Can we talk about Tor /g/?
I hear a lot of anons claiming the inefficacy of Tor but I rarely see any strong evidence or any non-theoretical evidence for such statements. Sure, exit nodes control your info. Sure the government might own enough exit nodes and relays to catch the entire chain of your data. But in reality, used in conjunction with, say, Tails and a VPN (encrypt first, pass through Tor, then exit through VPN), is not one more or less protected? Sure there are many ways a dedicated enough individual or group can follow the breadcrumbs but even from the documented cases I've read the breadcrumbs are left by human blabbering and error.
Are these Tor haters just shills and uniformed tin foil hat conspiracy theorists?
Often I hear buzz words tossed around and meme catch phrases that basically amount to things like the "lol nsa can do anything" or "security is just an illusion." Yea okay if I break into your home and have physical access to your computer, or if you stupidly go on Tor on the the network of the same institution or location you're trying to compromise (a la the Harvard bomb threat) of course your security is fucked.
But isn't the truth of the matter that we CAN hide? That we can use Tor, VPNs, VMs and the like, hide behind tumbled bitcoins, etc, and be more or less safe? Even from the NSA?
>implying the NSA is our biggest concern anyway
With that said, I'd love to know what you all have to say.
http://www.spamfighter.com/News-20309-Fifty-Hackers-Arrested-in-Russia-during-One-Biggest-Cyber-Crime-Raid.htm
tor literally does nothing, it's just a meme kid
>>55107260
>Kaspersky explains the gang utilized hijacked Wi-Fi connection nodes, VPNs and Tor while infiltrated servers so they could conceal their actual Internet Protocol address during attacks on organizations. The servers sometimes were of different telecom and information technology firms of Russia.
That is the only mention of Tor in that article you fucking shill. It doesn't even mention how they got caught. For all we know the Russians followed the wired money and put pressure on foreign banks leading them to the offenders. Or something as simple as one of the hackers telling a former girlfriend, etc.
This is no different from authorities claiming that bank robbers used fucking ski masks and a honda civic get away car. Doesn't mean that's how they got caught.
Are you this dense?
This could be bait but someone else might just take your link for granted and assume you have evidence. Which you don't.
>>55107328
Wow they even used stolen wifi to use tor and they STILL got caught.
Either Tor really is a meme or they were just really careless.
>>55107345
>they were just really careless.
You don't even need to be really careless. We constantly betray ourselves. This is millions and millions of dollars these guys were sitting on. And they got caught robbing people internally. Not from any of their international exploits. They could have stopped and disappeared but crooks rarely know when to let up. These idiots were probably driving around in AMGs without a job or anything else yapping away.
"If his lips are silent, he chatters with his fingertips; betrayal oozes out of him at every pore." - Freud
>>55107172
>Are these Tor haters just shills and uniformed tin foil hat conspiracy theorists?
yes
/g/ converted to be satire, it's basically the /b/ of technology
Some people may claim the NSA runs exit nodes:
It's basically pretty much possible that any gubbermint runs an exit node, but fact is, it doesn't matter since you're still behind of a whole chain of proxies, which change in intervals - exit node inclusive.
Then there are people who claim Tor is insecure and may post random proof articles about how "Tor was hacked":
Fact is, Tor itself is secure. People loose their by in other ways like canvas tracking, using javascript in general, plugin tracking, flash cookies, etc. This can of course make a Tor user trackable.
>>55107421
>loose their by in
Jesus christ.
*People lose their identity in other ways
>>55107421
This is the first time I've read about canvas tracking, thanks for the informed response.
>/g/ converted to be satire, it's basically the /b/ of technology
Yea but every so often we get some good stuff in here. I supplement my chan time with /tech/ from 8 and lainchan.
>>55107490
https://github.com/kkapsner/CanvasBlocker
Has a pretty nice feature of sending random noise instead of completly blocking it. Enjoy.
>>55107539
Hey, thanks anon.
>>55107172
>developed by rapists
>used by pedos
>promoted by faggots
yeah thanks but no thanks
>>55107172
>>55107211 here
>Often I hear buzz words tossed around and meme catch phrases that basically amount to
Yea I knew I forgot to mention these buzzwords:
>>55107637
>>developed by rapists
>>used by pedos
>>promoted by faggots
>>55107637
>privacy = pedophilia
You got some serious brain problems bud.
>>55107713
Nothing to hide
Nothing to wear
>>55107713
FYI denying reality is not helping your argument. Look at the logs of any onion node. 90% of tor is cp.
>>55107850
90% of windows users are computer illiterate
>>55107850
Source? Genuinely curious.
bump for Snowden is best /g/ husbando
In other words; yes, you are being monitored for visiting that Girls Hub honeypot you found on that Tor repository.
>>55107172
Tor's site is the best source you'll get on how effective Tor is. They're really open about what that form of onion routing can, and cannot, protect you against.
What I can honestly say is that Tor provides for extremely good protection against many untargeted mass surveillance techniques, even given adversaries with very good views of the network - which is beyond what it is formally capable of. However active attacks against the software you use via Tor remain effective, such as "watering hole" exploits versus Firefox ESR like the FBI did to FreedomHosting - because Tormail was hosted there, and Snowden used [email protected] in his pre-disclosure approaches to Glenn Greenwald while trying (unsuccessfully!) to teach him to use PGP properly, although the FBI then used the parallel construction approach to justify the raid via warrant post-hack, thanks to the CP hosting of Playpen there that they found.
It is of particular note that you must not use torrent software via Tor.
If you are specifically targeted, it is arguably already too late for Tor, but Tor can still be helpful as part of your nutritious paranoid breakfast of counter-surveillance techniques, bearing in mind that extremely targeted attacks such as spear phishing with 0days will be used against you and you must protect against hardware, firmware, and wetware attacks (i.e. social engineering and direct 'black bag' ops).
I must warn you against "tumbled" bitcoins. The blockchain is entirely public by design: Bitcoin is not anonymous. There is no form of "tumbling" mix known that allows for every transaction to be revealed to the attacker and still completely protects against traffic correlation attacks - and the TRACFIN database allows for endpoints to be extracted beyond the Bitcoin network which makes them public. If you're interested in that field, I suggest looking at Zcash which provides for zero-knowledge transactions, subject to certain limitations - this is ongoing research.
>>55107850
No legitimate Tor router keeps through-connection logs. It would be incredibly stupid to do so and the option is not even in the software: they would be subpoenaed to break that link. You would be, in I2P parlance, "shitlisted" for doing so - i.e. blacklisted in the Tor consensus.
The vast majority of Tor's traffic, by far, is outproxy traffic.
As far as onion site (previously hidden service) traffic goes, Gareth's research into the prevalance of CP is unfortunately fatally flawed - the results, based largely upon the cache behaviour of the lookup at the time, were seriously thrown by the repeated cache-ignoring lookups of a single bot run by the Internet Watch Foundation at the time, who had just gotten legal permission to spider the CP sites (all ~10 of them) looking for abuse images, to hash them and provide the hash lists downstream for forensic and blocking purposes. They did this repeatedly, effectively shift-F5ing their way every time, creating a traffic pattern that not only distorted the research, but alerted at least one of the sites because it was distinctive enough for them to block. They have since fixed their shit, but Tor has since responded to the bug report and changed the cache behaviour, so currently no accurate survey by lookup is thought to be possible.
The majority of onion sites currently, by volume of creation, are ephemeral and unconnectable, and appear to be created by P2P software, either older versions of Ricochet or unknown botnet command-and-control channels, possibly used by ransomware. Most of those have probably never been visited by anyone.
There is no known way to assess traffic to onion sites reliably. However one of the biggest known is facebookcorewwwi.onion, who are quite happy to share their results and have done so.
>>55107260
That appears to be just good old follow-the-money, or talking about shit. That's how most criminals get caught. .ru is famous for throwing the book at people who rip off .ru people.
>>55107421
>Claiming Tor is good because a chick uses it
>Sure is SJW in here
>Are these Tor haters just shills and uniformed tin foil hat conspiracy theorists?
Pretty much. You can't really have a good discussion about privacy on /g/ because of this FUD shit.
>>55109536
>>55109380
Where does your information come from ?
>>55111812
whoever is in control of exit nodes is in control of the network which makes me in control
>>55109380
Hey OP here. Thanks for all the info anon. Really interesting stuff.
In order to be specifically targeted and to actively attack the software one uses however, one would have to have a relative idea of the unknown individuals (us) MO, no? I guess I'm more concerned about general anonymity but also cyber crimes and how crooks get away with these things.
And suppose one were to fall victim to something like a watering hole exploit, wouldn't a live OS along with standard precautions prevent these issues?
>>55111962
I was thinking about running a relay with a raspberry pi. Any tips?
why aren't other peer to peer stuff like ipfs making more progress?
>"totally legit" compared to tor
>literally hires people to remove cp
>unbelievably orders of magnitude larger than tor
>good outweighs the bad with facebook but not tor
