![650_DSC_0472[2].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/gOBczxi.jpg "650_DSC_0472[2].jpg")
>Thus, humans have characteristics of herbivores, not carnivores.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1312295/
>>36621156
Yet 95% of peopIe are carnivores eating meat daiIy, because we do whatever the fuck we want and there isn't a thing you can do about it :) :)
literally don't care, I'm going to eat meat. It is tasty.
>>36621156
>2016
>Not realizing that nature is a fucking gains goblin
>>36621182
Meat isn't tasty. Objectively.
>herbivore
>can digest meat
Anon, I...
>>36621156
People were meant to eat pretty much whatever the natural fuana eats including the fuana. If you want a diet that most accurately fits the natural diet eat trash. Eating whatever was available pushed us to the top
>>36622420
So is ethylene-glycol.
>what are canine teeth
>what is the ability to digest meat
Hmm. Humans have no carnivore characteristics at all. Kill yourself
I find it interesting that they used intestinal length as a characteristic:
>The intestinal tract of carnivores is short (3 times body length); that of herbivores, long (12 times body length).
The human intestinal tract is 4-5x body length, closer to that of a carnivores. In addition, unlike herbivores we lack the ability to digest cellulose and other tough plant fibres.
Plus we do have sharp teeth, they're called canines, we just don't use them subdue prey. Human are opportunistic eaters, just because we have some herbivore characteristics doesn't mean we aren't designed to eat meat. We are designed to eat just about anything.
We're fucking omnivores. Jesus fucking christ, it's not that hard.
>>36622492
/thread
>Vegans
>>36622492
That's just a label
When humans eat meat they don't eat it raw , and eventually it clogs their arteries
Humans are fruit and starch eaters. Who started eating meat recently when they made tools, but their digestive system didn't adabt quickly, WE still got long intestins that suck all that cholesterol in.
>>36621182
And i'm still gonna smoke and snort cocaïne, it tastes good.
Vegan here. I love trolling vegan feminists by telling them that women who wear fur deserve rape.
Top kek. Y'all should go vegan and try it.
>>36622542
>Previously, the Dietary Guidelines for Americans recommended that cholesterol intake be limited to no more than 300 mg/day. The 2015 DGAC will not bring forward this recommendation because available evidence shows no appreciable relationship between consumption of dietary cholesterol and serum cholesterol, consistent with the conclusions of the AHA/ACC report. Cholesterol is not a nutrient of concern for overconsumption.
That's from the USDA DGAC 2015 report that you can read here:
http://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015-scientific-report/pdfs/scientific-report-of-the-2015-dietary-guidelines-advisory-committee.pdf
And we didn't get that long herbivore intestine it's only 4-5x body length, not 12x
>>36622542
really? you still believe dietary cholesterol matters? you should check out science some time, it'll blow your mind.
>>36621156
i'm going to continue eating meat and there is nothing you can do to stop me, you jaundice skinned faggot
>>36622485
Well, evolutionary speaking we descend from fruit eating monkey faggots, who also lack the ability to utilize cellulose.
The ability to kill other animals drastically increased the calories availabe to us, allowing us to support such massive brains.
Fun fact: My biochemistry prof advocates the use of creatine.
Fun fact 2: Creatine supplementation has been shown to increase cognitive ability in vegetarians and vegans -> basically not eating meat makes you retarded.
Time to eat some vegetables like pizza then
>>36622612
OP : stop eating shit it's bad for you
(You): i'm going to keep eating shit ...
>>36621156
I'm vegan and even I think you are a faglord for making this thread.
>>36622652
Yeah that's a second point, our ancestors may have not eaten meat but even that doesn't mean they lacked the ability. In addition, we have come up with ways of processing food(ie. cooking) externally that no other animal has, I think a lot of people don't realize that a lot of our digestion now starts outside the body. And I've also looked into that creatine/neurodegeneration relationship, pretty good starting point on some stuff about it here:
http://www.alzforum.org/news/research-news/can-daily-dose-creatine-prevent-neurodegeneration
We are now /fit/ biochemistry bros
>>36622591
>USDA
>not egg and dairy board puppet
Check your cholesterol
Eat butter everyday for a long
Re-check your cholesterol and stop being a retarded slave
>>36622694
All of science: yeah it's not actually shit and OP's a fag
(You): *drools onto plate of raw unseasoned vegetables and quinoa*
>>36622749
>fuckin meat eaters denying science
>fuck you that science doesn't agree with me
Also
>implying the sugar and sweetener industry would want a study like this to come out and potentially shrink their market in making fat-drained food palatable
>implying there aren't people out there who actually care about public health
>>36622756
Science facts : non-shit eaters are the healthiest, the lowest in diabties and heart disease and cancer. And the lowest in BMI.
>>36622785
>implying most vegetarians don't care more about their health than the average person
Let's compare vegetarians against meat eaters equally invested in their health, rather than the general population, shall we?
>>36622782
They are lying to you anon http://nutritionfacts.org/2016/03/22/the-effects-of-dietary-cholesterol-on-blood-cholesterol/
>not understanding what an omnivore is and how they differ from specialised carnivores
>>36622420
If it's red it has a lot of fat in it.
>>36622740
Pretty safe to assume that they did not eat a lot of meat because meat tends to fight back.
Afaik chimps eat meat, such as small monkeys, when they can.
>>36622804
what >>36622804
said.
> And the lowest in BMI.
Basically all skinnyfats.
>>36622477
>what are canine teeth
I think they might be for fighting in some cases, but I can't think of an example since we know gorillas eat meat sometimes now.
>what is the ability to digest meat
Most people cook it, though. Besides, we can digest metal too, but it isn't recommended.
>>36622835
Corps addicts BTFO
>>36622482
nothing anyone knows will counter-balance the observed behaviours of humans all over the world - the way an animal eats isn't defined by anything physiological unless you're an obligate carnivore (needing to eat meat) it's defined by behaviour, what animals do - and it's abundantly clear humans eat whatever is available and are happy to eat meat if it's available.
>>36622542
>primates need tools to hunt
chimpanzees do it with no issues, you grab a howler monkey one limb to a chimp and you rip it limb from limb.
>>36622809
>citations are all over 20 years old
>cherrypicked data
>most convincing data is that serum cholesterol levels rise immediately after a meal then quickly return to baseline
>Author has a blatant agenda
>writes like a conspiracy theorist
Yeah I know how I feel about this article
Also, inb4
>He has a PhD!
So did the guy who said vaccines cause autism
>>36622864
A baby bear will kill and eat a rabbit
A baby human will play with the rabbit
>>36621156
First fucking sentence is a lie
>Atherosclerosis affects only herbivores.
http://www.petmd.com/dog/conditions/cardiovascular/c_dg_atherosclerosis
Dogs get it.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7740743
cats get it
Fucking shit paper. Why should any of it be trusted, if the fucking opening sentence is wrong?
>>36622878
Go check his other videos , he is raping the egg and beef and dairy boards daily.
>>36622876
Chimps are physically much better suited to that than humans are, due partially to the way their arms are hooked up differently to ours (we get way better manual dexterity, they get a much more efficient setup for force production).
They're also tool users. They can tear up a small monkey barehanded, but just as often they'll bash it over the head with a rock or club it with a branch.
Of course, none of that changes the fact that humans have been omnivorous since before their were homo sapiens and certain primates have been omnivorous since before the human/chimp split.
>>36622809
>nutritionfacts.org
the owner of that site (Greger?) apparently misrepresents science regularly, like using the higher hip fracture rates in scandinavia to say dairy causes bone density loss.
>implying it isn't that they have ice on the pavements for a lot of the year
>>36622859
correlation =/= causation
>>36622849
Yes, surprise, surprise. Humans have the intelligence to cook meat in order to derive nutrients from it just fine.
Unfortunately, I don't think I can say the same for the intelligence of someone who's trying to compare the digestion of something that provides sustenance to that of fucking metal. What are you even trying to prove with that comparison?
>>36622859
because that right column includes everyone who takes no thought of what they eat. I'd like to see the column showing diabetes prevalence in carnivores who only eat wholefoods.
>>36622749
http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/55/6/1060.abstract
Jesus, are you really spouting 70s science?
>>36622542
Fuck you, I eat meat raw. Just sear the outside to kill the bacteria.
And good luck with your diabetes.
>>36621181
BTFO
> The only way to produce atherosclerosis in a carnivore is to take out the thyroid gland; then, for some reason, saturated fat and cholesterol have the same effect as in herbivores.
>then, for some reason
bro, science has gone far enough to determine why that is
this is the level of knowledge the source contains
>>36622964
t. 5'5" manlet
>>36622981
Vegan, not even once.
>>36622889
humans are not adapted to hunt to the same extent as bears, to them its much older behaviour. That doesn't mean we aren't evolved to hunt.
also, cats will adopt abandoned rabbit litters if they've recently lost their own - we're all a mixture of instincts.
If you raise a human in an environment where it's normal they don't mind it.
>>36622993
Age-adjusted regression analysis showed that on average vegetarian children were taller than their meat-consuming classmates (2.5 and 2.0 cm for boys and girls, respectively).
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1855500
>>36623022
but they were green.
>>36621156
>le naturalistic fallacy
We also aren't meant to live in anything but hunter gatherer societies, but I don't see you living in a fucking cave, you idiot.
>>36623022
Those same vegetarian children had a leeway in their diet that offered source of protein in the form of dairy products like milk and eggs. Both are considered animal products and technically fall under the same category as meat that you're trying to disparage.
If you eat animal protein, of course you're going to get as tall as other kids who eat meat. The rest hinges on luck of the draw genetics, which is always a crapshoot.
Once again, your argument that vegetarianism is somehow superior to a balanced diet holds no water.
>>36621156
Just for posting this stupid shit imma eat twice the meat I would today. I hope they died painfully for my gains.
>>36623022
> cult members who are fanatically obsessed with their health are better than retards on the standard american diet
>b-b-b-ut it must be the meat a-n-d animal products!!! they're the work of the devil!!!!!
t. Loma Linda young earth creationist '''University"""""" '"""""scientists'''''''''''
>>36623076
I've read a few things about how there's some evidence living in a tight-knit village (more like a tribe) improves health outcomes and mental health, so there may be truth to that.
>>36623170
Whereas humans eating in a true herbivore fashion often have their children removed from them due to neglect. Both the bodies and minds of children forced to eat vegan can have their developments stunted.
>>36622889
Name a known carnivore that hunts when it's a baby.
>>36623183
Hunt for your own quarry and slowly bleed them out to death. The slow, painful death makes them release adrenaline into their system, which in turn makes their meat tastier. If for nothing else do it to spite OP.
>>36623224
My kitten ate flies.
Now he just hunts socks.
I don't get it. If you want to go vegan go for it. But quit trying to persuade others to do it too you attention seeking FAGGOT.
>>36622574
>y'all
Triggered
>>36621181
/thread
>>36623269
To a vegan a meat eater is like a child molester. Just as they are offended by child molesters molesting children they are offended by meat eaters meat eating. In their moral view of the world, it is wrong for them not to speak out against meat eaters.
![20120321[1].gif](https://i.imgur.com/vnfQQNu.gif "20120321[1].gif")
>>36621156
>William C. Roberts, cardiologist
Just some dumbshit cherry picking and talking out their ignorant ass on a field he has no expertise in, not reflective of the consensus among comparative anatomists nor published in a comparative anatomy journal at all
>>>/trash/
>>36623303
It's mostly about higher IQ.
Higher scores for IQ in childhood are associated with an increased likelihood of being a vegetarian as an adult.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1790759/
>>36623269
I think it's their need to be vindicated for all the adjustments they've made in their lives that require extra effort for a comparable result. It's honestly just silly for them to demand recognition for restrictions they've imposed on themselves for their own smug sense of satisfaction. I believe a large majority of the vegan hubris roots from sunk-cost fallacy and deep-seated insecurity rising from it.
>>36622574
I'm not vegan but I love PETA cause they make stuff that suits my fetish.
>>36623331
It's almost like it's a trendly thing with wealthy and affluent faggots, which also tend to have higher IQ offspring due to an being raised in an enriching environment with stimulating materials and good nutrition.
>>36623331
While good science does not get outdated, I wonder about the reliability of a cultural observation from 50 years ago.
With the advances in nutritional science over this period of time, are these results accurate today?
>>36623360
>It's almost like it's a trendly thing with wealthy and affluent faggots, which also tend to have higher IQ offspring due to an being raised in an enriching environment with stimulating materials and good nutrition.
It's a 4chan thing to not read the links that get posted?
>IQ remained a statistically significant predictor of being vegetarian as an adult after adjustment for social class
>>36623331
It could have to do with a conscious choice to make a better choice in life from a nutritional and moral standpoint. This group represents the majority of the higher-IQ folks.
It could also very well have to do with smugness and fedora-tipping. Following vegetarianism for the sake of establishing moral superiority seems to be a trend that grows by the day. This group represents the majority of the dumb trendchasers who tend to be the most vocal in preaching the sins of eating meat.
>>36623425
>dumb trendchasers
Projecting much?
Eating meat is the trend also pushed by peer pressure.
"As I mentioned in my entry “Are Humans Carnivores, Omnivores or Herbivores?”, I had heard rumors that Roberts was a fish and chicken eating “vegetarian.” Now I have it from a reliable source that these rumors were true. I couldn’t confirm the chicken for sure, but Roberts does eat fish and even uses saturated-fat-laden (and thus fatal) sour cream and butter on baked potatoes."
So he knows his own research is bullshit.
http://letthemeatmeat.com/post/523938817/vegan-leaders-dr-william-c-roberts-md
>>36623499
Eating meat is a trend pushed by meat being delicious and not being the artery-clogging product of devilry that staunch vegans preach it to be. What am I supposed to be projecting?
>>36623331
>On average, vegetarians had a higher childhood IQ score than non-vegetarians. According to sex, the mean (SD) childhood IQ score of vegetarians compared with non-vegetarians was 106.1 (14.7) and 100.6 (15.2) for men and 104.0 (14.1) and 99.0 (14.7) for women, differences of 5.5 and 5.0 points (P<0.001).
literally comparing brainlets to slightly bigger brainlets
definitely too homogenous of a population to draw any firm conclusions
>>36623216
Living in a tight-knit group of any kind has many psychological and health benefits because social interaction is actually a psychological and biological need.
This does not apply exclusively to hunter-gatherer societies.
Benefits include greater psychological health as well as better immune system and overall healthiness.
>>36623536
6 iq is an huge difference, it's literally the same difference between south korea 105 and poland 99.
In which country would you rather live?
https://iq-research.org/en/page/average-iq-by-country
Isn't John Venus the king of fit?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkOSwH2tyZQ
>>36623013
mongolians are fucking metal.
>>36623224
He just said it. A bear.
>>36623331
That is a correlation, not a cause
There is also a large relationship between developing in affluence and having a higher IQ. Guess what kind of people usually can afford to fall for the vegetarian meme? Guess what kind of people go to universities where they can be exposed to trends?
>>36623536
You're comparing people who, for better or worse, is willing to make changes in their diet, to a population bogged down by trailer trash and blacks with considerably lower standard of intelligence who don't give a fuck about what they cram down their maws.
This point was made already in >>36622935. Do you have a learning disability?
>>36623555
Poland. Definitely Poland.
>>36623362
Nevermind, I misread it while skimming. I thought they were 30 in 1970, instead they were born in 1970.
However now that I am reading more thoroughly, I am interested in this line
>When vegetarians were divided into those who were strictly vegetarian (no fish or meat) and those who consumed fish or chicken, no difference was found in IQ score.
and this one
>On average, vegans had a childhood IQ score that was nearly 10 points lower than other vegetarians
>>36623555
South Korean here. I'd like to try living at Poland. South Korea is a fucking suffocating place, and I know this by experience.
>>36622652
Frugivores still eat tons of leaves and stalks. Plus they had functional caecums, bigger large intestines, and a fitter microbiome (http://pnas.org/content/111/46/16431.abstract), so there was probably at least some capacity vs humans
>>36623555
>>36623613
>thinking anything <140 IQ isn't subhuman
Top sides. This is what brainlets actually believe.
>>36622749
Hello bro,
I'm not trying to be aggressive, just hear me out:
>Have been eating 4 eggs daily, with yolk, for the past 2 years because I started a farm and to be honest I absolutely love eggs
>No exercise other than farmwork
>smoke and drink regularly, red meat and olive oil pretty much every day
This is my latest bloodwork.
I honestly think that dietary cholesterol doesn't matter.
>>36623235
Don't do this
I actually hunt, and slow and painful deaths makes boar, deer and even pheasant meat tougher.
There's hunter broscience around that it also releases toxins in the meat due to stress, but I can't cross-reference those. The meat is DEFINITELY tougher and less good on badly-shot animals though.
I've ruined many of my dad's hunts by poor aim, believe me.
>>36623733
fuckin greek farmers man
peace, greekbro
>>36621156
then why do we have a short digestive tract forward mounted eyes and teeth that are not suited to grinding hard vegetation. we are omnivores we eat anything
>>36623832
A farm is surprisingly fun by the way.
9-10 hours of sweaty honest work, then internet and food all day. It's just a bit lonesome since most neighbor farmers are normie dipshits.
How did you notice it's Greek?
>>36623324
jesus christ who sits down spending hours making these terrible shit comics what an autist
>>36623013
>That doesn't mean we aren't evolved to hunt.
yhea bro, our completely useless fingernails, small canines, small mouths and plantigrade feet that makes us slower means we're born killing machines
go try to kill a deer with your bare hands and see what happens, faggot.
>>36623871
>>How did you notice it's Greek?
Not him, but how many languages use the Greek alphabet?
>>36623842
>then why do we have a short digestive tract
stopped reading there
>>36623871
>how did you notice it's Greek?
Really?
>>36621156
And fatties believe that humans are meant to be obese. There are a lot of ways to live.
>>36623912
>strawman: the post
>>36623911
>smbc
>shit
pretty bad taste tbqh
>>36623941
>implying that our digestive tract isn't short
wat mate
>>36623733
Heres the lowdown on meat vs veges
In humans and rats saturated fat does encourage atherosclerosis. This doesnt happen in strict carnivores unless they have a thyroid defect.
However if you eat like a normal person, and not an amerifat/britbong, you wont get heart disease until youre 70.
So basically, when you become old a senile, become vegan by all means
>>36624089
Bullshit
Atherosclerosis is caused by grains and sugars. This is why cows get it, and why lions rarely do. And why domesticated cats get it, but wild cats do not. Why dogs get is, but wolves do not.
>>36624107
You have no idea what you're talking about.
>>36622591
Topkek mate. Then why is my cholesterol <100 as a vegan?
>>36624107
Its caused by whatever the body cant metabolise effectively ie. Food that they dont naturally eat.
Humans are omnivores with a strong bias to vegetables, so they can eat meat but not that much without increasing their risk
>>36624139
no u
>>36624143
Then why do herbivores get it with their natural diets?
>>36621156
This is a fucking citationless opinion piece. How the fuck are you guys falling for this bait?
>humans are naturally made to be herbivore
>including having the eyes facing the front, the ability to digest meat and increased stamina for hunting
>>36624188
>including having the eyes facing the front
Hunters - front facing eyes for clarity to hunt
Prey - Eyes on the side of to avoid being hunted
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20141013-why-do-your-eyes-face-forwards
>TFW humans are naturally vegans
>>36624173
Please stop spreading misinformation about topics you are clearly not well versed in.
>>36621156
I just want to point out that herbivores eat meat too if they can get their hoofs on it.
>>36621156
literally who gives a fuck, meat tastes good and makes me strong
>>36624188
>increased stamina for hunting
Herbivores don't have stamina? Silly goy, eat your meat
>>36624239
>potatoes have multiple eyes on their bodies
>humans have eyes facing the front
it just works
meat eaters BTFO
>>36624276
name me an animal with a natural predator that can run for as long as a human can
>>36624143
I guess we should just ignore studies done on and the groups of humans who ate literally only meat and were healthy...
http://zerocarbzen.com/
I'm not saying a diet of zero carbs is ideal, but people who stick to the diet are perfectly healthy, completely disproving that humans do not effectively digest animal foods.
If anything, we don't effectively digest animal foods when we also attempt to digest plants.
>>36624242
no u
>hurt durr only herbivores and carnivores exist
the only legit reason to go vegan is cos of the environment. Animal agriculture is responsible for a lot of GHG. If you care about the environment but dont want to go fully vegan, cut beef out of your diet, beef is really low yield and makes a lot of GHG. Chicken is a bit higher yield, so if you want to eat meat thats still fine
>>36624027
it's called a rebuttal you dumb baby
>>36624328
we're not omnivores.
we have to cook meat to keep ourselves from getting sick from eating it/ be able to digest it due to weak stomach acid/ be able to chew it
>>36624735
no we don't
I eat raw meat all the time. it is delicious.
>>36624301
>muh anecdotes
there are people who pack smoke and are considered "perfectly healthy" too
>>36623598
Bears are omnivores senpai
>>36624735
You're a fucking idiot. Early humans were eating raw meat just fine before cooking was even invented. Based on your idiotic logic, i could argue that raw meat is bad for lions given they only have a lifespan of 14 years.
>>36624735
http://www.nature.com/news/food-processing-1.19513
https://news.ncsu.edu/2015/07/beasley-acid-2015/
>>36624140
If it isn't dependent on diet the point is a healthy people, vegan or not, will have low levels. You having optimal cholesterol levels doesn't disprove the point
>>36624173
>Then why do herbivores get it with their natural diets?
Do they?
>>36625752
It's called spontaneous atherosclerosis. Requires serum cholesterol to rise of course. Generally happens in old age or during the suckling period.
>>36622904
He clarifies in other articles that carnivores can develop atherosclerosis, but that the only way to make it so that saturated fat and cholesterol can raise their blood cholesterol levels is for their thyroid gland to malfunction, which in experiments requires either removing the gland surgically or using thyroid depressing medication.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1849886/
>Indeed, atherosclerosis is one of the easiest diseases to produce experimentally, but the experimental animal must be an herbivore. It is not possible to produce atherosclerosis in a carnivore, with one exception, and that is in carnivores who have hypothyroidism due to thyroidectomy.
Atherosclerosis is extremely uncommon in dogs and cats because of this, yet in humans, whose cholesterol levels easily increase by eating meat, it's the most common cause of death and, statistically, will probably be how you're going to die.
OP also kind of dicked the dog by leaving out who the man in that article is. William C. Roberts is the editor-in-chief of the American Journal of Cardiology and has been for decades. One of the most accomplished and well-respected cardiologists in the world.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_C._Roberts
>>36624301
Opened link expecting studies, got anecdotes of young people eating poor diets and saying "everything's fine, I love it." As weak as it gets.
The only studies on these pure meat keto-style diets are relatively short-term studies looking at weight-loss and measuring biomarkers of disease as a means to estimate future risk (rather than measuring hard end-points like heart attacks, total death, cancer deaths, etc), which gets confounded by the effect of the weight loss.
>>36621156
Our cells, DNA, and digestive system prove that we evolved to eat meat regularly, just not DAILY like so many people currently do.
You veganfags are full of shit and will ALWAYS be wrong.
>>36622542
We don't actually have to cook our meat, you know? You can eat raw meat. People do it all the time.
Cooked meat just has no chance for bacteria and tastes a lot better.
>>36623912
thats what spears are for silly goose.
and humans arent lions... we arent built to fuck shit up fast
but using those feet that you say make us slower also does something nice. Having a two legged stride makes us waaaay more energy efficient when it comes to moment. Humans are persistence predators ala wolves.
running prey down until they are exhausted, then picking off the stragglers.
there is a reason why within a few thousand years of humans migrating to a continent nearly every single large land animal on that continent has been driven to extinction.
Humans are really fucking good at hunting and eating animals.
>>36622749
>egg and dairy board puppet
Shit, he's on to me!
>>36623331
And the only form of success IQ does not correlate with is reproductive, this is a feature not a bug
>eyes facing forward like most predators
>front teeth found in predators
Nah baka senpai desu
>>36625810
Mälmros, H., Sternby, N.H. Induction of atherosclerosis in dogs by a thiouracil-free semisynthetic diet containing cholesterol and hydrogenated coconut oil. Progr. Biochem. Pharmacol. 1968;4:482.
P.]. Manning and T. B. Clarkson. 1973. Diet induced atherosclerosis in the cat. Arch. Pathol. 89:271-278
>>36626359
>hydrogenated coconut oil
why.jpg
>>36626359
Can't find even the abstract of that first paper and the abstract of the second paper doesn't really give much information. It was mentioned in this paper though
http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/9389784
>The domestic cat has not been used in studies of atherosclerosis, with the exception of a single study published in 1970. We have further evaluated the susceptibility of the domestic cat to diet-induced atherosclerosis, the ultimate intent being to discern the atherogenic risk due to lipoprotein lipase deficiency in an affected feline kindred with a phenotype very similar to that of the human form of this condition.
Lipoprotein lipase deficiency apparently is a rare genetic disorder
https://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/000408.htm
So, while you could add it to the list of unusual situations where a carnivorous creature can develop atherosclerosis, especially from eating animal fat and cholesterol, you can see the point that these are very rare cases under abnormal circumstances, while with herbivorous animals (and humans) it's very common and easy to produce experimentally
>>36621156
>characteristics of herbivores
>eyes placed infront of the face
fuckin retard
>>36622542
>They don't eat it raw
ayy lmao, you're really missing out
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mett
>>36621156
also:
https://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/hal-00545795/document
>>36626686
It's almost like there's thousands of exceptions...woah
>>36626636
That uses normal wild type domestic cats and a similar feeding protocol used to induce lesions in herbivores like rabbits. Obviously susceptibility to diet-induced atherosclerosis is highly variable even among herbivores. Chimpanzees and other non-human great apes can have very high LDL cholesterol (~160mg/dL) yet don't develop any atherosclerosis until it's pushed much higher. Not his point though... he's flat out saying it's impossible for carnivores to develop diet-induced atherosclerosis without thyroid problems. That's just wrong.
nope
nyanyanya
TAKE YOUR CARBS OUT OF MY BUTT!
>>36621156
YOU MUST USE A LIFTING PLUG OR YOU SHIT OUT ALL YOUR NATURAL FIBERS, BANANA MAN SEMPAI!
FUCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCK I will milksheik you in the butt
satoshi soze?
>>36621156
stfu troll
>>36626771
Where's the column for normal healthy non-meme diet and where's the line for omnivores?
>>3662
JESUS FUCKING CHRIST STICK A CARROT IN YOUR ASS AND CALL IT A DAY!
Fuck you OP I will kill a million more for my gains
>Eating poor and defenseless plants
>>36622749
Go eat nothing but coconut oil and drink unfiltered coffee, then go get a lipid profile.
>>36622555
>smoke and snort cocaïne
>taste good
You got sold powdered sugar friend
>>36624290
that's misleading, humans can run for a ridiculously long amount of time because of the way we sweat.
>>36624301
Inuits (the people in this picture) >>36623013 fill all their macros to some extent with meat - they eat the bone, drink the blood etc.
They also have high fatality from.. something, strokes or aneurysms I'm not sure. Their life expectancy increases a lot when they switch to a western diet.
>>36624380
Red meat has unique nutritional properties, though. Chicken is alright if all you want is protein; it won't help with carnitine, creatine etc.
>>36626771
>True Paleolithic diet
![Roger-the-Kangaroo-31[2].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/czQRXce.jpg "Roger-the-Kangaroo-31[2].jpg")
Do you even lift?
>>36621156
stfu, fatty.
>>36623013
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwIK7cjfVpg
>>36621181
>Because we're too stupid to make the better choice
>>36621182
Meat tastes bad. Fact. The human tongue has no protein or fat receptors, like actual omnivores or carnivores. Meat only tastes good when it is prepared in such a way.
>>36622442
>>can digest meat
Meat takes approx. 5 days to digest, we could theoretically digest wood, but it is obvious we shouldn't eat wood. Why does no one make the connection with corpses?
>>36622477
>canine teeth
They are only called canine teeth because of their location, and they are some pretty sad canines compared to meat eating animal. It is literally just a slightly pointed tooth. Also, canines don't always imply the animal eats meat, just look at this gorilla.
>>36628651
i'm sure this is the 10000x time you explained this. why are meat eaters fucking retarded ? jesus fucking christ.
>>36628616
fun fact, people all over the world in various cultures see raw meat as a delicacy, from arabs to japanese.
>>36628616
they don't like meat, they are addicted to its salty saturated fat.
>>36621156
Even chimpanzees our closest relatives hunt and eat meat.
Heck, humans have hunted and eaten meat for millions of years, literally what is this bullshit?
>>36628630
I bet I can digest meat a lot quicker than 5 days. Give me a salad with it and watch.
>>36628675
>arabs
i'm arab and you're full of shit
>japs
they eat fish raw WITH sweet seasoned rice to mask the stinky smell of fish.
>humans are carnivores
no we aren't, we don't eat pig or chicken meat raw.
>humans are herbivores
no we aren't, we don't eat grass
>humans are vegans
no we aren't, strict vegan diets literally degrades a persons brain and causes them to be a contant irrational irritable state. strict vegan mothers can't produce the breast milk needed for a breast milk feeding infant to survive.
We eat fruit, veggies and cooked fucking meat. Stop comparing people to animals. Ever seen a Leopard cook meat? No? Then fuck off.
That research is bullshit and the researcher knows it. He does it anyways cause he gets paid by doing so.
>>36628697
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kibbeh_nayyeh
Kibbeh nayyeh or raw kibbeh (Arabic: كبة نيئة) is a Lebanese and common Levantine mezze. It consists of minced raw lamb or beef mixed with fine bulgur and spices.
Pro tip: Vegetables taste like shit raw and need seasoning and cooking.
>>36628691
chimps are 99% herbivores
they kill animals not to eat them but to show dominance, and when they eat it they stuff it down with herbes.
also, humans even ate other humans to survive, it doesn't imply that's the optimal food for them.
>>36628616
>no protein or fat receptors
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v416/n6877/full/nature726.html
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20573884
>>36628697
sandnigger docent know arab food, they eat raw meat in lebanon and syria.
>>36628712
are you an idiot or what, there are literally pictures and videos of them eating other animals.
Fact.
>just had my 500 g of beans with 250 g of broccollis and 200 g. of soy
feel great ;p
>>36628708
>Kibbeh nayyeh
that's an exotic dish not the commun thing to eat. and it is nuked with herbes to make it taste good
>vegetables taste bad
yes i agree. humans are fruit eaters not vegetable eaters.
that explains why only fruits taste good to us raw.
>>36628557
It's the culture they grow up in. If they encounter animals only ever as friends instead of prey then of course it's horrifying, if they grow up as Inuits then they're not only not horrified by "murder" they'll happily eat the dead body raw.
>implying we should be led in our actions by how children react
Humans have the ability to mentally separate "animals who are not in our group" from "animals who are in our group" to the point they'll even eat humans of other tribes. Vegans can't into setting a limit to their compassion, so they become this absurd all-embracing "world-saver" who sees goats and chickens living to old age as morally important when under natural conditions humans see predation as part of nature. Really it's about sheltered people who aren't being exposed to the harshness of having to survive which has always come at the expense of other animals for humans so much so we've evolved to rely on that. If we all ate vegan our brains would atrophy over generations, unless we were able to synthesise something nutritious enough in a lab (which we aren't yet).
>>36628602
malnutrition isn't the better choice.
>>36628616
>The human tongue has no fat receptors
https://source.wustl.edu/2012/01/receptor-for-tasting-fat-identified-in-humans/
>>36628691
Since 2 million years yes. Before that we were frugivores.
The problem is that we humans never hunted/eaten meat like real carnivores.
We didnt/dont catch or kill animals with our claws or our teeth.
We dont bite into their necks to kill them.
We dont grab them and rip of their flesh.
We throw spears at them/shoot them, then we use tools to cut the animal and we cook/prepare the food to make it easy chew-able.
All these things made our brains grow bigger, but they didnt give us carnivore-ish characktistics.
If the humans in the past were to hunt/kill animals with their bare hands and their teeth, if they were to bite into the dead animal and rip off its flesh and then chew the raw meat, without cooking it and therefore making it very soft. Then yes, today we would prolly be somewhat carnivore-ish or atleast have carnivore-ish charackteristics.
This is the reason we are not carnivore-ish. We can disgest meat, but we are not true carnivores/predators like lions. A lion has to hunt and kill animals. A human can eat fruits, veggies and eggs and continue with life.
>>36628729
1.read
2.understand
3.reply
>>36628743
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/99legacy/6-14-1999a.html
Human ancestors who roamed the dry and open savannas of Africa about 2 million years ago routinely began to include meat in their diets to compensate for a serious decline in the quality of plant foods, according to a physical anthropologist at the University of California, Berkeley.
It was this new meat diet, full of densely-packed nutrients, that provided the catalyst for human evolution, particularly the growth of the brain, said Katharine Milton, an authority on primate diet.
Without meat, said Milton, it's unlikely that proto humans could have secured enough energy and nutrition from the plants available in their African environment at that time to evolve into the active, sociable, intelligent creatures they became. Receding forests would have deprived them of the more nutritious leaves and fruits that forest-dwelling primates survive on, said Milton.
>>36628630
Meat is excellent nutrition, wood isn't. Also, I don't think it takes 5 days to digest.
>>36628749
i never said we are carnivores, we are Omnivores, your whole post is nonsensical
>>36628749
>This is the reason we are not carnivore-ish. We can disgest meat, but we are not true carnivores/predators like lions. A lion has to hunt and kill animals. A human can eat fruits, veggies and eggs and continue with life.
That's bullshit, my female cat eat her vegan pet food just fine. She just need some taurine supplement once in a while.
FUCK VEGANS AND FUCK HUMUS
>>36628756
Hunting the animal, crafting tools and making fire to prepare the meat is what made us smart.
NOT EATING MEAT ITSELF
>>36628651
Gorillas have been observed eating meat.
>>36628748
i'm not talking about culture here, i'm talking instincts. like a chick who get out of the egg directly looking for grains in the soil.
baby omni/carnivores have killer instincts even if you lock him away from his family, a baby lion will fucking kill and eat a rabbit if you lock them inside a room of apples and rabbits with no cultural influence.
a baby human in such a room will eat the apples and PLAY with the rabbit.
a baby
>>36628776
read the fucking source retard.
http://www.livescience.com/23671-eating-meat-made-us-human.html
Fragments of a 1.5-million-year-old skull from a child recently found in Tanzania suggest early hominids weren't just occasional carnivores but regular meat eaters, researchers say.
The finding helps build the case that meat-eating helped the human lineage evolve large brains, scientists added.
"I know this will sound awful to vegetarians, but meat made us human," said researcher Manuel Domínguez-Rodrigo, an archaeologist at Complutense University in Madrid.
MEAT IS NUTRIENT DENSE.
>>36628771
Well i was talking about lions here, not cats.
Cats been living with humans since thousands of years. So obviously they can digest plants too.
>>36628770
Yeah right, sorry about that.
My point still stands though. Humans can digest meat, but apart from that everything about us is herbivore-ish.
Didn't humans evolve so that they can outlast their prey in Africa? Natural state humans have some of the best stamina of any animal
>>36628770
omnivores eat meat raw, and they don't get heart disease because of it no matter what.
>>36621156
Here you go, now fuck off forever.
https://www.researchgate.net/blog/post/human-genome-shaped-by-vegetarian-diet-increases-risk-of-cancer-and-heart-disease
Why can't I just say that I like meat and that I don't give a shit about where it comes from?
>>36628776
that's false, cooking is what made us human
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgmfRUwqGy4
>>36628804
ae you fucking stupid or what?
I'm posting links, are you even reading them?
it literally says that meat eating was a crucial part of our evolution.
>>36628793
i meant that >>36628815
for you
cooking is what made us human
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgmfRUwqGy4
>>36628821
It's the process towards acquiring meat not the meat itself.
>>36628821
NO, COOKING IS, BECAUSE IT IS THE ONLY THING HUMANS DO DIFFERENTLY THAN OTHER ANIMALS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgmfRUwqGy4
>>36628849
no no no, read the fucking links, meat provided nutrition crucial to the development of our brains, hunting did not provide the calories, eating meat from the hunt provided the calories and nutrients.
>>36628743
You will die on a fruit-only diet.
>>36628749
>A human can eat fruits, veggies and eggs and continue with life.
But eating only those puts you at risk of disorders. Our brains need fats which are in high levels only in seafood, so we need seafood. Meat is also rich in micronutrients (carnitine, creatine), which our brains rely on.
Almost all essential nutrients are in a vegan diet, so with supplementing b12 you can hit the recommended levels of all essential nutrients. However, recommended levels are only about staving off disease - they're not about thriving. It isn't about reaching your highest level of functioning, only about staying out of the healthcare system.
Secondly, non-essential nutrients are needed if you want quality of life. Essential nutrient means if you lack it you will die in a way which they'll link directly to "Vitamin A deficiency". If you lack a non-essential nutrient it might be linked to dementia or alzheimer's but having a functioning brain is not "essential" in that sense.
>You must be either a herbivore or a carnivore
>Omnivores don't exist
>>36622830
Yeah, the darker the better
>>36628776
Meat is nutrient-rich, especially with nutrients used by the brain (carnitine, creatine). The brain needs fuelling to craft, hunt and make fire.
>>36628789
and let that child grow up on a desert island with some pigs and see if they're still playing with the pigs when they're 20, or whether they've made a spear and hunted one of them down and roasted it over a fire.
>>36628801
>Humans can digest meat, but apart from that everything about us is herbivore-ish.
I think we have subtler adaptations to hunt like being adapted to focus on prey etc., I think the instincts are just repressed like a lot of other instincts because we're all up in our neocortex all the time (thinking, reasoning, planning).
>>36628802
Humans can run an absurdly long distance in one go because of how we sweat. It isn't even close to horses, for example. I think that might be a happy accident coming from losing our hair, though.
>>36628861
It also allows us to get a lot more nutrition out of the food, to digest it more easily etc. It's a way of massively increasing our ability to put energy and nutrients into our brains and extend the variety of our diet. Doing an activity isn't enough to fuel a large brain, you need the nutrients and variety. It comes at the cost of other animal's lives, though. Vegans don't want to live with that, but veganism is doomed because it reduces performance and selects itself out.
>>36628994
Does pic related look like he has reduces performance?
Please dont be delusional. I admit that being a vegan is not easy at all and many things go wrong.
But if you know what you are doing, you wont lack in anything in life.
Its true most vegans are kinda skinny and low performance, but that not because of their vegan diet. its because they are retarded.
>>36628793
Retard.
Our brain grew as we evolved, the meat eating is a situational adaptation that our ancestors did for survival. Eating an oblect carnivorous diet like the Inuits fucks them up real good too, their health improves immensely when they move somewhere modern. If meat didn't contain glycogen, we wouldn't be able to survive from it.
>>36628913
if we're alone in a desert i'll even eat you.
but we don't live in a desert, we live in a giant super market.
i'm right, you're wrong, fuck you.
>>36621156
our digestive tract isn't long
>>36621182
Sounds like fatty logic.
"MCDONALDS TASTE GOOD IM GOING TO KEEP EATING IT YOU CANT STOP ME"
>>36628831
"and some worms"
you just rekt yourself in your own post
>>36629221
i'm not a liar, gorillas eat worms from time to time, but they spend the most of they day eating greens. that's 99% of their diet, do you fucking understand dipshit ? 1% is irrelevant.
>>36629074
I'm not sure who that is, how much muscle he added before becoming vegan etc. The reduced performance I'm talking about is mental though. In reading about human evolution I've read meat and seafood were important, that makes sense to me since I know they're both rich sources of micronutrients (in red meat's case creatine and carnitine most obviously, in the case of oily fish omega-3 fatty acids).
>if you know what you are doing, you won't lack in anything in life
In my country (UK) we have a lot of talk about how omega-3 fatty acids are important to stave off dementia and how everyone should eat more oily fish. I can see the links between meat/seafood and higher mental function and I never hear anyone vegan talk about it or address it. Maybe if they supplemented they wouldn't have reduced functioning, and I don't know if eating a lot of nuts you could hit your omega-3 requirements (I don't trust the recommended intake, though - it's only about keeping yourself "not sick" which isn't the same as healthy/high-functioning).
I've been a strict vegetarian since I was 8 and never once in my life have I had a stomach ache, diarrhea, or "the runs" from eating any kind of food. Meanwhile, my meat-eating friends literally have the runs ever other day any time they eat anything with meat in it. I don't know how people can live like that
>>36628630
>meat takes 5 days to digest
>implying humans can digest cellulose
Vegetarian logic, ladies and gentlemen.
>>36628805
The gene causes the body to produce more arachidonic acid. If you actually would look it up to see what it does, Arachidonic acid is necessary for repair and growth of skeletal muscle tissue, helps maintain hippocampal membrane fluidity, and activates syntaxin which is a protein that helps repair neurons.
"Arachidonic acid is also involved in early neurological development. In one study funded by the U.S. National Institute of Child Health and Human Development, infants (18 months) given supplemental arachidonic acid for 17 weeks demonstrated significant improvements in intelligence, as measured by the Mental Development Index."
Bodybuilders: "Arachidonic acid is marketed as an anabolic bodybuilding supplement in a variety of products. Supplementation of arachidonic acid (1,500 mg/day for 8 weeks) has been shown to increase lean body mass, strength, and anaerobic power in experienced resistance-trained men. This was demonstrated in a placebo-controlled study at the University of Tampa. Thirty men (aged 20.4 ± 2.1 years) took arachidonic acid or a placebo for 8 weeks, and participated in a controlled resistance-training program. After 8 weeks, Lean Body Mass (LBM) had increased significantly, and to a greater extent, in the ARA group (1.62 kg) vs. placebo (0.09 kg) (p<0.05). The change in muscle thickness was also greater in the ARA group (.47 cm) than placebo (.25 cm) (p<0.05). These results suggest that ARA supplementation can positively augment adaptations in strength and skeletal muscle hypertrophy in resistance-trained men."
As for the inflammation?
"One study at Baylor University reported a significant reduction in resting inflammation (via marker IL-6) in young men supplementing 1,000 mg/day of arachidonic acid for 50 days in combination with resistance training. This suggests that rather being pro-inflammatory, supplementation of ARA while undergoing resistance training may actually improve the regulation of systemic inflammation."
>>36622464
>fuana
kek
>>36622672
I see you are american
>>36621156
>herbivores
>Can't digest cellulose
sounds about right.
>>36629446
see this :
>>36628743
herbivore is just a label, the meaning is plant based food
>>36628223
The point is that we can. And we're evolved to. Because we're pursuit predators.
>>36630080
>we're evolved to.
That isn't how evolution is supposed to work. It's meant to be random mutation which either survives or not. Humans mutated to have less body hair and those who didn't mutate were selected out.
I read somewhere the supposed persistence hunters in Africa don't rely on it for food that much (because it's time and energy intensive), they do it for tourists. If you look at the way humans hunt elsewhere I think you'll find they run the animals down sprinting. They don't need to use endurance advantage; they surround them in groups like wolves do and the tools (spears etc.) are the advantage.
>>36630080
>humans
>pursuit predators
>predators
L
O
L
Running efficiency is an attribute of foraging PREY animals, pronghorn are an example another one is wildebeests
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1944533
The pronghorn antelope (Antilocapra americana) has an alleged top speed of 100 km h-1, second only to the cheetah (Acionyx jubatus) among land vertebrates, a possible response to predation in the exposed habitat of the North American prairie. Unlike cheetahs, however, pronghorn antelope are distance runners rather than sprinters, and can run 11 km in 10 min, an average speed of 65 km h-1.We conclude that their performance is achieved by an extraordinary capacity to consume and process enough oxygen to support a predicted running speed greater than 20 ms-1 (70 km h-1), attained without unique respiratory-system structures.
Vid related is wildebeest against ashmatic cats, contrary to lions they've oxidative fast fibers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jmv516y6s0w
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22071196
Black wildebeest skeletal muscle exhibits high oxidative capacity and a high proportion of type IIx fibres.
This study confirms the presence of both fast-twitch fibres and high oxidative capacity in black wildebeest, indicating an animal that can run very fast but is also fatigue resistant.
>>36630174
It's only an attribute of prey animals because they have to be able to outstrip predator animals some of the time - maybe the prey animals would be slightly faster on average since supposedly predators will prey on weak, young, sick or old animals (although I think I remember reading recently that doesn't happen as often as thought with wolves, they'll hunt healthy adults).
>>36625752
they do
>>36628707
>don't eat pig meat raw
I do, it is delicious
>>36628743
>pic filled with lies
great source bro
>>36628771
enjoy your feline diabetes
>>36628801
vegetative matter in cat diets leads to diabetes and cardiovascular disease.
cats feed only meat, do not develop these diseases.
>>36628958
humans outrun horses
>>36630750
that's what I'm saying, not sprinting but when it comes to endurance running horses overheat after only a relatively short distance whereas humans can run ultramarathon distances.
>>36630849
happy accidents is essentially what evolution is.
>>36621156
>2016
>opening a thread using digressive considerations from a 16 years ago "20 questions about something completely unrelated" as argument for anything
meh
There are dozen of studies which say we're frugivore, opportunistically omnivore, flexatarian - depending on the drug used by the aspirant Ph.D and depending on who's funding the research.
>>36630849
>humans can run ultramarathon distances
No, humans can not run ultramarathons. Average humans can barely run half marathons - and they need to train for that too.
You're levering on the fact that humans can choose to train an ability or to learn something - even if it's a "violence" against their instinct or even body. That's not a fair comparison if you're going to compare physiology.
Isn't the fact that people can survive off fat and protein alone enough proof that humans are meant to eat meat?
>>36630992
You are talking about humans suffering from modern living. Take away the cookies and cars and office jobs for 2 years, and anyone will be able to run for 40 miles.
>>36630735
My 19 yo cat died recently. It ate almost exclusively rice, veggies and some white meat/fish (with no ashes) in the last ~10 years. Any vet suggested to remove any kind of red meat since it was ~6 and to introduce more and more rice and veggies. So no, you're full of shit.
>>36630915
right, well what I was meaning to say is that there wasn't any selective pressure related to persistence hunting, the pressure was on something else.
>>36630938
>studies
it isn't that hard to classify an animal, you look at how they eat and humans eat omnivorously.
>>36630992
>Average humans can barely run half marathons
Being out of shape isn't typical it's a product of modern society, sedentary lifestyles etc. I expect you'll find reports of kids who grow up running in Kenya and can run half marathons without any issue at all.
>choose to train an ability
If you can show me an example of a horse ever training to run an ultramarathon then my point won't stand, otherwise you're missing what I'm saying.
>even if it's a "violence"
Distance running isn't a violence against humans, though. If they're out of shape maybe but we're talking about humans in a wilder state where they're often raised running.
>if you're going to compare physiology
the comparison is that it's possible for humans and not for horses or other animals due to differences in how we dissipate heat.
