When did you first realize this body is above the natty limit for 99.9% of lifters?
Subject: Jon Jones
Height: 6'4
Weight: 220 (before cutting weight)
BF %: 11
Adjusted FFMI: 24.7
Sauce: NaturalPhysiques FFMI calculator
Note: If we give him 9% BF instead of 11, he leaps to FFMI 25.4, well above the natty limit of 25.
>professional in a sport
>natty
Pick one
This will never change
>6 4
This is just the lanklet limit, not the natty limit.
>>34886831
The question though is, at what point did you realize that even relatively unimpressive physiques are still unattainable without drugs?
On some level, I always held out hope that even though I'd never look like Arnold (who in turn wouldn't even qualify for a pro card these days), I could at least escape Otter mode. Then one day it hit me that I would never even be as big as a lot of guys who are fairly DYEL by /fit/ standards. Or at least, without juicing my balls off.
Feelsbadman
>>34886843
Well, I'm 6'5 so I guess I'm pretty fucked then.
>>34886787
isnt that thing completely broken for taller people? hafthor (while enhanced) has a ffmi of 35, wich is better than a lot of bb'ers
>>34886896
Give me 0,5 and were both 6'0, it's win-win situation
>>34886787
>UFC
>Natty
Top kek
>>34886787
He'd look a million times better with decent pecs but yea
>>34886906
Is it? I've certainly never heard anything to this effect. In fact, I frequently hear people use it to prove taller people like Simeon Panda can't possibly be natty (not that anyone needs FFMI calcs to figure that fucker out).
I don't know why it would be odd for the Mountain to have a freakishly high FFMI. Everything else about him is freakish.
>>34886951
Again, missing the point completely. Replace Jon Jones with some guy you've never heard of with exactly the same unimpressive physique.
>>34886787
Don't listen to people on fit. They are retarded. Yes a large portion of professional athletes are on steroids. I'm not denying this. To seriously think that 99.9+% are, is stupid. For example, I have a close friend, who is Russian. The guy always looked to be in decent shape. Did things like hitting punching bags in his garage, push-ups, pull-ups, his junior year of high school he did two things, took a weightlifting class, and wrestled. Mostly because I did it and was his friend. This guy literally Olympic style cleaned 265 pounds a month or so after he began lifting. While being about 5'11 170 pounds. He ended up going to state for wrestling, despite having never done it before, and having started the season late. There was also a laungaue barrier and he barely understood the sport. He did track his senior year, shattered our triple jump records, and then got hurt. With a proper program and diet, this kid would look better than most if not all the people that you guys argue about Wether or not they're natty. If this kid had been training since a young age like most pros, I sincerely believe he could be a champion mixed martial artist, in the nfl, or the Olympics. Also super nice guy. Swears he never beats off. Only reason he didn't continue sports, is that his parents are crazy religious and won't let him.
>>34886988
sounds like he won the genetic lottery
>>34886993
I agree, he did. But so did many pro athletes. That's my point haha.
>natty
>big
>lean
Pick two, really. Also 3-4 years natty = 1 year and a few basic test cycles.
I'm 26 and in the best shape of my life, but noob gains are long gone and I realized a while ago that gear is really the only way to progress past a certain point.
Also
>pro athletes
>natty
In your dreams.
>>34886787
Also I'm not sure what you're point is OP.
>hey look it's one of the most, if not the most accomplished athlete in an extremely physical competitive sport
>he's in the top 1% of genetics
>this is weird
Duh? Also you've been ruined by fit. Jon jones looks great, think about how lanky and tall the dude is. To be fair though I'd bet my left nut the guy IS juicing, he snorts Coke and drives away after hitting pregnant people
>>34886988
Again, the point isn't that 99.9% of professional athletes are cheating frauds. The point is that 99.9% of drug free tall fitizens who lift weights and diet religiously will never have a physique as "impressive" as Jon Jones, who most people would agree isn't that impressive.
The lanklet struggle is real. Actually, the struggle is real for all drug free people lifting weights to enhance their physique, even the mighty manlets with their tiny little frames. There comes a point where you suddenly realize "Holy shit, almost everyone I've ever looked at as having a somewhat impressive physique is a cheating fraud. And further, a huge percentage of people with unimpressive physiques are also on steroids."
>>34887014
My point can be found here >>34886985 and here >>34887017
I regret using Jon Jones as an example since my point has NOTHING to do with him being an elite athlete. It would have been better to use some random asshole no one has ever heard of, but I couldn't think of one.
Well, other than say, Vegan Goblin, but then this would quickly turn into yet another VG hate thread.
>>34887046
I see what you mean now. We were arguing different topics it seems. I got fucked with a chest gap personally. Like a really really bad one. I also store a lot of fat on my chest, though I don't think it's actually gyno.
>>34886787
>well above the natty limit of 25.
The 'study' that defined FFMI was poorly performed and even that had examples of FFMIs above 26 in the pre-steroid era
>>34887017
Dude we know we all know. Every day I wake up wondering if I should trade my natty card. I have dreams of beings competitive lifter, but without roids, I will only ever compete seriously at a regional level.
>>34887084
I feel your pain. The genetic lottery has more losers than winners, it seems.
>>34887099
Are you talking about this?
>Similarly, a sample of 20 Mr. America winners from the presteroid era (1939-1959), for whom we estimated the normalized FFMI, had a mean FFMI of 25.4
http://journals.lww.com/cjsportsmed/Abstract/1995/10000/Fat_Free_Mass_Index_in_Users_and_Nonusers_of.3.aspx
This is also tangential to my point but it is worth noting, I suppose.
>>34886787
FFMI doesn't apply to goats
I met Jon Jones at UFC expo in 2010 before he became champ. I'm 6' dead on and unlike half the fighters there (Randy Couture 6'2 aka 5'10 I'm looking at you) he is actually fucking huge. Easy 6'4, more like 6'5 and his arms were ridiculously long. Big black hands too. He put his arms around me for a photo and I accepted I was in the presence of a genetic freak.
>>34886985
i ment when you compare the way he looks to other people with comparable FMI´s. lets say thor cuts, he would be fuckhuge, but not as fuckhuge as other people at his FMI. hes got like 7 points on panda
>>34886787
FFMI is bull, the study that came up with it is also bull and badly designed. They actually disprove their own theory with the pre steroid bodybuilders but they decide to go full retard and compare adjusted FFMIs with the ol bbers raw FFMIs
Also the online calculators have all been copied from one retarded source that uses a wrong equation. The whole reasoning behind the adjusted FFMI is taller people have higher FFMIs anyway. So the adjusted FFMI for this above average height is lower than their actual FFMI
>>34886985
He is ofc on a lot of drugs.
>be a natty lifter
>train for nearly a decade because you enjoy it
>have the body of somebody that trains that long
>everyone claim you're on gear because you look jacked
I'm convinced that some of the people that claim natty and aren't trying to sell me mystery pills may actually be natty and everyone just hates the idea of people being bigger than them.
Lifetime goal is to get big enough that people accuse me of gear.
>>34888016
Good lad
Jones appearance there is due to a weight cut, he weighs 205 or slightly under there, not 220
Boxers don't train you be big aesthetic targets.
