Why does both SS and SL have you doing squats on every workout? I did SL for 5 months, had a break then for 2 months more to get back where I left and now I switched to a Push-Pull routine.
And it makes so much more sense to do squats on one day and deadlifts on the other.
My routine is basicly
A
3x5 bench
3x5 squat
3x5 ohp
+accessories
B
3x5 pullups
3x5 deadlifts
3x5 rows
+accessories
And it makes so much more sense. My deadlift went up 15kg almost instantly and my squats have stayed the same despite doing them only 1-2 times a week.
SS and SL are scam
Anon says it makes much more sense!
He must be right!
>>36627943
Squat progress drives deadlift progress in beginners, but deadlift progress does not drive squat progress. That and SS is derived from sport training programs that consider squatting more important than deadlifting, for fairly good reasons.
Also you fucked up your arranging if you're still doing this AxBxA/BxAxB. Putting bench/press and chins/rows on the same day is exactly the same issue you're complaining about with squat/deadlift fatigue.
>>36627943
>And it makes so much more sense to do squats on one day and deadlifts on the other.
it does if you're lazy and would like to progress at a slower pace than optimal. SS is a squat, a press and a pull every workout. in theory it doesn't have to be a back squat every workout, and you don't have to alternate the presses. you could alternate front and back squats and bench every workout, for example. would that be "too much benching"? would your chest and arms become "too big"? in practice there's nothing good to alternate the back squat with, because it's just better than the alternatives. and you can't deadlift every single workout because it's too hard to recover from.
>>36628019
Beginners can handle DLing every workout for a while. Doesn't last too long but there's a solid reason behind some of the SS variants starting with every-session deadlifting and dropping one of them for power cleans once recovery starts to matter.
>>36628038
>Beginners can handle DLing every workout for a while
obviously, but not for long.
>a solid reason behind some of the SS variants starting with every-session deadlifting
SS, as written in the book, has you deadlifting every workout until recovery becomes an issue.
>>36627978
I don't feel the problem with bench&ohp and pullup&row because I switch them around every other day.
And I do realise the benefits of squating, but is it really necessary? I mean I noticed that with this program I can work out 4 times a week (ABxABxx) without problem which I can't do with the mixed programs
>>36628065
You won't be able to maintain 4/wk on that schedule for much longer than you could have maintained the regular SS/SL schedule, because squatting and deadlifting on subsequent days sucks almost as much as having to do them on the same day.
>>36628065
>And I do realise the benefits of squating, but is it really necessary?
it's "necessary" if you want to become as strong as possible in the shortest period of time. squats train many of the largest muscle groups in the body in a way that no other exercise can. squatting 3 times a week isn't even that much. some competitive lifters will squat twice that, and a few will squat even more.
>>36627943
good god that is shitty infographic
>>36628095
Yeah, but deadlifts do train many of the same muscles as squats. I'm not training to be a powerlifter, just to be stronger and maybe slightly better looking. I just feel like doing squats and DLs on different days makes a lot more sense, esspecially for beginners.
>>36628238
you can't train deadlifts with the same frequency as squats. SS has you squat every workout because it's an exercise you can recover from relatively quickly. you deadlift every other workout and do a lighter pull (power cleans) in between. it's not that your idea won't work, it's just that SS (and many other routines) has a much better solution to this than you.
I think the main flaw of SS and the squat frequency in particular is that it gets way too monotonous.
It's like eating brown rice, chicken and broccoli. Sure it might be good for you, but if you eat that every day you're gonna want to kill yourself.
>>36628279
if you think squatting 3 times a week is "monotonous" then you'll probably never get anywhere with lifting. as has already been mentioned, 3 times a week is not even that much. many serious routines call for a significantly higher frequency than that.
>>36628294
Most of those serious routines have more variety to them than SS though - you're either rotating set/rep ranges or squat variants. Very few (aside from Bulgarian style, which is a real mindfuck after a while) stick to the same sets and reps day after day.
>>36628279
depends what you want, if you want to get strong, you need to squat and 3x a week is nothing.
What I have done though is add front squats in an alternating fashion, to help with quad growth.
>>36628313
that's true, but we're still talking about a total of 9 work sets during a week that frankly aren't even that heavy except towards the end of the program, and in return you're adding 10-15lbs to your squat every single week. it's just not a huge effort, and I think if something struggles with it then how will they manage a more serious routine?
>>36628320
that qt asian mirin
>>36628344
In fairness (and yeah, serious training is not fucking easy on the mind) the hardest part of training for most people is the first few months before it becomes part of the daily grind. They'll put up with monotony a lot easier after they're accustomed to hitting the gym than they will when they're first getting used to it.
Humans be weird sometimes.
>>36628238
Jesus fucking christ, you dont know shit about fitness, muscle/strength building or anything related compared to the people who made these programs. You want to change it around? Feel free to, but dont think youre making an informed or wise decision.
>>36627943
What weights did you get up to in your five months of SL?
>>36628475
Bench 75kg
Squat 105kg
DL 125kg
Ohp 50kg
Row 65kg
It's not the best but I started pretty much full skelly, went from 65kg to 75kg during that time tho.
>>36628370
Okay, the OP was a bit exessively aggressive, I meant to raise the question, how necessary is it to squat 3 times a week in addition to deadlifting and why is it recommended instead of squating and deadlifting every other workout? The simple PP routine is not that much different, it just has a little less squats and more upper body. Just logically thinking it would seem more suitable for beginners who aren't directly aiming to be powerlifters.
>>36628737
>more suitable for beginners
That would be something with no squats since they cause most normal people to quit.
>>36628762
> That would be something with no squats since they cause most normal people to quit.
why? it's not like i'm screaming my lungs out about how fun and exciting squats are, but they're not not-fun.
>Professionals with years upon years of experience sets up a program for quick increase in strength for beginners, that has worked for a shitload of people.
>Random faggots on /fit/ thinks he can do better after working out for 5 months
Go ahead, OP. Do whatever the fuck you want.
>>36628057
>Expecting people on /fit/ to have actually read SS
Good one. People here just looks at the routine and think they know everything about the program.
>>36628650
those stats are pretty good man
>>36628650
>You’ll know when it’s time to switch to a more advanced training program when you’re no longer able to add 2.5kg/5lb each workout. When you’re no longer able to get stronger despite repeating the weight up to three times a week, deloading and dropping to 3×5, 3×3, etc.
>As a rule of thumb, you’ll usually have to switch once you Squat between 100kg and 140kg
So, yeah?
>>36627943
op thinks he's more qualified than an ex competitive powerlifter with a lifetime of experience and 20+years of coaching experience
>>36628895
Y-you too
I got back to those numbers only a month ago or so, so I don't know how impressive my stats are for someone who's lifted for a year.
My lifts are currently (at 5rep)
Bench 80kg
Squat 105kg (I switched from lowbar to highbar so that's why no change)
DL 135kg
Ohp 50kg (still my weakest lift)
Row 75kg
I got to the point on Stronglifts where I just felt like progress stopped completely so I mixed the routine around a bit and added some accessories. I recently caught a flu so no real progress has been done yet but at least the workouts are more varied and enjoyable.
>>36628975
>>36628779
>what is information criticism
I don't doubt that SS and SL don't work but I feel like depending on ones goals, they might not be the best workouts.
Read SS before asking stupid fucking questions like these.
How do you know you're not fully recovered from deadlifts when you're neither sore nor fatigued whatsoever?
good job op you realized ss is a meme before
>tfw no press
>tfw no bench
>tfw no gf
>>36629029
If your goal has anything to so with getting stronger, even bodybuilding to build a base from, then do the routine.
If you're stalling you're not eating or resting enough
>>36629045
Okay, let's put the question like this:
What advantage would doing SS have over simple PP-routine? Would your progression on all lifts be better on SS or would it be just the squats?
