I'm looking for examples of other heroes' stance on the mutant issue? Out side of Uncanny Avengers I can't really think of or remember a book about a non mutant hero having an opinion or more accurately a public opinion on mutants in general. It would seem like some support from the hero community would go along way to improving their image. It seems perhaps unintentionally that other heroes choose not to get caught up in the argument and play it kind of neutral.
Second question, If there were mutants or mutant equivalents int the DC universe, do you think that some of the larger hero figures would make an effort to create or support peace and understanding between two different species? Or would they stay on the sidelines as well?
>>83131870
Just always pick the right side.
>>83131870
The Avengers were pro mutant, I mean look at how many mutants joined there team
Thor especially is angry with humans who hate mutants, especially the X-Men
>>83131870
DC has "metahumans". At least that's what they called them in that one Superman comic I read that did the whole mutant question thing.
>>83131973
>I mean look at how many mutants joined there team
(Just for arguments sake, not saying it actually applies to the Avengers) There in some cases can be a difference between letting people from a group work for you or with you and actually liking that group.
I'm looking for Cap or any member really, saying look the way the public treats mutants is wrong or unfair considering we have powers as well or just because descrimination is wrong period. Or the opposite, someone saying yea I get how people without powers can be scared when a mutant could just pop up anywhere.
>>83131980
>metahumans
I don't know Metahumas always seem to refer to anyone that had beyond normal abilities. I was thinking more of a group of people being born with abilities different than the average human that didn't get powers through some science accident. There's no difference in classification, which maybe just shows how DC universe doesn't care about that sort of thing.
>>83131973
Pro mutant rights doesn't always mean that there's an agreement on what rights they're pro for.
For instance: Mutants having a distict cultural identity of their own?
Or how about if mutants can have access to the Phoenix Force in a time of need?
What about self governance in light of the fact they don't have HUMAN rights in human society?
Being really nice to your tolken mutant doesn't necessarily mean that you're for mutants being accepted as whatever they are.
>>83132310
>we are defined by our choices
>my choice is to use my laser hands that normal humans don't have to shoot stuff
>>83132260
>metahumans
(I really hope I'm remembering that name right)
Yeah, in that Supes issue I read DC just gave the subject a lightweight political discussion, basically it ended with Superman flying down to say everyone should be nice to everyone like good neighbors. Problem solved!
Kingdom Come KINDA did the issue, but that was all on actual superhero-supers not being heroic as they grow in numbers.
>>83132260
DC uses the term inconsistently. There are people with metagenes who are more directly metahumans but metahumans will also get used on all heroes with powers anyway. But I guess that's kind of the point too that outside of the specific situations where the metagene is being talked about it doesn't really matter.
>>83131941
You know that person was having a mental breakdown when they did that, right?
>>83132602
>that person
Casual racism much?
>>83132546
>DC uses the term inconsistently.
Not him, but would you say that's because of the writers, or more like the characters saying "Fuck it, if you're not like Batman, you're a Metahuman."
>>83132310
P.S. - a "tolken mutant" is typically a hobbit, elf, dwarf, goblin, troll, or orc.
>>83132618
Cyclops deserves it. You just remember I said that.
>>83132667
I guess it's kind of both really? It's not particularly important to the overall narrative of the universe so it's not something writers try to spend a lot of time on either. Just mostly an explanation for some people getting powers.
But I haven't read much actually starring a character who had a metagene so maybe there are some where it's a big deal for them.
>>83132602
I dropped Bendis' X-men after X-men were given to Bendis.
>mental breakdown when they did that
Did he re-use his Daredevil plot with Cyclops?
>>83132310
>>83132699
Don't you mean "Tolkien mutant", with an I?
>>83132808
It doesn't come up a lot because the DCU doesn't really draw a distinction regarding where your powers come from. If you've got a metagene, if you were mutated by an accident, stumbled into an ancient egyptian tomb, whatever. What DC civilians and characters concern themselves with is how you use those powers, and whether you decide to be a superhero or a villain.
>>83132851
SHHH!, Lad, do ye' wanna be sued?!
>>83132524
>Superman flying down to say everyone should be nice to everyone like good neighbors. Problem solved!
Well if Superman says it, we gotta do it. Too bad he can't go to the Marvel universe and fix mutant relations too.
>>83132822
Trust me, this is a whole other thing. Daredevil has had life easy by comparison.
>>83132935
Yeah, it's always bugged me that Marv' doesn't have a Superman leader of their own.
Captain A comes closest, but has his number of detractors in universe that wouldn't ever take his advice.
Supes is unique for being (almost) universally beloved the whole comic universe over.
Marvel just doesn't have any character that represents that sort of influence.
>>83132986
That's not the point. though.
>>83133259
Okay-okay...
Yes, and no. He re-used the plot, but the characters were both on that arc before he showed up so it's not like he cut-and-pasted a story element.
>>83131941
Based Cyke
Marvel tends to not really go into mutants issues outside of X-Men. Honestly it's such a weird thing in the Marvel universe since 99% of heroes don't share their origin so for most people they might just be mutants. Spider-Man and others should be treated like every other mutant but outside of maybe a line or two no one really brings it up.
>>83133121
>Supes is unique for being (almost) universally beloved the whole comic universe over.
>Marvel just doesn't have any character that represents that sort of influence.
I think that's intentional.
>>83133891
LIES!
Spiderman's been accused of being a mutie on multiple occasions.
Thor showed up in that X-Men "Mutant Masacre" storyline.
Spiderman, Spiderwoman, The Avengers, The Fantastic Four (who have a mutie kid in their family), Dr.DOOM!, etc.etc. have all shown up as X-Men story guest-stars.
Old-days Marvel comics used to have cross-overs and team-ups all the damned time.
For Phoenix's sake! Rogue's debut was in an Avengers annual, Wolverine's in an issue of Hulk, and Magneto has guest villianed against every major hero at some point, just like DrDOOM!.
>>83133925
Intentional on Marvel's part? Why would they have it that way?
>>83134163
Why would they make it so that Marvel doesn't have an ideal figure of good at the forefront of their universe? Because that's one of the things that sets them apart from DC. Look at the Avengers. It has a very rotating lineup. Cap is the most common leader, but he wasn't at the beginning, and he hasn't always been since. Even the Wasp's gotten a turn at it. I feel that Superman has a very solid, static place at the top of the DC hierarchy, even if Batman is more powerful now, and it's natural he would be. I don't think Marvel really aspires to that kind of setup.
>>83133259
>That's not the point. though.
The whole idea of "Cyclops was having a mental break down" was one character accusing him of that to his face. A character who in that issue had become a villain. So it's not something to take seriously.
If anything, the concept reused was the post Schism Extinction Team concept: showing humans that mutants can be their best friends and allies, and their worst enemy if you cross them.
This time, he deliberately created a approach where his motivations appeared unclear, to keep people wondering. And cautious.
>>83134432
You think that makes Marvel or DC stories better?
>>83134446
The motivations thing... it was about control. First to last, control. It's a compulsion with Cyclops. For a few reasons.
Cyke going more and more extreme in order to keep his purpose ... after that thing he did ... Well that's part of the big mental breakdown ... as is that thing he did.
And he is having a mental breakdown, he's been having one ever since the first time he lost his reason for living, and everytime that happened since.
Remember "JEEEEAAAAN!!!", well now he doesn't have Jean, doesn't have the Professor, doesn't have being the good guy, not even being an X- Man to distract him.
And when even these last desperate efforts started to fail he accepted his reality, sent his students away, and disbanded his team.
The man finally gave up.
>>83131870
In JLA/X-Men neither the League nor the DC civilians have absolutely any problem with mutants, they see them as fellow heroes.
Meanwhile Marvel civilians try to lynch mob Flash because he saved a kid.
>>83135399
I read the X-Men/StarTrek crossover (timetravel adventure), Kirk was all like;
"Humanity of the future has evolved past that historical hatred of mutants... blaw-blaw-blaw..."
...But I didn't see any mutants on the Enterprise, what happened to them again, Kirk?
>>83135762
The Eugenic War
>>83135399
Marvel has always been a little more realistic in how it portrays politics in a world with superheroes.
>>83135829
...
... KAAAAAAAAAWWWNN!
>>83135855
>Marvel has always been a lot more cynical in how it portrays politics in a world with superheroes.
>>83136062
Truthy, that is horrifying. I could fight the point with specific examples, but you're right about the reaction in theme overall.
But what was DC's take? All I can think of is "What's so Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American Way?" ,the amazingly good Superman story that was actually about responding to Wildstorm's take on superheroes, not 911.
Does any DC superhero ever have to face the kind of horrific moral and ethical bad options that Marvel heroes do???
Did DC cop out of exploring the difficult material?
>>83131870
During the Marvel "Dark Avengers" company-wide storyline, when Norman Osborn was put in charge of all superheroes, he had some choice opinions from time to time, and despite being crazy and evil he was a superhero then.
Then there's Maria Hill, that SHIELD chick from the movies, in the X-Men comics she's had some great lines about how much she hates problems involving mutants, there's an amazing diatribe she makes about how she hates Hank McCoy, Beast, more than any other mutant, but she makes a point of saying it's not a thing about hating mutants in general.
And because I hate Tony Stark, IronMan, I wouldn't put it past him to be a bigot.
>>83136560
>Does any DC superhero ever have to face the kind of horrific moral and ethical bad options that Marvel heroes do???
Almost every issue.
But DC heroes don't crack.
