![hadza-honey-hunter[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/qCmj8hN.jpg "hadza-honey-hunter[1].jpg")
Is lifting something natural for our bodies? Did ancient humans lift or the only exercise they did was running? How can building so much muscle makes us so attractive if apparently it wasn't something important for our survival? Also, why humans need to exercise a lot more than any other animal to stay fit? Most animals just do some cardio and eat little to keep fit.
>>36201030
No species really dos something "just for exercise". That's just not a thing. Living in the wild doesn't really allow for so much leisure that u do something " just for exercise".
We exist outside of the wild. We created a sort of fake comfortable living arrangement where we do things like exercise for the sake od exercise to simulate the wild.
As for why we find muscles attractive.. They were likely a little rare sure, especially before we learned to cook meat. But like a woman with birthing hips or big tits, we recognized what little muscle we saw as something powerful. Whoever had the most muscle was the strongest. The alpha. He was the strongest and for women being with him meant the best protection.
Like with what we find attractive in women, societ has distorted the view to some degree
Even hunter-gatherers had to lift animals that could weigh hundreds of pounds. When they began to develop civilization, they would need to lug around wood and stone for shelter until domesticating animals of burden to do it for them. We have arguably had to lift longer than we've had to run long distances.
>>36201030
WE WUZ KINGZ WHITE MAN PUT UZ DOWN THEY COME AND STEALZ OUR KNOWLEDGE
>>36201072
that 'alpha' thing is not really appliable to humans
like you said muscular=strong=being able to protect, but thats it though
>>36201030
Read this OP: Exercise like a hunter-gatherer: a prescription for organic physical fitness.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21545934
Lifting for increased strength/size began in ancient Greece. The first details/concepts of "progressive overload" come from notes taken from ancient Greek philosophers.
One could say this was one of the big reasons as to why ancient Greek infantry units were able to withstand wave after wave of malnourished DYEL manlets from the Eastern Empires. Your heavy armor,shield and spear/sword aren't going to feel anywhere near as heavy when you're training with heavy weights the way they did.
>>36201072
Yes, but it looks like most animals can live a less active lifestyle and be fit in their environment. Also, for me at least, its weird how unattractive ancient humans looked compared to bodybuilders nowadays or even the average joe how lifts once in a while.
>>36201030
Well, back when we were a hunter-gatherer society it was all about functional strength, and the strongest and fastest males were the ones who caught food, ate, and mated. Survival of the fittest was a real thing.
Now that we're an agrarian society and our basic human needs are met effortlessly we use lifting to supplement the activity we don't do anymore. Hunting, catching, building domiciles, staving off adversaries, etc.
That's why you have so many diets and exercise programs that emphasis doing things that our ancestors do, because only the best of the best lived and survived back then. Now, not so much.
>>36201103
Alpha can be applicable to humans, under certain conditions
Strength gives the ability to dominate others
>>36201121
This, the Greeks realized the benefits of strength training and general athleticism over other cultures and it helped them strive because of it.
They're not the founders of western civilization for nothing.
>>36201030
Lifting for hypertrophy not, but we lifted some heavy weights across a long distance and that made us a lot more resilient and fit. But the most important aspect of our ancient lifestyle was cardio, and it is to this day the most important aspect for health.
cardio + rest + stress free = health
Ancient humans weren't jacked. But their daily lives consisted of a lot more physical activity. Hunting/gathering/building shelter/migrating/being in the wild in general is physically demanding.
>>36201121
Lel nope.
Greece beat persia due to luck and bad persian strategy, most hoplites were farmers and civilians
>>36201114
Link to full article?
>>36201030
Most of what our ancestors did was endurance cardio and bodyweight exercise. A lot of the time there wouldn't be enough stable supply of food to bulk and fuel huge muscles - that would actually be bad for their survival because it means more calories they need to keep up with and more calories burned just moving around. Being much bigger than otter mode was unrealistic and inefficient.
Cultures all over the world have lifted for thousands of years. The Indians were jacked as fuck before they got subjugated.
Having muscle makes you strong, and being strong means you can overpower enemies and stay alive. It also means you've always had a steady supply of calories so everyone knows you're good at hunting and gathering and making sure you get enough. These are all great traits for survival and attractive to a mate who will want to pass these traits off onto their offspring.
I'm sure cavemen were showing off with feats of strength all the time. Ogg can lift that big rock but Grugg can't, what a faggot! No mammoth meat and cavegirl pussy for him.
>>36201240
You sound like a bad stereotype
>>36201179
>most hoplites were farmers and civilians
Do you even Greek history? It's more the other way around, ie; every single capable civilian was a hoplite. Spartans took it to the extreme, but it was still a fairly similiar story in other ancient Greek city states.
>>36201160
>strive
>thrive
So help me god i'm triggered
u fucking retard
>>36201072
>As for why we find muscles attractive.
"We" don't. Americans do. Social engineering during the 70s. Yes, people did studies about this.
>>36201121
>Lifting for increased strength/size began in ancient Greece.
Greeks did the Pentathlon and their halteres were about 7kg. You're wrong again.
>>36201220
http://thepaleodiet.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Organic-Fitness-Physical-activity-Consistent-with-Our-Hunter-Gatherer-Heritage-The-Paleo-Diet.pdf
Have fun. You won't like it.
>>36201391
interestingly enough, as much as Arnold has done, this will likely be the longest lasting legacy he leaves, even after his name is forgotten and his movies (say 500 years, whatever). The depth of social engineering he pretty much single-handedly orchestrated is staggering. People are still going to be trying to get jacked on alpha percion 231 a million years from now.
>>36201391
>social engineering
Elaborate
>>36201380
Doesnt disprove my argument though
>>36201434
Nah. Bodybuilding/muscle worship is a niche shitfest.
Normal everyday people don't give a shit.
You guys are delusional if you think otherwise. Ive been lifting for 12 years before you assume I am shit posting.
>>36201434
>as much as Arnold has done
It was Joe Weider. Before him, bodybuilding didn't exist. Sure, you had fringe sports like weightlifting and physical culture during th early 1900s and stuff like the Turnerbewegung in the middle 1800s, but that wasn't mainstream at all and not bodybuilding as we know it today.
>>36201434
Arnold's body isn't the ideal aesthetic unless you're gay
>>36201391
Source? Or are you just full of shit?
>>36201501
Basically, bodybuilding was created as a new market to make money. It started after Pumping Iron (Jewish Joe Weider basically created the scene out of nothing) as a homo fetish. Became kinda mainstream in the 80s and 90s (90s were actually more of an ottermode thing after the bodybuilder action flick stars of the 80s), but not really. People didn't like it that much. It was something to sell to adolescents and childish men.
Only in the 00s did it start to gain some traction. That's when the bulk of the bodybuilding memes got created. Right now, everyone is doing calisthenics and shit, so you could say bodybuilding is over again.
Problem is: The whole thing has degenerated into a steroid cult. We'll see how it turns out in, say, 20 years. Hindsight is always 20/20.
>>36201553
Dude, look it up yourself. There are many, many "History of weightlifting" studies and articles available. Read a lot. Then you know.
It's really an artificial trend because nobody really likes it. Usually, a slim, athletic body (see 70s) is more than enough.
>>36201557
So explain how that is social engineering instead of just plain capitalism
>>36201512
>>36201520
>>36201533
not talking about competitive bodybuilding, i mean a culture of men lifting weights to look better. it literally didn't exist in the populous and was just a freakshow on stage (yes even with weider). Arnold's charisma and marketing acumen made "fit culture" what it is today. Read his autobiography. He essentially said, "fuck, I can't be famous with this stupid niche bullshit, it needs to be more popular." After his decades of social engineering it's seen as completely normal for men to pack gyms lifting weights or trying to get lean. So no, has nothing to do with Arnold's body, and everything to do with culture.
>>36201582
Use google, I really DGAF. I wrote this shit all down for you guys at least three times in the past. It's basically normalization of homosexuality and goes far beyond the normal grooming men always did.
>>36201668
If its due to faggotry being accepted by mainstream, then thats all you had to say derp
>bbing is for fags
>fags get popular
>bbing gets popular
Was that hard
most roman soilders probaly looked like this, they rucked 12 miles for time weekly and often swam whenever possible, not to mention the work in a military back in that time problay included, fire, fort building, hunting, fishing, and running from place to place that and getting drunk and fighting your friends during sword practice
>>36201391
People find muscles attractive naturally dumbshit, just not roid levels of muscles.
>>36201030
Well hunter gatherers would have been very active and a lot stronger than the average person nowadays. But obviously they weren't doing fucking zercher squats with barbells.
>>36201638
What about charles atlas senpai?
>>36201995
People like Atlas, Reg Park, etc were all early figures of what was always a very niche thing and would have continued to be. From a macro, anthropological point of view, their greatest contributions were inspiring Arnold to follow the path he did and ignite/promote the fitness wave that would change culture as a whole. So yes, obviously there were other figures and contributors because no man works in a vacuum, but it's not a stretch to say that without Arnold, we wouldn't have the culture we do today.
