>DC rightly realizes after years being stuck with Lobdell on Titans Tim's been getting the short end of the stick as far as Robin's go
>made one of the headliners for an event, Future's End, which ends up sucking
>Given his own solo spinning out of it, which conceptually gets shit for being a Beyond book without Terry
>it's also written by Jurgens and mostly consists of him getting his ass beat while other people stop the villains
>after more than two years of build up the groundwork is already being laid for Terry to come back
>In the main continuity he finally escapes Lobdell and Titans only to end up with Tynion
Why can't Tim catch a break lately?
>>82606496
They already have three Robins.
Dick is the most popular and has the luck of being the first Robin. Also his gen of Titans is the most popular and well known so he gets used there.
Jason at least has his dying and coming back, and will probably be in the Batman solo movie, so they keep pushing him even if Lobdell keeps writing him.
Damian is the current Robin and Bruce's bio son.
Tim has nothing that the others don't have.
>>82608787
>Tim has nothing that the others don't have.
except intelligence
which has no place in modern dc
>>82609051
i forgot him being an actual detective
you know
like the writers do
>>82609051
Nerds don't know how to write "intelligent characters" anyway.
>>82608787
I firmly believe there's a place for any character as long as someone's willing to write them competently.
>>82609051
>>82609079
Detective work is the hardest thing to properly write in Bat comics.
>>82609051
All batcharacters are "intelligent".
>>82609232
I don't blame them. Writing detective stuff is really hard, I think. You have to make a mystery that's solvable but not obvious, as well as clues that don't look like they were added in just for the plot. It has to feel genuine as well as be compelling. Anyone have any idea how to do that? I know I can't.
>>82609439
You, nor I, have the staff to help with it. Editors, assistants, even artists who can tell us 'this makes it obvious/is unnecessary/is done well'.
Also, the story of the month vs. storyline dilemma
>>82608787
>luck of being the first Robin
You do know, once apron a time, Robin was not a intern position? How was Dick "lucky" when his character shaped the imitators and also gave birth to the lion share of classic boy-sidekicks?
>>82608787
>luck of being the first Robin
You realize he was literally the one who gave the name Robin, right? To honor his mother?
And his reasoning for hating Bruce was because he felt it was a disrespect to his mother and him for giving away a name that held only a meaning to him?
>>82606496
One day he could be free. Maybe not soon, but one day. One thing I applaud DC on is that they are literally actively trying to Retcon Tim not finding out who batman was on his own.
>>82609051
>except intelligence
It's not like the other three are stupid tho.
>>82610327
>>82610538
Not the same anon, but Dick is popular because he was the first Robin and I actually believe that if he wasn't, he would have ended up in worse place than Tim because he pretty bland character.
>>82610327
>How was Dick "lucky" when his character shaped the imitators and also gave birth to the lion share of classic boy-sidekicks?
He spread like AIDS, funny considering the character only appeals to faggots
>>82606496
Here's a theory: He's not as popular now because he isn't anything other than Robin / Red Robin. Dick is also nightwing, Jason is red hood, and Damian is both Batman's son and an al Ghul.
He just doesn't stand out much from the other Robins.
Yeah the main issue is really that he doesn't have a very interesting post-Robin identity.
>>82611120
He's the Kyle Rayner of Robins.
>>82606496
i hate tim drake i think he's literally the worst robin of them all and a whiny punk ass bitch after reading battle for the cowl & its aftermath.
>>82611120
They should've let Dixon turn him into the next Blue Beetle.
>>82610968
I hate Tim with a fiery passion because he’s a privileged brat with horrifyingly inconsistent characterization who has cheated on his girlfriend, is a dick to his friends, and manages to look like a Mary Sue even while standing next to fucking Batman, and fandom makes me hate him even more by turning him into a whiny uke.
>>82606496
Tim was interesting in his own, but Jason return and Damian introduction made him not stand out much. Which is why dc doesn't seem to have any idea what to with him any more.
>>82611257
This can be applied to literally every Bat-sidekick, though.
>>82611099
But their characters extend deeper into other stories anon. The reason why he isn't popular now is because it's literally garbage writing.
The bit where they took Tim and made him not Tim, where they made everyone except Tim into Tim, is what makes me never want to look at a book related to him ever again. Dick made the Robin Mantle as the joy to offset Batman's seriousness, Jason showed that Robin wasn't just a game and that thinking so could end badly, Tim refined the role and made robin in to something that could actively help Batman and be reliable and Damian is showing that he can actually live up to the standards set by his predecessors.
But they took everything that made Tim into Tim and just shoved it out of existence, The team building, the relationships, the deaths that battered his mind, even his flaws concerning his parents. None of it happened and we're left with a character that has little to no growth and nothing to show that he deserves any kind of recognition.
>>82611281
Tim started going to shit LONG before the reboot though.
>>82611344
As in how far? Young Justice, Year One or Battle for the Cowl?
>>82606496
Harper is a better Tim and Duke is a better Robin even if he isn't a Robin at all
>>82611257
Tim wasn't a bad character and one can argue that his Robin run was the best compared to the other robins, but the writers did go overboard with him sometimes.
I still think that he is much more interesting than Dick to be frank.
>>82611469
>Duke is a better Robin even if he isn't a Robin at all
You're a damn liar!
Why do even people hate Tynion? Not that it's a big thing, but he's better than Snyder.
>>82608787
>Tim has nothing that the others don't have.
Reminder that Tim's Teen Titans have been existing since 2003. 13 years. And New Teen Titans/New Titans (i.e. Dick's Titans) existed for about that long too. They probably figure it's about time to change it.
If the Rebirth TT is well received, or at least not reviled like Lobdell's was, we'll probably see Starfire getting replaced by a more age appropriate character for Damian, like Maya or Emiko. Then Starfire will move to Titans and Damian's Titans will be the Teen Titans, while Tim and his team either continue to be ignored or they relaunch them under a different name (like Young Justice). So Tim may lose Teen Titans too.Beast Boy and Raven will never leave TT though.
>>82611693
>So Tim may lose Teen Titans too.
Thank god I felt so bad reading that shit because there's nothing to Salvage from that Kon or Bar-Tor. Cassie just keep the status quo of wherever she is and who fucking cares about the rest of them. Maybe Tim can stay in the future with Terry and play Oracle to his Batman.
>>82611421
Identity crisis. Tim was supposed to be fan self-insert character, a normal person's window into the superhero world, but then they decided to go all grim and gritty with him because YJ introduced the idea that he was going to be the next Batman and we all know you can't have Batman without "muh darkness". What's worse is that they took even that from him when they decided that he wasn't going to be the next Batman after all.
>>82611481
Growing up with Tim as Robin.
I felt, after reading Tim's progression, That I grew a healthy interest in all the Robins, Even Damian when he was just being a little shit. But Tim is still my Robin and I liked him alot as he grew into earless Batman, fucked up flaws, distorted interpersonal relations and all that good stuff that makes Batman interesting.
>>82611775
Oh yeah I know, New 52 TT was just horrible all around, and Tim's Titans in general are horrible outside of Johns' and a few characters/storylines like Rose/Ravager and Kid Devil.
>>82611693
>So Tim may lose Teen Titans too.
That may be a good thing. I honestly think they have the right idea with what they're doing with him in Rebirth, having him back in Gotham running around with Cass and Steph could be a good thing. Sure, it reeks of 90s nostalgia but the 90s were good for Tim so I'm ok with that.
>>82611583
He wrote a worse Red Hood than Lobdell, subscribes to the Teenage Mutant Ninja Robin philosophy, and shills Harper Row even harder.
>>82611849
>Identity crisis.
I don't honestly thing the bit with Tim being insecure about being Robin after Batman says "no you can't" is out of character for him or the situation though. He didn't exactly volunteer for the position as he was pushed by Dick and Alfred to do it and in the end, despite how how dumb the ghost of christmas past thing was, he was able to do what a robin is supposed to do and help him out of a bad situation, which ends in him accepting it.
Yeah that was a dumb story, but not out right horrible.
>>82611693
Yeah that was stupid, but in hindsight I think it did build and set him up for better things. After the fact, he actually does become his own batman in Red Robin with full on Ra's support.
>>82612229
woops, was meant for
>>82611849
>>82606496
Because he's the worst Robitn.
>>82612061
>He didn't exactly volunteer for the position as he was pushed by Dick and Alfred to do it
They didn't force him and Batman was completely against it actually.
>>82612298
Oh please, that title is a coin toss between Stephanie and Jason.
>>82612320
Stephanie yes.
Jason no.
>>82612313
No they didn't force him, but he was adamant about trying to get other people that Bruce actually trusted to see reason and help the man. Dick got fucked up for it and advised him to do it. And even after that Tim was full on "It's just a temporary thing that needs to be done for the better of everyone else, until you find someone you actually accept to replace me"
He even had to go get training, which he ended up getting from a Master Assassin.
>>82612352
>As Robin
As Robin? Not Red Hood or after the fact but as Robin?
>>82609051
>>82609103
>>82609235
Pic related is canon so it's not like he's that smart. Most "smart" people have a higher IQ.
>>82612583
That's... that's nothing. That's laughable. Why even state it at that point? Tim's supposed to be on par with the likes of Mr. Terrific, Batman and Luthor.
>>82612502
Yes, as Robin because I actually bothered to read his run and find out if he was bad which turn out that he wasn't.
>>82612583
The funniest part is that I'm fairly sure the reasoning for not making him a super genius is because then people can't relate to him at all.
A far cry from the kid who deduced who batman and robin were from a young age and matched wits with Ra's Al Ghul.
>>82611959
DC doesn't know what to do with Red Hood and doesn't care since Jasonfags continue consuming stupidity. His non-Bat/Snyder-free work has been good.
>>82612678
Yeah but i mean... That's rough. I'd wager that's like in the tenth percentile or something. I actually think it's lower than mine. How are we supposed to be impressed. Not that I value IQ or anything but the writers want us to buy into that "IQ=tech&computer genius" fantasy, yet at the same time, gives us nothing to look up to. That's the comic book equivalent of a porn guy being marketed as having a 6 incher. Kind of a dumb move on their part, really. But I guess that's more a matter of not looking up what the standard values and thresholds are.
>>82612583
I remembered reading this and thinking the same as
>>82612678
They killed the only thing that made him special. Funniest part is, as Tim was written as the smartest, I'm pretty sure that would make Dick and Jason average in terms of intelligence which, again, would fuck up their canon.
>>82612811
No that's my point, in making him that people can go "Oh my god I can do it too!" and then self insert harder then any one ever could. If he had shit like 200+ then it's like they have no chance in hell relating to him. As if they ever had a chance relating to a 10/10 acrobat, A guy who died and came back to life and a Kid trained by assassin's with a private island.
>>82612871
>would fuck up their canon.
No I think it could match up well enough. They're all above average intelligence, but Tim would be on par with Luthor, Ra's and Batman. Of course, as said before, no one writing him knows how to write being a detective rather then some generic power ranger insert.
>>82612895
That's kind of a paradox, though, isn't it? A realistic insert? Aren't insert supposed to be Mary Sues, especially in such mainstream comics where their goal would be to pander to kids who think they are way smarter than they think? I mean, I used to be one of those kids, and none of them wants to identify to the average guy who climbed up the proverbial ladder through hard work - they all want to be the wonderkid.
>>82611120
Eh, not really. Look at Dick, for him it's basically holding him back. He lacks a post Robin direction is the problem, which honestly is the same boat as Dick. Dick was at his best when he was either filling in for Bruce or in more esoteric roles.
>>82613589
I actually liked Tim's transition into Red Robin in the fact that it was a play on his situation of disconnecting with his family so that he could go do the thing that he believed was right. His taking up of the mantle didn't feel so forced as it felt kinda right that he took it up as something that means something to him.
>>82612895
Jason is the one that a lot of teens relate to because of his anger issues and I even remember some kid once said that him and his friends really love Red Hood because they find him relatable.
