I'm a new reader and wanted to get into DC. I just got done reading the new 80 page Rebirth and I'm very confused. Many people told me it would be a good jumping on point but it seems there's a lot of references to Crisis on Infinite Earths, Flashpoint, Watchmen, etc.. I'm wondering if it's just a better idea to read Flashpoint and go through the New 52 or do something else. Thoughts?
When people say a good jumping on point, they mean good jumping on point for ennui engorged fanboys who live and die by how much nostalgia they intact
>>83934811
wow i've never seen a more apt description
>>83934734
No, stop, you're making this too complicated.
All you need to know is those events happened, really shook things up, Watchmen may have noticed or something.
>>83934734
Nah, you really don't need to. Pick a series to follow, look up what happened immediately prior to the new Rebirth run starting, and go with it.
Like Superman/Action Comics: Older version of Superman is on Earth now, Lex is hero, kind of. Death of Superman happened in the 90s, and they are paralleling it.
Hellblazer Rebirth: Probably won't need to know old stuff, the New 52 Constantine series have all been disjointed with completely different tones. 1st was bad, 2nd was good, 3rd remains to be seen.
Batman stuff: AFAIK, and I haven't been following Batman lately and the Rebirth issue still made sense to me, you don't need to know much going in, other than who the Bat Family members are.
Titans and Flash are both probably going to be the most continuity heavy, and that's because they're where most of the continuity stuff gets brought up thanks to Speed Force shenanigans. Although since they are giving Wally a New 52 origin (in addition to whatever he remembers of pre-Flashpoint), it's probably not going to be too bad.
Wonder Woman stuff: The first arc seems to be how all her backstories keep changing, and they reference them all, so it's probably not too bad a place to jump in. I haven't followed her at all though, so IDK.
JL Rebirth stuff isn't out yet, so I can't comment on it. I haven't really looked into anything else, my favorite DC stuff is usually Spectre stuff or New God stuff (or JSA or Shazam), so not been following lots of titles lately.
>>83934811
Yeah, that is a pretty apt description, although I'm a fan for continuity reasons, rather than just nostalgia. I like DC as one big story, though I'm not attached to any specific character other than Spectre (not Corrigan, just people getting the Spectre force and having to go through introspective and interesting stories).
if you're going to get into it, fucking get into it, grab COIE and then work your way through every event since then and every character book you want to read. Everything is canon.
I hate you people that say it's hard to get into comics, you just fucking google the universe history and read what's talked about. jesus christ.
>>83934734
>Thoughts?
Find a character you think looks interesting and jump in. It's not actually that hard. I'd recommend checking out New 52 series, not because they're necessary to read to understand Rebirth, but because there's a pretty good cross-section of good stories within them, none of which are longer than a few volumes.
>>83935408
damn. will do.
>>83934734
Just read a summary of COIE, watch the flashpoint animated movie and read watchmen or watch the movie, reading all that bullshit is just going to give you too many new questions and it'll be a never ending cycle. Just get a general gist and then carry on with rebirth, go back to oldr stuff when you already have your basis and don't need to worry about ending up confused as fuck.
>>83934734
Pretty sure if people told you to read Rebirth for trying to get into Superman they meant the Superman: Rebirth special you have in your post and not the DC Universe: Rebirth special you're talking about. Each of the Rebirth specials for the comic lines are for new readers and set the status quo for the lines, which is what you're looking for.
>>83934811
Rebirth was a mistake.
>>83938115
Infigure I might as well give a pic and a link. This is the issue you're looking for: http://www.dccomics.com/comics/superman-2016/superman-rebirth-1
>>83934873
This.
>>83934873
You really, genuinely don't need to know everything that happened. If you start with, say, COIE, you'll still "need" to read what came before it, because THAT event is jam-packed with references. Comparatively, the Rebirth special is light with references. COIE is like barely mentioned in Rebirth, IIRC? Flashpoint is the big thing, and even THAT isn't a big deal.
You have to understand that, from an editorial perspective, Flashpoint wasn't meant to be a "universe resetting" event until the New52 came along -- the final pages of Flashpoint indicated that things would go back to normal. It was just supposed to be a cool/weird event across the DCU.
Watchmen is probably the only thing that you might want to read to understand and guess at Doctor Manhattan's intentions.
You also don't *need* to go through the New52. The Rebirth one-shots are a good look into how everything has settled into place. I suppose Batman and Justice League and the "death of Superman" 8-parter have enough status quo changers that they're useful to read (e.g. the questions of "who is Duke Thomas? why is Luthor powerful? how did Superman die?"). But otherwise, they won't elucidate much.
Just pickup the golden age Superman omnibus. It's the best place to start.
>>83934734
>I'm a new reader and wanted to get into DC
You don't "get into DC" just like you don't "get into Marvel" or whatever. That's just madness.
You get into characters or teams of characters. Start with one or two characters that interest you. /co/ has recommendation charts for pretty much every DC or Marvel character, and if they don't you can feel free to ask.
>>83938231
>provided the official link
I salute you my fellow comic-buying /co/mrade
>>83934734
Every major cape crossover storyarc you're ever going to read is going to be full of references to previous stories.
You're going to have to learn how to understand those references WITHOUT having read the stories they refer to if you're ever going to be able to be happy reading cape books.
If you can't do that, and if spending a lot of time on wiki sites doesn't seem fun to you, then mainstream cape comics aren't for you, sorry.
This has all been super helpful guys. Spare one asshole who was really mad and shit, all of you have really made me want to dive deep into comics but also shown me how to go about doing it. You all just made some comic book writers and artists a little bit of money.
>>83934734
Just start with flashpoint and then read the mean title justice League and pick any other titles that interest you.
>>83935408
Yeah, and in ten years once he's read everything, he can read Rebirth!
This is why comics don't sell
>>83934811
I love you. New 52 was a perfect jumping on point. Why do I say this? Because I got on the DC train with the New 52. And now, even after almost 5 years of reading comics, I couldnt understand some of the stuff in Rebirth. I just couldnt give two shits about the new Superman.
I'll say it now. New52 Superman is my Superman
Could anyone here in help me out? I'm trying to figure out continuity. I just finished Futures end and am trying to figure out where it went from there. Trying to not put too many spoilers out there or anything. So simply the BMB afterwards. Do I just go right into the bmb issues around that time? Should I start looking into convergence? I'm trying to find out what happens next
>>83934811
>ennui
>engorged
>fanboys
>live and die by
>nostalgia
>intact
The number of words and phrases you used wrong in this single sentence has to be some kind of record.
>>83947596
Any continuity before Rebirth isn't really all that important.
>>83947596
They're just going to make shit up as they go along anyways
>>83934734
Just read random books and get a feel for the characters, try to find quality writers and stick to that.
I'm going through Grell's Green Arrow at the moment.
>>83947048
More or less this. I would say there are only a few runs in the New 52 that are not new user friendly (Green Lantern, Batwoman, Morrison Batman).
>>83947691
Pretty much anything that didn't hit the reset button was confusing to new readers
Which is funny because Post Crisis did the same shit and you'd think they'd learn
>>83947048
>New52 Superman is my Superman
So fucking glad this cancer is limited to /co/'s tiny echo chamber.
>>83934734
Nigger just pick up any ongoing with Rebirth One shot. It's a really good jumping on point. :^)
Basically DC realized that reboots create way more problems than they solve. New 52's continuity was a huge clusterfuck and most of the books weren't very good, so they finally decided to roll up their sleeves and solve the problem at its source instead of trying to bury the problem with the mother of all copouts, "story trumps continuity".
DC continuity has a lot of shit wrong with it and it's not all going to be fixed overnight. Rebirth was more of a mission statement than any kind of major fix, but things will get better over time. The catch is that for some characters, things might get a bit more complicated in the short term, but hopefully we'll get some quality stories out of it either way.
Here is the thing OP and it's a really hard hump to get over.
You don't have to give a shit about ALL the references to get into comic books.
You know the basic structure of the storytelling which most people don't. You know what an "Event" is and what a shared universe is.
Read Watchmen though. You seem to "get" superheroes well enough to understand it. Don't skip pages of full text.
>>83934734
rebirth was always meant to be for bringing back lost fans
>>83947646
the basic idea he was trying to get across was correct though
>>83947803
>Read Watchmen though. You seem to "get" superheroes well enough to understand it. Don't skip pages of full text.
this
>>83947803
>>83947965
I came here to second this.
I would also like to say that it was basically Watchmen that got me into comics. You COULD read the original crisis and I don't know, maybe Wally West run as the flash if you really want to? Superman was also a fucking mess to new readers I understand. Basically Superman is dead and that's from a previous earth superman with a son. Yeah.
I did read Crisis on infinite earths out of curiosity early on (and I'm glad it did because it set me up for some really great DC stories that I love, like Wally West as the Flash, Morrison's JLA, etc) and it kinda helps for all other "crisis" events like Identity Crisis (there's a JLA by johns that actually fixed this and led directly to Infinite Crisis but i don't think many people read this arc as by then JLA was a shit book and Johns was kinda unknown even though he wrote an amazing Flash run after Waid, worked on JSA and had just started Green Lantern Rebirth prior to Infinite Crisis but ok)
>>83947596
Go ahead and read Batman Beyond, and as for Convergence, read the tie-ins and skip the main book. Afterwards, start Superman: Clark and Lois.
>>83947048
>I just couldnt give two shits about the new Superman.
>new
The Superman currently replacing New52 Supes is the previous Superman, who has been in published books for about 20 years or more. The only "new" Superman is the one who died, who has had a 5 year run.
That said, New52 Superman will return. That much is obvious. Just take the time and get acquainted with the old Supes. You might just find something you like about him.
>>83934734
Yeah, they're references. They're not the story, just a reference to another story. It's comic books, you're gonna have to get used to it.
When I picked up Action Comics 957, I had no idea why Lex had a Superman suit (still don't, even), but I just went with it and ended up really fucking enjoying the issue. I also have no idea how N52 Superman died or anything about him other than he lost his powers and he died, but I'm not having any problems with the Superman comics when they mention him in passing.
Just say "Ok, I guess something happened/that's a thing" and if you get more interested, then go look it up and read the arc. If not, then fuck it.
>>83948134
Lex built a suit. Especifically during Forever Evil I guess (in the n52 continuity). He just painted it like Superman after superman died. I think he has a new solar engine that he hinted earlier on but that's just a theory of mine.
Basically, Final Days of Superman happened. It's the last event of the New 52, happening even after the Darkseid War in JL (which, yes, happened after all arcs were over in the new 52)
CoIE was a big dal in the previous continuity, as were all the Crisis (Identity Crisis, Infinite Crisis, Final Crisis, I guess Zero Hour could be considered the 90s crisis too, a shitton of events followed up since Zero hour including Gotham's Cataclysm and the death of the superman doomsday version. Wally West as the Flash, Kyle Rayner as green lantern and the JSA as legacy heroes too, which is referenced in this issue.
Basically, what the DC Universe Rebirth references are:
Crisis on Infinite Earths, which was kind of a big deal in "previous" continuity.
Watchmen.
Wally West as the Flash, which happened immediately after CoIE. Just read Mark Waid's and Geoff Johns runs.
The original JSA, just fucking read JSA and Johns' Justice Society of America. He also did a Teen Titans run if that's important.
The Final Days of Superman. Read Superman: Lois and Clark for old superman adventures after Convergence and how he ended up here. Continuing in Superman Rebirth and the Superman series. Super Sons is another universe entirely. Action Comics will follow Lex Luthor.
>>83934734
For Superman, read Flashpoint (optional, it just introduces the new 52), Convergence (introduces Classic Superman into New 52 Universe) then Superman #51 (New 52 Superman dies) then Rebirth and ongoings.
Oh jeez, I sure do wonder why comics sell like shit.
>>83948217
I figured his suit was just something like that, but I thought I had heard it was related to Apokalips, but didn't care enough to look it up. I'll get through N52 JL and Forever Evil at some point, so why look up spoilers, y'know?
Same thing with N52 Superman. I started Action Comics, but I'm not that interested after finishing the first arc so it'll be slow goings.
Essentially I stopped reading comics for a few years a year or two into N52 because the books I was reading were so bad. Teen Titans, Static Shock, Blue Beetle, Superboy, Deathstroke, etc. The only one I actually liked was The Ravagers, and that was 99% because of Terra and Beast Boy. I just stopped caring about comics after that, so now I'm playing catch up on the good runs.
>>83948342
>the Ravagers
Ha! I knew I wasn't the only one who got some enjoyment outta that book.
>>83934734
Just read things you like, and if for whatever reason you want to read something just do it. Do it with no solution just enjoying the single arc or story or whatever are you reading, until you start to get a grip at the world. At that point you can go ahead.
>>83948088
That guy's old. He even has a kid. I read the story with him hiding with Lois and his son before Rebirth. He seemed boring compared to the hotheaded New52 Soup
Hey OP. I was in your position about 6 or 5 years ago. I downloaded comics I wanted from here and also bought stuff I thought looked interesting. There was a /co/ essential reading on flash and I can't find it anywhere but I loved it. Through that I got into other characters as well.
I used to believe that supes was a boring whatever character too. Now, aside from Wally West, he's my absolute favorite. Read his big stories. Birth Right, Through The a seasons, red son, kingdom come. There's more I'm sure I'm forgetting. But his stories always give you an idea of how the DC universe is.
Yesterday I found a collection of Batman Superman comics 1-55(maybe more?) that I didn't know I had. They've been a blast to read and it reminded me that early 2000s DC really had comics figured out. In just 25 issues they've fought Lex, found super girl, became villains, traveled space and time and dimensions and teamed up with Darkseid, etc. It's been such a blast to read and if you can find it I recommend it highly also.
The last thing I'll recommend is the animated series. It starts with Batman then Superman and then the Justice League. All great and wonderful renditions of their characters. Justice League Unlimited is also a good intro to lesser known characters.
I remember being very scared to jump in. But it's been a blast and now that DC seems to see they fucked up I can't wait to see what they do now.
>>83934734
>Many people told me it would be a good jumping on point
They're really, really wrong, Rebirth is not a reboot or something like that, it deals with some complicated stuff that happened both pre and psot flashpoint
Thing is, start in the new52(after watching/reading Flashpoint), there are some really nice books in the start, then after you're a little bit established on the universe you can search for good pre-flashpoint runs of the characters you liked, and then you can go full-on COIE, Final Crisis and shit like that since you'll already know quite a bit about what's going on at each time
>>83934734
No, you're chilling.
Literally just google those things, you just need a vague idea as to what they are.
tbqh I rarely read events. When they get referenced it'll probably be explained or it isn't super important.
>>83953009
>tbqh I rarely read events
/co/ ? Reading comics? Why? You only need google!
>>83953032
I read comics.
Events are just gay.
>>83953032
Events and big crossovers are cashgrabby and usually terrible by nature. It's pretty reasonable for someone to skip them.
>>83934734
I was in the same boat not long ago, I just jumped into reading the new 52 stuff then branched out to reading more about the characters I ended up liking.
>>83953100
>Events and big crossovers are cashgrabby and usually terrible by nature.
Not really the thing with DC, their big events usually change a BUNCH of shit, see Flashpoint, Rebirth, COIE etc
And the other small stuff like the Darkseid War was literally just an arc in JL, so yeah
