Two guys who literally wrote the book on Apple's design standards shit all over Apple's latest designs
http://www.fastcodesign.com/3053406/how-apple-is-giving-design-a-bad-name
>Apple is reinforcing the old, discredited idea that the designer’s sole job is to make things beautiful, even at the expense of providing the right functions, aiding understandability, and ensuring ease of use
Are they right?
>Apple is reinforcing the old, discredited idea that the designer’s sole job is to make things beautiful, even at the expense of providing the right functions, aiding understandability, and ensuring ease of use
What did they mean by this?
I study human computer interaction, a field don norman and a small handful of other people basically invented.
in a nutshell, yes. design is supposed to make interaction more efficient, more satisfying, etc... not just "shinier".
People are still pretending that they need more than one port.
>setting fire to the biggest, most luxurious, exclusive bridge you have access to
So... What do these guys do for a living now?
And yet we have millions of homescreen threads where everyone is trying to make their android as minimal as possible.
>>51388122
>>51388122
Google gets dinged on this too. It's interesting that he didn't go into detail about the move from text interfaces to pure graphical layouts (Menu is now the hamburger bar, dots replace options, etc). The ethics behind Material Design were supposed to simplify the GUI so that it was intuitive, but to any new user, the symbols and representations used in the interface only confuse the user unless prior knowledge is given to them. The only reason Microsoft never gets mentioned is because people have used their shit for years and no one complains. At least their fonts are utter ass
>>51388691
Yeah, comparing programs designed for large screens with programs designed for small screens is very smart.
>>51388827
MS doesn't get mentioned because they focus on non-retarded text based menus, retain text labels, and use icons-only only when they know it's near universally recognized.
>>51388454
The lack of replies to this amuses me
>>51388939
Does this mean Microsoft is better then Apple at intuitive design?
>Apple softly btfo
Oh I meant aren't utter ass
>>51388939
Ever tried using the new setting app on 8/8.1/10? It's a pain in the ass to navigate because with the exception of the categories, there are no icons whatsoever. It's not intuitive, it's not easily memorizable, everything is white and there's also a second control panel.
>make a GUI
>don't use fucking graphics
>what's wrong can't your read huehue
>>51388967
It's irrelevant because it's personal customization. Setting Dildroid to launch with a gesture and hiding the icon means only you know how to launch Dildroid so it's technically counterintuitive for everyone else, but it's your own personal customization. You don't have to make it as intuitive as possible for the general population, there's no point.
>>51388454
>>51388967
Because it's a bitter argument
>>51388454
Instead of giving argument whether apple design it's good or not, you decided to remember everyone about androids home screen threads. Literally, the worst way possible.
Congratulations, Anon. I bet you are proud right now.
>>51388122
>Two guys who worked on Apple's design standards DURING THE COMPANY'S WORST PERIOD shit all over Apple's latest designs
pass
>>51388454
there will always be those who want elements from the other side
we have a few jailbroken threads now and then too
however, the fact that we have millions of homescreen threads is because android has the market share to support millions of threads
>>51388871
i'm sure that the ipad version has labels instead of fucking "test for the colourblind / set your gamma to where you can't see the dots anymore" dots
>>51388939
ms design is shit also, they use text but they fucking use only text.
no separators, no hierarchy, no fucking correlation of function to color, no nothing. just fucking text
and the sad part is that they fucking came up with this shit more than 20 years ago and now they went full retarded
>>51388122
>two guys literally too retarded to figure out how to use a Mac
gee
>>51388871
m8, they could do it over 10 years ago with QVGA 3" screens, why the shit can't they now with FHD+, 5"+ screens
>>51388122
>The products, especially those built on iOS, Apple’s operating system for mobile devices, no longer follow the well-known, well-established principles of design that Apple developed several decades ago.
Welcome to 2002
>>51388124
Meaning that designers have a say in the functional part as well instead of choosing what colour the UI should be only.
>>51388519
>>51389297
doesn't make it less right
>>51389245
>Waah, I have the intellect of a LITERAL CHILD and I can't read words fast enough for them to perform their symbolic function. ;(
There is good and bad bits about the current OS X UI. A lot of the bad things about it are actually much better done in iOS. Given they had full desktop class apps, i'd rather run iOS on my Mac than OS X on it at this point. More money and talent is clearly going into iOS development than OS X development
>>51390530
That said, if iOS doesn't get linkedIn integration in iOS10 i'm going be annoyed
>>51390377
Thanks for proving my point.
>>51390181
Under the Dome?
That was a good show.
>>51390321
Because it's not right. Aosp gives you a clean slate/canvas. Stock caters for those who like/tolerate the UX.
Replace the argument of Android to Arch and iOS to OSX. Does the argument make sense now?
>>51390611
>Under the Dome
yup
>>51388124
they want more buttons n shit
>>51388691
iOS actually tries to use text. Even the context menu when you want to cut/copy/paste
Android is the one at fault with this, every time I don't know which stupid icon is copy and paste
should be one icon for pasta there
>>51388122
>Design is a way of thinking, of determining people’s true, underlying needs, and then delivering products and services that help them. Design combines an understanding of people, technology, society, and business.
>>51391256
But that's what design is.
Yeah, he might've said it a little snobbishly, but that's actually what design is.
>>51388122
this article lost all credibility when it says that windows 8 solved gesture and discoverability-related problems present in iOS
i'm sorry but windows 8 has literally the WORST discoverability of any user interface i have ever used
>>51391418
i remember it took me 15 minutes to find out where shutdown was without logging out first when i first tried 8.0
funnily enough i mainly use linux, and my setup here looks about as discoverable as 8.0 does, the difference is that i set this up myself, so i'm aware of everything available, i can't imagine the frustration an average computer user went through when facing windows 8.0 initially
they've yet to truly top windows 95 in terms of discoverability, imo, 95 was fucking flawless
every time they try to move away from it (8) the next version changes it back to be more like 95, once they realize their mistake
el capitan is nice and so is current ios. bad time to shit on apple
>>51389849
Why do I get the feeling you've never used windows phone
>>51389245
I see a few dozen icons in the post you're quoting/
>>51391670
I still don't know how to do it. I also never found out how to close fullscreen apps.
No one will ever be able to trump Microsoft over bad design
>>51390822
Surprised nobody replied to this.
Completely true.
>>51391827
>how to close fullscreen apps.
this is one thing I knew only because it was a common DOS thing (well, at least FastTracker 2 did it) -- click the top-left corner to close fullscreen apps
that shit's retarded
>>51391670
Windows 95 was the first and last time Microsoft put any serious effort into UI design. It's got issues (some of which get fixed in later versions of Windows even as things get fucked up more and more), but it's ultimately one of the nicest interfaces around.
completely shit under the hood, but we'll ignore that for now
also, when I first got Win8, I opened the task manager to shut down
installed Classic Shell within the first couple hours of getting the machine
>>51391687
heard it's got issues, still waiting to update
>>51389931
This
>>51390962
Gr8 b8
>>51388122
>>Apple is reinforcing the old, discredited idea that the designer’s sole job is to make things beautiful, even at the expense of providing the right functions, aiding understandability, and ensuring ease of use
>Are they right?
of course theyre right, there are too many wannabe-Steve-Jobs out there (ie Marrisa Meyers) who think 'everything I do is so pretty' marketing that Jobs did is the answer to technology. The people who run Apple are in the marketing department and have no understanding of the technology
Of course they're right. As of the new Mac Pro and the 2015 Macbook, Apple is making things look appealing to the point that it hinders functionality and thermal performance. These people probably know the story behind what happened when Apple had an entire computer designed by their marketing department instead of engineers.. The Apple III.
Idiots are running Apple. There are still people who are smart who work there, but their voice is not heard. The people who run Apple are the blowhards who hooted and hollered at Steve Jobs keynotes but were completely absent when Jobs ran the design process that was not built on hype but a in depth understanding of operating systems and usability of interfaces. The people who run Apple have the same mentality as the Apple shills on /g/, it has become only a status symbol for an overpaid managers who think they are part of something but in reality just mindless fanatics selling false-exclusivity
>>51392812
please feed the executives at Apple's sense of entitlement that they have inherited Steve Jobs technical excellence by staring at the picture of people waiting for Apple products 10 years ago when Apple actually designed good products and not hyped shit
>>51393169
I thought that was the line for the 6s.
>>51388691
"what do you mean click? What's a menu?"
"Click the other button, dad. You're right clicking."
"What's right click? why does this box keep coming up"
"Just tap on the button, dad, you don't have to press it for so long. You're making the mouse drift."
"just show me that screen that had the tits., son."
>>51393375
fucking use a trigger warning next time dude
>>51393192
take another xanax and then it will be for the 6s
Why when discussing threads on /g/ do we always talk as if we're the lowest common denominator of tech users
idgaf if my grandaddy can't figure out a menu
the point is WE can, and in some ways it's easier for US
we ALL know what a hamburger menu is/does
Maybe touchscreens are just inherently a usability nightmare
maybe we all got caught up in the thrill of a new consumer technology and didn't realize until it was too late that it was a useless technology
>>51393569
I found that it was actually the line for the 5, so that puts it about three years ago.
>>51393848
>line for the 5
yeah, that really happened
>>51393375
>>51388691
A while back i set up my old iMac for my parents to use as a photo album. Set it to simple mode, hid just about every icon from the desktop except iPhoto. I showed them how to use it, and they were still apprehensive about it. They rarely ever used it.
Last year I bought them an iPad, and loaded the photos onto that. I showed them the basic gestures, how to use photos, maps, and Youtube.
Within an hour, my dad found tits on Youtube (apparently the original iPad app didn't do age verification.) Though he still doesn't quite grasp the web browser, I'll find a dozen open tabs when I launch it.
>>51393912
I sense sarcasm.
Reverse search it, you will find the truth.
>>51393613
Relax, Tim Cook.
>>51388454
Minimal icons in a homescreen, vs 1 port for everything on a macbook. I don't see a correlation.
>>51393613
I have only seen one hamburger menu at Apple in Cupertino. It was in the company cafeteria. No, I'm fucking serious.
>>51388691
why does the one in 2015 have people with pink hair
>>51394043
He's actually right.
Every design will be incomprehensible for some idiot or another, but if the majority of the people who use it understand it, what is the problem?
testtest
>>51393169
>we all have great jobs, lots of money
I was referring to that part. Also, use commas.
>>51391670
>Win+X, Shutdown or sign out, Shutdown
Fucking plebs I swear. No wonder so many of you autistic shits thought Windows 8 was bad.
>>51388122
Yes. The only reason Apple is so successful is because they sell an image. Without that image, even a fucking Dell is a better computer to have.
ᵀʰᶦˢ ᵖᵒˢᵗ ʷᵃˢ ˢᵖᵒᶰˢᵒʳᵉᵈ ᵇʸ ᴹᶦᶜʳᵒˢᵒᶠᵗ'ˢ ᵂᶦᶰᵈᵒʷˢ 10™
>>51391687
Not having any issues with El Capitan, but iOS 9 is a different story. Its not as bad as Android 5 and 6 but it definitely has its issues. Almost makes me miss how nice Android 4.4 was on my 2013 Moto X.
>>51388454
As I see it, the difference is that I made it that way. Basically, it is the entire argument of sane and standard defaults.
By default, a system should follow conventions, and be easy to use, at least basically. If I make my layout minimal as possible, cool. But probably the default should be something that most decently savy people can pick up and start using without hassel.
(I say this from a laptop that has no default graphical interface, and when you start one, it has no icons, no menu bar, no friendly message, just an image that tells me [and probably pnly me] which interface it is so I can use the right key commands to do everthing)
