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Blacksmithing thread.
>>973546
Fedora smiting
OPEEE you gotta start it off with something to talk about. Like anvils, favorite hammers/tools, charcoal vs coal. Blacksmiths hate him, 1 neat trick to make your anvils stop fucking ringing so loud you wish you could buy a suppressor for it
how do i even start out blacksmithing? i want to make stuff like arrowheads, nails and maybe some bigger stuff.
>>973706
Soup can forge is the way to go if you just want to make things like arrowheads. You can use a simple hammer bolted to a surface somehow (figure it out) as an anvil. My "anvil" is for ants at the moment but enough until I build a bigger one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClULe1DfsRM Here is an example of a propain powered forge. Bonus: The commentor sounds similar to homer simpson.
That is the cheapst way imho. What you might want to do is to do the inlet for gas a bit steeper, like a slope, maybe that would help with spreading the heat. Never tried that though.
AND how do I get my anvil to stop ringing? Somebody once told me that bitumen is the way to go about that, place it under the anvil (!!) and cut it away at the sides. Said to work wonders...I doubt it. And whats up with them magnets...
>>973546
There are something like three other threads about it.
I have an old outdoor brick oven barbecue, would I be able to use it as a proper forge?
>>974102
Solid fuel is better, fuck propane.
>>974104
oh well it looks pretty similar to this
>>973713
thanks
>>973713
Soup can forges are shit. You can't heat up much material, they won't heat up quickly or hot enough, and they are incredibly wasteful since there isn't enough space for the propane to properly mix with oxygen.
A solid fuel forge using something like charcoal is much easier to build and is much easier and safer to use.
In my opinion coal and charcoal give much better results than propane unless you're doin production work.
What type of mould can withstand zinc, but is able to be formed from a liquid base?
I want to make a zinc statuette using lost wax casting.
>>974408
Clay slip. Just drunk your way in the slip and let each layer dry before you redip it. When you have an appreciable amount of clay you can melt the wax out and pour in the zinc
>>974410
Thats what I was thinking of doing, I was just hoping there was a one pour material because it would reduce the risk of the the wax breaking
>>974408
> zinc
its almost like you're TRYING to give yourself metal fume fever.
get some pewter, you bloody idiot.
>>974417
>Don't play around with that dangerous zinc!
>Here, play with this lead alloy!
Trying to go about taking an old file and making it into a knife. However all the tutorials I find are the usual "use power tools to shape it into whatever you want." kinda thing. Where as I want to actually try to hammer this stuff into shape, do it the old fashioned way.
Anyone know any good tutorials on stuff like that?
>>974420
You can get lead-free pewters, you know.
Also, lead doesn't put off enough fumes to kill a horse.
>>974612
>file
Meme-tier. You'd be best off buying a blank of metal of known composition for making a knife. O-series tool steel isn't expensive, and you know exactly what to do to harden and temper it.
>>974710
This.
It' hard to make an optimal product if you don't know what steel you're working with.
Steel isn't very expensive either, and you will gain more experience if you work from a blank.
>>973713
The best way to get your anvil to stop ringing is to mount it properly and solidly so that you can't move it without moving the base. It will go from a ting ting noise to something like thunk thunk. What the magnets do is absorb the vibration as it spreads through the anvil. Ultimately you are wasting energy, properly mounting it will put the energy into the metal you are working as opposed to turning into fucking earsplitting ringing noises.
>>974406
I found it way easier to build the propane forge, and it's easier on the neighbors who would have to deal with the charcoal fumes and shit.
Those things smoke worse than old trains. I haven't gotten by to build the brake drum forge yet, but I doubt I'll be too happy, since my neighbors will be pretty similar to smoked salmon afterwards: Salty.
>>974710
You would have made a shit smith back in the day. Where is your sense of adventure? No omelettes without broken eggs. If a bad heat treat breaks your heart that bad get a new hobby. Buy nice steel for special projects, practice on scrap.
>>974612
You can't learn forging without swinging a hammer. Its not a casual, one time thing. You have to feel it to know. Practice making your desired shape with some mild steel, then do the same on your file (you will have to work harder on the high carbon but the technique is the same). There isn't an easy mode, sorry. Not saying don't read/watch videos. Just don't try work the file until you have practiced on something else.
>>974949
>>974710
Sweet thanks, I'm not looking for an easy way at all, in fact I'm looking for something to sink time into and get better at, which is why I wanted to avoid power tools. I'm looking to pick up a craft to master not just cutting out a knife shape with an angle grinder and using a belt sander to sharpen it.
>>974612
Tip 1: Practice hammering on some dirty bit of steel you have no plans to make anything with, a chunk of rebar, some bit of flatbar, whatever you find in a bin. Get some practice making your hammer blows flat and consistent so you dont fill your knives with huge crescent moon shaped marks.
Tip 2: Try hammering in single strikes, as in hit the steel and then check what the blow looks like. If you see and crescent shapes, angle your hammer the other way. Once right is worth 10 times wrong, you may take ages getting anything done but always try to learn good practices.
Tip 3: Something of an uncommon opinion, but files, chisels, random bits of spring are fine to make knives out of AS LONG as you are fully aware that they are only for practice. You will make suboptimal knives, but you are not going to be making amazing knives anyway. Second hand files are dirt cheap if theres a market nearby and if you melt the steel because you forgot it in the fire, or crack it because you worked it too cold, or the gods randomly decide "Fuck this guy" and things go wrong you have lost almost nothing but gained plenty of experience.
Tip 4: Find a knife you want to copy. Then copy it until you are sick of it, then copy it more. If you can't make identical knives then you still need more practice. Fight the part of you that want to say "Oh that'll do, it's close enough, 25mm shorter than the plans is good enough".
>>975055
Fantastic, you have the right attitude. Smithing is glorious, super satisfying. If you aren't on a dedicated smithing forum I would recommend it highly. It specialized so the odds of getting detailed info here aren't great, it happens though. I have an old file kicking around that's about 2x16x.25 inches that I'm brainstorming what to make into. My favorite file knives are ones that preserve some teeth, you should look into that. Best of luck man.
>>975109
Also, listen to this guy, he is right on all accounts.
>>975127
>>975109
Awesome, thanks again for the advice. I just grabbed a copy of "New edge of the Anvil" and "practical Blacksmithing and Metalworking: second edition" that I'm gonna crack open tonight. I'll take your advice and find some old stuff to practice on first.
Any suggestions for good smithing forums?
>>974948
Hmmm...you have a point there, especially the "Fuck the neighbors" part.
It would be easier if I could just place my forge in the forest my family owns, but its all peat land, and peat fire sucks.
Well I'm almost finished with my first pair of tongs, got the grips too short but I hope its better than the piece of shit I'm using as tongs right now...
FUUUUUUUUUUUCK.
I just forged some tongs, been working on them two days, and now the hole that holds the two pieces together ripped.
At least I can do this from normal steel now, I only had rebars to use...
Feelspepeman.jpg
>>975442
Don't feel bad, i waisted a whole day making half a pair backwards.
>>973546
alright I got a question for any of you who might be able to answer.
I have a piece of steel thats 2mm thick and about 4.5mm wide at the tip. its a custom wood chisel that I need for carving reliefs in scabbard work. I've got my shape down. but im curious how I should heat threat it, as its very thin and I don't want to melt it, Its so thin that I don't even have the main bevel on it in fears of burning the end of it during heat threat. I don't have a gas torch but I've got plenty of hardwood charcoal, and a tuyere to go along with it, and plenty of red bricks to create a small pit for heat treating, just wondering how not to burn the piece? should I just go really slow and watch the color carefully? or should I find a way to clamp it onto a larger slab of steel and use it as a heat sink to easier get it to temperature?
>>977050
Just build a fire and set it on top so you can see the entire thing. It only needs to be dull red so just watch till it's that color or use a torch.
>>974946
The only reason "smiths back in the day" used shitty scrap steel is because steel was expressive. That isn't the case anymore. A bar of O2 tool steel, enough to make a couple of knives, is only a couple of bucks at most. And if you don't know the exact composition of your knife, you're probably going to end up with a shitty knife.
Not to mention that a shitty old rusty file probably has a shit ton of micro fractures running through, which will guarantee it either shattering on hardening, or shattering on use.
>>973546
This is a $40 set up less the anvil, 152lb Trenton from the 20's
>>977357
That cheap steel is still more than scrap. Why are you so uptight anyway? I said practice on scrap and pay for something good when you are ready. Are you a steel vendor or something? Also, the heat treat gamble kinda excites me.
>>977357
Not to mention your absurd claim that every knife made before modern times is shit. Seriously think of how ridiculous you are being.
Any help for this
>>977811
Pic related is the smallest furnace I built yet. It's just a practical joke I built within an hour of some scrap parts I had left over. The middle part is a stainless steel espresso machine sieve (the kind you put on the stove, like bialetti makes). It's built into Ytong-Stone which I carved out accordingly. The whole thing rests on aluminium profiles which were attached with nails and carefully tapped into the ytong.
What you can see inside is the remains of burnt hard charcoal, I found out I still have a lot of it in my cellar (in loose form), and some of it in bricett form. I was astonished to see that it semi kinda eventually worked out. I'll try to forge something small in it just for fun...I think it's the ideal size for forged paperclips.
Also building a charcoal forge from Ytong, I think of lining it with Shamott and refactory cement. That should work out, no? Not the biggest furnace either but it doesn't have to be.
>>976983
I just hate when I work hard and then fuck it up in the end. Went inside while throwing an autistic fit of rage over my own stupor...
>>977617
Is that a break drum forge? Looks similar to one. I am considering to build one myself, but I have this giant oil barrel which I will probably line with kaowool and refractory cement.
Whats the cheapest alternative to a decent anvil?
I know cast anvils are garbage and a decent anvil is hundreds of dollars.
So what's a good alternative I can use?
>>978162
Some people say a grinded piece of railroad track. I'll tackle that project when I have the time for it.
At the moment I just use a big cubic hammer in a bench vice. Looks stupid, but works rather well.
Can this thing be used as a forge?
>>978477
If it was a lead ofen I'd be careful because lead poisoning and such. On the other hand it does look sturdy enough.
On a completely unrelated topic, I've been watching colinfurze videos on turbojet engines and had the idea that maybe modifying one into a furnace could actually work. Any thoughts on that?
tl;dr: I need an excuse to build a turbojet engine.
Op here, I'm working on a foundry and i want to know if white clay and rfine river sand will work for the inside walls?
>>979230
I know that soup can forges are made of plaster of paris and fine sand. Works out ok. Real refactory cement would be nicer though.
I bought shamott stone and heat resistant cement today for my personal foundry though.
>>979230
Your not op usurper
Watching Man at Arms on youtube has made me want to forge a sword.
Im 100% sure Im going to accidentally cremate myself.
Might be a dumb question, but I have no experience in this. Wanted to try making a knife (or three) out of an old farm implement that is completely beyond salvation, but holds sentimental value to my family being as it was the first thing grandpa bought. I tried heating a piece of it up and hammering it flat/thin enough that I could grind it into a knife in a homemade propane forge based off the coffee can forges on YouTube, but it still stayed very very solid, and apart from burning my hand and ruining a good pair of visegrips, I just put a few dents in it.
I'm now thinking about trying make a real forge out of an old coffee can lined with plaster and sand like the propane one, but don't know what to run through it. Will charcoal briquettes work?
I have lots of material, it's an old plow and I'm using the blades, but apart from watching a few Chandler Dickinson videos have no idea where to start.
Thanks in advance for any help.
>>978162
You are going to be tempted by railroad track, just know that it does not have much mass compared to a real anvil. I have a small anvil as far as smithing goes and it is 140 pounds. That is a long rail. Anvils are heavy on purpose, and made a certain way. Try to get one as soon as you can, it will make working your metal much more enjoyable. Don't get discouraged when your makeshift anvil substitute bounces around and makes you bust your nuts to get anything done. Its worth the money.
>>979510
Also unrelated, but my neighbor bought an old anvil at an auction this morning as part of a lot he wanted, he plans on scrapping it with some other junk from the lot cause he only wanted the welder.
It breaks my heart seeing something like that, and I am pretty sure he would sell it to me if I asked. Problem is I already mentioned to him how anvils can be pretty valuable, so I can't just offer him $50 for it now. What would a low-fair price be for a roughly 300 pound anvil be?
>>979516
Honestly, $300 is still a really good price for a 300lb anvil, if it's in a good condition and steel.
http://www.anvilfire.com/article.php?bodyName=/FAQs/anvil-2.htm
>>977826
This picture gave me black lung
>>979516
If he is scrapping it anything better than scrap price is a win for him. 300 is a good price for that size if you want to pay it, do you know the make? If its a good one like a Peter wright or Hay Budden that would be a steal. It should be marked on one side. If it says 3 0 0 spaced out its even bigger than you think. Look up the hundredweight system. Check if its swaybacked or cracked. If it rings your in good shape, if it doesn't you could still be ok. Get it even if you don't need it, someone will pay more for it.
>>979516
Scrap is down to shit so scrapping an anvil is the least profitable way to sell one.
I just got all of $64.50 for a complete Chevy Lumina I brought to the crusher. China isn't buying much scrap right now.
>>979559
I told him not to scrap it because it's valuable, I can't just offer him scrap prices now. I looked it over and didn't see any print on it, so I have no idea who made it, but it seems to be in good shape except the tip of the pointed part is welded like it broke off and was repaired. Has a considerable amount of surface rust, but no pitting that I could see.
Does $250 sound too low? I don't do any blacksmithing but it would be nice to have if it didn't break the bank.
>>979630
Would you be upset about receiving 250 dollars for a large chunk of iron? I would recommend trying to identify it before purchase. Don't see many anvil shaped objects that large so its likely legit but I would make sure. Any way to post a pic? I could give a moderately informed opinion. Try cleaning the sides up a bit with a wire brush if you can. Any markings would help.
>>979514
Wouldn't you be able to make up for the bouncing by placing it onto a sturdy piece of wood and placing that wood in a bucked filled with fine sand?
I read somewhere that some people also do this with regular anvils, for it greatly decreases loudness since some of the shock or something is absorbed by the sand.
>>979951
You should certainly mount it well, it just won't be as stable as a larger, monolithic chunk of iron. I have mine on a piece of oak weighing around 70 pounds or so. I have rubber cut from old tires under the corners and its firmly nailed down. Its still rings loudly. Wrapping chain around the anvil waist helps a lot though, if noise is a concern. Also, you don't really want the shock absorbed much, the rebound from the anvil actually does a lot of the work for you. If you have a good one the hammer will bounce back and make your life a lot easier. This doesn't happen with pieces of rail.
>>980183
Well as it is at the moment I only have a piece of rail, a friend of mine will CNC it to it has a flat surface, correct form, etc.
Finished my diy charcoal furnace build too, it's just steel pipe, an old american gas grill and firebrick. I think it'll work out fine but could not try yet today.
Really though I need a workshop somewhere. Can't keep doing this in the garden all the time. I can't do any blacksmithing when it's raining and that sucks. But halls are so expensive...
>>980547
Do what you have to, just know it gets better. Charcoal is awesome. I built a similar forge, grill and pipe and refractory. Works great. What are you using for air?
>>980611
Hairdryer. It's old and beat up and won't shut off even when you switch it off. The switches on it do nothing. Basically plug and pray you don't get eletrocuted.
The airflow is a bit strong though. Had sparks flying everywhere today. But in principle it works and is way more versatile than a propane powered forge (been having a hard time sourcing parts for propain accessoirs here in Germany, I need very specific parts that I couldn't find in any hardware store here).
Also need some way to get rid of the smoke when starting it up.
>>981066
That's a start, definitively look into a more controllable blower. I use a hand crank blower. I also dislike propane. Its purpose is convenience, which is basically anathema to the whole art of blacksmithing in my opinion. I wonder if you can find one in Germany easily? I didn't have to pay much for mine, and its a neat piece of equipment. Good exercise and amazing air control. I just see it as a labor of love.
>>981066
Oh yeah, being in Germany you have much better odds of finding a continental pattern anvil. Nothing wrong with London or colonial, but those German anvils are really sexy.
>>981292
Well I'm considering to build a ghettorair(tm). Something similar to this construct, but more sturdy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFf10wdYW70
yh...I'm a lazyman.
>>981295
Have neither the time or the space for such a big anvil. Best thing is my mother said once we have one in the barn somewhere, under a pile of useless crap. But how get the heavy anvil out of the barn? First I have to search and find it anyways, no time for that.
Uncle had his anvil mounted in a big log then went ahead and surrounded the base in sand (had some boards making a fence around it and filled that in)
>>981559
I set mine on a giant oak stump and wrapped it up in about a mile of tow chain.
>>981555
With all due respect, if you can't be assed to drag a free anvil out of a barn, perhaps you chose a hobby that doesn't suit you...
>>981794
Nah I'm just having a lot of exams right now. I'll find the anvil once all this blows over.
I just have no idea how to drag it out, but I'll find a solution when the time comes.
>>979514
Thanks for the advice. I'm a little poor right now and also very new to the craft so as interesting as it seems I can't say for sure I will love it or not. So I can't exactly go out and blow over $100 on an anvil right now.
I managed to track down a decent sized piece of track, my only issue right now is does anyone have any good tips on how to grind the surface nice and flat? Unfortunately I only have access to a angle grinder.
>>982249
Also what would people suggest I mount the railroad anvil to? I could try to find a log to nail it to. Or someone mentioned the post in a bucket of sand? I'm not quite sure what is best.
>>981555
>Something similar to this construct, but more sturdy:
Get the compressor side off an old truck turbo, electric motor with some kind of pulley-belt drive to start it spinning and that'll push a lot of air.
>>982253
you rich enough to afford a few bags concrete?..
basically you get a concrete tube or build your own frame with plywood and sink your rail road track 1/2 of itself down into the wet concrete. when everything sets off and cures in a few days. you can easily have turned a 40lb piece of track into 200-300lb+ surely it will keep it from walking around on you.
also you can mount some casters to the bottom of. just if you do. get some high quality casters that lock really good. or the ones that raise a lower so when you don't need it to roll the casters pop up and let it sit on the ground.
>>982298
actually I work at a reuse and recycle warehouse, its where I got the track, I think there's a bag of concrete mix there, I can check when I go in on Saturday.
>>982301
yeah basically anything to add more mass, will improve your track anvil.
I have a friend with a 200lb 2" piece of steel from something, that he has cast into concrete, and works very well..
>>982019
That's the spirit. Any idea how heavy it is?
>>974408
Practically anything since zinc melts at a ridiculously low temp
Clay is good though, enjoy the toxic fumes
>>982350
I don't even know how it looks like. Just started the barn because I had my seccond last exam today and it's weekend, but so far I only found an old wooden waggon, an old hand-cranked grinding weel (note to self: add motor), and a weird thing which you could use to jack a car...but it's been made way before cars.
So far no luck with finding the anvil. I'm starting to suspect that my mother told me that just so I clean out the barn >.>
I really hope she did not mean this....
>>973546
What's the best anvil to get? Right now I'm using a railroad tie and I feel I'm ready to upgrade to a nice Anvil.
>>975442
I tried making tongs and when I tried to punch the holes the punch's just fucking bent from the heat. Do I just need better punches or what?
>>982622
Check out the channel "workingwithiron" on youtube.
You can always try the "let it cool and drill a hole" method...ugly, but guranteed to work:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_H4h79Sflik
Swallow Forge has the original process that includes keeping the metal hot:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dUu9RN1PDQ
As I said mine were too thin and ripped out, which sucked because now I'm stuck with a pair of electricians pliers.
Will do some smithing when the weather is good again ... I need a hut/carport of sorts, so I can smith while raining.
>>982622
not if you have decent drill...
but I guess punch is quicker when you have metal already hot
So I just did an experiment with a primitive, hole-in-the-ground forge, using charcoal I made myself. I was able to get the 3/4" round stock I was using the get red hot.
>>982652
This was my setup: a hole I dug in my yard about 16"x16"x8"(depth), charcoal I made from various logs and branches in my yard, a metal pipe for blowing air, and an old wok to insulate since it was windy.
Awesome. I have to try this some day.
>>982639
I just prefer the "blacksmith" way I could always drill a hole but that's just machining to me.
>>982657
Probably would work out better if you'd align the hole with firebricks
>>982659
For sure, the point was really to see just how mare bones I could go and still have it work. It was hard to actually get a lot of shaping done because of how labor intensive the heating process was, but, I proved that I could get hot enough temps to work a thick piece of steel with nothing more than a hole in the ground.
>>982659
I mean, if I was gonna fix ANYTHING if replace my shitty 50lb harbor freight anvil FIRST.
>>982664
Oh yeah. Didn't notice that was searching for my anvil. Mother said she'll show me where she's seen it yesterday.
Apparently only was used for farmers tools ... but if it has a plane surface, I'm more than happy. Still gonna do the railroad track anvil though when I finally get my ass to the machine shop where friendly person I know works at.
>>982695
Could not find the anvil but found an old axe. Currently treating it against the Rust. It has a heart stamp in it and an interesting Form for an axe of those times. I think i'll use it as sample to make a similar one.
>>983121
Beautiful find, looks custom made
Its still in great shape and easily restorable.
Look into Apple cider vinegar rust removal, and at least invest a cheep wire wheel, it'll look like new in no time
>>983121
Interesting, did a bit of looking around and that's quite an old axe...
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/today-s-finds/272341-update-clean-pics-colonial-british-square-poll-camp-axe.html
Possibly its English made from about the late 1700's-early 1800s or so, but you'd have to get a museum to tell you much more.
>>983318
I've soaked it in vinegar solution for a day and am currently brushing and polishing it. I'll give it a new handle. No finding oft the anvil yet and father is at a loss since it should be there...
Probably the axe is custom made, since my ancestord were farmers in rather good standing (our house is in the Hill where the castle used to be).
>>983330
Hmm, the heart shape does not seem to have the MF stamp. Also the shape of the part where the handle goes is different.
Though it might be possible that an English axe found its way down to southern Germany I doubt it. My best bet is it's custom made, like all the other tools we have. I wonder who was the blacksmith here back in the days.
Working on building a forge, but all I have is galvanized pipe, could I build a fire out in the back and effectively burn of the zinc so that I don't kill myself, or do I need to buy all new pipe?
Anyone here work bronze or similar base metals? Im going to build some bag bellows and smelt/cast/forge copper/tin/bronze this summer, basically ancient africa style
Any tips for alloying? Still not sure if i should be using a flux or not...
>>973706
On ebay you can get a cd archive of rare and out of print books on smithing as well as anthing else
>>983622
If you are so poor that its an acceptable risk, then go for it. Good luck.
>>973546
I just tried blacksmithing with my friend for the first time yesterday, it was fun and a lot easier than I thought.
Does anyone know anything about foundry work? We were thinking to start a process where I build my own foundry, take random shit scrap steel, melt it all down and add carbon and whatever else to it to make it better steel, and pour it out in bars, then give them to him to make stuff by blacksmithing.
>>983811
It's not that I'm poor, I just don't want to buy new shit if I can make the shit I have work. It makes sense to me that their is a finite amount of zinc, so given enough heat and time I should be able to simply burn it all off. I just don't know enough about the topic to know if throwing it in a fire before I leave for work is enough, or if I would be time, money, and safety ahead to just buy new pipe and find something else to use what I have on.
>>983837
Is not that easy to make better steel, different, maybe, better is hard, you need to know ehat steel you are melting to know what steel you are producing. Im a manager at a foundry shop and
Is hard as fuck to control the chemistry in the melts,
>>983920
How can you find out what steel you have? If someone just handed you a random, unrecognizable chunk of rusty steel, what steps would you take to determine what alloy it was, and how much carbon it had? What tools would you need?
>>983973
> If someone just handed you a random, unrecognizable chunk of rusty steel, what steps would you take to determine what alloy it was, and how much carbon it had? What tools would you need?
Accurately? you'd need a chemical analysis setup. for steel, generally, grind clean, and then an XRF analysis scanner will get an accurate composition.
Unfortunately, an XRF gun costs about $8-10,000 currently. Price is dropping slowly, you might find one for $5000 in some places.
You can grind clear, and put it to a wheel, to get a rough estimate of carbon content by the colour and shape of the spark. but that is no way an accurate test, and its really only of use if you have an accurate understanding of metallurgy already.
The best way to know what a "random unrecognizable chunk of rusty steel's" composition is, quite simply, is to sell it as scrap, and then use the money from the sold scrap to buy steel you know the composition of, from a supplier. that's it.
>>983837
>Does anyone know anything about foundry work? We were thinking to start a process where I build my own foundry, take random shit scrap steel, melt it all down and add carbon and whatever else to it to make it better steel, and pour it out in bars, then give them to him to make stuff by blacksmithing.
If you have tens of thousands invested in electric arc kilns, oxygen-shielded smelters, industrial scale additive processes, you can. In your backyard with a DIY gas furnace, you might as well try making a working Saturn V rocket out of old drinks cans and a boxfull of hand tools. Even if you do, cast ingots are utterly useless for blacksmithing.
First knife i ever made, just used an old carbon steel line pin. Not sure what steel exactly but it had long bursting sparks and it hardened considerably when i quenched it.
Used an oxy-acetylene setup and a rosebud to heat it for the quench, but i never tempered it.
Also the tang is burnt into the handle, no epoxy or anything, stuck in extremely firm.
I'll do better next time.
>>983477
Hey man there's another thread where we're talking about axes and restoring them, want to come over and share your pics?
>>983914
Yeah its doable, but you really don't want to fuck up. I wouldn't do it in town for sure, and you can't do something stupid like trying to adjust the fire after it is started. As long as you are cool with that go for it, I get not wanting to buy something you already have. Be fucking careful though. I wouldn't do it personally. I breath in enough shit at work.
>>983622
just buy black pipe for like the parts that come within about 2 feet within your flame. the rest you can use your galvanized pipe if you need more then that. trust me, feeling sick all day because you were trying to burn paint off of something that was also galvanized is no fucking fun.
>>984334
This is what I ended up doing. Had some old black pipe at work that they were throwing out, so I grabbed it real quick and threw it in the truck.
Now I just need find something better than a bowl lined with plaster and sand and I will be all set.
>>983998
Ok. I guess I should have expected an answer like that. I was hoping there'd be an easy trick of some sort, my friend had mentioned just looking at the sparks.
>just purchase steel from a supplier
I know that would be the smart way, but I want to get really good at using the scrap I find. There's kind of a prepping element to this as well, my friend and I who are doing this want to be able to make good quality steel goods out available scrap to use and barter in the event of an economic crash or whatever.
>melting, adding carbon, and casting ingots takes thousands of dollars of equipment
...you sure? How did they used to do it before that equipment was available? And what about that little period in China when literally every poor Chinese family had a small blast furnace in their backyard?
My friend is working on a setup like pic related. Will that not do the job?
>cast ingots are useless for blacksmithing
I was more thinking of casting long, flat bars, because that seems to be what he uses more, but either way, why? Steel can be heated up and hammered into a different shape regardless of what shape it starts in.
>>984532
>my friend had mentioned just looking at the sparks.
a spark test can give a hint - it'll let you tell a carbon steel from mild, or manganese steel from wrought. It'll never let you tell if is a 1060, or a 5160 steel, or the likes, however. At best, its just a hint. And it takes a lot of practice to know.
> Will that not do the job?
No. not even close to it.
I honestly dont know where to begin, I'm sorry, but your knowledge of what the subject is, is so deficient that you simply don't understand the magnitude of the complexity. I don't mean this in a nasty way, but its the classic Dunning-Kreuger effect - the person who barely knows anything about a subject assuming its far easier than it is.
let me try to explain in layman's terms.
At no point did "every poor chinese family" have a blast furnace. They were complex structures with hundreds of employees, manufacturing industrial equipment. Read the wikipedia page, for a start:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blast_furnace
The result of those is cast iron. 5-6% carbon solution iron. That stuff can not be forged. you will not, in any way, be able to cast steel. it takes a temperature vastly higher than that you can produce in a home-made bucket, and even if you do, at that point it starts instantly reacting with oxygen in the atmosphere and will end up with horrific inclusions, impurity, and in all likelihood, attempting to cast it will resut in injury. Forging accidents hut. Casting accidents MAIM. I know a guy who had a splash of steel go down the back of his boot in a foundry accident. He no longer has an Achilles tendon.
Even if you can produce a steel billet, it has a crystalline structure that is pretty much akin to something like plaster of paris. it'll simply break.To make it usable, it has to be forged out, stretchingand elongating the grain structure into long filaments like wood grain. That's a process that requires rolling mills that pump out 50,000 pounds per square inch of pressure. See pic:
>>984321
Maybe. I don't have a handle for it yet.
>>973546
1st attempt at casting aluminum from scrap
>>984575
shit forgot pic
>>984547
Well, thanks for taking the time to redpill me a little.
Small backyard furnaces are pretty well documented to have been in wide use in China in the late '50s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backyard_furnace They were largely unsuccessful, but that seems to be a problem of people using them wrong.
And how did they roll out steel before all that equipment? People were making passable tool and knife steel in the Middle Ages. How did they do it?
Like I said, I'm trying to get some prepper tier self sufficiently skills. Ideally, I want to make my own charcoal, and use it in furnaces and forges to create steel goods out of scavenged scrap.
If y'all had to take a guess, how much money do you think youve put into this hobby?
I was the guy who posted the broken knife. i had made that at the technical center i go to, dont have tools of my own at the moment cause im saving money up and focusing on learning a trade then moving on from there.
>>984578
Cool, why did you post it in a blacksmithing thread though?
>>984801
Probably about 700 to start, anvil, hand crank blower, forge, few hammers and tongs. Lot cheaper if you improv the anvil, I just decided it was worth it after taking a class. Champion 400 blower sexy as fuck though, it's just relaxing hearing it whir away.
>>984845
Dollars, btw
>>982656
I pretty much done this exact same thing with a pump to blow up a bouncy castle
>>983468
Can't wait to see it restored
>>984623
A furnace ain't the same as a blast furnace, sunshine
Guy asking about railroad track anvil earlier. Somehow I managed to find 3 pieces of railroad track.
Now i have a question. If I wanted to make my working surface bigger, could I grind the anvils down flat, bevel them and then weld them together to make one larger anvil out of them?
I know it can be done, but my question is how would that affect the quality of them as an anvil? Would the filler metal from the weld ruin it? Since I know that railroad track is desirable due to the carbon content of the metal, it makes a semi decent makeshift anvil in terms of how much "bounce" the metal has when you strike it. I'm wondering if the filler metal would be too shitty ruining it. Also not having the entire surface be one type of metal, as the points where the welds were would be different.
So I ask, good idea or not?
>>973546
Anyone here know where I could find some large crucibles for casting? Not blacksmithing but its pretty related
I want to echo >>984951
I'm going to be building a small arc furnace soon, and will also be needing crucibles...
What does everyone think of my anvil. Made it out of rail road tank
>>978422
>>984972
I was under the impression that you should use the other side of the track, that the bottom, wider part of the track wasn't thick enough.
>>984974
The centers of the top and bottom are the same thickness. Obviously the outer edges are thinner. But honesty I use this for shoeing horses.
>>984940
At least read the link before you bitch.
>These small steel blast furnaces were constructed in the backyards of the communes, hence their names.
>>984972
Looking good. Did you weld two steel pipes to a brakedrum there? How does it sound? I could imagine it being quite loud with this setup.
So does anybody have an idea for a fume extractor, or any knowledge on them?
I'm thinking of building a big blade and installing it into a piece of oil drum I have around. Add electronic motor to it and it should work out. I'm not sure on the dimensions of the chamber or the filter material I might want to use though.
Sure I could also not give a fuck about the smoke but I'd rather fuck my neighbors gently with the nice sound my makeshift anvil makes rather than hard with a living room full of smoke.
A quick search yielded not many useful results, most of them were for welding or soldering and frankly, too small.
>>985254
Btw, my new pair of tongs is coming up nicely. Still doing it on the Propain furnace, but hopefully I can use my charcoal furnace sooner or later, when I found a way to not smell like a smoked fish after working with it.
>>985131
I welded pipes to a old car rotary disc. It's not as bad as you'd think. The vibrations go all the way through and level out into the ground. I can definitely tell a difference using it in the grass, dirt, or a concrete top.
>>985162
My anvil works fine for what I use it for. Maybe when I get serious about blacksmithing I will get a serious anvil
>>982622
You're supposed to cool the punch between hits on the hot steel
>>983622
dunk it in vinegar for 2 days, or in muriatic acid for about 5 minutes
>>984949
Welding is a process that is used to quickly melt together two metals. Steel is welded at 5600 fahrenheit, this would mess with the temper of the steel making it brittle after welding. At least wherever the welds are done.
But, if it is made out of a railroad track, I am guessing you wouldn't mind cracking it.
>>985658
Yeah I'm not too worried if it breaks on me. I was just looking to get a bigger surface area than just the single rail track while keeping the, I'm not sure the term for it, but bounce or spring of the metal since I know cast anvils have none and are considered shit anvils due to that. Where as rail tracks have enough that they don't make complete crap makeshift anvils.
>>985745
I hope you have steel protected shoes...Wouldn't want a piece of railroad track, whichever shape, to fall on me feet.
I did some blacksmithing for an hour or so again today on my tongs, and am quite pleased. I have to do some work on them though, the pining process which I fear the most will be done tomorrow.
Also some work must be done on the grip. One can see that it is work by an amateur, but I don't care. I just want working tongs with a long grip so I don't have to burn myself.
Once I have this pair done, I'll do another one for the guy who CNC's my anvil. Railroad track works out fine I found out today, the thing isn't even flat yet, really, but it works out for starting. It's starting to grow on me.
Basically all I did is take a railroad track and get the shape of the anvil with an angle grinder, then loosely put it onto a piece of wood. This allows the anvil to bounce a bit, and reduces noise imho. The rebound still is strong enough to help when hitting a hot piece of steel with a hammer.
Also I had some time today to think of a solution to my smoke problem, I think I'll just build a big bong, basically. Smokes goes in, driven by a fan, through a cooling coil with ends in water.
And hopefully it cools off enough never to annoy anybody again. Might work, might not. I wonder if this might actually work out.
>>973713
I built something similar to a soup can forge, what the best way to put out the charcoal? Don't want to slap water on it, but also don't really want to have to watch it for an hour to not burn something.
Side note, I need to join two pieces of aluminum, essentially a lid and matching box. It contains small electronics so I need to be able to open it to replace the battery, but also strong enough to stay in. I feel like basic screws would just tear it apart after taking them in and out once or twice.
>>985807
Maybe you can add a lid of sorts for the air entry vent and the main hole. Then you can seal off it's air supply and it should not be a problem, the charcoal will not be able to continue burning once all the oxygen is used up and the seal provides protection from any sparks leaving it.
Do you have any pics of your furnace?
>>985819
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHD10DjxM1g
followed this and it turned out well. I definitely could toss a brick on the top hole and in theory could slap something on the side air vent but idk what would work well for that
>>985825
Same lid as he has, but with no hole in the middle. For the side door, get creative. Firebrick?
A custom lathed piece of whatever?
Working on making a forge, but don't know how.
I'm planning on making it out of a milk can cut in half, but I am unsure that it is thick enough. How thick do my walls need to be? Trying to cheap it as cheap as possible, and I have a milk can, but I am not opposed to spending a little more if need be.
>>985893
How thick is the wall of your milk can, what material is it made of?
>>985900
Haven't cut it yet, but 1/8" stainless approximately
>>985957
Doesn't really matter as long as it's not galvanized. You should be lining it with some kind of refractory material anyway, so long as you use enough it should hold up fine. I made my own with clay, mortar and perlite. Works well and has been plenty durable so far. There are lots of options, Google is your friend.
>>985893
I got some old brake drums from a mechanic for free, see if you can do that as well
>>985900
>>985968
>>985994
Change of plans. Found this beauty in the trash on the way home. Took the top off and it looks about perfect. What is my next step?
Hard mode, I would like to use it as a fireplace still if at all possible, can I just line it with fire brick and call it good enough?
>>986025
Pic related is what I was thinking. Except I would fill the void with sand or dirt or something.
>>986038
Forgot pic.
This should work quite well. Try it.
>>986170
Glad to hear that. Picked up a bag of charcoal to try play with since its impossible to find coal within 3 hours of me, so I hope it works until I can get some real coal.
Gonna find out tomorrow.
could one practice blacksmithing on aluminum? Hammering it and such like you would iron?
Would love to start but it would be much easier to begin this way.
Plus it requires much lower temperatures, making it easier on my forge capabilities.
>>986189
No. Aluminum doesn't work the way iron does, it work hardens like a bitch, so you'd have to anneal it after every couple strikes, has a melting point lower than it's glowing point, and you'd turn it all into aluminum oxide after a short while unless you did the whole process under inert atmosphere, including the hammering part.
>>986206
Ah, okay. Thank you. How would you suggest getting started then?
>>986189
Nah, aluminum is a complete bitch to work with. Past a certain temperature it just turns into a liquid mess without any warning and without changing color.
>>985072
Sorrynotsorry
>>986221
It was also found that too much aluminum dust, be it inhaled or as medication against heartburn, will greatly increase the chances of getting dementia and other neurodegenerative diseases such as Alzheimer.
>>986249
Correlation =/= Causation you pompous ass.
>>986510
>Just because I snorted a line of asbestos and got cancer doesn't mean snorting asbestos causes cancer
Take risks if you want to, but if breathing in aluminum dust has a link to Alzheimer's, however flimsy, and I can avoid breathing in aluminum dust, I am going to do so.
>>973546
I'm not exactly a blacksmith but I will ask a question anyways. Let's say I want some cast iron or stainless steel cookware, how much do you think i will end spending be it by doing myself or telling someone to make it for me?
>>986612
Far more than you would pay for a superior product at Walmart.
>>986517
I'm not saying that it's a good idea to start snorting lines of aluminum, just that the evidence that aluminum causes Alzheimer's is really, really flimsy.
Obviously you should have on a respirator or dust mask when you're doing something that produces dust.
Girlfriend and I just got our offer on a house accepted. I think I'm going to use the "King of Random" foundry for some aluminum stuff, but I think I want to buy a 4x4 stake anvil from old world anvils to start with. Then I'll hit someplace like Les Schwab here in town and ask about a large brake drum to use in a charcoal forge and beat on my steel with a harbor freight cross peen hammer until I can make my own hammers.
Tongs and hammers are my first projects, then knives and small artsy things like broaches and such.
Any reason why any of this would fail, other than the woman throwing a huge fit?
>>986657
The woman saying "No, it's fine."
>>986657
You pound metal harder than you pound her ass?
So I'm trying to find Anvils for under $200 that aren't cast peices of crap.
Found this one selli g near by me, what do you guys think?
http://m.kijiji.ca/hand-tool/mississauga-peel-region/anvil-blacksmith-knifemaking-forge-steel/v?adId=1156799068&ck=CK&from=Search&ts=1462026569290
I've done some more research and I think a "kitchen" fume hood might do the job against my smoke problem. They are cheap to buy used and might just work for this.
>>986041
what are you planning as the fuel?
Was this thinking that I can beef this up some by welding on some more steel.
Or is it fine like this?
>>986717
Kind of small but if it actually rings and has rebound its a pretty good start. Pics look good from the little it shows. I would go see it for sure.
>>986657
Sounds like a good plan. What about a blower?
>>986870
Might wanna read earlier in the thread about welding rail track. You'll need a good electrode that's high carbon, something like 7018. Also you will need to pre heat to around 600F and then post heat it at 600F after the welding. You can heat treat it at 1675F for 1 hour per inch of thickness then quench it in oil when its around 600F again.
At least this is what my internet research has brought me.
So unless you have some serious plans for it it's probably more trouble than its worth.
I'm doing it because I have 2 tracks I want to put together, which will double my mass and working surface. But if its just to add some plate steel on it its probably not worth it as the plate won't give any rebound.
Here it is boys, my first time firing it up. Only thing I had buy was the hair dryer.
Using charcoal for now, but plan on getting coal soon, it's just a long drive.
>>987216
Also, any fun projects for beginners to help learn the ropes?
Approximately how much per pound should I expect to pay for a quality used anvil at an estate sale?
>>987227
I've always heard $0.50-$5 a pound depending on size and condition, but I am sure there is more to it than that. Sorry I can't help more than that, I don't know much about it.
>>987220
knive (more like shiv), tongs, arrowhead, cutlery, flint striker
things like that
>>987256
I made this just to try it out. I'll try tongs next weekend, as I need a set.
Just came here to say goddamn I love this guy.
https://youtu.be/2tDDloL-yFA?t=40m40s
>>987453
Cringey as fuck though.
>>987227
At an estate sale, as little as possible. Ki d of the point of an estate sale. Wouldn't go more than 3 a pound unless its extra special.
>>987216
You will have a much better time with lump charcoal instead of briquettes, looks good otherwise.
>>987532
Yeah, I found they were to big to use well, and had wait for them burn down to a smaller size for best results. My hair dryer crapped out on me, so I am in the process of building a manual pump out of an old fan.
Other than accidentally burning my ass, I think I might have found a fun new hobby
>>987643
My hairdryer turned out to have a safety of sorts, if it got too hot, it crapped out. Try it again after not using it for a while. A long pipe helped me quite a lot for this.
>>987453
Not a blacksmith, just a welder making garbage.
>>987702
At what point do you differentiate between the two?
I'm not disagreeing I'm just curious what your criteria is.
>>987784
forging
>>987786
What if they use a mechanical hammer? Is that person still a blacksmith? I mean if a welder cuts the steel heat treats and grinds in edges it's not a whole lot different of an end product than if forged. So you classify based on procedure. You said forging which is pounding into shape with a hammer, if someone uses a machine to do the pounding does that still count?
Sorry this is something I've been debating and its interesting to see what other people think.
>>987791
I would say yes, using a mechanical hammer counts. Cutting and grinding is a different procedure entirely so that would not count.
>>987792
>>987791
>>987786
>>987784
As, a craftsman who makes blades professionally, my point of view is roughly as follows.
Blacksmithing and Bladesmithing are two different things - blacksmithing is stuff like gates, furniture, all those sort of things. Once upon a time, it was everything from nails to hinges to hardware that every farm and household needed.
Bladesmithing is a very different thing in that it is a specialist craft, with many similar processes to *some* blacksmithing - but many more processes that are entirely unrelated.
The main one, which matters most is the heat-treatment processes; If you're not using a thermocouple to measure heat accurately, and using a good quenchant, like Parks' 55, you're just dabbling in the craft really.
Guys like Michaelcthulu, who do not heat-treat, are not bladesmiths - they're making decorative art, through metalwork fabrication.
Forging is not an integral part of modern bladesmithing. The billet of steel next to me here has already been forged out under rolling mills that have elongated its grain structure, *exactly* in the same way that forging out a small, thick rectangular block of steel into a long, thin blade-shaped length would've done in the past. That said, a blade which is solely ground out is not "forged" - and describing it as such is extremely misleading, both to a customer, and to the maker claiming that.
Understanding what the processes are, and ensuring that they are used is, I personally feel, the important differentiation between craftsman, and a fabricator, even if the craftsman is not the one who does the processes. I heat-treat most knives, but if I'm doing something bigger than about 50cm/20inches, I will have it done by a commercial company to my specs. That's simply a limitation of my equipment, and many craftsmen outsource in similar ways. I know smiths who have 20 blanks laser-cut out, and then forge them. that's simple economic sense, its not diminishing their skill in any way.
>>987817
ctd:
How much work should be done under the hammer to warrant the term "forged" is of course, entirely subjective. Personally I normally do not call myself a bladesmith, but a "cutler", because when I make knives, (and swords), I feel more than 50% of my work is stock removal, and claiming that they are smithed is somewhat misleading. That's mostly because I have RSI damage to my hands, and cannot forge entire blades all day without harm to my health; I forge in the rough shape, of fullers only as a guide line, and swage the tangs, some holes are punched hot on a hardy hole, but those are often only as guide holes for drilling, I stamp in my maker's mark hot, because I dislike etching. the rest is done on a belt grinder or by hand, and therefore I tend to use the phrase "lightly forged" to describe the work.
Other smiths I know do far more of their stuff into hot metal - particularly those who do pattern-welding, etc. That is absolutely "forged" work. Whether it is forged in by hand, or by a power hammer is irrelevant. It takes no less skill to work a power hammer, to control the flow of metal, than it does to work with hammer and anvil. In some ways, it takes more skill, as its very easy to over-power the work using a power hammer, and ruin the work. Some elements of forgework are relatively easy - forgewelding wrought for instance, is easy, that stuff sticks like glue. Forgewelding two carbon steels can be a bitch. There, it is the craftsman's eye, and their ability to control the placement of pressure, that is the skill, not whether it is mechanical or hand-applied force.
But it must be noted that grinding, and stock removal is an integral part of forging. No well-made knife is made solely under the hammer - its shape is invariably refined by grinding and file-work - and has been since well before the medieval age. Only the machinery used has changed there.
Finally finished my hand crank blower, I get enough air to make the coals glow, but short of ripping my arm off, I just don't get enough out, so until I can scrape together enough for a stand and a pulley set to crank up the spin rate, I am out of commission.
Finally finished my hand crank blower, I get enough air to make the coals glow, but short of ripping my arm off, I just don't get enough out, so until I can scrape together enough for a stand and a pulley set to crank up the spin rate, I am out of commission.
>>987022
Where is the ash gonna go?
>>986717
that's almost $4 per pounds for that small chunk of steel. Look for anvils at flea markets, get to know some local farmers (they might know someone with an anvil they don't want), go to auctions. I found my first anvil that way, and got a #135 fisher anvil for $250
>>987453
He makes nice looking art and I'm sure some of his stuff will actually hold up to destructive testing but that's not smithing, it's fabricating. His stuff are exercises in stock removal and welding, even a bit of casting iirc but the actual act of forging the components is absent. Not that there's anything inherently bad or wrong with it but fabricating and smithing are apples and oranges.
>>987792
You're a retard, welders use pressure and heat to fuse welds together all the time.
>>984131
>but i never tempered it.
There is your problem
>>988771
Yeah, thats why i said ill do better next time.
As in i wouldn't make the mistake again.
Thank you for pointing it out though if you were genuinely trying to help.
>>984547
>pounds per square inch
what. the. fuck.
>>978477
an old blast furnace? yes, they can be used as they get quite hot... obviously.. buut i would suggest getting a top for it to place metal on/in, just not inside unless you want it to melt entirely
>>984972
bell curve is the harder part of the rail from the constant pounding of the train cars
>>977357
You literally don't know what you are talking about. get out of here.
>>989051
gtfo metriquefag
For the German readers here, I recently went to an art store for some stuff and found a book called "Gestalten mit Metall - Schweißen, Löten, Schmieden", published by "Haupt" and authored by "José Antonio Ares".
Found it to be quite informative, it covers the basics of blacksmithing, welding etc. Though it doesn't really go into detail it gives a nice overview over most of the basic techniques...
Considering the target demographic, it's quite noticeable that it has been written for artist rather than those who do technical jobs, more images, less text.
My tongs are coming along nicely, turns out using a bigger piece of material pays off. Can't wait to have good tongs with a charcoal forge :3
Just spent an hour dicking around with my forge, first time ever actually hammering anything. Really need to watch some tutorials.
>>984547
You work at badger foundry?
Anyone in anyone in Indiana that knows where I can get an anvil or know where to start locally?
OP here, don't really like gas forges. Threw this together in a few minutes with some fire brick i had and a torch that was made for me and i wasn't impressed. Didn't have the same feel as a solid fuel.
>>990360
I'm interested aswell.
>>983640
Interested. Are you planning on smelting from the raw minerals or what? Also, planning on buying the minerals or going out and finding them?
anything knife designs i can make without a forge
im perfectly ok with using a file for 12 hours straight
I'll post some of my things. Been smithing for a couple years, but haven't been doing anything lately since I don't have a place to work in.
>>991046
Welded the pieces of together
You can make surprisingly cool rings from a stainless steel pipe
>>990360
Yeah, check barns and antique stores. I got mine at a antique store in Corydon for a decent price. They are definitely around... Join a blacksmithing group, there are a few in the state, that would be the easiest way.
A restaurant wanted something to hold candles so I made some.
That's all. I lost a lot of pictures due to my old hard drive failing and not being smart and backing them up.
Have fun smithing, people!
>>991036
You can make any kind of knife you want using stock removal. Its not blacksmithing though, so you are off topic.
>>984972
That looks really high up. Have you thought about lowering it and using the extra metal rods as additional support?
>>991058
candle holder or clever tripping/arson device?
What are ball peens and cross peens used for exactly?
>>991607
Crosspeens move metal in one direction, ballpeens move it in all directions, to put it simply.
>>991458
Maybe anon is really tall or something. That things scares the hell out of me, hope he wears steel toes...
>>991715
ah, good to know thanks.
>>979227
Loud as fuck, but I guess it would get pretty hot because you can cram so much air into it
But what the fuck man I want to build a turbojet too so try it I guess
Got this today at work from an old steel worker, the tooth side is hardens the spine is not.
Obviously it's going to become a knife of some form, but I have never worked on anything other thank junky scrap, and don't want to mess up.
Any tips/tricks?
>>992590
Forgot pic
>>992590
> but I have never worked on anything other thank junky scrap,
if you're making a knife from that, you still are working with junky scrap.
>>992592
It's a damn sight better than pieces of rotting farm equipment, and I don't want to fuck up since I don't get nice looking stuff like this very often.
bottle opener forged out of a railroad slice
>>992603
>since I don't get nice looking stuff like this very often.
*what* "nice looking stuff?
its a piece of scrap.
Do you know the carbon content of that? No. what about the right heat-treat? no.
Its scrap metal. Worthless. It'll not make a knife, at best you can make a prison shiv.
stop being a fucking gypsy, rooting around in skips for scrap, and simply go to the NJ Steel Baron, and buy some 1084. It'll cost you less than $20, for enough for 4 knives.
$5 a knife. that's hardly going to break the bank.
I live in Scotland where getting knifemaking steel from a distributor is challenging.
I, years ago with more eagerness than brains, started making a blade shape from a Nicholson file. A slightly more experienced friend of mine told me to wrap it in foil and let it heat and settle in the ashes of a fire overnight to anneal it. Afterwards, it was very workable and soft and I was able to make a blade blank.
I lost it while moving house years ago but found it again. My question is, did I screw up in the initial stage beyond salvation by just throwing it in a log burner and leaving it overnight?
Can I continue where I left off?
I know ideally i'd be purchasing a piece of known steel stock and working from there, but given what I have, can I salvage it?
Thank you very much.
>>992689
>I live in Scotland where getting knifemaking steel from a distributor is challenging.
Bullshit.
Phone up Furnival steel, talk to Andy. He'll do you EN8, EN9, EN24, EN42, EN45, O1, or D2, and a few others.
Groundflatstock.com. O1, D2 and Werkstoff Niolox.
Steve at springsteelstrip will do you CS70. and CS80.
plenty of suppliers will deliver, even if you live in the Highlands, I do, and work as a professional smith.
Anyhow, you should have an annealed file, and Nicholson were usually 1095 spec. but it might be casehardened shite, and you cant tell. (which is why you dont waste time on scrap.). It should be fine to shape and then re heat-treat.
>>992641
if it is a power hacksaw blade there is plenty of metal for a decent knife
http://www.motherearthnews.com/diy/copperhead-survival-knife-zmaz83sozshe.aspx?PageId=1
http://www.motherearthnews.com/diy/copperhead-survival-knife-zmaz83sozshe.aspx?SlideShow=7
i've made a couple in the past, they take and hold a great edge but are a bitch to work because they are very hard and brittle
mmmmm my country doesnt have wood so coal and charcoal are pricey
how many kilos do i need to make like three fires in a hole in the ground forge to soften shit then harden it after im done filing and hacking away
>>992950
A 40lbs bag should do it. That's what, 90 kilos?
>>993024
>That's what, 90 kilos?
Twenty.
I'm softly rustling in the wind.
>>992749
Much obliged Sir
>>992749
Sorry for rustling you and thank you. I live in Edinburgh and struggled to find anywhere to get steel in person but will check your recommended suppliers
>>992749
Hey mate, just wondering while you're about: im not that guy but you mentioned the chance it might be case hardened, but youre saying its it still worth making it into a knife right, its not immediately useless shite right?
>>992749
Have you tried ground-flat-stock.co.uk?
Are they worse?
