>Behind Ulbricht in the library, a man and woman started a loud argument. Ulbricht turned to look at this couple having a domestic dispute in awkward proximity to him, but when he did so, the man reached over and pushed Ulbricht’s open laptop across the table. The woman grabbed it and handed it off to FBI Special Agent Thomas Kiernan, who was standing nearby.
>Ulbricht was arrested, placed in handcuffs, and taken downstairs. Kiernan took photos of the open laptop, occasionally pressing a button to keep it active. Later, he would testify that if the computer had gone to sleep, or if Ulbricht had time to close the lid, the encryption would have been unbreakable. "It would have turned into a brick, basically," he said.
Is that actually possible or was the agent being overly cautious?
>>51275990
Likely bullshit, the computer stores the keys in memory. They would still be there even if the laptop went to sleep/hibernate, the real problem would have been if the laptop shuts down
>>51275990
>Is that actually possible or was the agent being overly cautious?
Completely possible
>>51276041
If he wasn't retarded his laptop would had been setup to shutdown after a short time or if the lid was closed
Also, if he was a good /fucko/ his laptop was probably epoxi'd to hell and back, making it almost impossible to recover the keys from the memory
What did we learn from this? If you're going to use your encrypted laptop in public while doing shady shit you should stay inside of a locked vehicle.
>>51275990
Its called an encrypted lvm.
>>51275990
>going to a public library to be a 1337 h4x
What the fuck is this, 1998?
Remember the dead man switch talk after details came out.
If I ran an operation like that, that would be something I'd look into.
Scummy as shit though.
>>51276187
Public wifi m8 that's why
>>51276041
In hibernation, keys are not stored in the HDD and power is cut from RAM, at least on real OSes, which I assume he was using.
>>51276191
What the feds did I mean, not rossy.
>>51276194
So you WANT to get caught? Go to a McDonalds, nobody would believe a nigger could hack gubment compooteys
>>51276209
You have no idea about what you're talking about right?
>>51276201
Edgy
>>51276215
Why don't you explain why public wifi is a brilliant idea, since it's unsecured and literally EVERYONE with half a brain can see what you're doing, 1337 hacker guy?
>>51275990
>Solder a switch that requires an object to be inserted into the pc in order for it to have any power at all
>Attach the object to your wrist with transparent fishing line
Guy sure was a dumb fucker
>>51276237
So yeah, you have no idea about what you're talking about
>literally EVERYONE with half a brain can see what you're doing,
Literally everything uses SSL this days, even goybook
Ulbricht used at least a VPN, or TOR, so literally no one but possibly the NSA would be able to know what he was doing
>>51276254
Then how did the FBI catch him? Oh yeah, his fucking public wifi.
At least TRY to pretend you're smart.
>>51276229
Yeah throwing away his entire defense and stealing those bitcoins was in the up and up.
Don't get me started on the undercover fed and how they found the server.
>>51276245
desu he had quite a lot of holes in his /fucko/ practices, he frequented the same public wifis in a pretty regular way, he had left traces relating his IRL persona and Silk Road on StackExchange, and his site wasn't all that secure
>>51276264
That wasn't how they got him, the first way how they got a lead to him was through a subpoena to the VPN company that hosted Silk Road, and even then it wasn't related to him
The thing that actually got him was that he left information relating his real name and his personal email in StackExchange, in an account that was used to ask questions regarding Silk Road and Tor
>>51276280
and they got his location through the open public wifi that the VPN could easily trace
:^)
>>51276288
Which would be much worse if he connected to a private wifi, in public wifi you have plausible deniability, since you're not the only one who is using that wifi
Also, iirc he didn't connect directly to the VPN that hosted Silk Road, he connected through Tor
I could see why an angry man would push his laptop over if he was peering in on their argument, but how does that suddenly turn into the woman handing it over to a nearby FBI agent with no other context?
Did they leave something out or what?
>>51276314
Yes, but his location was visible because they had an open public wifi to nose through. Also, lol, plausible deniability. This is the FBI we're talking about.
>>51276322
how is that even legal? doesnt that violate search and seizure laws?
>>51276322
They would have coordinated that so he got distracted by the fight, and the feds would swooped in shortly after they had their mitts on the laptop.
>>51276340
It's a public place, and have you ever heard of eminent domain? US law enforcement can pretty much take your shit if you get arrested.
>>51276338
>Yes, but his location was visible because they had an open public wifi to nose through. Also, lol, plausible deniability. This is the FBI we're talking about.
Even the FBI needs evidence, if his laptop had shutted down they wouldn't had been able to convict him like they did
>Yes, but his location was visible because they had an open public wifi to nose through
But it wasn't, do you even know how https works? Or how Tor works?
>>51276350
Eminent domain applies to land siezure for public good, how does it apply here?
>>51276347
Oh that would make sense.
Wouldn't have taken much more to avoid confusion there in the writing imo.
>>51276354
You're still forgetting that they had his location. Ulbrecht fucked up by being on an unsecure wifi.
>FBI needs evidence
Patriot Act
This is why you need a smartwatch. When the laptop is out of range of the watch, it can be set to shutdown itself.
>>51276366
>Ulbrecht fucked up by being on an unsecure wifi.
Except he didn't, he fucked up by a lot of mistakes in the past, unsecure wifi doesn't give your location
Do you think the FBI is sniffing over all the unsecured wifi's of the US? They already had his location pinned down due to past mistakes that revealed his identity
>Patriot Act
You can't convict under Patriot Act
Who the fuck is Ulbricht?
>>51276359
It now applies to possessions, not just land. "Public good" is just legalese for "interested law enforcement parties".
>>51276388
he founded and ran silk road. have you been out of touch with the world for the past few years?
>>51276382
>You can't convict under Patriot Act
Bad wording, you still need evidence even with the Patriot Act, but the Patriot Act makes it easier to acquire such evidence
>>51276398
No, just never visited Silk Road
>>51276382
So how did he fuck up if he was "invisible" with Tor and VPNs and https and proxies?
Oh, I know, using facebook messenger with location services turned on, revealing his Tuesday library sessions! Because a public wifi can't possibly compromise location.
>>51276277
>defending a pedo enabler
You're like a double edgey sword mate
>>51276421
Isn't it that one map in battlefield 4?
>>51276432
>So how did he fuck up if he was "invisible" with Tor and VPNs and https and proxies?
>http://krebsonsecurity.com/2013/10/feds-take-down-online-fraud-bazaar-silk-road-arrest-alleged-mastermind/
>Other rookie mistakes also contributed to DPR’s identification as Ross William Ulbricht. In 2011, a person using the nickname “Altoid” posted a comment to the Bitcoin Talk forum trying to get users there to visit the Silk Road. Later in the year, Altoid posted again on the Bitcoin Talk forum, this time seeking an “IT pro” in the Bitcoin community to help with Silk Road administration. In that comment, he posted his Gmail address, the contents of which were later subpoenaed by federal investigators.
>Finally, DPR tripped himself up when he ordered some fake IDs from an international Silk Road vendor and had them sent to his residence. The fraudulent IDs were intercepted at the border by customs agents working with the U.S. Department of Homeland Security, which paid a visit to the address to which the documents were to be delivered. The agents noted that while Ulbricht refused to answer any questions about the alleged purchase, one of the identity documents was a California driver’s license bearing Ulbricht’s photo and true date of birth, but with a different name.
Lot'sa shitty mistakes in the past
>>51276454
Guess he shouldn't have gone on that public wifi to do all that stupid shit, huh?
>>51276392
[citation needed]
>>51276444
>banned cp in his ancap marketplace
>pedo enabler
>>51275990
>tfw Ulbricht has now taken a seat in the Internet Pantheon alongside some of the greatest to ever use a computer
>tfw you will never do something as meaningful in your lifetime
>>51276477
He did that way before, and it wasn't the public wifi the one revealing his identity, but literally associating his real persona with Silk Road administration, and later literally telling US Border Customs that he was buying illegal stuff from Silk Road
There were other dumb mistakes too
>>51276477
Christ.
>>51276041
>hibernation
He wasn't using windows you pleb
Real OSes remove vital keys from memory.
>>51276421
It was all over the news. Not just tech news, but I'm seeing stories about it on CNN. Simply not having been to Silk Road is such a poor excuse for not knowing about it that it's like saying you've never heard of England because you've never been there.
>>51276522
What's an England?
>>51275990
Yes its possible
Drive could be encrypted
If PC shuts down encryption password is quickly disappears from ram
All he would have had to do was remove battey/hit power button
here is a vide of how to move a desktop PC without it ever losing power so you can get it to FBI Tech PPl
https://www.cru-inc.com/products/wiebetech/hotplug_field_kit/
also here is a usb dongle that simulates mouse jiggle to prevent the lockscreen from appering
https://www.cru-inc.com/products/wiebetech/mouse_jiggler/
>>51276529
very funny, i sent you some reddit gold
>>51276522
It also happened 2 years ago and people forget in that time what they might have briefly heard about without paying much mind.
>>51276530
lol forgot video
>>51276454
>he posted his Gmail address
>Gmail
>>51276543
Personal email, I guess it was supposed to be for normie stuff, but he dun goofed, legitly bad
>>51276539
That's kind of fair, but being on /g/ and not taking an interest in these sorts of things (online markets, etc; not drugs) seem contradictory (unless you're really new here).
>>51276554
neo-/g/ is here for phone talk or someshit.
Wouldn't be surprised one bit if they didn't give a shit about anything other than their little consumer shit.
Sounds like there's an opportunity to write something that requires say, a USB drive to be plugged in otherwise the laptop turns off or sleeps, and the usb drive is attached to the user by a strap.
Or maybe some other proximity related device, maybe instead of the USB cable itself, a USB device that when plugged in has a little hole in it for a strap-switch. Easy to make by hand actually.
Could make a little diagram but it's basically a circuit connector attached to a strap that is attached to your wrist or something. When used in public, if the device is stolen from you it automatically locks.
Useful if you're ulbricht.
>>51276573
Well, the important thing is you found a way to feel superior
I also have that on my laptop. It's just full disk encryption.
>>51276586
Upboated!
-Posted from my iPhone-
>>51276551
Yeah but still Gmail? He could've used a more secure one. There's no way Gmail is secure at all
Ask for a password every 5 minutes, else, lock.
>>51276454
Why the fuck did he even stay in murica?
South america has good internets now too, could have ruled it all from there.
>>51276450
>Isn't it that one map in battlefield 4?
No it's a korean mmo.
Anyone know what type of Laptop he was using to get his whole operation going, for research purposes..
>>51276616
>ending up in a south american prison
He shouldve went here to the Netherlands.
>2 years comfy prison
>live like a king afterwards with a clean record
>>51276624
He wasn't running the site on the laptop itself.
Why would it matter what it was?
>>51276624
Some articles say Samsung z500
>>51276600
>Yeah but still Gmail? He could've used a more secure one. There's no way Gmail is secure at all
>thinking gmail is the problem
Have you even read anything about it you dork?
>>51276637
>Samsung
every time
don't buy samshit devices if you want privacy kek
>>51276765
Every time? What are you talking about?
>>51276765
>thinking that the manufacturer has ANYTHING to do with privacy
Unless you believe it has a backdoor built in at a CPU level in the case of Intel or AMD at which point you are reaching tinfoil levels.
>>51276600
It was just his personal email. That was the problem.
He linked his personal email to his silk road administrator identity by having an email address on an account that was linked to portions of silkroad php code.
>>51276530
>also here is a usb dongle that simulates mouse jiggle to prevent the lockscreen from appering
spooky
>>51276083
Or better yet, leave the fucking country and even better, don't order fake ID's internationally.
We should just learn from his mistakes rather than taking shots at him after he got caught
>>51277398
> Don't do everything wrong.
Duly noted.
D I N D O N U F F I N
I
N
D
O
N
U
F
F
I
N
>>51276575
I was thinking about exactly the same thing, anon.
Ideally it would be a simple thing that asks not for an indiciation of presence (like simple button pushing or mouse wiggling), but authentication, like a password. or, perhaps a USB stick's presence and a password. If the computer cannot see both it shuts down immediatley. Clears the memory as best as possible, and leaves the fully encrypted disk.
This probably would not be too difficult to implement, really. A few days and probably any one of us, even without much experence.
Of course, it seems most funny that people like DPR failed to do something that would be that simple. A lot of us act like we are paranoid, many of us probably really are. The fact that he got away with this for so long seems like strong indiciation that of anyone, he was paranoid, and good at what he was doing.
People can argue against this, and that is fine. There are many places where he could have done better. But the thing is a universal problem in computer security. There are heaps of means to attack an entity, and it is impossible to block each of them, and, after a point difficult to evaluate which is the greater threat.
The defender needs to protect effectivley against each attack that is possible. The attacker, needs simply to find one of the places where an oversight has been made, or insufficient defenses implaced. DPR made oversights, and so would anyone in his position. Those mistakes were exploited by a powerful adversary.
But to say that one of us could have done better is very boastful. In these evaluations we often note what he did wrong, what he did that was silly, and yes, he made silly mistakes. But we fail to note where he did well. Part of the problem is of course that we determined where he made mistakes inorder to find him, but again, the simple fact that he did such a big thing for so long without capture, seems a good indication that he was doing an overall good, or at least good enough, job.
>>51276322
the man and the woman were probably agents.
>>51277447
Everything?
The way they caught him was through the things he did wrong, not the things he did right.
He did a LOT of things right.
He used Tor. He administrated remotely from a location that wasn't his.
He almost successfully isolated his own life from his silk road administrator identity.
The links look obvious now but they're very strenuous each by themselves.
The main lessons to learn are:
1. Secure your fucking server.
This is the biggest lesson. Run it in a VM, in such a way so that even when it's compromised it won't leak the real IP of the server. Ideally it shouldn't ever be compromised in the first place, but you can't count against FBI zero-days.
2. Assume that all information can link you.
If you have to post anything about your clandestine server it should be completely unlinkable to your real life.
I think that when DPR was posting code about the SR his attitude that it was a pet project rather than a serious venture.
3. Secret internet hitmen aren't real.
Don't hire an FBI agent to assassinate another one, jesus christ. If only just because this is a crime they'll hang you with.
4. Don't do what I'm doing now. I'm posting on 4chan about these kinds of things so I can't actually run a secret server. This information can be linked to me personally and so if I decided to run one, this post would be used against me. I don't plan on running one though.
5. Do pay attention to anonymity tools. DPR did his work 95% right. He was almost completely unfindable.
6. You can't undo posts. Keep track of every single piece of information related to your website.
You can't go and unpost code that was on stackoverflow, and you can't unpost an advertisement for the website back when no-one else but you knew about it.
If you keep track of it, you can obfuscate the evidence.
>>51277473
Problem with such a device like how I described would be you would have to use it every single time just for that occasion.
literally did nothing wrong but get himself caught
>>51276575
maybe some eye recognition software that turns off your computer after a few minutes without the correct eyes?
>>51277668
>maybe some eye recognition software that turns off your computer after a few minutes without the correct eyes?
That's fucking stupid
>>51277530
Was it ever revealed how they got the server to cough up an ip? I remember that being the real stickler.
>>51277690
Nothing I can recall but it's bound to be some kind of php exploit.
>>51277517
Ya think?
So let's say he managed to shut off his laptop in time. Would they be able to charge him for anything if they weren't able to access the laptop?
>>51277926
They already had enough to grab the laptop. He would have been charged with the same things, but the stuff on his laptop just made it so that no lawyer would ever be able to worm DPR out of a guilty verdict.
Thanks America for jailing yet another harbinger of freedom. Who's next?
>>51277462
He didn't
>>51275990
>literally who?
he could have used pam_blue.so to automatically unmount / log off / etc when his phone left bluetooth range.
since he removed from the scene after he was arrested, it could have automatically cleared the keys and saved his ass, unless the feds took his phone from him and kept it switched on and within bluetooth range of the PC
>>51275990
Who is this, what did he do and why does anyone care?
>>51280397
You really don't know?
Jesus christ fucking millenials.
>>51280443
More like someone who has a fulltime job and a life to attend to and shit so I'm afraid I don't have time to subscribe to The NEET Daily or TinFoilHat Report Special.
>>51280461
Or someone who never reads the news, you mean.
This guy ran the Silk Road.
>literally a drug peddler
>dindu nuffin
>>51280475
I don't watch tv or listen to the radio. Both those media are fucking cancer.
The only news I ever find worth hearing is the occasional gem on /g/, like fish to replace bash as shell in my linux (which I rarely use, hence the lack of caring if you're gonna say fish is old news), ublock when it came out, what stupid shit mozilla is gonna do next, etc.
Silk road sounds like a "dark web" drug shop?
>>51280534
The silk road was THE 'derp web' marketplace.
I view it as revolutionary, but most people won't understand: It takes drug dealing out of the hands of gangs and violence and into the hands of postal workers.
The buyer and seller know nothing about each other (besides an address to deliver to), the marketplace knows nothing about the seller or the buyer, the currency exchanges were done with bitcoin. It's a system that mixes all the modern technology of anonymity together to a functional unit.
I'm sure you're aware of the various excuses for the war on drugs- organised crime being one of them. This type of marketplace cuts through the lies and the crap of drug legislation and turns commodities into exchangeable items.
It was almost the single most important website of this decade. All it had to do was stay up.
Not that I like drugs or anything, but the rotten edifices that continue the war on drugs and such needed to be broken. There are more important things than teenagers smoking weed.
>>51277690
Silk road was crazy insecure because he was a shit coder, I remember reading he was paying monthly ransom money to multiple hackers so they wouldn't reveal his shit.
>>51280490
>implying
He was a champion of freedom. I don't want to get all edgy and defend drug usage since I don't use them but why shouldn't people be allowed to do what they want.
>>51280915
>He was a champion of freedom.
>ordered several murders
>why shouldn't people be allowed to do what they want.
This is why.
>>51280534
>I don't watch tv or listen to the radio. Both those media are fucking cancer.
Ouch, all dat edge.
>>51280534
What a really long-winded post basically saying you don't really know what you're talking about.
Sounds about right for a typical /g/ poster.
>>51276522
everyone knows what the fuck england is go ask your mom and dad and the rest of your family what silk road is and the only person who will know is your fat ponytail neckbeard cousin who dropped out of cs undergrad after one year
>>51280915
Posts talking shit about the following are probably shitposting:
Loli
Big tits
Freedom
Do not reply to them.
>>51277530
>Problem with such a device like how I described would be you would have to use it every single time just for that occasion.
Well, yeah. Passwords are annoying too, but when someone trys to log onto your account and they are not you, it is pretty easy.
The point is, the DPR was in a situation where security was imperative. He was paranoid. Something like this could have helped him, if he had implemented it.
As you say, though, he did a ton of things right. I certainly agree with that. If I were in his shoes, I cannot say I would have lasted as long as he did.
>>51280915
Now this, I do not agree with.
I do not like DPR. I do not like the Silk Road. I agree with some of the grand Ideals of the place, but, basically, the guy ordered murders. He saved up for his eventual promis of a revolution that was, from what I can tell never really a plan. I am sure he was nervous, terrified in his position where any mistake seems like it could topple his veritable empire in an instant. I feel like to some extent I sympathize with him, but He is not a person I admire or appreciate.
Completely possible. If it were my machine, I would certainly have it unmount anything encrypted when I close the lid.
>>51281465
What do you think of the basic idea that DPR had; the universal marketplace?
I think it's a good idea. If for no other reason it makes gang power struggles over territory a thing of the past. It makes drug purchasing easier, a nightmare for law enforcement but for the people who have to live in drug gang ghettos it'll take the crime out of it.
Drug dealer kingpins will be people who run postal offices in afghanistan or wherever.
Read the fucking article, they found out where he lived and tailed him to the library.
They found out where he lived due to them intercepting a fake id package months before and eventually someone put it together. What did him in was the fact that he mentioned Silk Road himself when asked about the fake ids.
This is of course assuming it all wasn't parrallel construction .
Anyway read the article, it's really good.
>>51280156
>they wouldn't have taken his phone off of him as evidence with the laptop
>>51281500
The Universal Marketplace is, it seems a decent idea. Something that would fit excelently on the internet.
I would have to think, and do some further investigation into its actual impact on drug related crime, though. How DPR ran it, though, he was not bent on eradicating violence associated with the drug market, and happily joined in when it suited him.
It would probably need to be implemented differently. As always, a single person in charge is a problem.
Regardless, there are still going to be people who cannot easily access the internet, cannot get drugs to a mailing address, whatever. The system, as it is, works. It would be difficult to change it.
I wonder, at its height, what fraction of the world drug market was held by SR. Something tells me it was not too big. Notable, certainly, but very small.
>>51277473
>>51276575
RFID, NFC or just a simple signal, like Bluetooth of wifi. If signal is present, it's possible to log in. If signal disapears, fuck the shut down. RFID on a bracelet would do the job. Plus it's not so easy to see how you did it.
It's easy to build a "secure" system.
>>51282009
How about geofencing or what if it shuts down when they leave the library wifi...
So many ways...
>>51276630
>levenslang=levenslang
>>51281345
No, it's just how it is. Tv and radio are both utter shit.
>>51282009
No. You are missing the point.
You could implement your idea, I have no doubt. If I were not too motivated I would not have the resources, but, OK. DPR could have had suche a system if he wanted.
But the thin is, there are so many little details. If he had implemented your plan he would have been safe from the exact ploy that he fell victim to. Cool.
But that does not mean he would be invincible. There could be other ways that he would be caught. To pretend you have the perfect solution is hubristic to the extreme. He was in a very difficult situation overall, and he did not get the advantage of hindsight that you so conveniently have.
>>51276041
>he doesn't know about TRESOR
>he thinks hibernation keeps ram alive
>>51276616
And get murdered by corrupt police. Solid idea.
>>51276254
>a VPN
so you don't even begin to understand what you're saying. Got it.
>>51276245
Keep a blutooth emitter on you. If you are further than a set distance from the device, immediate hibernation.
>>51276372
This sounds like a marketing ploy.
Do you have a source for this?
>>51276484
>>51276359
He's talking about civil forfeiture, not eminent domain.
The FBI seized a laptop; they didn't try to build a football stadium on it.
opsec is essential from day 1.
suggest you guys use libreboot capable laptops, and not use personal emails to do this shit.
also set up a dead man switch.
>>51283619
that got vince killed. Got raided after that db dump and he went to flip his kill switch and got shot.
>>51283174
I didn't say anything about a perfect solution. Imho it's nearly impossible to be complete safe.
But this thread is about the situation in which he was caught.
>>51283936
you'd need something on your person, and not diving around your desk.
you aren't faster than a bullet.
>>51283936
link?
Is this a thinly veiled /fucko/ thread?
>>51284298
how often are those posted again?
been awhile since i've seen one
>>51281453
>Freedom is slavery
How'd we get here
