>Hasbro makes Marvel toys
>Mattel makes DC toys (also Disney Princesses)
>Generator Rex has a toyline by Mattel
>sells horribly
>Secret Saturdays cartoon has toys made by Mattel
>is massively oversold by stores
>sells horribly
>due to the failure of both lines, retailers will not accept toys for Sym-Bionic Titan, causing the show to be cancelled.
>Green Lantern movie comes out
>stores are FILLED with Mattel GL toys
>almost universally the entire stock has to be put on clearance
>Due to the failure of the film and toyline, Green Lantern TAS does not get a toyline
>Young Justice gets a toyline
>first wave is incredibly simple, includes no accessories, and is massively overpriced
>sells horribly
>due to both shows not being carried by a toyline, both Young Justice and Green Lantern TAS are cancelled, and the entire DC Nation block goes with them
>Man of Steel released
>Green Lantern levels of toys fill aisles
>the movie does okay, but the toys are a huge flop
>some are still in stores to this day
>because of all this, many retailers don't carry any DC toys other than a recent 5PA Batman line or Imaginext pre-K toys
>DC now handles most of their collectibles and figures in-house
>Meanwhile every retailer that stocks toys in the US has a large chunk of shelfspace for Marvel toys
Mattel's poor practices have cost DC a portion of the mindshare of children, and damaged action cartoons in general. It's also worth noting that
>This year, Mattel lost the Disney Princesses licence to Hasbro when Disney pulled it
>They had intentionally been putting the Disney brand on the back burner in favor of bolstering Barbie, their floundering flagship product
This is a company that has a history of sabotaging or neglecting brands they control in favor of other brands. DC needs to pull their liscence pronto.
Only within the last couple of months have a number of stores started ordering DC toys again, with Batman vs Superman also bringing along Mattel's new line of DC figures meant to compete with Hasbro's Marvel Legends. I've checked around though, and many of these stores have only ordered a small endcap worth of products that have yet to move. I think it's safe to say that DC's partnership with Mattel is a toxic one.
Wait, isn't this a /toy/ thread?
>>81515994
If capeshit tv shows aren't banished to /tv/ then I think we can talk about capeshit toys here
We're not Time warner.
So why are you telling us this shit?
>>81515879
Most stores stock large amounts of DC Lego toys, alongside Marvel Lego.
>>81516552
LEGO is not Mattel. different toy company, different license.
>>81515994
It's about how toys affect animation you dolt.
>>81516552
Lego is a known quantity though. Stores don't even see the sublines of legos; they just know that they're legos.
>>81516552
>still no official lego marvel/dc crossover media like a one shot, film or vidya
who should i blame for this? didio or quesadilla?
>>81516776
Marvel is fiercely protective of who they allow in their Legos; they're pretty much all MCU stuff.
DC allows just about everybody.
>>81516840
Basically DC tries to support its legacy while Marvel supports the product they're pushing right now
>>81515879
Mattel got based Dik Dik back.
Hope for salvation
>>81516731
>toys affect animation
>>81517279
>I didn't read the thread: the post
fucking kill yourself
>>81517279
>being this new
>>81517279
Nigga are you retarded?
>>81516776
I would've said Quesada, but now he's merely a pawn for Disney
>>81517304
>>81517344
>>81517423
Please explain to me how toy sales directly impact the quality of animation.
>>81517561
The sales are used to bolster the income of the cartoons.
Sym-bionic Titan, for example, was explicitly cancelled because retailers refused to stock proposed merchandise for it.
>>81517561
Animation costs money
Toys bring in money
?
That being said, that ISN'T what they said at all. I'm just commenting on how doubly stupid you are.
>>81515879
>due to both shows not being carried by a toyline, both Young Justice and Green Lantern TAS are cancelled, and the entire DC Nation block goes with them
No, DC Nation was still around when Beware the Batman and TTGo! premiered.
Another question is why Mattel didn't make a Batman toyline when they had a cartoon on-air. Wouldn't that be easy money?
>>81517798
Doesn't mean it wasn't good.
Would anyone here care to explain to me how the sale of physical merchandise directly affects the quality and appreciation of a show or film film?
Yeah, Mattel has sucked since the 90s. Your point?
>>81517917
If good thing sell bad good thing get cancelled. That mean no more good thing. Understand?
>>81517917
That's not what was fucking said, you smug sack of shit
>>81517917
Now you're moving goalposts, but fine.
Investors now are less likely to invest in action shows, or cartoons in general because there is a weaker expectation of merchandising profit, so animated shows must be produced with harshly reduced budgets, or not at all.
If it sounds stupid, it's because "business" is an idiosyncratic pursuit and often clashes with more commonly held ideals.
>>81517962
DC not selling toys to kids mean less kids will be into DC
Shut the fuck up Boco
>>81517878
>?
Toys also cost money to produce. If the show isn't popular enough for the network to scrape together ad revenue, then why bother throwing even more money at a failing toy line?
Why not just make good shows instead of banking on the impulsiveness of children and autists?
http://nerdbastards.com/2014/06/12/warner-bros-re-ups-with-mattel-for-dc-toys/
>Anyway, in toy business meets show business news today, Warner Bros has announced that they’ve renewed their 15 year deal Mattel in a new multi-year contract.
>implying either WB or Mattel will be around in 15 years
>>81517561
>Generator Rex has a toyline by Mattel
>sells horribly
>Secret Saturdays cartoon has toys made by Mattel
>is massively oversold by stores
>sells horribly
>due to the failure of both lines, retailers will not accept toys for Sym-Bionic Titan, causing the show to be cancelled.
>Green Lantern movie comes out
>stores are FILLED with Mattel GL toys
>almost universally the entire stock has to be put on clearance
>Due to the failure of the film and toyline, Green Lantern TAS does not get a toyline
>Young Justice gets a toyline
>first wave is incredibly simple, includes no accessories, and is massively overpriced
>sells horribly
>due to both shows not being carried by a toyline, both Young Justice and Green Lantern TAS are cancelled, and the entire DC Nation block goes with them
Not too bright are you?
>>81518019
Why not just make the good thing better?
>>81518063
Then what was said, my rustled friend?
>>81518068
Then I guess it's time for shows, films,and cartoons to finally adapt to the Internet age or die slow, flailing deaths at the hands of network and studio executives.
>>81518171
Because good shows don't make money on their own. Successful toy lines do.
>>81518370
But everything he said is true.
>>81518370
And you contributed what to this conversation...?
It's insight into how greedy networks have become, not in how toys determine how great/popular shows are.
>>81518444
Not entirely >>81517905
>>81518523
True.
But man, CN basically fucked up DC Nation from the start. They really had no desire to do it in the first place, you can tell.
>>81518399
Good shows/films make money through butts in seats, BluRay/digital sales, advertisement and "swag", not toys.
>>81518648
Unless it's an action cartoon. If toys don't sell, the show is canned. No exceptions.
>>81518648
>american animation
>wide release cinema features
>american animation
>blu ray sales
o i am laffin
>>81515879
DC seems to be setting the groundwork for dumping Mattel. The in-house DCC brand has been massively building up its presence amongst collectors and now makes figures in competing scales rather than just the oddball 6.75" stuff of yesteryear.
The only problem is that DCC isn't well versed enough in QC for materials like Mattel and has had their asses lit aflame more than once in the last year or so. It used to be that because of the specialty market share that they inhabited, they were kind of lax in making sure the figures weren't fragile; kind of a holdover from the McFarlane era where a large swath of collectors were MIB collectors and the rest were just the types to put a toy on the shelf and forget it.
Now that they want to roll with the big dogs and get a competitive share, they had to come to grips with the fact that a 1% QC error rate was unacceptable in 50k+ produced unit lines, so the early BTAS stuff really busted their balls and they were forced to make very public amends with consumers. With that behind them, I would give Mattel maybe a few more years before they're completely pulled from DC products.
DC figures just don't seem appealing to me. granted, i don't really follow the toy scene, but the nu52 7 figure set had barely any articulation and horrible paint jobs and the BTAS figures work better as statues than anything you could actually pose
meanwhile Marvel gets great meme figures like pizza spider-man and hawkeye+dog. also avengers figuarts, while not perfect, got a hell of a lot more buzz than the injustice figuarts.
>>81518648
Toys are merchandise you mongoloid. In the case of Action Cartoons they're the primary form of merchandise.
Even movies are like this. Batman and Robin specifically had a toy company consulting and providing ideas for what they could make into toys. There are no exceptions.
>>81518444
Shut the fuck up Boco
>>81518071
This. You can walk into any store in America and buy Morbius or Machine Man action figure. They sell Namor action figures at Walgreens. You can't buy a Green Lantern or Flash figure, though.
>>81518940
This is true. Up until DC Icons there was nothing that DC could do to compete with Hasbro's Marvel Legends line. Now Mattel has their own DC Universe line at retail AND DC Collectibles has the DC Icons line through Diamond (which means comics stores only), and both are competing with each other.
DC is competing with the company they gave the lisence to. That is insane.
And don;t forget Marvel's Disney Infinity merch. DC has LEGO Dimenions but that doesn't sell nearly as well and they have to
>>81518629
Don't remind me.
> Put it on around 9:30 to 10:30 am ET.
> Originally they had Sunday night repeats. Then removed so the only repeats were the next day at the same time. Then those were taken away.
> It takes almost two years for Season 1 of Young Justice to air. So many periods of breaks.
> that one break that came out of nowhere in October that lasted four months for both shows.
> TTG starts out like this. Then they start to air it. Then air it more. It airs so much it's basically all that's seen sometimes on CN.
>>81519106
>DC is competing with the company they gave the lisence to. That is insane.
It sounds insane but on the other hand, have you notice the last like five years or so of DC Classics? There was a serious lot of pegwarmers.
>>81515879
>some are still in stores to this day
I can got to the dollar store down the street right now and get one.
>>81519339
DCUC was a terrible line, though. It had barely any accessories, no ankle tilts, barely sufficient elbows, and dear god, the manfaces.
>>81519621
>man faces
Perfect for her, then.
>>81519784
shut the fuck up boco
>>81519857
Yes sir...
>>81519621
>DCUC was a terrible line, though.
Still better than their 3 3/4 figures.
But still, that's why DC competing with the company they gave the license to doesn't sound that insane to me.
Why did Dc go with Mattel?
>>81521731
Because Hasbro didn't want to make wannabe marvel shit, they've already got the genuine article.
>>81521831
Hasbro didn't even have the Marvel license at the time DC made the switch, memeposter
>>81521731
>>81522071
>>81521831
This is Kenner's Super Powers Collection. It was made to compete with Mattel's Masters of the Universe line in the 80s. Kenner also did Marvel toys in the 90s; all those comics accurate figures of minor Marvel heroes with a weird bug or accessory you might remember were all Kenner.
I don't know when Mattel snatched the DC lisence, but Kenner was purchased by Hasbro in the 90s (they did Beast Wars) so it had to be before that.
For a long time Mattel was the biggest baddest motherfucker in the toy industry, though. That's because of Barbie. Nowadays they don't have any viable boy toy brands and Barbie is dead in the water, so they're floundering.
The best thing would be for Hasbro to buy out Mattel; every year or so rumors of a buyout start circling. Unlike some industries, there is not any risk involved in the kind of semi-monopoly a Hasbro/Mattel merger would cause; at this point it could only benefit consumers.
>>81521731
>>81522683
Mattel got the license around the time Justice League started airing, IIRC. I remember the Justice League figures were the first DC figures.
> Kenner also did Marvel toys in the 90s
No they didn't. That was Toy Biz. Mattel was the one that did Marvel toys in the 80's (with Secret Wars) and Toy Biz got the license in like 1990 or something and made the figures till like the mid-00's (Hasbro got the Marvel license by the time of X3, IIRC)
>>81522888
>I remember the Justice League figures were the first DC figures.
First Mattel DC figures, I mean.
>>81522888
>No they didn't. That was Toy Biz.
I stand corrected.
I think this is a very valid thread for /co/ and indicative of how badly Warners-DC had handled its properties compared to Disney-Marvel. Kids these days barely know DC characters other than Batman and love Marvel ones.
>>81523928
Not only that but it also shows how Mattel negatively affected Cartoon Network's programming.
>>81523928
>>81523961
That reminds me, I started wondering why Mattel didn't do either the Teen Titans or Teen Titans Go figures and came across this:
http://www.actionfigureinsider.com/teen-titans-go-2-hopes-for-mattel-product/
In the comments section:
>Well aware that Bandai did a very extensive Teen Titans line, but my focus was on Mattel, which had first rights on it and passed. The story I heard was that Mattel passed because the show featured the girls too prominently and therefore was not a “boys show”. I do not know how accurate that is.
>>81515879
You know a lot of this could be solved by simply looking at the shows and the toys as two separate products. It seems like that was the case in the 90s.
I even remember as a kid getting frustrated because all the toys became The Movie: The Toy. And it looked lame because they were trying to make it look exactly like the movie version instead of just being it's own thing.
>>81522683
see >>81518321
Hot Wheels/cars/matchbox make up a large portion of the market man. But I will say that Mattel has had shit action figure marketing for quite some time. DCUC was terrible, and MOTUC almost never hit retail.
>>81519106
>google DC icons
Holy shit, they look really good. Good proportions, good paint work on them, they look actually collectible and true to the comics.
I never realised DC made toys like this, maybe I'll pick up some.
>>81525188
They're newer and they're pretty cool. Articulation could be amazing with just a few alterations, but otherwise good. And they come with some great accessories. I'll probably go for the accessory pack just for starros and the display tank.
My issue is that I like to set up little displays using multiple characters and franchises. And the DC Icons line are a bit smaller than most 1/12th scale figures. It works fine for scrawny guys like Deadman, but I'd like Batman to be taller than characters like Spiderman.
>>81516776
Quesada initially, disney now probably
>>81515879
>still trying to push toys as what determines a shows success
Toys have fallen out. People want shit that shows they like the fotm like bags and t-shirts so they can show their friends.
If they just made a video game based on the series then it'd be just fine.
>>81518321
>Barbie is the largest block by far, worth $1.9 billion
Why is everyone in this thread saying it's dead in the water?
>>81526366
Ok, second largest after Fisher-Price, I just think of FP as more a "brand" of all pre-K toys and Barbie as more of a single franchise.
>>81526311
>People want shit that shows they like the fotm
What?
>>81526311
>If they just made a video game based on the series then it'd be just fine.
To be fair, they tried THAT with Young Justice too. It was terrible, just like the BTAS tie-in games for the PS2.
>>81525379
No kidding, I put my Icons Flash next to Movie Masters Superman and the Multiverse Batman and he looks like a twink. They're all supposed to be around 6 inches but the Icons are TINY.
>>81526366
http://www.bloomberg.com/features/2015-disney-princess-hasbro/
> Last year, Mattel put the size of its Disney Princess doll business at $300 million, though analysts at Needham say it’s closer to $500 million. With sales of Mattel’s most famous toy, 56-year-old Barbie, tumbling 20 percent from 2012 to 2014 andstill falling, Princess dolls have been a much-needed revenue stream.
>When Barbie’s sales started to fall in 2012, she became Mattel’s problem child. “Barbie is going to continue to be a brand that we spend a lot of time and attention on to make sure she [improves],” Mattel’s then-CEO, Bryan Stockton, told investors last year.
Barbie has momentum. It was the biggest toy in the world for years, but it hasn't kept pace. Lines like Monster High are increasingly popular and appealing to young girls, while Barbie looks boring in comparison. Barbie is also less articulated than other doll lines yet is priced at a premium.
Barbie will still be around for a while but the brand has lost the imagination of children. It's essentially restricted to early childhood girls who don't quite have personal tastes yet, or older ladies with the collector dolls .
Basically, Barbie is uncool, and the core of the brand means that it can't be cool again without dramatic changes.
>>81515879
Mattel's handling of the DC license has been pretty shit for the past few years ever since they killed DCUC. I like the new Multiverse figures they're putting out now but they're mostly just A-List characters with designs from their most recent storylines (Batman from Zero Year, The Joker from Endgame, etc.)
>>81527623
They only put out the Multiverse figures because DC themselves put out the DC Icons figures though.
>>81527911
Yeah, but Mattel fucked up badly and switched DCUC to a subscription service that didn't get the interest of enough people. Then they canned that too.
>>81527911
Did DC start the Icons figures last year? I can't remember.
>>81517279
Holy shit, that's some ignorance. I know I am late, but damn.
How can people be so certain when they are so wrong? Do you just imagine something truth without evidence and then insult people when they disagree?
>>81518390
>Why not just make the good thing better?
So, I know I am wasting my time, but since other people gave up on trying to make you understand, I will try.
Even if you were literally making the best show ever, so long as kids don't literally go screaming into stores for the toys until someone makes them, then you can't seriously expect store owners to know anything about the quality of the show.
To begin with quality is subjective, so any and all attempts at making something that has all good qualities possible is ridiculous. Kids would like simple plots, older kids would prefer something with more deep to it, and Intention if you would, but those older kids, and man childs, barely invest on toys, and it just so happen that toys make a large margin of the money made by such shows.
For example, some of the oldest action cartoons, think He-man, G.I.JOE, Thundercats, older Batman shows, and such, had as main objective promoting toys. Same with princess, and female oriented shows and dolls.
Honestly, I understand now that you are either russing or so full of yourself you would never even listen to reason or logic if it goes against what you had decided to believe. But on the off chance that you have the common sense and it has been obfuscated by your share inability to accept you are wrong, I am wasting my time and explaining.
