Swift is being open-sourced now
https://swift.org/
Apple has saved programming!
>>51665916
well duh, they did invent programming so they will know how to save it.
Rust and Go are officially kill now.
>>51665997
Elaborate.
>>51665916
>tfw Applefags will start claiming Apple invented the concept of open source software
>>51666123
They didn't!?
Check your facts anon!
>>51666058
Swift, unlike these two, is already being used in a major platform (OS X, iOS) as the preferred programming language. Adding multiplatform support and an open-source development model will only improve that. Also the language itself is simpler and more enjoyable than Rust and more featureful than Go. Rust/Gofags literally in suicide watch.
Note I'm comparing it to Rust/Go because they're supposed to be "modern" system languages, like Swift. I doubt C/C++/Java/Python/etc will be affected in the short term.
>>51666123
Apple did, apple invented the first computer, apple made programming cool, apple invented the first smart phone and everything. Apple is just innovation after innovation.
It's interesting that they included a package manager with the release.
>>51665899
swift is probably the only decent thing apple has ever made. I never thought I'd see a language I liked as much as C#.
>>51666135
>what is C#
>what is mono
Nice meme
>>51666150
>Apple did, apple invented the first computer, apple made programming cool, apple invented the first smart phone and everything.
first computer: nope
made programming cool: top lel
first smartphone: nope
try harder
>>51666200
>what is mono
A bug ridden and slow partial implementation of the CLR.
>>51666200
>C#
>system language
>>>/b/
>>51665899
>Is being
Your language is as bad as Apple's
>>51666227
>is being wrong
It is correct, because right now the code is not on github yet, Where it will be. https://github.com/apple/swift
>>51666135
>swift
>systems language
Wat? Swift is just a less shitty version of objc for writing your shitty mobile apps.
>>51666258
He's talking about passive voice ya dingus.
>>51666309
But there's nothing grammatically wrong with the passive voice. The "you shouldn't use the passive voice" is just a style thing harped by your high school English teachers. All great writers have used the passive voice.
Also lol that they released a binary for Ubuntu. Wonder how difficult it is to build everything it needs on something like arch
It's really nice that they included https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution
Go = DEAD
SJWRust = DEAD
What a wonderful day!!!
>One language to rule them all.
>Wouldn’t it be amazing if you could develop every aspect of your apps, front and back end, all using Swift™? We think so. That’s the vision behind Perfect. Perfect is the first enterprise-grade web server and web toolkit for the Swift programming language.
>If you’re already developing in Swift and you need backend server software, Perfect eliminates the need to choose and learn a backend language by allowing you to use Swift for all your coding.
https://www.perfect.org/
So... server code in Swift + apps running in swift. Looks like a win.
>>51665899
What is Swift and why should I care?
>>51667615
From https://github.com/apple/swift readme
>Swift is a high performance systems programming language. It has a clean and modern syntax, and offers seamless access to existing C and Objective-C code and frameworks, and is memory safe (by default).
>>51667615
What is Google and why do you need to be spoonfed information?
Go back to your Hot Pockets, loser.
https://github.com/apple/swift/pull/26
Where were you when swift was infected by the CoC disease?
>>51667658
RMS sent his cult in:
https://github.com/apple/swift/pull/17
Will monitor the development but for now Python + C is still my choice.
>Windows is not supported
India on suicide watch
>>51667751
kek'd hard.
don't worry, MS will make it compatible with Windows in no time. Give them 6 months. It will be a high priority project there... I guarantee it.
>trusting applel code
I'm not saying anything about their intentions, but just from a pure techical standpoint, apple shit is notoriously bad.
Think Mac OS before they used BSD and acquired code.
Think HFS.
I don't have high hopes.
>>51667790
>repeating and believing Linus nonsense...
god damn retard
>>51666150
>Apple invented the first smartphone
nope, IBM did.
>>51667821
Stfu nigger, apple worked with xerox (legit) to make the first smartphone k please get ur fukken facts straight
>>51667834
*citation needed
>>51667819
You weren't alive to see Mac OS 8 or 9 were you?
>>51667790
llvm, lldb and clang are Apple projects, all of those are godlike and one of the only innovations in the compiler area in the last several years. Those are the same people that now bring you Swift.
Maybe their OS team used to suck 15 years ago, but their language and compiler team surely doesn't.
Hating on HFS+ is a meme, it has the same features as other file systems.
>>51667751
it's open source, someone will port it to windows eventually.
http://www.windowscentral.com/microsoft-also-working-towards-swift-compiler-ios-developers-come-windows-10
>>51666205
>>51667821
How can you fall for such obvious bait?
>>51667918
It's over, Swift won.
So who will be creating pull requests to educate cis scums from Apple on how to use gender pronouns, how to properly represent pocs and women in documentation, and why using a word `class` toward classes is a microaggression against a marginalized group of ML users.
>>51667785
They'll probably do it like they ported ObjectiveC to MSVC by taking the Clang frontend and shoe-horn it onto their existing code generator.
B R A V O M I C R O S O F T
>>51667834
wow... just...
swift will make programming great again
>>51667897
Implying Apple won't use a similar embrace, extend and extinguish tactic to introduce hardwired shit on the reference release that makes the language non-viable in anything but Apple hardware.
When was the last time you show anyone using Darwin?
>>51667852
>>51667834
are you litteraly retarted? google made the first phone it was called ultron
>>51667944
This shit needs to just stop, it's not funny anymore.
>>51667957
Swift uses a FSF-approved license kid. It's free as in freedom and nobody can limit what you can do with the source code.
>>51667957
Apple never cared about having monopolies, they literally depend on being the expensive niche-manufacturer.
>>51667866
>llvm, lldb and clang are Apple projects
They are communal projects with contributions from many entities (including Google, Microsoft and IBM from memory).
>>51667957
dumb nigga, it's Apache licensed.
https://github.com/apple/swift/blob/master/LICENSE.txt
>>51667866
And WebKit.
>>51668003
So does Darwin.
For a real open source project you also need the control of the reference release.
>>51668048
>Darwin
Darwin has never existed as a standalone project.
>For a real open source project you also need the control of the reference release.
That's the most retarded thing I've read in a while here. Who exactly needs to own the reference release?
>>51668028
Apple was the main driving force in the development of those projects since 2005. They paid most of the development team for years.
In the end when it was successful there were other contributors too.
>>51668092
>Who exactly needs to own the reference release?
The community at large.
A lot of Foundation for Swift is not yet implemented. https://github.com/apple/swift-corelibs-foundation/blob/master/Docs/Status.md
So you'll have to wait for Swift 3 for a lot of things.
>open sourced
This is Apple's new strategy.
>start shitty free software project
>fanboys make sure it's well known
>vendor lockin means it's widely used
>others come and develop for you for free
>because you still are in charge --you get to chose the direction
>your software is no longer shitty
>you don't have to pay to have it developed
Microsoft went poo in the loo.
Apple went gnu in the poo.
>>51668117
Who are exactly that community "at large"?
>>51668092
>Darwin has never existed as a standalone project.
It kind of did, apple used to make iso's that could be installed
>>51668092
https://web.archive.org/web/20050217011816/http://www.opendarwin.org/
>>51668140
anyone outside of Apple.
>>51668122
>Apple's new strategy
>new
>>51667947
>crying laughing Country guy.gif
That's the AVGN.... And he's laughing because some silly Swede told him to "live as a windrammer as you fuck"
>>51668160
>>51668173
That's not a standalone project though. It's just a distro that takes all the individual projects from Apple, and GNU, etc and combines them together, each one with different licenses. Sorry if you are too retarded to understand the difference.
Also another retard implied that Darwin doesn't work on PCs because Apple, but that's false. In fact, Hackintosh works because Darwin still works.
>>51668122
>>open sourced
>This is Apple's new strategy.
That's a great conspiracy, but they've been making practically-unusable bits of OS X such as Darwin "Open Source" under their licenses for over a decade, now.
>>you don't have to pay to have it developed
Again, you get a gold star. FreeBSD was already OS X's bitch for free development in the userland, ages ago.
>>51668312
>Up to Darwin 8.0.1, Apple released a binary installer (as an ISO image) after each major Mac OS X release that allowed one to install Darwin on PowerPC and Intel x86 systems as a standalone operating system. Minor updates were released as packages that were installed separately. Darwin is now only available as source code,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_%28operating_system%29#History
>>51668312
>>Darwin doesn't work on PCs
>treating Macintosh, especially post-Intel, as if it's not a PC
It's the same shit. Some kexts/drivers and the bootloaders are just maintained by hobbyists instead of Apple, for better or worse. Not that support matters at this point, El Capitan is usually worse than Mavericks in almost every way, which is in turn still worse than Snow Leopard, since Lion began adding the simply ebin philosophy:
>UNUSED RAM IS WASTED RAM :::^^) XD
This only holds true on servers, especially webservers. On laptops, doing this is fucking retarded and causes an unholy amount of wakeups.
>>51666135
Fanboyism for programming languages?
Fuck your an idiot.
Get a hobby/girlfriend m8.
>>51666150
Apple's founder was not Steve Jobs, but Ada Lovelace. Apple created programming.
>>51668407
>on /g/
>implying will ever be able to get a gf
>>51667658
>Where were you when swift was infected by the CoC disease?
Shocking that this comes from a Rust faggot that works for SJW Mozilla.
>>51667688
Isn't apache 2.0 compatible with gplv3?
Also, it looks like they're seriously considering C++ interop support. It's out-of-scope for 3.0 though
>>51667688
those memes are off the hook
>>51667658
Who's the baneposting faggot?
>>51666205
>>51667821
>>51667688
>all those disgusting BSD keks (i.e. proprietary keks) voting against
>>51665982
Wow Mac fags believe this?
>>51667728
> dynamic typing
> 2015
Fucking idiot.
>>51668992
>can't detect sarcasm/irony
first day here, champ?
swift is a good language desu
i know most users on /g/ are manchildren who cry whenever encountered with something not windows or linux and cant write anything beyond fizzbuzz, but its everything i like about compiled languages mixed with everything i like about modern typeless scripting/functional languages
its sort of like if C++ was good
>>51667688
>There are people right now calling macfags a cult, whilst believing this shit
The guy is 61 years old, and hails from the time ARPANET was still trendy. Why do people take his words as gospel?!
>>51668221
Please be pretending, for the sake of every living person.
>>51667688
>this stupid dumbass a this joke is "insensitive"
>"valuable improvements", when literally every commit made since the publish is fixing typos
I'm so fucking tired of "code of conducts", "insensitivity", and stupid americans exporting their stupid political-correctness to every corner of the world thanks to technology.
So how long until I can build and publish Swift for Android? The Linux port looks like it's intended for server side use only, so it's a start but not everything.
I gotta imagine even if Goog takes no action, someone's gonna step up to the plate.
>>51669046
>swift
>a good language
0/10
>>51669443
you'll need to wait till Swift 3 for a fully functional Foundation on Linux. Because if you look at the current implementation of foundation, it's riddled with NSUnimplented()
>>51669046
Swift is literally just F# (ocaml) and C# combined.
what a disgusting fucking syntax
javascript wins again
>>51669491
>my random access humor
official support for Linux!
This kills the Winfag
>>51668417
She didn't create programming you fucking moron.
>morons actually believe that Charles Babbage invented the idea of a computer but had no notion of a program
>>51669567
Serious question, why would you want Swift on Windows?
>>51669591
>Thinking Charles Babbage "created" programming
You're still wrong.
>>51669595
To compound bloat-for-excessive-ease-of-use with more of itself. (In this case, "ease of use" refers to MS/Swift's stupid misinterpretations of the idea, not something that is actually easy to pick up and use.)
Have any of you programmed in swift? It's like a retarded Javascript, even Javascript is better
>>51669595
>Why would I want the single best language since Common Lisp?
>>51669648
http://swiftcomparsion.qiniudn.com/
I've already got it?
>>51669463
>i am a manchild who bases all my opinions on uninformed /g/ memes
i know its expected for you to all act like retards, but in that case why even discuss programming
>>51669642
this desu senpai
Swift is "programming" for webdevs and fart app makers who couldn't even figure out C.
>>51669648
Common Lisp is still alive and it's superior to any language available.
>>51669700
>Swift is "programming" for webdevs and fart app makers who couldn't even figure out C
On the contrary, most Swift developers is/are Objective-C developers, which requires knowing C. Since Objective-C is still the most used language for Apple development. Though Swift is making a big dent.
>>51669766
>is/are
were/are
I can't english today
Parallel job launch swift came first.
>>51669665
>>51669700
I'm getting mixed signals here.
>>51669700
/thread
>swift
Just kill yourselves retards, the world has enough fart apps already.
>>51670057
it's from a beta with debugging info turned on you stupid autist.
>>51670057
That was an old beta
>swift
>>51670307
Yeah, I sort of agree, it's a shame Windows hasn't gotten a port yet. The ADHD-riddled illiterates in the userbase would have a much easier time with this technique than an existing language.
>>51670307
>swift
>because vb was too hard
>reading the first pull request
>GPL a BEST
>GNU + Linux
>Bane
God dammit you guys...
heh https://github.com/apple/swift/blob/13ae184fba37563b87996b06eb168a7c85b18c06/www/FAQ.rst#wont-the-design-and-evolution-of-swift-be-warped-by-being-too-c-centric
Is this the new Dylan? I bet it'll die within the year by apple abandoning it completely, just like they did with dylan.
>tfw contributed to the repository
>tfw officially listed as a contributor
>>51665997
probably.
Even though rust technically can compile to faster code since it doesn't do RC, the benefits of Swift are pretty obvious - platform support, a larger library, pretty much the same speed.
>tfw Swift is coming to GNUstep
>>51666200
fuck mono, literally.
>>51666212
pretty much this
>>51666205
>ignoramuses who actually believe putting a computer together is some noble feat that requires critical thought or skill
>/tinfoil/s who think the nsa is out to get them, and have no concept that it's merely a big governmental organisation
>the entire hardware enthusiast community, dont even get me started on how pointless their existence is
>brand fanboys
>people who got lost trying to find /wg/ (desktop threads)
>people who got lost trying to find their way to /v/
>my preferred software is better than your preferred software for these reasons which are irrelevant and entirely subjective:
>Much like the DJ/Producer of yesteryear, programming, aka "making apps" is the latest must-have personality accessory
>computer scientists: concerned with type systems, side effects, paradigms, etc
>programmers: concerned with available library bindings, performance, and platform support
>bosses of programmers: concerned with the language being object oriented in a way that keeps their hordes of inexperienced employees from stepping on each other's toes too much
>/g/: concerned with aesthetic issues like brackets and indentation styles
Bikeshedding is the proper word for it. /g/ mainly talks about brackets, syntax, and identation styles because it's non complex and everyone can contribute a opinion and be semi valid.
Any real issues will cause too much risk of being pointed out as incorrect or stupid if they're wrong / mistaken.
>>51668403
i'm just gonna leave this here
>>51665899
>open source
>most of the shit relies on objc stuff
>the linux version can't even handle strings
useless.
>>51671280
project harder fedora tipper
>>51670791
sorry
Has anyone of you developed a single app ever?
I did. I wrote the app for a mobile provider.
Swift is the most disgusting language I ever used: The forced ObjectiveC interoperability crippled it from the start.
The only reason its used is that you can make iOS apps with it.
XCode is the worst IDE I ever used.
>>51670401
Swift is not easy.
It's very uncomfortable to learn compared to better languages like Java, C# or Python.
Even C makes more sense than it.
>>51671981
XCode is the worst IDE I've ever used
Someone's never used eclipse.
>>51672033
What's wrong with Eclipse?
>>51672033
Eclipse is my main IDE and right now I like the newest version even more than Visual Studio.
It's fast, feature-filled and rocksolid.
>>51671326
Could easily be 10-12h with Safari, which still has some semblance of power-saving. Doesn't mean that the cache/App-nap isn't an abortion. Also, security has become pretty piss-poor since Lion. Especially the fucking hilarious Core Text exploits. If more of the developers from 2009 were still here, I'll bet we would be at least 5 years ahead.
>>51672059
>fast
I haven't used it in a while. Did they tear the whole thing down and rebuild it from scratch?
>>51671453
Open source Foundation is slated to be feature complete by Swift 3.0.
>>51671981
>The forced ObjectiveC interoperability crippled it from the start
Only it's not forced. Nobody is forcing you to include Objective-C code in your app. And the Objective-C/C interop is one of the strengths of Swift. It lets you use the vast amount of existing Objective-C/C code in your projects, picking and choosing where you want to write Objective-C/C/Swift.
>>51672552
>picking and choosing where you want to write Objective-C/C/Swift
I can imagine the horror professional Swift developers will have to deal with, with all that spaghetti code
>>51666213
http://cosmos.codeplex.com/
>>51669011
probably autism, top kek
>>51672633
The interop is pretty seamless. Pic is my Swift wrapper for an arbitrary-precision arithmetic library. Most of the ugliness is because the C library works with pointers
>>51672085
>piss poor since lion
in el capitan they implemented rootless mode. c u c k harder
>>51665997
>>51667504
>Go
>dead
As a Go user, swift has absolutely held my interest and definitely has some things I miss from Go, but Go certainly isn't going away.
>>51673539
What things from Swift were interesting to you?
>>51665899
So, you can write programs for windows in that language?
>>51673973
Someone needs to port the compiler to Windows. It only compiles on OS X and Linux right now.
>>51673811
Operator overloading, classes, named parameters, to name a few.
Go as a language is nothing special outside of the concurrency primitives and tooling, but it gets the job done portably and relatively efficiently, and has a fairly good community about it.
>>51668187
>first
Yeah Google totally doesn't do that since years.
>>51674069
>outside of the concurrency primitives
Yeah the demo I got on Go that showed those was pretty neat. There's also talk of adding those to Swift as well
>>51674281
I think my overall favorite properties of Go are the tooling and the niche it fills.
It can take less than a second to go (no pun intended) from source to working binary you could scp to any other system of the same OS and CPU arch. To download, compile, and install a library or program is as simple asgo get github.com/hitler/kampf. Updating it is done simply by adding a -u flag. To compile for another platform and/or CPU arch is done by setting the GOOS and GOARCH env variables (provided you've already bootstrapped those OS/CPU combinations). There isn't a really good go debugger yet, but I have hope.
Go's niche is terminal- or network-based software. This gives rise to some really interesting projects, like Hashicorps'. Go doesn't have a good UI kit currently, but there are attempts.
The standard library is thorough and expansive.
Another minor feature I enjoy is the tendency to have one way to do a given thing. This can be annoying at times, but I am typically more happy for it than burned by it.
>>51674736
>Another minor feature I enjoy is the tendency to have one way to do a given thing.
That's what they guy giving the talk said. And it was also his sentiment that was more often better than not. Another thing he said was that the GC for Go sometimes burns him for some things. He said it's still not on par with the HotSpot GC (JVM). But I guess that's to be expected since it's had 20 years to develop
>>51674789
All in all, I can absolutely see myself adding Swift to a prominent position in my toolbox.
>>51665899
>everyone in the discussion is spamming le ebin gif reactions
I'm glad I don't use Shithub.
