CS IS A MEME
On first year my roommate was studying physics, now 2 years after PhD he is working as C++ programmer in bank and he is earning 150k euro basic/year.
While most of cs grads are working as shitty code monkeys with c#/java for half of this.
Looks like /sci/ was right
>>53636627
>2 years after PHD
Oh so it only took 10 years. You're a dumbfuck
>>53636654
10 years of dicking around at uni, in eu education is free
>>53636654
10 years of a physics education dumbfuck. The point is anyone can learn CS in less than half the time it takes to get a degree in an actually challenging field.
>>53636627
I got a Rails job right after finishing a mathematics degree at university.
>>53636627
>go through physics course load
>end up being a programmer
that is the true meme
>>53636884
yeah, he could end up on 2 years contract with 1/5 of this salary in cern
My friend earns 120k as a JS programmer at Yahoo right out of 4 years of CS. Seems like a better deal than 6 more years of harder schooling for 30k more.
>>53636909
>hair up
no thanks, it completely changed her look
also that dress is ugly.
>>53636807
And? Everyone knows this. CS is one of the most pointless things you can do with your time unless you really know nothing about computers.
Anyone can be a code monkey, and anyone can learn the shit you are taught online with various tutorials, how-to, stackOverflow and guidebooks. Even virtual courses though I find it to be overkill.
Nothing about programming is particularly hard or requires years of academic experirnce. You just need to adapt the mindset and know how to structure code and algorithms. CS is mostly just math for dummies.
Of course your friend is gonna earn a high paying job, he's a physicist, he knows math and he knows algorithmic thinking, he took on one of the hardest fields possible. CS is nothing compared.
What matters in this field is not your degree, it's the experience. Get some.
> be some CEPS dude
> take CS class
> complain about programming and how it is just not for you
> slob all over Matlab and talk about how superior is it, no need for all that strange syntax
> begrudgingly learn Python at some point because you needed to change a couple scripts
> it ends up on resume along with Java and maybe C because why not close they are enough right?
> "Oh hey anon I see you can code..."
> end up ~8 hours of coding and 30 hours of meetings a week
> strange hateful feels....but money so good
Quite literally almost every electrical engineer, computer engineer and mathematician I know.
fuck this thread
I am a recent computer engineering grad enrolled in a Masters.
I'm trying to get a job but there is nothing in Canada. Might consider the states. Seems like everything around here is all "full stack developers lelele".
I know C, VHDL, Assembly, Java, Python, json crap
but now I feel like I really should do a full stack developer course online with code academy. I have a website that I just designed with word press, so maybe that should be a project.
I tend to play with arduinos for fun. I've worked with FPGAs plenty, but I think I have to buckle down and buy one so I can really start getting into the nitty gritty of the architecture. Vivado is great when it works. I'm not sure where to go from there.
Should I bother really learning algorithms? I get the basics, but is an in-depth knowledge beneficial?
Anyone else a computer engineer? What do you guys do? I actually want to work in the field but I refuse to drop out of my masters for 34k as a QA.
>>53637063
I have one friend who is a FPGA programmer he is pretty meh about it. The other one I know is a full time Java/Ruby bro. Both have undergraduate degrees only. The java bro tells me most of the people he graduated with are now in the same positions as him, money and easier to find job.
You can go ahead and apply to any of those "full stack" jobs with your skills right now. Code academy isn't enough of a challenge if you are proficient in what you claim to be.
>>53637063
the fuck is the difference between computer engineering and computer science
>>53637251
computer engineering = .60*electrical+.4*cs
and more calc
>>53637298
sounds like another meme
>>53637188
It just feels a little bit beneath me and a bit mundane. I would be 100% okay with CLI if I could live in society like that.
I like robots and signals, shit like that. Fuck web sites.
>>53637318
It really isn't. You walk away with an extreme deep idea of how much computers really do at an electrical level. It's all fascinating to me how transistors and fabric works. I really hate that it was my last year that I go exposed to the good stuff.
>>53637298
Computer Engineering makes a shitton of sense. Went from theoretical electronics to playing around with wires and building a calculator using logic gates, to building a physical ALU, to implementing stuff in pure machine code and then assembler, moving on to C being already super familiar with architecture and memory addresses is a fucking breeze, then onto java/C# and building GUIs and finally some big projects.
I laugh when software engineering cucks spend three year with java and scrum.
>>53636701
In the US this would have cost >$100,000
Hence I'm hoping Bernie will win.
>>53638121
>Hence I'm hoping Bernie will win.
NOTHING IS EVER FREE, FAGGOT!
IS
EVER
FREE,
FAGGOT!
Have you ever stopped to think about how, suddenly, a hundred thousand dollar education will become free?
>idiot sheeple: licking everyone and anyone's dick just because he said he'd give free shit to them.
>>53638150
It'll become free and you'll be getting the knowledge you paid for - none.
>>53638150
>Have you ever stopped to think about how, suddenly, a hundred thousand dollar education will become free?
>Doesn't realize the US spends trillions on attacking foreign countries
>Doesn't understand how taxes work
You and every other citizen pays for this, would you rather lose wars or get an education?
>>53638150
>hurr durr muh taxes
>hurr durr I don't understand how so many other countries pay for it
>>53638150
>Poster is a product of American education
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-32608772
>>53638150
can somebody explain how this works in merica? where i live country pays for your education if you get good grades
>>53638226
You have to pay for everything after high school in the US. Everything up to 18 is paid for in taxes and has been turned to shit by morons creating frivolous lawsuits.
>>53638226
>>53638254
The result of this is that the age at which one learns algebra and a reasonable level of english has been continuously pushed back. The average person graduating high school in the US is considerably dumber than the rest of the civilized world.
>>53638163
>none
this.
>>53638166
US spending on invading countries will only increase.
Tax rates will only go up, because now they have to pay for everyone's free education.
Bernie's tax plan can never pay for quality education. So, not only military budget would have to be reduced, but the education system will dwindle as well.
so, America will not only lose wars, their kids won't be getting any quality education either.
>>53638172
"so many countries" do not invade other countries just for shits and giggles. they have surplus money.
Google "US budget spending"
>>53638200
Google "US budget spending"
>product of American education
not american. thankfully.
Americans don't know how good they have it in terms of programming jobs.
the Pajeet meme is literally true in Australia
>>53638284
>US spending on invading countries will only increase.
Where do you get this? Bush and Obama were the ones shilling the pointless war in the middle east. The whole thing is a fucking joke, we've wasted an absolutely ludicrous amount of money on trying to establish governments in countries that are incapable of functioning peacefully.
>they have surplus money.
Of course, many European countries like Germany already offer free college, though "free" is a relative term since tax payers absorb that cost.
http://www.businessinsider.com/how-do-european-countries-afford-free-college-2015-6
Try actually reading about Europe and it'll make sense.
>not american. thankfully
.......
>>53638331
There's plenty of outsourcing here. I have to deal with Indian fucktards that send me random ass errors generated by programs their peers wrote demanding to figure out why it broke.
They have no clue how the magic windows box works, they just write shit for it.
>>53638339
>trying to establish governments in countries that are incapable of functioning peacefully.
hahaha, visit >>>/pol/ sometime, and remember to lurk moar, faggot!
tl;dr -
>USA wants pro-US govt in these oil-rich countries. cause cheap oil, man.
>current leaders of these countries care about the locals and refuse to sell oil for cheap.
>US finances wars and coups in these countries.
>US pretends to be helping the native people by "trying to to establish governments in countries that are incapable of functioning peacefully."
>locals die, americans rejoice. 'murica!
>2000 niggers died in somalia. *crickets*
>35 whites died in belgium. """THIS IS WAR, FAGGOTS!"""
>"free" is a relative term since tax payers absorb that cost.
you said it.
so, i was right, nothing is ever free.
Can I study physics and work full-time in USA or some European country?
I can't do it in my country, only physics courses are 30-40h/week.
>>53638391
cont.
no, i don't care who dies or not, i'm just here to show everyone's hypocrisy.
sorry, for going full-/pol/
never go full-/pol/ outside of >>>/pol/
also, CS is a meme. go for something less saturated.
>>53638391
>so, i was right, nothing is ever free.
I never suggested education would be free. Taxpayers pay for people to go to public school. Taxpayers would pay for people to go to college with the opportunity to go to school themselves. Plenty of people cannot afford school in the US anymore, a Bachelor's degree from a state university runs about $40,000 minimum. If you're lucky you can get a factory job paying up to $15/hr. You still probably won't be able to afford it though.
>>53638424
To add: That's having the slight possibility of affording it if you're working full time. So you're working full time and going to school. I did but that required a summary dedication of time of 60 hours per week not including homework.
>>53638424
>Taxpayers pay for people to go to public school. Taxpayers would pay for people to go to college with the opportunity to go to school themselves.
>If you're lucky you can get a factory job paying up to $15/hr. You still probably won't be able to afford it though.
so, basically it's an indirect way of paying for your education.
the only respite is, because tax is collected as a percentage of what you earn, you are actually better off earning as less as you can live with, so that you have to pay as low taxes as possible.
fucking kikes have done us all good, eh?
I wish usury was still a sin.
>>53638474
I love that you speak like you've lived in the US. Tell me something: can you afford $700/mo in rent, $400/mo in food, $150/mo in mandatory heathcare, $100/mo in mandatory car insurance? That's assuming someone else bought your car. You can buy a used one but if you go under $10,000 you're going to be paying more in repairs. The payments on that would run you atleast $150/mo not to mention you wouldn't qualify for more than $10,000 not having credit. That's $1,500/mo in nothing but mandatory expenses. That's not even including fucking utilities for your rental.
>>53638474
>actually better off earning as less as you can live with, so that you have to pay as low taxes as possible.
This is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. Most of the people on welfare in the US have full time jobs. They're on welfare because they can't afford to live in the US without fucking welfare.
>>53638150
How about instead of spending $1 billion on terrorism equipment for the middle east pay for 10,000 x $100,000 educations with that money? And I dont know where you get the 100,000 figure the local college in my area is only $5000/yr full time.
>>53638474
>>53638520
For reference $15/hr would amount to about $1700 in my state. Before $15/hr you no longer qualify for most welfare.
>>53638579
And before you ask - people making $15/hr get by on welfare by having kids. So the US economic system is designed to fuck people into having more kids that the people refuse to support. Real fucking great logic.
>>53638520
>>53638534
so, americans can't afford basic every-day use things.
now, who's fault is that?
Are you sure, asking people to pay more tax will actually help them in affording these basic need items?
>>53638570
>$5000/yr full time.
okay i'll use this from now on.
also, this is still way too expensive.
it's not like the professors are being paid in pounds of diamonds.
it's not like the colleges need to upgrade their lab equipment and whatnot every year.
with a thousand students joining every year, im sure the colleges can make do.
i'm sure the $5000pa can be reduced still. [pa = per annum]
>>53638588
>Real fucking great logic.
yep.
So, it comes down to,
>how to make life affordable to people?
certainly not by putting extra burden of increased taxes on their shoulders, which even though Bernie claims to not do, but, i bet, he will have to, if he actually plans on coming true to his promise of free education.
i think most countries need to bring a balance to what they produce, how they produce it, and how much of their population can afford it.
$800 cellphones is just ridiculous.
$500 processors is laughable, which soon leads to tears.
$5 for a burger? i mean, really?
$10 pizza?
common people are hurting.
the rich won't mind eating $1000 meals, cause they can afford them.
welfare doesn't work, but giving people the opportunity to earn [by giving them work] as much as they need to live by, and more, works!
we need smarter politicians, but much more than that, we need compassionate politicians who have the correct idea about the grassroots of the world's most basic issues.
>>53636627
>2 years after a physics PhD
You're friend spent 12 years to get to a 150k salary? I make more than that straight out of undergrad at Google.
>>53638688
>now, who's fault is that?
It is technically the fault of the corporations that monopolize products and set the price. A small tax increase to the middle class and higher would be sufficient. I'm well into the middle class and wouldn't mind paying in to make sure I can further my education and help some people out. Taxes in the US are really shittily setup. Sure 45% sounds outrageous but try applying it to an income of $200 Million per year (Donald Trump). He still has over $100 million per year to blow on whatever the fuck he wants. He could buy 5-10 of the most expensive hollywood houses per year.
The 1% problem is a serious problem but as long as politicians can be bought off (or are 1% cronies) no change will happen. If we can bring more people into the middle class instead of allowing it to shrink, the US economy will become stronger.
>>$5000/yr full time.
>okay i'll use this from now on.
>also, this is still way too expensive.
You're joking, right? $5,000/yr is enough for community college which will get you an associate's degree. Associates doesn't qualify you for anything outside of IT.
>>53638688
>but giving people the opportunity to earn [by giving them work] as much as they need to live by, and more, works!
You bet it does. It was proven in the early 1900s when infrastructure construction increased. There were jobs for people to do.
America isn't creating jobs that pay a livable wage though. The vast majority are low-end near minimum wage. A high school education is unfortunately not enough anymore and it's getting worse. Now if you try to apply for even the most menial jobs that pay a livable wage, they expect you to have a degree or atleast a few years of experience. Sometimes you can get around these requirements by knowing someone but the percentage is small.
Has anyone done those programming bootcamps or are they a meme? 12 weeks sounds a lot better than 4 years
>>53638807
Have you seen the picture how to draw an owl?
Yeah, it's like that.
>>53638807
If you have a degree and/or a job in IT and want to push your way forward it helps. If you don't have either don't bother.
>>53638807
What the fuck is the point of those boot camps?
If you just want to learn to program without in depth understanding of algorithms and data structures, you're better of using those 12 weeks to read some books.
>>53638870
It's the American way of cutting costs by employing programmers that have little to no background knowledge.
>>53636701
>10 years is free
>6 years wasted on education
>never used, sitting at a desk coding for a bank
I wonder who really gets the most out of their time? The manlet cuck with the PhD or the ripped CS bachelor with 6yrs experience in the industry?
>>53638694
>college is job training
literally the cancer on humanity
>>53636627
>>53636701
7 years of not making money.
7 years of struggling because you cannot make proper amounts.
(Best you can do is work at some company as a student, which is barely enough for rent.)
0/10 OP, try again.
>>53636627
>PhD in physics
>working as a sepples programmer for a bank
Your roommate fucked up
>>53638121
phd is free even in US. Phd is like a "working" status, the professor hires you basically. You get paid from the budget allocated for Phd students.
>>53639112
I wonder who has at least tried to expand mans knowledge and leave a mark behind when he has to go sometime :^)
>>53636701
That is not true.
In NL tuition is around €2000 a year and then there's all the other money sinks like rent and insurance.
This is my 7th year as a student and I figure I'm about 30-50K euro in debt at the moment (haven't checked lately)
Granted, I saved up 10K from those loans (super low interest rate), but it'll still be quite some time before I'll have paid off everything.
Then again, that's what you get for pulling €1000 a month in loans and not working :^)
>>53639918
>spend 10 years getting a PhD in Physics
>works as a C++ codemonkey
Kek
>>53639112
Why does every male programmer lift
I do not get all this hatred for wasting 10 years on PhD, my friend is a smart guy, he enjoyed this time studying physics.
Its a common knowledge that money in reschearch after PhD in physic are meme.
>>53640304
In Poland, its free, if you want free PhD uni will ask you to work with students 3h/week.
You will teach 3h of advenced programming or intro to programming.
If you are doing some serious reschearch you can even get free grant 1.2k euro/month.
You can get 3h programming
>>53640527
>Learning is bad
>Avoid learning at all cost
Literally subhuman
>>53640304
Dude, why are you studying that long? It took me 7 semesters for my B. Eng. and 3 more for my M. Eng. That's 5 years and I've instantly got a really good job.
And I only paid €90,- per semester. Feels good living in northern Germany.
>>53640527
>C++
>low latency
>codemonkey
yeah senpai
>>53640756
>low latency
You misspelled "legacy"
I wonder how is it possible that nobody posted Linux opinion on C++
How is it possible? Multibillion banks know better that master of linux?
>>53640696
I studied EE straight out of HS, but I dropped out. Later I went on to study CS. If all goes well I'll have my MSc in less than a year and a half.
>tfw graduating at 27, maybe 28
Those first 2 years were basically wasted.
>>53640868
i flunked engg royally.
wasted an year back home.
went back to uni and now it's my 3rd year. actually getting good grades this time around.
gonna be a bachelor in 2017 at the age of 27. would probably go on to do a masters as well.
parents are well off and they want me to study (even after i flunked out once) and we are not american.
>3rd worlders get cheap education amd go on to fortune 500 companies and earn shitloads of money.
feels good, man.
https://www.quantstart.com/articles/Self-Study-Plan-for-Becoming-a-Quantitative-Developer
What is /g/ opinion on Learn C the hard way?
http://hentenaar.com/dont-learn-c-the-wrong-way
>>53636627
I did CS, and I am making plenty of dosh doing what I like. Why does this anger you?
>>53640222
Western countries tend to give interest free loans for living costs. Which means you either get a student apartment like pic related (they have communal games rooms, kinda like tech campuses), or you spend the whole thing and get your own family sized house.
You would never consider working at a shop or something because the PhD pays at least double, and if you did work it would be at a tech startup on campus.
>>53638150
People who always say dumb shit like this don't understand how taxes work. Fucking kys
>>53636627
Cousin went with cs. Works for Verizon making well over $200k, field manager of some sort.
CS DOES NOT EQUAL PROGRAMING
>>53638280
If we got rid of niggers, the scores would be on par with the rest of the world
>>53636627
so if i study cs i become a code monkey, but if i study physics i get to become a code monkey that works for a bank?
>>53642770
What does it equal then, sempai?
>>53642770
>COLLEGE DEGREES DOES NOT EQUAL JOB TITLES OR EVEN JOBS
>>53642921
this
now a days its who and what you know
>>53636701
>in eu education is free
>>53636627
>programmer
>code monkeys
Also >>53636884 applies.
>>53636838
kek, but if you like Rails & webdev, good on you.
>>53640863
He dislikes it. Is he not allowed to? Linux works fine. The banks mostly work fine. Everyone is happy.
>>53638150
>le 1 month of war costs roughly the same as 10 years of every citizens college education
why don't we just do no war for a month to pay for it?
>>53643282
Linus is a good programmer, if he says that something is a shit, then most $$$ places use C++
Every STEM graduate can do CS jobs, some probably even better than CS graduates.
>>53640620
poland physics phds are a dime a dozen
i know at least 10 polacks with a phd in physics
>>53644386
Poland has one of, if not the highest (I can't remember) IQ levels in their population.
>>53636627
>waste 8 years studying physics
>unemployed for 2 years
>end up programming at a bank
>not smart enough to work at CERN
>you will never work on physics again
How depressing. CS is studying CS and will end up in CS job. Sad to see Physics go to shit.
>>53637009
>first day in programming which is only a small subject in my education
>teacher who knows nothing says we need matlab
>new teacher replaces old, laughs about matlab and tells us not to get it
>
>>53644428
it has nothing to do with IQ
science phds don't even involve an original contribution on behalf of the graduates
the way STEM phds work is like this
the professor comes up with a really massive project that requires a lot of research
and divides it up into little pieces, and hands each little piece to a phd candidate
if the candidate conducts the research and then writes about it, they got a phd
there's literally no risk involved cause the professor coddles them the whole way through cause their own neck is on the line since it's their overarching project
>>53644479
Job perspectives for scientists are shit overall, you better get used to the thought of ending up as a code monkey if you study math, phsyics or something like that.
Lol, op is one ginormous faggot.
It's not the degree that makes you, it's what you make out of it.
I only have a CS bachelors degree, which I obtained at the age of 26, and I worked in 3 countries as a lead dev/team lead, held sessions on conferences and published OSS that's being used by a number of companies in production.
On top of it, I spend around 3 months a year on the road, traveling, working remotely, and SAVE (not earn) more than your PhD friend.
College, that's the real scam. Not a specific degree, but the whole system.
yeah and i did a literature degree and now work as an analyst for a bank
your degree is a good way to learn a lot and get your foot in the door of some places, but not much more - it's mainly signalling unless you go the academic route
>>53636627
>degree in CS
>borderline B student, don't even try
>graduate, start job searching
>*anon, we need you right away*
>o rly? do tell, i just graduated, lel
>*anon, we hired a bunch of STEM majors early on*
>*none of them were CS anon, all math, physics, and engineers*
>top lel, i'm going to need a bigger salary than you paid them, paid vacations, sick leave, relocation assistance, paid meals, paid bus fare, health benefits galore, 401(k), gym membership, and a comfortable office setting including bean bags, a pool table, etc.
>*when can you start anon?*
Keep doing what you do best non-CS bros, keep doing what you do best.
>>53644758
thats not how the world works, kid
>>53638226
lmao people are really cucked and truly do believe it's "free"
>>53644956
>kid
the butthurt is real
>>53645002
Not really butthurt, I just assume you are a kid because no one who ever had a job would think stuff like that actually happens.
>>53644758
>tfw I fell for the engineering meme
>>53636627
Meanwhile I know a CS graduate that makes $200,000+ because he got promoted over and over. He's been in the field for about 5 years.
That being said, people that live outside of Silicon Valley should find a different field.
>>53645048
Can confirm, it happens in MASS, for obvious reasons. You would be surprised.
>>53638121
Fuck that, I don't want a bunch of retards and plebs in my class dumbing down the experience even more than it already is. You already have some retards, but that shit is kept to a minimum because poor people can't get in and poor people are fucking stupid.
Imagine a bunch of niggers ruining your class because they think it's like highschool and have stupid trivial gang rivalries with their classmates. Fuck that and fuck Bernie and fuck you.
Is there any hope for a math-retard like myself to learn enough programming shit starting now (at 24) that I can get an okay non-ape job before I'm 30? I don't mind working hard.
>>53636627
Computer science is the future. College is just one of many possible steps you can take to enter the field. Please consider not being such a dunce. If you work hard, you will be rewarded.
>>53636980
This.
>>53638150
Bait or underage.
>>53638391
Fuck off you manic aspie.
>>53645208
apply yourself. Math, as with any discipline, can be learned. Unless you are learning disabled. But you don't sound like it.
Have some confidence dude
What is the fastest way to become an employee full stack developer
Hard mode: without undergrad
>>53645234
Yeah, I made a mistake by taking the easy path with regards to a history degree. I was immature at 18 and thought "History is the easiest way to a degree".
I'm good at writing papers and memorizing bullshit history stuff, but now I'm lamenting that I didn't work hard and do programming shit all these years. I want to have a steady job and not die poor.
>>53644956
This is how it works. All the old Legacy systems were not built by modern day CS, because CS was in it's infancy during their conception. They were built by Engineers (Math, Physics, Aerospace, EE, Mechanical Engs, etc) and they are notoriously horrible programmers. There are dozen and dozen of industries CS are bleeding into, because of modernism, efficiency, and security reasons.
>>53645300
Unfortunetly most math profs do not teach math with bigger pictrue, just proofs and formulas out of context.
It is better to learn linear algebra with its application in CS.
For example calculus
https://www.udacity.com/course/differential-equations-in-action--cs222
>>53645593
who is this semen demon
>>53645645
its not a semen demon pal.
Its pure, innocent, young, white, virgin, christian girl from murrica.
>>53645593
I'm a little wary because I've internalized that I'm a math-retard/degenerate. I never did well in math, but it was also the sort of class that throughout elementary-highschool I never did my homework in. Not sure whether that's a question of patience or retardation.
>>53641992
That would be so comfy, the dorms at uni are shit.
>>53645732
doubt.jpg.exe
>>53636967
> implying you wouldn't
>>53638121
100000 every year*
Yr roomate is above average, you are not. Know your place, do your shitty major and enjoy yr cushy 80k as a code monkey ya fooking mook..
Maintaining shitty 15-20yo project without documentation and where everything is broken. True life of a code monkey for a fucking 80k year + managers after mba without knowledge how to write hello world and with love for charts and graphs.
Everyday I wonder how does it feel like to flip burger on hawaii without stress for 8h and fall asleep drunk on the beach at night
>>53636980
> CS is one of the most pointless things you can do with your time unless you really know nothing about computers.
This is just balantly false.
> Nothing about programming is particularly hard or requires years of academic experirnce.
Not if you write shitty PHP code for some shitty outsourcing firm.
> CS is nothing compared [to physics]
You don't know anything about CS; you use the term exchangeably with programming for god's sake. I bet you don't know shit about physics either.
>>53645732
>american girl
>virgin
TOP KEK
>>53636627
I work with a programmer with a PhD in mathematics and he has no idea how to write maintainable code. he usually just puts everything into one big method and copypastes from stackoverflow like everyone else all the time
>>53636627
Degree = job is a meme in general. If you're a sperg, you aren't getting hired. If you are personable, employers will want to work with you.
4chan is full of spergs, so you'll see people from all sorts of disciplines here complaining that they can't find work and they're drowning in loans.
>>53646998
I think the problem is these dudes dont' wanna settle for a 40-50k a year job. Too bad, you suck at programming, you have no social skills, you're gonna have to take the bare minimum salary.
>>53646854
>>53646854
I wrote a decent reply explaining why you're wrong and how you lack reading comprehension, but clover crashed so whatever. Just know that you're wrong on all accounts.
>>53636627
Damn I guess that means my 80k post bcs job is a meme too
>>53647352
I'd fucking love to see you work your way through an advanced data structures or compiler design course.
>>53643798
C++ is theoretically pretty bad, but practically it works pretty well.
>>53647319
The complaint that I always see here is that people can't find any job, not just a mediocre salaried one. I'm not sure though.
I'm an adjunct on the side and I spoke to a kid who recently graduated and hasn't found a job yet. He was telling me how the HR of a company called him once to make an interview appointment, which he took, then they called him two days later to make another - apparently they forgot that they had already booked an interview with him. He said that he cancelled his interview because he felt insulted.
That seemed to be some next-level autism to me. He also said that he simply won't work for less than $70k, but the only thing on his resume is his undergrad and like a six months worth of help desk work from when he was 19. He was one of those kids who spent his summers playing video games when everyone else was out hustling and now he expects to be given the same opportunities as the other kids who worked their asses off just because he has the same degree.
>>53646559
>Everyday I wonder how does it feel like to flip burger on hawaii without stress for 8h and fall asleep drunk on the beach at night
Sister's bf is like this, it doesn't sound very fun
>>53646964
For my first job I worked under a 55 year old who had a MS in math. It was interesting to listen to his stories about working in the industry before computer science was a thing in academia, but like your issue, everything he did was so sloppy and shitty. My job was literally fixing his mistakes.
I learned a lot but I fucking hated that job.
>>53647615
You learned about cleaning up someone's mess. Time to create your own and let someone clean yours imo.
>>53646998
i'm an autist and i was hired just because of a game i made.
if you can prove that you can write good software, you can get a job.
What's with /g/ and the hate for cs? And /g/ tends to have a laughably outdated view on the industry currently and the proliferation of web tech.
>>53636627
What is wrong with you fucks? It's piss easy to get a decent job in cs, I have a 2.9 and I already have a 6 figure job offer lined up. Most of my friends were easily able to find something at least 70k.
I bet you got your degree thinking that was all you need to get job and didn't do shit all summer instead of getting an internship.
>2016
>Trying to work in overcrowded white collar jobs
>>53647964
Incoming trade meme from someone who has never worked in a trade before.
>>53646936
rude, very rude
>>53647582
Women will always find a reaon to whine
CS is not a bad degree, you guys are just losers that refuse to socialize and network. Does not matter how qualified you are, if your name is dropped by an acquaintance of yours then you are bound to be hired unless you completely bomb the interview (which is possible if you are socially awkward like most of /g/).
>>53636701
10 years of dicking around is 10 years of 0 income you dipshit.
In that time your jackass friend who worked nightshifts in a factory and leached of his GF, earned enough money for a nice furnished house and a god damn Porsche
>>53648031
Not that guy, but...
>Do my 5 years apprentice become journeyman
>Fuck this shit too much work I am going to college
>Study CS, finish degree good GPA
>Start work
>Fuck this shit I am going back to being a journeyman
To each his own, I guess I can say I legitimately tried a couple different paths.
>>53648031
>trade school
>there are people that genuinely fell for this meme
>>53648301
In my opinion it is generally better to find a way to get paid more money /hour than being pride of working your ass off, wasting youth and health in metal nails factory on three shifts without free weekend for a pricy car and a house.
>>53637557
Do you even learn ASM in CS? I've taught myself a few instruction sets and I like working closer to the actual CPU, but I'm not interested in (or smart enough for) things like transistors, gates, and everything else that CE encompases.
Im interested in writing code for things like embedded systems, or maybe even writing compilers.
>>53648566
Writing compiles is very hard field if you are looking for a job and embedded system is paid like shit.
Big companies pay for applications so now c#/java programmer makes the most of code monkey jungle
>>53637557
I sometimes wish I had gone CE instead of CS. I worked on ballistic radar systems for a couple years before going to college and I really miss having my hands on both the hardware and software. It worked out well in the end, but I still wonder where I'd be now.
>>53638226
It works like this in California, and a couple other states I'd imagine. You just have to not fail out and you get enough in grants to pay your tuition, housing is still your problem though.
Paying ~1.5% more in tax than other states in order to go to college for "free" and not worry about student loan debt is okay with me. I feel sorry for people who grew up anywhere else.
>>53648448
The final goal is a nice house and a nice car.
>>53648798
Where are you now
>>53648853
Guvment computer scientist.
It pays very well but is boring most of the time; just a bunch of business development stuff, hence my lament.
>>53648893
how much is the pay
>>53648947
$109,750
>>53648821
Really? Is it a final goal? Are you from murrica/eu?
Why not set a private jet as final goal?
If you can get job with 15-20k/euro month you can live on bali/hawaii/thailand without a problem.
I tough that a nice car is important for poor people from east europe.living in commie block
This ain't happening if you study Computer Engineering :)
>>53649072
>computer engineering
Heard that's really hardware based though and all the growth today is happening software side
>>53649233
You've heard well but the second part isn't true at all. If you look at embedded systems, they takes ~98% of computers so they are a solid market as well as researches on Memory Hierarchy and Parallelization and vectorization.
>>53649322
I honestly prefer software more than hardware so I chose cs. Theory is neat and it's nice being able to appreciate "elegant" solutions.
>>53649629
Indeed, but remember that hardware is also elegant. How everything works synchronized and is capable of reaching high performance for hard problems is wonderful. Using vectorization you can get 0.48 ns per pixel on image processing :P
>>53648821
The goal is financial independence, not buying a bunch of shit to keep up with the joneses
>>53650041
>to keep up with the joneses
kek where are you from senpai
>>53639918
Why do you need to spend thousands of dollars on a formal education when all the information you need is available online? It seems the main reason people choose a formal education is for the certification (aka the piece of paper) you get at the end, since that only matters in the context of getting a job.
>>53636627
I want Dove's thighs on my ears
>>53650277
getting a degree is proof that you've covered all the material that is necessary for you to be able to do your job.
Sure you could learn everything online by yourself. But not everybody has that kind of self discipline. Most people need some kind of external stressor to force them to do the necessary work.
Also, how are you going to prove to your potential employer you have the necessary skills if you haven't at leas completed a project that proves your proficiency ?
>>53650391
>getting a degree is proof that you've covered all the material that is necessary for you to be able to do your job.
That's the point I'm making.
>It seems the main reason people choose a formal education is for the certification (aka the piece of paper) you get at the end, since that only matters in the context of getting a job.
Is it wrong of me to NOT want computer science / software development to become any more popular? I'm getting nervous at the waves and waves of people pouring into CS the past couple of years. Wages go down. Suddenly you're not that special.
>>53636627
>be me
>get worthless English degree
>don't want to be public school teacher
>hate life
>find out about LaunchCode
>take CS50X, Harvard's free online intro to computer science
>this is the only prerequisite to getting a job through LaunchCode
>get placed as junior Java developer
>now working as mobile dev
>$75K annual, in the midwest where life is basically free, less than a year after applying to LaunchCode
Feels good man. If I'd stuck with English I'd be making $40K and hating my job. Now I make almost twice that and like what I do, and I'm nowhere near the ceiling on pay here
>>53651220
dang man, i just checked out there site.
That's amazing what they're doing.
and here I am getting a degree in CS in Denver and hating life doing hard ass math classes and working part time lol
>>53636627
it's ok, you learn some useful stuff
binary math, 2s compliment get drilled into you until its second nature
compiler construction
operating systems: threading, gridlock
turing machine shit
unsolvable problems
recursion
regular expressions
>>53651761
this
not to mention the discrete maths, calculus, and other things that I think a programmer with any scientific bent in his occupation (data science, lab experiments, algorithms) would need to know.
I think the wealth of knowledge from CS degrees is well worth it.
>>53651155
you were never special
education is the actual meme here.
>>53651894
>>53651761
I completely agree.
Taking a course to become a programmer is all well and good but a cs program teaches all sorts of life skills that can be applied to many different disciplines.
>>53651922
I agree with this as well.
If you're afraid of people taking your job or your particular skill set being devalued then you should up your game rather than just sitting at home and praying for weak competition.
>>53648301
Well you can take 4 years off as most undergrads aren't doing meaningful work, so it's more like 4-6 years of no real work but still, 150k is kind of a massive salary that not even doctors get until 30+
University is a waste of time.
Learn yourself what you enjoy and you will be able to do so much more than you'd ever dream. University is for shit-level businessfucks and highly specialized "you have to learn things from our official teaching institutions to even work in the field" garbage like medicine (which is, by the way, 99.9% bullshit).
>>53650647
>It seems the main reason people choose a formal education is for the certification (aka the piece of paper) you get at the end, since that only matters in the context of getting a job.
No duh that's the whole fucking point of it all
>>53651220
Lol I'm just like you. English degree and have worked as a public school teacher for 40k. Is the Harvard course the ONLY thing you studied? What else did you learn on your own? Also, did you have to move far away? That's the thing that would hurt for me...
>>53651155
>>53651922
Yeah, you gotta keep going. Keep learning. Keep innovating.
Progress never stalls for anyone's job security.
>>53652755
I taught myself HTML/CSS a long time ago and had messed around with scripting and some Python before, but other than basic concepts none of that applies to what I do now. After finishing cs50x they put me in a three month "apprenticeship" with my current company, where I learned side by side with devs
>>53651220
holy shit
I live in third world, outsorcing company for 1-2k$/month require 2years of experience, java/spring/jira/coninous integration, git/svn, unit tests, sql etc.
>>53636941
>Yahoo
Haha! Haha! Haha!
>>53654747
>can't be serious
>>53640863
This image is bullshit. There is nothing that will give you more sense of power than having money. If you have any power and you let women treat you however the fuck they want you're a fucking cunt.
>>53642985
>kek, but if you like Rails & webdev, good on you.
pays the bills and then some
Wanna make money? Study Information Systems..
>>53645244
https://www.starfighters.io/players
https://www.stockfighter.io/
What kind of clients do you work with?
We presently have over a dozen signed clients, mostly in the software or financial industries. A few representative examples are Stripe, Zenefits, Twilio, Shopify, Fastly, Close.io, and Qadium.
We’re happy to work with firms large and small, worldwide. We are very discerning with regards to clients; we will only work with clients that provide legitimately great environments for engineers to work in.
>>53645244
Forgot this
What is Starfighter?
Starfighter is a recruiting company which sources the best engineering candidates in the world. We make online programming challenges, such as Stockfighter, which allow players to have fun while doing real engineering work.
The overwhelming majority of our players are playing simply because we make very fun programming challenges. That said, we also try to identify the best engineers we know (through their participation in our games) and offer to help get them jobs if that is interesting for them.
StockFighter is a free Capture The Flag (CTF) programming challenge by Patrick, Erin, and Thomas at Starfighter.
We give you access to an electronic trading market that mimics exchanges in the real world. You write code to solve a series of challenges in that market.
Stockfighter has two closely related sets of challenges.
Trading levels, where you write code to an HTTP API to execute different trading strategies.
Jailbreak levels, where you manipulate assembly code to gain control over a handheld trading device and use it to compromise the market.
Software security, distributed systems, high-frequency trading, and low-level systems programming are the themes of StockFighter's challenges. But you don't need to know anything about any of that to participate; in fact, it's more fun if you don't. We've been doing programming challenges for years and we expect to be surprised by who clears all the challenges fastest.
CTF contests are part of the culture of software security. Most security CTF people play them competitively. You can do that here, too. We made our challenges interesting enough to be rewarding to people who don't care about programming contests.
Lots of people want to play with low-level embedded systems, but don't have time to buy and set up a hardware development environment. Lots of people want to play with automated trading systems, but don't have the money to bankroll a prop trading firm.......
>>53647753
This, this, this!
If you can't find a job in this market today, then you're not as good as you think.
>>53641992
That room looks comfy as fuck senpai
>>53651220
why would they offer you that high of a salary when others had to spend 4 years taking CS courses and get lower offers?
>>53654798
If you're working for Yahoo it means you suck. It means you're not good enough to be working for a relevant tech company.
>>53645161
I'm poor and I do good dick head.
>>53655211
I don't think apple, micrsosoft, and google are known for being the kings of quality software.
Just the kings of software that harms society.
>>53655211
You have no idea what the industry is like. I'm working for a internet coupon website making 100k and I love it.
>>53653646
Nice. I do wish I was closer to one of their hub cities, but I'm going to take the online CS50x anyways and continue stuff I was doing before. Just in case they ever do partner up with a company near me.
>>53655201
Probably because he went through that site in particular, that says explicitly that degree earned doesn't matter. And the fact that that he, like anyone else using the service, have to go through an apprenticeship first that pays much less. And maybe if CS graduates didn't seek employment at tech giants like Google/Amazon/Microsoft only, they'd do a lot better.
>>53638166
we were promised abundance for all,
By robbing selected Peter to pay for collective Paul;
But, though we had plenty of money, there was nothing our money could buy,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said:"If you don't work you die."
>>53638121
>make $150k a year
>$100k debt
I think they would be okay.
>>53641830
I'm in the middle of this as well, seems to really take its time and explain the intricacies of C but doesn't give much for practise. would like to know if worth finishing
>>53655360
a whole three months of getting paid at least 15/hour vs 4 years of getting paid that less than that.
>>53655599
You should apply for a job through LaunchCode then!
>>53647424
Just because it's difficult for your retarded inbred ass doesn't mean it's hard for everyone.
my roommate just landed a job paying well over $300k after just 2 years of cs
>>53655816
>>53647615
Heard the exact same thing from a relatively well known firmware programmer, had a colleague working on a project who was supposedly a really good mathematician, however his code wasn't organized very well.
>>53655011
>>53655040
thanks, do you have any more resources like that?
>>53655816
My friend got 600k/y after doing a CS and Math double major.
>>53655816
>>53658494
i just got 1m/year after doing ur mum
>graduate with a bachelors in Comp Sci
>nojobs
>suck a professor's dick I knew well
>get a job teaching CS at my school
Seems ok. I just hope everyone else doesn't do the same thing, or the universe will implode.
Somedays I feel bad for my students.
>>53640575
>"full stack developers
I do it because gainz, but it actually helps the lower back etc to counter the all day chair sitting. And it's not like I stay all day in the gym.
>>53636627
>While most of cs grads are working as shitty code monkeys with c#/java for half of this.
own fault of the code monkeys, i've met a shitload of idiots who barely made it through uni... never thought out of the box, because "hey we had java at uni and java is cool so why should i go on and learn something different" BECAUSE LEARNING TO CODE IN ONE CRAP LANGUAGE IS NOT CS!!!
nowadays the honks think that everything should be done in node.js or other crap because they don't know anything else and hesitate to learn something different.
we've had enough retards at uni who never understood the reason why there have been courses like automata and formal language design....
most monkeys alson never heard of bigO and shit, and i'm talking about monkeys with a uni degree......... the ones without one are worse, most of the time...
mathematicans on the other hand are trained in abstract thinking, finding optimal solutions. most of the cs graduates i've met never heard of occams razor.
and yes, i have a degree in CS and work as embedded developer.....
>>53642809
>If we got rid of niggers, the scores would be on par with the rest of the world
you are actually aware that your post backs HIS position, are you?
>2 years after PhD
Well, there's your answer, isn't it?
Cs major at top 10 school here.
I don't actually know any language specifics. But no one I know is a Java code monkey for anything less than 100k. Most of us are the CTO's and the people writing everything back end so we can hire code monkeys to do the finishing touches.
Some of us actually got tired of cs and just work the easy code monkey job. But we always get paid twice as much. You idiots need to learn actual cs and systems design.
>>53638150
>overpriced college should stay overpriced
>I'd rather we spend our tax dollars on the military we aren't using
>>53660299
>I'd rather spend our tax dollars on college so people can study African tribal history and basket weaving
>>53660299
>college is overpriced because the government subsidizes and guarantees loans
>lets throw even MORE money at the problem
How can you not see how retarded that is? If you want to make college more affordable, create laws to regulate the cost and quality of education, of which there are none.
>>53640304
So let me get this straight.
You managed to bury yourself in 50K debt
You haven't finished uni after 7 years so you are what now around 25-26yo?
I suppose you are living great life have a car,gf supporting parents and so on.
How do you people live with yourself then knife gets to the bone and you have to return 50K and you cant land a decent job?
I literally killed myself in uni and pass everything on my first try,sacrificing social life and everything else.
I have 2 more months of it and I recently found out that is incredibly hard to land a job unless good connections/networking which surprise surprise i dont have and I think what will be my next step since my father covers for my uni and after I finish Im on my own.
What am I doing wrong with my life.
How to be this laid back?
>>53658546
That would piss me off even more than teaching English because you actually have a useful degree
>>53660378
Apply for paid internships right now...anywhere you can....companies jump on new graduates so they can pay you shit. But at least you'll get some experience and graduate to a much better salary.
>>53660831
>Apply for paid internships right now...
Any idea on how I should go on about this?
What are my requirements I should fulfill and do I make CV or something?
At least point me in the right direction so I can do my research from there.
>>53645908
A ton of public school math courses are absolute dogshit. Most projects only require a little bit of basic algebra.
I.E. You want to calculate 15% off of a product's price in one operation. What do you do?
Did you think "Multiply it by 0.85"? Congrats, you can do 50% of CS math and 99% of web dev math.
>>53647424
What makes you think I didn't?
I'd like to see you work your way through a special relativity, bio physics and quantum physics course.
ITT: People believe that CS is an interchangeable term with programming.
You're all memed up, Lads.
>>53661201
Maybe at shit universitys :)
>>53661758
Best CS books IMO are still "Write Great Code" and Knuth's "The art of computer programming" (which 4 volumes I haven't read), which have "code" and "programming" in their title
>>53660863
You fucking idiot does your college not have a career center. Literally go inline and Google or fuckfuckgo "company" internship
Fucking Christ
>>53661758
God damn that's a big can o' beer!
Must be a liter
>>53662430
>does your college not have a career center
no it doesn't
thanks anyway
>>53645908
uni math is different thant school math, all you need is being able to use logic
>>53662867
That's shitty.
For other opportunities, check out ads on the usual places (stackoverflow and those), local job web sites, ads in newspapers and so on for companies that could be looking for a developer. I know that there's a ton of places that'll take interns really quick. I had my first internship two months prior to getting my diploma and they hired me full-time half a year later when they were allowed to do so due to head count limitations (somebody left for a different place).
Now, four months in, I'm a process engineer, leading some really fun projects all over the place (implementing automatic machinery/PLCs/laying out technical specifications, getting existing machinery online, analysing process data/quality, doing chemical experiments and stuff).
>>>53636627
You people need to get out of ur basements rather than delude yourselves with numbers kek
There's business CS and the Science/Math CS,both use programming for execution.
The Science/Math one pays more, the other is a code monkey working for bananas.
