are we finally going to admit as a species that "The Sandman" is overrated as fuck?
No
>>83275497
It's not because you slightly reworded the "NOW THAT THE DUST HAS SETTLED CAN WE ALL AGREE" shit that it isn't retarded anymore
>>83275497
When someone mentioned that they never saw any hate for Gaiman I was going to make a big reply about how it's mostly people aimlessly throwing around the word overrated towards things like Sandman and Hellboy with no specific point behind the how and where given the breadth of both.
I decided not to since it seemed a fingerpointing gesture against something not happening at the time yet
HERE WE ARE, YOU OPTIMUM CUNT.
no but seriously, it constantly tries to be so deep and intelligent and whatnot and it fails miserably
it's like it was a high school project of an emo teen who was failing the semester and had to do something to pass
>>83275578
No it doesn't. It's about a bunch of universal concepts made flesh and how they interact with one another. As Gaiman himself put it, Sandman is about "Dream having to choose between change or death, and making his choice"
>>83275578
Define "deep"
>>83275578
This bait is failing miserably.
>>83275598
Absolutely not, it's complete and utter bullcrap, Sandman is about "A retarded member of the Endless, some of whom are also slightly retarded"
>>83275637
open any issue and witness the laughable metaphors
>>83275641
i wish it were bait, i'm trying to wrap my head around the fact that there are people who love this comic book so much
>>83275681
Try wrapping your head around a noose instead, my man. Quicker results.
>>83275707
fine argumentation, didn't really expect anything else from a sandman fanboy
>>83275720
Yeah because you're a master of rhetoric yourself.
>>83275681
If it's so shot let's here an intelligent critique of it. Rather than just "no that sucks cos this vague reason"
It would be nice if an actual example was provided. Even BvS defenders can do that.
>>83275789
There's no purpose. This thread was made solely so you could dismiss any positive made toward the comic as invalid. "You like that...well actually no that's shit."
Your inability to come up with a worthwhile critique of the comic you claim to be so overrated shows this is just bait.
>>83275497
Some do, but that's your own opinion, you ignorant fuck.
>>83275497
I want Disney to go
>>83275578
>disnigger still trying this hard
hail hydra
remember to sage
I like his short stories better. The entire run felt pretty drawn out and the stories weren't that interesting for Gaiman's standards. The second half was pretty good though, as was Season of Mists. I feel like Gaiman's writing is quite imaginative, and is therefore better off outside of comics.
>>83275681
actually it's about ethics in company wars
>>83276654
Gaiman's style is pretty good, but yes, overall it simply works better in smaller pieces - short stories, novellas, even shorter novels. Sandman isn't bad but it's by no means his finest work, it suffers from being somewhat bloated, though it's not the sole example of that in his work, I feel similar about American Gods.
I felt the same way about Sandman that I felt about Lucifer
They were okay but not anywhere near worthy of all the praise they get.
>>83276826
American Gods and Anansi Boys were a bit of the exceptions to the 'rule' for me. American Gods not because it was 'objectively' good or anything, but because the town of Lakeside brought back wonderful memories from road trips. I had that from Black Dog, a new American Gods short story as well. I can understand why someone might feel it was bloated, though.
But I felt Anansi Boys is definitely good on its own terms. It is just about the right length for a novel, which is rare for Gaiman.
>>83275497
look if you didn't like the books on their own merits fine but Gaiman's Sandman remains a modern literary masterpiece regardless.
>>83277073
>modern literary masterpiece
not even OP but its no where near a master piece
>>83277121
pretty much is.
>>83277121
OP go suck cocks.
>>83277153
>>83277166
Its shit and you would realize that if you stopped sucking Gaimans cock. All his crap is extremely overrated and just gets praised because it uses mythology to make it seem deeper then it is. American Gods was legit one of the most boring books I have ever read and Sandman had terrible fucking pacing that often took pointless breaks from the main story to go talk about characters no one actually gives a shit about.
>>83275497
no
>>83277196
Did your girlfriend leave you at home to go cosplay Death at a con? Be honest.
OP here
>>83275847
no, it wasn't, it was made because i genuinely wanted to hear what makes people think it's a masterpiece but i didn't get that answer
>>83277073
if sandman is a modern literary masterpiece then the world has truly gone to hell
>>83277121
i second this anon, obviously
>>83277196
this. hey i took seven human concepts all starting with D, they're real characters, look at me i'm so smart and philosophical
>>83277196
Jesus, man. Look. Every character on the side like that, every story, every panel had something important to say, and how it relates to Morpheus himself. Men of good fortune shows how a man admitted failure sooner than someone as great as the endless, for example.
It's not the mythology, not the 'witty' metaphors that make it impressive, none of us said that it did. What makes it impressive that it's a massive, 'bloated' with bad pacing, story arc about one thing's conveluded suicide, and the side-characters are there so you can reflect upon it. Destruction keeps trying to change, to do what he simply can't. Morpheus is too proud to try and fail.
It's stuff like that.
>>83277457
just to add to my final claim, it could have been a very interesting concept
if he actually did anything interesting with the endless
>>83275578
I would say it's one of the few attempts at being deep in comics that doesent fall flat.
>>83277513
had to remind myself which one was "Men of good fortune"
that little story was bullshit, the only good thing is the little smile you make at the end when Morpheus admits that the dude is really his friend
if you, for example, imagine that the endless are truly real and everything we've seen thus far in the series is real, then the human is obviously mentally handicapped
immortal for some 6 centuries or idk how long and he does exactly nothing
and that DOESN'T show that humans don't change blah blah or anything like that
the dude could have done something remarkable every century, could have tried becoming a poet, scientist, explorer
could have used his immortality to reach new understandings
but no. he's a regular jackoff who won't ever change because you can bullshit your way through that story throwing in any metaphor conceivable
>but it wasn't about the human it was about Morpheus
ffs if the reader couldn't conclude that morpheus is an edgy isolated goth kid by that far in the series, he shouldn't read in the first place
>but the human was being extremely selfish, only making money for himself throughout the millenia
do you not see how shitty of a concept that is? a retarded monkey would realize that with the gift of immortality, you can benefit yourself and others way more than you benefit yourself only with becoming an entrepreneur
>>83277457
>I genuinely wanted to know why people thought this was a masterpiece
liar liar
>>83277804
>the dude could have done something remarkable every century, could have tried becoming a poet, scientist, explorer
I feel your memory has failed you on more than which story it was, you have completely forgotten what happened.
He says himself he could never stay around too long or suspicions arose, when he did he was considered a devil worshipper and burned but could not die. He however has no supernatural strength to accompany his immortality so if a mob wants to keep burning, drowning, hanging and stabbing him he's at their whim until they bury him alive and he has to wait for the plate tectonics to favor his escape.
Only when we admit that preacher is adolescent tripe.
>>83277804
>he does exactly nothing
The fuck you on about m8 Hob went from a peasant to a Fucking noble and made bucko bucks and who the fuck to dictate how a man should live his life anyway ya fuck? Hob lived his life exactly he wanted it which is his defining characteristic.
>>83277904
you're kinda right, i might have forgotten that but still, given that much time, anyone could figure out a strategy to do whatever they like
>>83277804
>Hob galding
>a man who won't ever change
Oh sorry I didn't know I was talking to a straight up retard over here.
OP are you the same idiot who asked why people like Catwoman a few weeks back and then ignored every answer for three days?
You sound like him.
>>83275497
I love that picture, everytime I see it I just feel like sand blowing in the wind.
>>83277804
Only the smile? What about how prior to that Morpheus got up fro the table, had a whole bitch about how dare he? He got up in a dramatic way, got his hat on, and walked off.
He didn't need to do that. He's a being beyond that, but he's of the theatrical, and he couldn't resist. Tidbits like that are something you should appreciate in the subtle characterization of something so massive as Dream.
Old Hob just didn't care for being better than that. He even says it himself, he just went for money and whores. He finally matured at the last meeting. He was an entrepreneur, he got into slavery. He realized how awful that was. Jeez.
>>83277073
It's one of the best comics but it is in no way a modern literary masterpiece.
>>83277904
Ah, and also this. Yeah. Overall, Hob lived his life the way he wanted, that's why he always answered with 'gimme another hunred, aye'. He lived like a human should.
>>83275497
Nope, sorry OP - it was a fun read.
>>83277804
Hob sponsored a number of ventures over the years, including the first printing businesses, which were very important in the protestantism vs catholicism bits, which influenced entire nations. Also improved literacy rates.
somebody dump hentai or some shit
>>83278133
Disney pays a lot for this shit
>>83278028
>i dont like a story because I can make up a bunch of fucking bullshit reasons for why I don't believe it
>>83278133
Ah I remember that thread
Was he really at it for 3 fucking days
>>83278952
Not as bad as that thread that lasted a week because one autist was ranting on about GR15.
>>83275569
Not OP, but I'm kind of indifferent to Gaimen. I mean I get why his stuff resinates with people, but it's just not for me. The only problem that I do have with his Sandman though is that it's considered "the definative itteration" and goes as far as to call Wesley Doods a "pale immitation" of Dream and his work
>>83275497
I am content with agreeing to some people on /co/ who have stated its a swing and a miss
>>83277457
>no, it wasn't, it was made because i genuinely wanted to hear what makes people think it's a masterpiece but i didn't get that answer
lookup sandman on the /co/ archives. If you are lucky you will find a thread discussing Sandman when /co/ was less shit.
Not really sure how far the new archive goes and how many threads it was able to incorporate from the previous archive
>>83275497
>>83276604
>>83278774
>muh Didney bogyman
OP is a cunt (and will be so for the rest of his life) , but not everybody who disagrees with you and/or does not like a Detective Comics publication is a shill from Disney.
>>83275497
A work will always be overrated when it is objectively an 11/10
>>83278368
It's a better book than it is a comic. As a comic it's like a 3/10 but if you look at it as an illustrated novel it becomes a 6 or a 7.
>>83277904
>He however has no supernatural strength to accompany his immortality so if a mob wants to keep burning, drowning, hanging and stabbing him he's at their whim until they bury him alive and he has to wait for the plate tectonics to favor his escape.
I don't think that's how it works
He lives forever but it's only if nothing happens to him, we see other long living mortals die by external means like that guy who got smashed by the bricks
>that one part where the character made of minerals or whatever can't figure out how to die
>>83275497
Friendly reminder that overrated does not mean bad
>>83280897
Elemental Girl. Got a little somber and esoteric for me in the end, yes even for Sandman, but hey.
Did have me wonder what Death does when something wants to die but can't, or can't for long anyway. Cyborg Superman could have used her grace during Sinestro Corps War.
>>83280965
OP didn't say it was bad
Why do people mistake 'overrated' as a criticism
>>83281156
>OP didn't say it was bad
>>83277457
>this. hey i took seven human concepts all starting with D, they're real characters, look at me i'm so smart and philosophical
Does this even sound like criticism to you?
Does this even sound like coherent thought at that?
>>83281156
Not in the OP, but then he quickly makes an ass out of himself for the rest of the thread.
>>83275497
Nope. It's not overrated enough.
>>83275497
Neil Gaiman is overrated as fuck.
Are there any comics similar to Sandman?
haha, gay man
>>83275497
Yeah, but overrated doesn't necessarily mean it's bad.
Which a lot of people don't seem to understand.
>>83275497
Johnsfags in full butthurt mode
>>83282849
Hellboy
>>83275497
it's a gateway comic. Calling it overrated is like calling Naruto overrated, or calling Betty Boob shit, or calling Watchman edgy, or calling Hell's Kitchen pretentious.
>>83283605
can't make that shit up
>>83283680
Check the Catalog.
>>83280580
Explain your reasoning
>>83282699
She's my favorite secondary character. I cried with that page.
>>83283605
Summer.jpeg right there
>>83275497
>The Sandman
>overrated
You mean underrated, right?
>>83282699
where's this from?
>>83285334
...Sandman?
