microATX
Mini-ITX
"Mini ATX" refers to a couple of different form factors, which are either obsolete or not in widespread use. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini_ATX
>>53980434
I don't like ITX cases because they're restricting your hardware choices and you are paying extra for the size. I would not buy mATX because mostly they are on the same price range as traditional ATX motherboards just slightly cheaper. And I would not buy E-ATX of XL-ATX because I don't like full-towers.
ATX formfactors have the best variety of cases, they do not restrict you on your hardware: as much RAM as you want, as many 2.5' and 3.5' drives as you want, various SLI/Crossfire configurations, any cooling solutions available on the market, great VRM configurations for your overclocking, great expansion compatibility if you need any kind of extra connectivity like USB, FireWire, Thunderbolt, Raid-cards, Ethernet cards, Sound cards whatsoever, you are not restricted on PSU choice as well - you put there anything from passive-cooled 400W to monstrous 1500W. And you will never have any cable management of hardware throttling issues as the cases have all kinds of airflow configuration to keep your components nice and cool.
God, I feel like I'm shilling ATX cases and mobos right now. But I'm not trying to say that ITX is bad in any matter. It's great if you are restricted on space or you just want something small for your living room multi-media PC.
>>53980434
Believe it or not most of the time it ultimately comes down to your case choice. I have a watercooled eatx system and it's only 41 liters, smaller than some m-atx cases.
>>53980732
That's ATI nimrod. ATX is a motherboard standard.
>>53980434
There is no reason for ATX since the early 00's. Micro-atx is enough for 4 dimm slots, dual GPU or a GPU + some form of expansion, six sata ports and good área for cooling and bigger VRM.
For some even that is too much.
>>53980518
There are mATX mobos with 4 RAM slots, 6 SATA ports and 10 USB ports.
>>53980766
So if you aren't doing SLI of RAID than there is no need for ATX, thanks anon
