Apologize
>>82552390
Not my fault you became batman
>>82554093
>Protects the person who killed his mother
Nah, cap was in the wrong, m8.
>>82552390
You roped a 15 year old into a battle without telling him what was actually going on.
Fuck outta 'ere
>>82552390
fuck you
>>82555275
>>82555334
bucky pls go
>>82552390
apologize that you're an overpaid quipster? No thanks, bucko.
>>82552390
Tony was right
fuck cap
fuck bucky
fuck Black Widow
Ironman could take Cap or Bucky on one on one and win. He nearly beat them both two on one. Iron Man won as far as I'm concerned.
>>82555354
someone's jealous
>>82552390
#TEAMCAP
>>82555384
AHAHAHAHAAHAHAAHAHA
>>82555245
He was brainwashed though he didn't do it consciously, he was fucked up and now without the brainwash he was remorseful.
Also Steve prevented Tony from killing him, whatever Bucky did he still didn’t deserve being murdered by Tony.
>>82555384
He had a power suit full of lasers and rockets and he lost to two strong guys. He lost, and he lost like a bitch.
>>82555347
No, Bucky was remorseful about the shit he did.
>>82555443
I still don't get that, he could build something like the Hulkbuster and he went one on one with Thor but he jobbed hard to Steve and Bucky?
>>82552390
Cap was friends with Bucky, fine. They grew up together. Fine. But he has started a team with Tony, they've saved the world together, fought along side eachother, it just boggles my mind that Cap was so adamant on being against Tony after all Tony had been through.
That's one thing the comic and movie shared. Tony was right.
>>82555354
>bucko
i see what you did there, Mister Lee
>>82555245
>Murder people instead of arrest them
Cap was right.
And Bucky would probably be acquitted seeing as how he didn't have free will for the better part of a century and didn't chose to do that shit.
>>82555443
He beat Bucky into the fucking ground and was going to finish Steve but Bucky was a cheap little bitch. Tony should've taken his other arm when he had the chance.
>>82555384
Completely agree. Iron Man also had multiple opportunities to kill Cap, but didn't because he's still his friend.
>>82555432
Being sorry isn't going to bring his family back. Fuck your reasons, he lost his parents and honestly? If I was in Iron Mans shoes I would have killed everyone Bucky has ever loved.
>>82555487
>Cap was right
yea ok cause Cap has never murdered anyone right? Not to mention when proof Bucky was back to his winter soldier ways, whether it was true or not he should have brought him in, it's exactly like what Rhody said on the highway. "Congratulations Cap. You're a criminal."
>>82555501
Bucky didn't kill his parents. The people who controlled Bucky did.
>>82555468
everyone else got nerfed on his favor in those other fights
>>82555443
He has this at his disposal. He held back a ton.
>>82555487
Good luck proving brainwashing in a court of law. The facility and whatever evidence is in ruins now.
>>82555519
tony go away
>>82555519
Movie cap has never hunted somebody down to kill them, no. He defends himself and will kill in a fight, but that isn't what Tony was doing.
And the after-credits show that Cap's way to handle it was the right one. Bucky is safely contained, bad guys were stopped, etc.
Tony literally did nothing wrong. He wasn't even the one who was being a dick, it was Ross. Also, did Cap really distrust Tony SO MUCH that he didn't think Tony would have believed him if he had just turned himself in and told him about Winter Soldier's plan? Fuck you, Steve, you are not a bro.
>>82555494
this, bucky got his ass kicked all over that movie and I loved every minute of it
I'm somewhere in the middle for the Bucky killed the Starks argument. If I were Tony I'd have killed him for sure too. But the argument that he was brainwashed is valid, it wasn't BUCKY Bucky doing it but it was proven he is still a volatile and damaged and violent individual who could snap very easily. Really if Tony had finished Bucky off, it would probably be the safest option. Props to Bucky for putting himself back under at least,
>>82555501
>Iron Man also had multiple opportunities to kill Cap, but didn't because he's still his friend.
And Cap could have driven his shield into Stark's neck after his helmet came off, but he didn't. They both pulled punches.
>>82555575
Tony gave power to Ross, it was his decision. If Ross is a dick with it, Tony is still to blame.
>>82555532
It wouldn't have fit in the bunker/lab. Also, how long would the Hulkbuster; or any suit for that matter; take in transit to get there?
>>82555551
First you Steve.
>>82555565
Yea but Tony had every right to. Again Bucky is a damaged and mentally fragile and downright dangerous individual. Cap was not right,the entire movie could have been solved diplomatically if Cap had been willing to sit down and talk, but he basically just said peace out and started a war.
>>82555532
hulkbuster got ridiculously buffed to make ironman look cool, even if it takes making the hulk look like a bitch
>>82555520
>Bucky didn't do it
>Despite his body bashing Tony's father head into the ground
>Despite chocking his mother to death
You can say he didn't do it all you want. His physical body murdered them. Being brain washed doesn't absolve you of the sins you committed. You still did them. It happened, no amount of being "Sorry" is going to undo the things you did.
>>82555471
You act like Cap wasn't also on a team with Bucky and helped save the world from Nazi scum during WW2.
>>82555596
Bullshit, Ross is the Secretary of State.Tony didn't give him shit. It's like Tony said, even if they all didn't sign the Accords, the world governments were going to force it upon them eventually. And just because the Avengers wouldn't get in board doesn't mean the government couldn't recruit other metas (or create more). Remember, the planet is crawling with Inhumans now. The Avengers are powerful but not unique. Tony was just thinking about the team's long term safety.
>>82555642
Actually, yes, having no control over actions does absolve you of the actions you take.
>>82552390
Tony a shit.
>>82555659
Tony has literally told congress to go fuck themselves multiple times. He wasn't required to sign the accords.
>>82555432
He wasn't sorry
But worst of all captain knew and he didn't tell him
That's just as bad as killing his parents
>>82555642
>Being brain washed doesn't absolve you of the sins you committed
>>82555647
I'm not trying to downplay that, I'm just saying that through the chitari and Loki and Ultron, I really feel like Cap should have been a bit more... in the middle between Tony and Bucky. Especially considering he knew about Tony's parents and didn't tell him, frankly a great deal of the movie including the conflict between Bucky and Tony can be attributed to Steve
>>82552390
1. Captain let several people die by losing it in the beginning
2. Kills several more trying to save Bucky
3. Doesn't know spider man but tries to kill him
4. Tony finds out Bucky killed his parents and captain knew all along and didn't tell him
5. Tony had every right to be angry about his parents murder and instead of it being 1v1 on bucky, captain gangs up on Tony and almost kills Tony
Captain Communist
>>82555633
Some incarnations are even bigger and most of Tony's armors do look cool. There's a reason his merch sells like hotcakes.
>>82555838
Tony just stop
The ONLY thing Tony did wrong was try to kill Bucky at the end. Other than that he was 100% objectively correct. A private paramilitary force with nuclear-level destructive capability answerable to no one is completely insane,
If Steve had just signed the accords instead of bitching off because Wanda had to stay inside for a bit, they could have easily worked together to stop Zemo. Steve was an arrogant, stubborn tool.
>>82555838
Also
On top of all that
Everything that captain did that he thought was just
Was put to shit when Bucky decided to go to sleep anyway
They should have just let him go to maximum security from the beginning
Captain communist a shit
How many people died due to captains terrible views?
>>82555838
>let people die
He's not god. He blames himself for not being perfect, but how many people were being killed before they even showed up. Those guys weren't carrying nerf guns.
>Tries to kill Spiderman
Nope. Not even close to murder.
>Cap knew Tony's parent's were murdered
Makes no sense for him not to tell Tony, sure. Dumb, but that makes him a dick, not wrong.
>Every right to murder the guy, without due process, who had no control over himself due to being captured during a war and brainwashed
Not even remotely true. He had every right to capture, maybe beat down, Bucky. Not kill. Cap was right to stop him.
>>82555384
Ironman won? Do the winners usually sit on the ground after the fights over and watch their opponents walk away because they can't stand and fight back any more? I dunno man, I think your logic is back-assward
>>82555487
>Arrest people
>You have no jurisdiction doing such unless you sign the paper
>Still goes on to break the law by being a Vigilante while trying to claim the high ground
Lel.
>>82555929
>Every right to murder the guy, without due process, who had no control over himself due to being captured during a war and brainwashed
No one said that dumbass
Anyway, Tony was supposed to bring them in to be put in maximum security
And they should
They are both a loose cannon who don't think like civilized human beings
How can you defend a piece of shit like captain?
>>82555907
But answering to a government is A OK.
Sure there last government was corrupt as fuck, but whatevs. Now the Avengers have to handle contract murders because the people they answer too demand it.
>>82555732
>>82555682
Do you also believe brain washed ISIS terrorists did nothing wrong?
>>82555907
This is the neatest most rational sum up I think.
>>82555886
that guy is clearly embellishing but the general ideas of what he's saying are true.
I don't think its really captain communist though, Steve pretty much proved his namesake in the sense he told everyone to fuck themselves and believed he was right no matter what proof he was presented with.
Captain 'Murrica indeed
>all these autistic arguments trying to defend ironman
>>82555948
Cap won the fight but Tony won the war. I'm a fan of IM and think Cap and Bucky should go fuck themselves but I can admit that by the end if Cap wanted to he could had bashed Tony's head in. Pisses me off to admit that though.
>>82555948
>>82555384
>implying Zemo didn't win
>>82555659
This. Its happened multiple times in both DC and Marvel where the main fighting force gets to powerful, the Governments have to create an alternate team just to stand up to them if they go rouge.
>>82555501
>If I was in Iron Mans shoes I would have killed everyone Bucky has ever loved.
>killing innocent people that had nothing to do with a brainwashed man's crimes just to spite him
That would make you even worse than him.
>>82556094
>Tony won the war
how? by walking away with no consequences? that's literally him after he fucks up big time in every movie he's in
>>82552390nonever
>>82555384
It's like you really didn't understand shit from the whole movie.
>>82556211
no by his side winning and the avengers becoming sanctioned into the law. Pretty similar ending to the comic. Which again Tony lost the fight but won the war.
>>82556047
>Wants a private organization to have unchecked power
Capfag pls.
>>82556101
Actually, that's a respectable stand point as well. His plan didn't work out 100% what he wanted but it certainly disassembled them that's for damn sure.
>>82556384
>wants potentially corrupt governments to have full control over every super human in the country
Starkfag pls
>>82556384
>wanting all that power as your kill squad
Ross pls.
>>82556101
this is the only correct answer
None of them were right, everyone was wrong, except Spidey.
I'm with Donatello.
>He's Right. He's Right. They're both right.
Despite being good guys, just trying to do the right thing, in today's self gratifying society they're guaranteed to become pariahs if just one innocent death is their fault by way of collateral damage.
This movie was the first we saw the Avengers stick around long enough after their mayhem to begin rescue and recovery services (and even this was limited to a singular call).
Imagine how many more lives they would actually save if we saw them sticking around, using their powers/tech to save the lives caught in the aftermath.
Oh sure, Tony bought a building he demolished in his fight with the Hulk, but you know the damage only escalated once it became Tony vs Hulk.
And who are they held accountable to? Who cleans up their messes or punishes them for breaking international laws? In the glory days, bureaucrats would be shunned by the general populace for coming down on a selfless hero; but these aren't the glory days.
Cap isn't wrong either. The UN sits on it's ass and slowly deliberates on thousands of crises every day. Why don't they take immediate action when addressing the world's problems? Political enmity between members that propagates posturing and inaction. Cap was right that the UN could decide to order a stand-down.
Certainly, the UN provides a lot of disaster relief, but imagine if Ultron was attacking a nation the US objected to Avenger involvement. The US reps get a majority vote to have the team sit this crisis out... until the US got what it wanted. Meanwhile, thousands or millions die while the Avengers would be forced to wait.
TLDR: Go team Spider-Man.
>>82556449
>Wants to be the lapdog of a country instead of serving mankind as whole
Starkfag plz.
>>82556633
>helping a terrorist because he's "your best buddy"
Capfag plz get out
>>82556666
>being gung ho about gubbament, but then wanting to murder without trial
>stankfag leave
>>82556666
Quads prove Tony was right, fuck Cap
>>82556713
Bucky deserve to die for all the crimes he did. Fuck trials.
>>82556033
Mind control is fictional, son.
>>82556713
Bucky would likely be sentenced to death or at the very least be thrown away for the rest of his life, or hell even be extradited considering all the terrorism he committed internationally. He is still a dangerous volatile mentally impaired individual.
>>82556796
And still deserves a trial and not in the hands of Tony.
>>82556033
ISIS aren't subjected to fucking sci-fi mind control bullshit, you fucking moron.
>>82556826
maybe from some standpoints, but from the personal standpoint that we saw, Tony would have an ironclad (pardon the pun) legal defense based on what he saw, it's more than enough for a defense of essentially a crime of passion or anger. Any average prudent person would have reacted the same way that Tony did.
>>82556853
that we know of
The Winter Soldier is a separate personality, forced into the body of Bucky Barnes through years of torture at the hands of HYDRA; the fact that he chooses to be put under until the Winter Soldier can be removed from his mind is proof enough of this fact. Bucky is free of blame for the same reason Clint was left blameless after being freed from Loki's control, or how Bruce wasn't really to blame for what happened in Africa after Wanda messed with him.
That being said, I don't blame Tony for not being able to think so rationally on the matter after watching footage of how his parents were murdered. I can sympathize with Cap's decision to keep the fact that WS was the one who took him out, but I also feel that there's merit in the argument that telling him before they found Bucky may have given Tony enough time to calm down and look at things rationally--assuming he didn't just up and do what Black Panther did through most of the movie.
>>82552390
Sorry.
Still "Team Cap", though. Rogers qt-powers are just too strong.
>>82556449
>>82556458
>Watched over by over 110 countries
>Believes a single one will be able to tell the others what to do in that scenario
>When most of them will do everything in there power to stop the others from getting more control over them
Pls. They have tons of things keeping them in check under the UN and stopping one country from getting control over the team.
>>82556946
exactly. Cap was largely at fault for the entire ordeal, he really should have just told Tony from the beginning.
>>82556033
youre actually retarded arent you anon?
>>82557037
This is under the assumption that Tony wasn't going to pull a T'Challa and immediately go after Bucky with the intent to kill and refuse to listen to reason. I feel like seeing what happened to the team kind of helped Tony look at things rationally. If he'd gone off right after the events of TWS he might not have had that kind of moment to reflect
>>82557204
I dunno, Tony found out RIGHT at his most mentally volatile, I mean lets keep in mind he was still dealing with trying to help the government, his best friend was recently paralyzed, all of his friends are fighting, and suddenly hes shown a video by a villain of his father getting hes face beat in and is told by a good friend of his he had always known.
I can totally see your point but I can't help but feel he would have reacted with less animocity had Steve told him from the beginning.
>>82556762
>>82556853
>>82557125
Bucky wasn't controlled by a psychic or any of that magic shit. They used actual methods that exist.
Modern countries can brain wash someone in much the same way Bucky was controlled. Ask North Korea and China.
ISIS can brain wash in the same way that they do in the movie (Via Pain and Propaganda).
>>82557310
I feel like there would have been less animosity, but once again, he probably would have been just like T'Challa throughout the film.
>>82557374
I dont believe you.
does anyone else realize that tony should have known that the shot he was taking when he bane'd warmachine wasn't clear. most fighter pilots would not have taken that shot.
>>82557374
nigga the real world is not the Manchurian candidate.
>>82557416
The human mind is a very fragile thing really, traumatizing emotional trauma can cause one to literally diassociate from reality which leaves behind a blank slate that can be programmed, in otherwords torture the shit out of someone to give them a second personality that you can control like a puppet or even have it overwrite the original personality.
>>82557434
I thought Vision was the one who took the shot?
>>82557490
then that's even worse.
>>82557488
you've seen to many movies
>>82552390
I'm will always be in the camp of captain america but damn did I feel bad for Tony at the end
He didn't deserve to be shit on so much
>>82555468
The Mark 45, the suit used in the later parts of Ultron, was noted as being pure Vibrianum, and as strong and tough as the Hulkbuster.
He was using the Mark 46 in this movie.
WHY WAS THE FUCKING SUIT SUCH A GODDAMN DOWNGRADE?
>>82555621
No. Bucky was innocent of the bombing, which is why he was being hunted (with orders to kill on sight, I might add).
And Bucky was not in control of his actions when HYDRA ordered him to kill.
So Tony doesn't have any right to.
>>82557557
he created a genocidal monster through his own arrogance. he deserves worse
>>82557434
what? it was Vision... and he only fucked up cause Wanda was giving him a robot boner
>>82557386
you could be right, I mean either way it would have at least left Cap and Tony's relationship less shattered. And again I think it was as much the way Tony found out as what he found out that really put him so over the edge.
Either way can we just quickly acknowledge the amazing performance RDJ put in? Sure he's always great as Iron Man but he really added to his character in this one, we saw Tony in so many of his moods, emotions and vulnerability.
>>82557434
>>82557490
>>82557522
He was trying to impress his waifu, but he should haveseen that coming
>>82555754
Bucky is a level above all of Steve's other relationships, brah.
Only Peggy and possibly Howard back then would've ranked as high.
>>82552390
I liked how Tony fighting with the Cap and Bucky wasn't forced.It wasn't something forced because of the accords forcing them, it was an instinctual emotional response that could be right or wrong depending upon how you look at it.It was brilliantly done and I liked the way everyone was acting in it. Black Panther was a surprise hit. I really like the way they portrayed him and he is very different from his Illuminate version in the comics.
>>82557488
Most psychologists will tell you that multiple personalities are not a real thing, senpai.
>>82557586
Tony absolutely had the right to, you would have done the same thing. And it doesn't change the fact that Bucky is still a damaged and dangerous individual. And Bucky running away made him seem more guilty if he and Steve had gone in, worked with Tony and the government, the avengers wouldnt have disassembled and went to war, all the resources would have been put towards figuring out what really was going on and Zemo would have been defeated by the collective efforts, and Tony also wouldnt have been in such a crazy mindset
>>82557561
>was noted as being pure Vibrianum
I dont remember that part
>>82557416
Do you even know what a cult is?
>>82555487
>>82555519
Except that the ink on the accords wasn't even dry and they were already doing some sneaky shit with the "Trial, what trial?" line. The accords weren't even signed and they were already having people put under house arrest and shit.
>>82557646
ohvertebraesnap
>>82556666
>terrorist
>has not done anything in over two years of being out in the world
>was framed
>was not in control of his actions when he was a weapon of terror
Tony, go hit the bottle.
>>82557679
no but DiD is
>>82557677
agreed, arguably the best marvel movie to date, everyone played their part perfectly.
>>82557663
Come on now, Tony's friendship still should have been worth more to Cap than what he made it out to be.
>>82556908
No they wouldn't.
>Natasha changes to Caps side
>Black Panther changes to Caps side
>Rhodey is crippled
>Vision is questioning himself
Fuck off Tony. You got no one.
>>82557828
He still has Spidey
>>82557784
>boo hoo I was framed and am mental
>I g-g-get triggered from words
>it's not my faaaaault, steve heeeeeelp
>I was brainwashed so I should get off scott free with no reprucussions or imprisonment
Bucky you can take that big metal arm and stick in right up your ass
>>82557861
A kid who was beat by Cap.
>>82557819
yea they would have
>>82557557
Speaking objectively, the movie shat on EVERYONE.
Nobody was wrong, nobody was right, everybody suffered.
>>82557814
DiD is a controversial diagnosis at best.
>>82555838
It feels like you didn't even watch the movie.
1. Cap doesn't kill anyone or 'let' anyone die.A guy literally suicide bombs them.
2.He doesn't kill anyone trying to save Bucky, that was the point of all the action sequences. Cap was Jackie Chan-ing it up to protect both sides.
3. He doesn't try to kill Spiderman, he tries to pin him and ends up only proving how strong Spiderman is.
4. Cap didn't know that Bucky was the one that kill them, in WS he found out that Hydra was responsible for that.
5.Tony leads the fight by shooting cap into a wall while putting his helmet back on. He goes into the fight wanting to take them both on, and its only midway through the fight that Iron Man tells Cap to stand down.
>>82557748
It's not what Bucky was subjected to.
>>82552390
Honestly, what I liked about the end fight is I'd do the same thing Cap did if I was in his position, and I'd do the same thing Stark did if I was in his position. I felt as if there wasn't exactly a person who was "right".
>>82557561
>The Mark 45, the suit used in the later parts of Ultron, was noted as being pure Vibrianum, and as strong and tough as the Hulkbuster.
It literally wans't.
You can't use your headcanon to scream DOWNGRADE.
>>82557828
>Won't change because of "Mah Pride"
Cap is literally one opinion away from being a villain.
>>82557897
Peter came out the best out of the whole situation
No jail time, fight with some of the biggest heroes in the world, upgrade from his onesie, and an awesome spidey light now
>>82557619
>and he only fucked up cause Wanda was giving him a robot boner
Man that must be solid.
Specially with his power to control density.
>>82557619
>less shattered
Let's be real, the next time they speak to each other--besides calling for backup in order to save the world--is going to be something along the lines of, "The Winter Soldier killed my parents, not Bucky Barnes."
Why are murder apologists like Steve fags so stupid?
>>82557814
>Come on now, Tony's friendship still should have been worth more to Cap than what he made it out to be.
No it wouldn't have. Not when pitted against Bucky.
They are brothers. Tony is just a trusted friend and colleague.
>>82556382
Steve just wanted to stop Zemo and prove Bucky's innocence. He ended up fighting Tony and his team on the way but that was never his intention. Despite the name of the movie there was never an actual war.
Tony is an edgy cunt tßh
>>82557882
to be fair Spidey is only 15 and more or less stalemates cap, cap won the fight technically but, still pretty good showing for a kid
How do you justify punishing someone before a crime?
>>82557719
>Tony absolutely had the right to, you would have done the same thing.
No, it's not. Even if any person would act on impulse at that moment, it doesn't make their actions right in the eyes of the law.
>And Bucky running away made him seem more guilty if he and Steve had gone in
They were going to kill him.
Those swats that came into his apartment opened fire immedaitely.
>>82556033
I Think you're confused as to the degree of mind control here anon, Bucky wasnt just convinced killing for hydra was the right thing. He was essentially unconscious while people used his body like a marionette doll to kill people.
>>82556101
Partially but not completely. He wanted them to essentially fight to the death consumed with revenge but they both ended up being above it. While yes, their friendship is damaged and their unit broken, the ending shows that both sides still respect the other. And in the end, it's gonna be that very respect that brings the Avengers back stronger than ever in Infinity War.
>>82557891
No, he doesn't.
Bucky was not an agressor, he wasn't trying to kill Tony back, he was acting in self defense until things continued to escalate.
Tony was outright trying to muder him based on an irrational, emotional impulse, not operating under any kind of law.
I for one completely agree with Tony.
>>82558005
Well then Cap is a piece of garbage and an idiot considering he and Tony have been through arguably more than even Steve and Bucky depending on how you look at it
>>82558017
But the way he did it was all wrong, again if Cap and Bucky had gone in willingly then everyone would have been working together, theyd have believed Cap more and theyd have pooled their resources and come out of it (more) as friends
>>82558143
I disagree, I think Captain America is right, because American Citizens are morally superior to the rest of the world.
>>82557679
DID and MPD is a real thing though.
>>82557034
>>Watched over by over 110 countries
In fairness, "110+ countries think that oversight is a good idea" is not the same thing as "110+ countries each get a say in that oversight."
>>82558069
it literally does though, it is a real and effectual defense in court.
and yea, Im saying Steve should have brought him in, they wouldnt have blown this dude's brains out if fucking captain amaerica walked out and said Ive arrested this man, then gone to Tony and them and the avengers would have solved it together.
>>82558122
Any average person if they saw some dude beat their parents heads in and he was right next to them would probably do exactly what Tony did, literally anyone would act like that. And again tell that to all the families winter soldier destroyed, all the lives he ended. whether he was in control of his faculties or not he should be (and would be) incarcerated for the rest of his life if he didn't just out and out get the death penalty.
>>82558143
>compares Tony to Hitler
Butthurt Hilary supporter detected
>>82557374
No he wasnt exposed to real world methods, they dug into his skull and rewired his brain. He had zero control. You can't create programming like that in the real world, especially to people that know about it and doesnt like it.
>>82555432
If he were blackout drunk and killed them would he not be charged with manslaughter?
>>82558225
Time was of the essence though. They didn't have time to go into custody and try and explain everything while the paperwork of approval to go was being processed. They needed to go stop Zemo now. Steve tried to explain that to Tony at the airport and he wouldn't listen. If Tony had trusted Steve that they needed to go stop Zemo now they would have teamed up but he didn't.
>thinking that it's good to have 100% uncompromising moral principles
*tips*
>>82558420
Getting drunk would be his own choice, and the level of mental impairment still isnt comparable. His body was entirely on autopilot and he had zero influence over anything that happened.
>>82558461
but by that point Steve had pushed Tony too far, he had basically dodged Tony at every point to sit down and Talk, now Zemo kind of fucked them when he masqueraded as the doctor but by that point Steve had at least an idea of what was going on, right there was the time to be diplomatic rather than start a war. Tony wasn't just gonna not listen to him, all of them could have worked together.
>>82558420
Brilliant comparison. Mind control is obviously the same thing has getting drunk.
>Ross gets angry that Thor left and didn't leave a note.
Last time I checked he didn't need to?
>>82558512
>>82558516
It's his fault for letting himself be captured by Hydra. I like people who aren't captured, he should be charged with treason
>>82558516
Actually being drunk is like mind control only its your more primitive parts of your brain pulling the strings.
>>82558545
>Trump is Team Tony
B A S E D
>>82557590
That was Wandas fault, you faggot
>>82557872
>im gonna call this character a pussy
>that's a great argument
tonyfags everyone
>>82559647
>I'm gonna call a lunatic mental terrorist a good guy
Capfags everyone
>>82555432
>and now without the brainwash he was remorseful.
Then maybe he could've said, I dunno, "Sorry." during the fight.
>>82559815
Bucky is a good man that horrible shit keeps happening to. Cry about it.
>>82559972
>good man
>Murder
>Good Man
Kek
>>82558375
it looked more like electroshock therapy, which can wipe out memories.
with the old memories gone, the handler is free to install new ones.
when the subject starts to reconsider the righteousness of its own actions, rinse and repeat.
zola's weakened super soldier serum keeps him from turning into a (frozen) veggie
>>82559577
the staff is what melded tony's will (and possibly banner's and thanos' and even possibly loki's will from avengers 1) with ultron to make spaedertron (in the deleted scenes of aou, there's a deactivated ultron drone in strucker's base).
the end of aou indicates that thanos is aware of what's happening on earth. the staff is the only thing that could give him this power.
the staff appears to have the mind gem (blue) and appears to have mind gem powers but in actuality contains the reality gem (orange), which is a magic reality altering device.
in gotg we see thanos in near seclusion in a strangely non threatening posture, getting visibly annoyed at intrusions ... it's possible he was concurrently watching over earth and that's why he was so alone and getting irritated by interruptions.
when the reality gem was separated from the mind staff, thanos lost his sight and this is what causes him to put on the gauntlet and start the infinity war.
here's to hoping thanos lives up to the hype!
>>82562465
The reality stone is the Ether from Thor 2.
>>82555245
how did cap know this?
No seriously how did CAP knew Buckey killed his parents? when did this happen?
>>82555532
Him bringing in the HB would be the equivalent to using nukes to stop an inner city gang fight.
>>82555582
And yet Stank built a killer AI death robot and pretty much got a slap on the wrist after saying, "Whoops, my bad."
The amount of deaths caused by Stank's murder bot completely outweighs the deaths Bucky did while brainwashed.
>>82562659
Probably something the Widow found out when she divulged SHIELD/Hydra secrets and was probably something they opted to not put in the public eye to try. Doing this they thought it would save Tony's feelings and keep him from going off the wagon again.
>>82562659
He knew Hydra was behind it since WS. Maybe the files Nat got for him had more details.
I don't believe he was lying when he said he didn't know Bucky did it, but he probably suspected it.
>>82562604
i think the aether is actually the power gem and maybe the asgardians are confused (-not hard to explain since the reality gems are elements that predate the universe).
the aether is red and grants super powers. the power stone is red and grants super powers.
if the aether were the reality gem, malekith would have succeeded the second he took it upon his body ... not that thor 2 made much sense otherwise.
>>82563162
Isn't the orb the power gem though?
You know, everything could've been avoided if Steve just talked to Tony when theu got Bucky.
Like just told him "Dude we got Bucky but let's keep it on the down low for now." I'm damn sure Tony would've listened.
Hell, why didn't he tell Natasha?
Also, even if he tells it to Tony and Bucky gets put back in jail. Again. They could still go out to stop Zemo.
>>82564565
Because if he did then there wouldn't have been a fight. A problem with a lot of hero vs hero fights is that rational behavior is discarded.
>>82564665
>>82564565
It's cause it was suggested by a black man and Steve was raised to discard their opinions.
>>82562976
>>82563088
>>82562659
In winter soldier, Zola showed Cap in the montage of all the stuff hydra has done since infiltrating sheild. Bucky killing toys parents was part of it.
I want to hug Tony and tell him everything will be allright.It won't.
>>82552390
I apologize for believing you had reason
>>82563782
aw poo. i can't see a way to make the color coding work.
the orb being purple coincides with the space gem (which presents an interesting way to reintroduce ronan), but the tesseract doesn't really work as anything else. i guess it could also be a cosmic cube but why would thanos sacrifice either the reality gem or the soul gem to get that?
maybe to sate his curiosity? (beyonder egg side story) ...but that seems silly even for thanos.
speaking of which, i REALLY hope we get to see the red skull and the nazis in some weird dimension before the mcu is rebooted. even if it's just as a cameo in thor 3. now there's a tremendous story opportunity! what would those survivors be like under the red skulls leadership in a strange alien land? especially if there are allies mixed among them!
Does anyone have the link for the airport fight?
>>82566870
>Infinity War
>Thanos: I brought some presentsfor you
>Red Skull, Ultron, Ronan and Malekith are brought back as Thanos' generals
>each one have a hidden agendaI just want to avoid blacked order from being used
>>82558420
He would.
Difference is that Bucky wasn't going to be charged, he was going to be killed.
Fucking worst part is that the other two anons who replied to you didn't catch that, jesus fuck some of you make it hard to hold an argument.
Honestly, while Tony was made a few mistaken assumptions and was wrong about Bucky initially, I feel like Steve was more of a dick about everything in this movie and that it's mostly his fault.
>>82567917
You can't blame a man for trying to protect the smile of someone who's dear to him.
>>82567917
Yes. Tony only crossed the line at the end, but Steve might have been able to stop him more peacefully if he hadn't already made so much bad blood between them.
>>82555384
www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYGxWGduCCQ
>>82556600
And of course, you always have to worry about Hydra infiltration in the UN.
>>82555575
Did Cap distrust Tony Stank so much? One word.... Ultron. After that disaster, I think Steve would be totally justified in ignoring the shit out of anything Tony said would protect the world. Face it, Tony Stark is a less hairy version of Mojo Jojo.
DAYLIGHT
>>82557828
>Vision is questioning himself
Because he fucked up. I don't think he ever questioned that cooperation with the government was wrong.
>>82552390
No. I will instead make excuses and say that Bucky didn't do nuthin. Sure, I could comfort you about what you just witnessed, but you're a 46 year old man, so that would be pretty gay
Did Vision want to fuck Scarlet Witch?
Did anyone else feel like Natasha had way better chemistry with Cap than the blonde?
What the heck is this Tonyfag argument about Bucky needing to be punished? I get the idea that people in-universe would think that, but we all know what happened to him. How he was turned into a weapon. I don't understand how your personal sense of justice tells you he should be held responsible for acts that were essentially done TO him, no by him.
How contrarian do you have to be to think that someone being mind controlled doesn't excuse them from their actions?
Cap was certainly in the wrong for not telling him though.
>>82558298
Also, consider for a moment that they do. How often do you think those 110+ countries ideas are going to come into alignment on how the Avengers, if they should at all, intervene?
Ever heard of Rwanda? The UN has too many voices to act quickly enough for them to be truly effective. There being no oversight for the Avengers is risky, but it's better than the presented alternative.
>>82568645
>What the heck is this Tonyfag argument about Bucky needing to be punished?
He didn't have one.
He called him a Manchurian Candidate when they were infiltrating the Siberian complex, so he understood that Bucky's escape rampage wasn't his fault.
It's just, y'know,25 years of thinking your parents went one way, when their end wasn't nearly as tidy is bound to mess you up.
I mean, he spent 17 years of that quarter century drinking, fucking, and handing Stane dozens of weapons to fund his drinking and fucking so he wouldn't have to deal with the regret that he never told his mom and dad that he loved them one last time.
But Cap really should have consoled him better or at least told him about the truth of the assassination in the two year period between TWS and CW.
>>82568601
>Did Vision want to fuck Scarlet Witch?
Yes, it was not even subtle
>>82569104
Don't forget that 5 countries have the power to veto almost anything. So even if a majority come to an agreement, one of them can just say fuck off.
>>82569528
No, Tony in the movie, I get. When I aid "Tonyfag" I meant in every thread there's like one or 2 guys who seem to want to argue that being brainwashed doesn't make Bucky less guilty.
Anyone have that comic of Cap, Tony, and Bucky beating the shit out of BvS Batman and Superman?
>>82569528
See, that's the really fucked up part. Because I thought by the next Avengers movie, Steve would tell Tony what he had found out.
>>82558545
>did his job in WWII and went after the enemy
>got jumped with bullshit Hydra tesseract weapons and captured along with rest of platoon and experimented on
>falls out of a fucking train, losing his arm in the fall and getting knocked the fuck out from the fall
>literally incapable of getting away when Hydra fucks drag his broken body away
>probably half-dead, incoherent, and sufferring brain damage/serious concussion
>programming and cryo-freezing begins
Yeah, it's totally all his fault.
>>82556003
>But answering to a government is A OK.
Considering it was made up of over a 100 nations of the free world...yes
There's a reason why the police and military aren't privatized
I like how Black Widow barely gets called out on being a traitor
Hey Capfags, how do you deal with the fact that we have a police force and it's illegal to go vigilante in most countries in the world right now?
Captain America was objectively wrong from the beggining.
>>82571171
Oh yeah because the local police force is so much better?
>>82552390
Tony was wrong
at least this time it made sense why he was wrong
Steve and Tony are both equally at fault and unfit to lead anyone.
>>82571791
They would've killed the incredibly dangerous human weapon, and everything else in the world would have been better for it.
>>82556003
Because none of these people have ever had personally driven motives and agendas that may not have reflected the public good. Nope. Not once.
>>82555545
That's probably how Clint and Selvig didn't get executed/life in prison
>>82555501
>Being sorry isn't going to bring his family back.
You say that as if blasting Bucky in half would.
>>82561810
That shit is scary, but it was more than that though. The control words still had effect on Bucky even when he was trying to fight them off, even when he recovered his identity, even when he was no longer just a blank slate vulnerable to influence. His body and mind were literally hijacked out from under him. They set the whole scene up like Zemo was doing some sort of enchantment, because it was more akin to Bucky being under a spell than him simply believing installed propaganda. It was more than Hydra wiping his memories and planting false ones and him falling for it, which is why they had to continue brainzapping him and keeping him on ice in between. People equating Bucky's brainwashing with real life brainwashing are severely underplaying what happened to him.
>>82552390
You did this to my waifu, shame WS didn't finish the job with you.
>>82555501
>Being sorry isn't going to bring his family back.
Neither does killing their murderer.
>>82574026
Chained up like fucking Hannibal Lecter. Haha.
cap is right
>>82571171
we're discussing capeshit, starkfag
your argument is irrelevant
>>82555600
About 3 minutes, given it launches from orbit.
>>82571791
I see no vigilantes around.
Cap didn't tell Tony about the parents thing because he knows how emotional Tony can get. He was simply keeping his cars close to his chest.
Captain America: I Fight for democracy and transparency of actions because one person shouldn't make decisions for everyone else
Tony Stark: Literally the entire world should probably have a say in what and who we destroy, because we've killed like...a LOT of people
Captain America: Only I should choose who lives and who dies because I know best, fuck democracy
Tony: I'm keeping Wanda safe from assassins and police who want her arrested for killing a bunch of people, she's kinda a criminal, but I know she's innocent
Cap: How dare you, she should run free!
Tony: You know she doesn't have like...any legal right to be in the US right? She has no visa...no passport...
Cap: FUCK THE LAWS OF THE UNITED STATES
Cap: Oh btw, I'm keeping Bucky safe from assassins and police who want him arrested for killing a bunch of people, he's kinda a criminal but I know he's innocent
Tony: ... and that's different from what I'm doing because?
Cap: Because he didn't WANT to kill all those people, he just happened to
Tony: Let me repeat my question...that's different from what I'm doing with wanda...because?
Cap: THE SAFEST HANDS ARE STILL OUR OWN!!!
Cap: Bucky is like family, and I'd destroy anyone who hurts my family
Cap: Oh btw he killed your entire family, but like, don't be mad K?
Cap: I know I'm wrong sometimes but that's just the way I am, sorry
Tony: You're not sorry
Cap: You're right, I'm actually totally fine with it
Tony: I've lost my mother, my father, and the love of my life, and now the world wants to take the only family I have from me, so I'm doing everything in my power to prevent that, because I've never had any control over any important part of my life since I was born. Please help me by signing this paper.
Cap: Pssh, I can't relate to any of that, sorry bro, can't help ya.
>>82552390
>Capfags arguing with Starkfags
This pleases Zemo
>>82558347
>Im saying Steve should have brought him in, they wouldnt have blown this dude's brains out if fucking captain amaerica walked out and said Ive arrested this man
Yes they fucking would, did you not see the movie? They were ordered to kill on sight, Cap did the only action possible to protect him.
>>82568601
I'm not even sure he *has* the D, but he wanted to give it to her, hard.
>>82575748
Tony got put down like the dog he is, deal with it.
Trying to kill Bucky was wrong, but understandable. Everything else Tony did, he did so the public could feel safe again, but that doesn't make it less stupid.
Unlike Steve who is a soldier, Tony obviously can't handle the idea of civillian casualties, and being made personally responsible for one of them by the mom in the start made him go full retard.
Ross is an obvious villain, no one in their right mind would sign the accords with him running the show. Tony knew the accords were bullshit from the start, he thought he could just dismiss them later if needed, but got shot down by Ross, because ROSS IS AN OBVIOUS VILLAIN.
>>82574026
G-guys... I think Tony may have triggered Disassembled.
>>82557490
>sentient living omnipotent A.I
>misses
>>82576405
Tony lost his mother
Tony lost his father
Tony lost his love
He didn't want to lose his family too
his excuses about why he supported the accords were merely another brick in his facade of strength
he was willing to do anything to keep from losing his friends too
Tony wants control over his own life, in order to protect the things he loves
that's why he drives the cars, after losing both parents in a car crash and being ambushed in a vehicle in the desert
he gives his best friend a suit to keep him safe when he's not there
he creates ultron (albeit with disastrous consequences) to try and keep the world safe when he's no longer able to
he keeps Wanda on the compound so that the world can't get to her, to keep HER safe
So he signs the accords, because as far as he can see, it's the only thing he can do to keep the Avengers safe
He knows he can't save everybody and that kills him inside, but Tony is not a man to show weakness, so he puts on a tough front and claims to have ulterior motives
That's pretty much his M.O. from day 1.
Then you've got Cap, who doesn't care how many people die as long as justice - as HE sees it - is served, and the mission is over. He doesn't care if the Avengers split up. He just wants his bucky and to keep punching bad guys.
That's some serious "little picture" thinking on Cap's end.
>>82576503
Yes Tony wants to protect what he loves, but he is driven by his emotions rather than logic, as always, and it leads to him making stupid decisions.
He agreed with the accords out of guilt and to keep the Avengers together and safe, when he should have realized no one would be safe with Ross at the helm.
Cap warned him 'what if we need to go somewhere and the accords won't allow it?' and later in the movie this is exactly what happens. Tony realizes Bucky was set up and wants to help, but Ross tells him to fuck off, so he goes on his own anyways - dismissing the accords.
Because the accords were a shit idea to begin with, and Tony knew it. The leading powers in MCU are incredibly corrupt, Cap is right not to trust them.
>>82556033
Did you miss the part where he literally has a control phrase that will overwrite his free will, and can literally make him do anything they want?
Would it make it easier for you if HYDRA and Zemo said "Would you kindly?"
>>82557034
Anon, when you have a problem that needs Avengers-level power, you need them to mobilize quickly.
Seriously, do you have any idea how long the UN would sit and argue while Fin Fang Foom stomped all over your house?
>>82558225
>Well then Cap is a piece of garbage and an idiot considering he and Tony have been through arguably more than even Steve and Bucky depending on how you look at it
Cap's one major flaw is his disability to let go of the past. Bucky is the only thing he has left from his previous life, who also happens to be his childhood friend and someone he 100% trusts. Tony is nothing like that to Steve. They've been at each other's throats since Avengers, Tony has clearly always held a grudge towards him for reasons Cap had no way of knowing or changing and I think it's fairly obvious he was never that fond of Tony's personality and emotional fuckups either.
They respected each other, but I can't imagine them getting together to have a beer or watch the telly together after Avenging without anyone else being present. They were never close friends.
>>82558347
Tony was literally calling him Manchurian Candidate when he walked into the bunker. Intellectually, he knows what Bucky's deal is. Given that Tony likes to act like he's the smartest man in the world (and given who's missing in the MCU, he may be), he should damn well know that blaming Bucky for his parent's deaths would be like Wanda blaming the Quinjet that Ultron used to kill her brother.
>>82558544
I'll admit, I haven't seen Age of Ultron in a while, but I thought he DID tell Steve and Tony he was going back to Asgard to deal with some crap.
The question is, what does that knowledge do for literally everybody else on Earth? He might as well said he went to Fairyland for how easy it is to go after him.
>>82555591
>And Cap could have driven his shield into Stark's neck
that was at the end of the fight and Iron could have killed them both if he wanted.
>>82576904
He wanted to kill Bucky.
>>82576919
Then why didn't he fire the missile at winter soldier instead at the cylinder?
he just wanted to kick his ass.
>>82576953
The scene isn't completely clear in my mind (watched it over a week ago) but I got a clear impression he wanted to kill Bucky. That's why he raised his hands to protect his face when Cap lifted the shield, he legit thought cap was going to execute him, just like he would have executed Bucky if he got a hold of him.
Do you ironfags really think cap being friends with Tony is reason enough to let him fucking murder someone? Why does it matter if cap is closer to Tony or Bucky?
>>82577286
Cap being friends with Tony should be reason enough for him to tell Tony the truth about how his parents died.
>>82577286
He is fine with Tony murdering someone when it isn't his bestie. The Avengers don't have a no-kill rule, least of all Iron Man.
>>82576904
>He could have won, he just didn't want to!
Christ, you Starkfags are delusional.
>http://marvelnault.tumblr.com/post/144018337774/the-final-showdowncaptain-america-vs-iron-man
>that repulsor elbow strike
Damn, this final battle was good.
>Guy with super powers murders a bunch of people
>Find out he was brainwashed yet continues to run away
>Try to bring him to justice
>No he gud boi he din du nuffin. he remorseful n shit
>Be normal guy
>Be fucked in head by mental illness and kill people
>Suddenly get medication and feel remorseful over your actions.
>Still goto jail where you belong
And people wonder why the government is concerned about the supers and accountability?
>>82552390
>insert zemo to make tony not look like a traitorous douchebag
>almost kills his friends to let the villain get away
It's like they're not even trying to make Tony likable.
>>82555545
>Good luck proving brainwashing in a court of law
Jessica Jones literally already did
>>82578096
For what people said, Tony's delivery of ''My father made that shield'' is pretty weak.
>>82572096
And how exactly is a piece of paper supposed to stop someone like Banner or Thor doing whatever the fuck they like if they so choose?
I can't believe how many of you seem to think the government overseeing something automatically makes it more safe
