Hello, I'm a bio-mechanical analysis god. In this thread, I will use my superior understanding of human movement, and apply it, if possible, to your own movement.
If you are interested, send in your video!
Also, if anyone is interested, we can discuss, movement in general as well.
Join and learn about the most important factor in your success as a lifter!
please show me an example of good squat form. I have not progressed on my squat lately, i think its because i dont use good/correct form
>>34933352
While there is a distinct difference between form and movement, which I can elaborate on if you are interested, I can show you an example or two.
Tian tao: Perfect form and perfect movement, this is the result
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmCFwgR1JVw
Ilya Ilyin: Legendary movement, almost perfect form
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZwBAUHgnKA
How long until city snap?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEo8d62qrl0&feature=youtu.be
>>34933466
Less weight would help...
>>34933507
I got back to the gym after not being able to go for a while and didnt want to lower the weight too much. Dont want to hurt my shitty ego.
>>34933466
You loading your lower back in this lift.
Due to your inability to execute the movement solely by the power of your hamstrings, glutes and quads, you force yourself to lift it with your erector muscles. Also, you probably have a less than optimal movement to begin with, which facilitated this to begin with.
As long as you don't overwork your deadlift, (and in turn your lower back), and keep loading the muscles and not the ligaments of your back, you should be relatively safe.
Do you want something akin to a recipe to improve your movement and shift your deadlift to a 100% 'prime mover' movement?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URs1gWfKXko
Help me pls. A few things: I already know I'm straining my neck and I should keep it more neutral, so I'm working on that. Anything else?
>>34933520
Don't be stupid, in all aspect of your life you must allow logic to dictate the most important decisions. Is your goal to become as strong/safe as possible, (this involves minimizing risk for injury). Then don't be afraid of hurting your ego, be afraid of being stupid.
>>34933450
How come the guy with almost perfect form still is a weightlifting gold medalist? Wouldnt that require perfect form, like the other guy?
>>34933560
Thanks for the answer m9, i was thinking that my form is something along those lines since i used to skip leg day and my lower back got kind of disproportionately big.
Sure, it would be great if you had something that could help me.
>>34933278
>>34933582
Im not sure if living is all about making all the "right" decisions and going just by logic.
>>34933576
You have surprisingly good movement, better then 90% I would estimate.
Check list for you:
1. Learn/Improve inter abdominal pressure
Video to an okay 'guide'
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcY3YSW9vX4
2. Focus on keeping tension on the glutes, and avoid round the back by going to low (These are related, no force can pass through the back if it is rounded, meaning you can't use any hip muscles). If you want to go lower, you must do one or more of these; increase forward knee travel / rotate your femurs 'in' more / improve mobility overall (your mobility seems good, but maybe you could squeese a little more out if you aren't already limited by your actual hip bone)
3. Descent as slow as you need, but remember, it's about activation, always control the weight, if bounce prevents you from doing it as your set progresses, then don't you bounce, activation above all.
>>34933690
Thank you mr biomech-god
>>34933591
Many factors factor in to this(especially as this is not an olympic lift), that man is by for the one with the highest strength/speed potential in weightlifting. Here is a video of Ilya when he was 17 y/o.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6wu-zeO19Y
>>34933642
Do as you may, but you must consider that getting injured, perhaps seriously, is going to be a major negative impact on your life. Logic can prevent it, your ego causes it.
When squatting, most people like to move their ass back on the ascent to get more power out of the hips. the way I see it, moving your ass back means your knees must travel inwards, travel backwards, or both. But everybody says that your knees should maintain their position for most of the lift.
When I squat heavy my knees shoot as my ass moves back, and I ascend out of the bottom. Would it be preferable to avoid the valgus knee position and instead move them back?
>>34933812
Also, is this an acceptable amount of knee travel?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYeDpZfzEUY
>>34933614
You need to maintain stability and integrity in your hips and core. You will likely need to increase should mobility to do this.
Make sure list:
Lock your glutes (this will rotate your hips to neutral)
lock down your abs, pulling your torso down, so if a were to hold a stick to your spine, it would be completely straight, at a normal angle with respect to the ground.
For your actual push:
Your movement is pretty good, giving advice without seeing you execute them might involve more bad than good.
>>34933852
thanks for the tips. That was a PR lift btw. I'll try to keep myself more tight
>>34933830
Your movement is fucking great bro!
Yes, it is absolutely fine, and near optimal (as it helps you to just avoid rounding your lower back.
If you are interested, here is a tip. You can increase the effective output of your glutes by not overarching your lower back, your spine should be straight from the absolute bottom, to the top. Try standing naked in front of a mirror and flex your glutes till your hips are straight under you. Now you must learn yo brace in that position, if you need help with it, try the link in my other post. Keeping your hips in this position, (and in turn your glutes), puts your hips in a much better position to exert force in the horizontal direction. To feel it if you are unsure, try doing bodyweight squats with your current style, and this new style. Please report your experience if you are able to do it now.
You have even greater potential than your current, and very impressive, stength. Keep doing more volume over time, educate yourself in programming, and you can become world elite, not shitting you.
>>34933950
lol dude this is 70s big, not me.
Justin's excellent though.
>>34933950
Just realized that it most likely isn't you, just completely zoned myself into writing mode -.-.
>>34933961
Haha, yeah, fuck me
>>34933965
Yeah lol
If I can find a quick webm guide I'll post a PR squat set if you want to look at it. I've tried deloading to reduce knee travel, but it always come back for my heavy sets. Good to know that my natural tendency was the right way to go all along.
>>34933989
Yeah, forward knee travel allows you to go deeper and not round the lower back. It isn't safety I'm worried about, it's that fact the a rounded back and transfer force == less strength, and fuck that right?
>>34933950
Despite me being a complete idiot, you guys could apply the same glute/hip trick to yourselves. Almost everyone is slightly off with their hip position, and everyone would benefit from adjusting it.
I will return and begin responding to this thread in 20 minutes, too inefficient to monitor it all the time.
>>34933601
Sorry, completely forgot about you, damn, that sounds bad. Give me a few minutes to type something up. I simply can't be short with it, there are so many things, and i feel so bad when i exclude something. Wishing teleporting was a thing.
>>34933560
>superior understanding of human movement
>fails basic anatomy
the lower back musculature does not lift the weight no matter what your form is. it only keeps the lower back straight and rigid. flexing your spine and then extending it in theory lifts the weight but it's a very small part of the actual lifting done.
DYEL?
>>34934027
yes, fuck that.
Here's the last rep of a PR set. I'm a bit shaky, but it's the end of a tough set.
>>34934382
did u bang that chick
>>34933601
You must learn about your psoas, there are a lot of internet resources for this, which I'll let you explore. Do that before reading further, look at picture and videos, get the basic gist of it's function.
You have to keep your psoas tight during your lift, (and semi tight during everyday activities), it play a HUGE role in transfering the force from your glutes and hamstrings into the bar. Imagine what would happen if your lower back was rounded and you flexed your psoas, look at a picture of it and try to figure it out.
Done that? Good.
It pulls your low back ''in'' or straight or whatever you want to label it. Now that you have learned that, you must learn proper bracing, refer to the video i linked in another post. Do the hip thing mentioned in the other other post, (this is so convenient, thank god).
Once you have MASTERED these skills, you can work you way up with your deadlift. You have to keep your weight low enough so you don't fall into old habits, and you will gain strength very quickly, surpassing your current level and increasing your potential massively. The difference between good, better, best in this game really is movement.
If you are a powerlifting and you want max kilos on the bar, go sumo, the ONLY reason anyone is stronger is sumo is because they are a conventional low back puller, and when they go to sumo they round their back less and use their less trained prime movers.
>>34934406
Nah.
She's squatting in the smith machine and has tiny arms. /fit/'s standards have dropped so much.
>>34934418
>It pulls your low back ''in''
umm, back erectors extend the back. the psoas contribute to it but they are very weak and actively insufficient in most movements. there's no point in trying to extend the back with your psoas.
>>34934382
Pretty good pretty good. I think you might benefit from a little more glute strength, notice how your hamstring are actually pulling your torso upwards. However, it could be you straightening your low back due to a little residual rounding from the bottom, I will let you figure this out yourself. (Also, don't beat yourself, up this is the last rep. You sent it so I analyzed it, but keep in mind that the final rep is no representative of all your reps, and thus this comment carries less meaning)
I would increase knee travel slightly throughout the lift and initiate out of the bottom by flexing the glutes, leading with them. (This takes loading away from the quads and allows you to use more forward knee travel without needing more quad stength) See if it help before you fuck with anything. Also, diagnosis by video is hard, I could be slightly off.
>>34934565
>I think you might benefit from a little more glute strength, notice how your hamstring are actually pulling your torso upwards
what is the function of the glutes
what is the function of the hamstrings
>This takes loading away from the quads and allows you to use more forward knee travel
nope, doesn't work like that.
you can analyze the movements ok but you seriously lack basic anatomy knowledge
>>34934565
I would have figured my glutes were pretty strong for a few of reasons:
1. I have never missed a deadlift above the knee
2. I switched to sumo and was significantly stronger
3. My ass is gigantic.
When you say increase knee travel, you mean shift them further back?
>>34934472
''in'' does not mean extension, no extension is done by it, it shortens the distance between the lower back and the upper thigh. Thus pulling the lower back ''in'' and helping the erectors yes. In non-movement fucked people, what you will see when looking at their back from the bottom up while they sit relaxed and are told to relax, is a straight piece and then the back rounds after that, the straight piece is the part of the spine where the psoas attaches and pulls down (not extending) the lower back. The psoas is absolutely essential for force transfer(the lower back is too, you are completely correct in regards to that).
>>34934593
The force not generated by the glutes in the bottom has to be made up for by something, that something is in nearly every case the quads. Attach arguments.
>>34934617
No, further forward. I should have specified, forward knee travel.
>>34934662
what the hell is extension if not pulling the lower back "in"?
>The psoas is absolutely essential for force transfe
no, that's crossfit bullshit. the psoas comes from such an angle that it has very little moment arm on the back. it basically only performs hip flexion, most sources only say it rotates the spine - which you're not talking about.
>>34934703
if the knees travel forward, the moment arm on the knee joint increases and the quads must do more work. forward travel also decreases the amount of moment arm and angle at the hip joint, decreasing the amount of work the glutes and hamstrings do. especially the hamstrings, since they also slack more at the knee.
Guys, I didn't expect this thread to be this interactive, I'll take my leave for know as this is getting pretty hard for my mediocre typing abilities.
Good night people!
>>34934752
...yeah, that sounds about right with regards to knee travel. I wish he stayed and explained what he was trying to say.
>>34934752
Last reply
I'm not aware of crossfit teachings on the matter.
The moment arm changes proportionally to how bent over you are, most easily visualized via classroom skeleton, or a smaller version of it.
Only true assuming not loadshifting is going on as the movement progresses, the minimum force the quads need to exert increases with forward knee travel, absolutely, but you can compensate for poor hip extension by shifting more weight the the quads. (If you want an extreme example, check you Mark Bell non the less, the dude is an idiot, but his movement is interesting)
Smetimes when I squat, I feel a burn in my shins. Is this bad form or normal?
>>34934825
Please try it.
It is so difficult to convey the concept without being there 1 on 1. Made worse be the fact that it is so hard to know if you are doing the right thing and keeping all the details in mind and so on. See if it works, if it does, great, if it doesn't scrap it and move on.
>>34933278
How do I use my glutes more in my squat? I keep hearing about it and I can't feel them working. The only time I can feel them is at the top just before I finish the rep. Is it just what you said in this post? >>34933950
I do flex them before I descent, but maybe not as much as I should? Here's a video if you don't mind. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiYgIOSNvT8
I know the valgus is noticeable, and the last set is pretty bad overall. These are PR sets though, so they are a bit shaky.
>>34934917
No way to tell from only your symtom, and includes a list of possibilities that extends well beyond the concept of movement.
This was the last post, good night people, for real this time.
>>34934955
Yes
Okay, very very last post, no more sorry if anyone posted anything i didn't respond to.
>>34934322
>lumbar paraspinals only keep the spine rigid
>except this guys spine is not rigid
hence he is hinging at his spine instead of his pelvis to gain a leverage advantage because his posterior chain is not strong enough to lift the weight on its on.. essentially he's raised his "hips" above the level of the pelvis to the point at which the lumbar rounding is occuring - that new hinge point is taking the majority of the load instead
>>34935000
You have brains, very good.
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_B4u9HzVVio
pls do me
this is at 95% so my form deteriorated a bit (butt moving up faster etc)
I think he means that if you don't activate the glutes in the ATG position, you apply less force to the bar and spend more time in the lift, so a larger % of the lift is performed by the quadriceps.
