caveat....'from before you were born'.
And by that I mean when they were in their prime, when the stuff that made you love their work came out.
For me, no contest. Jack Kirby. Loved his sci-fi and outer space shit. New Gods, Fantastic Four, the forever people. Nothing has quite beat him in the imagination department for me.
>>81008257
Dave Sim
>>81008346
Yeah, that's some nice lettering.
But all the truly great art of Cerebus comes from Gerhard, not Sim.
>>81008402
I think Sim is a god tier layout, fight and comedy artist.
He's also a masterful cartoonist with his lettering as you point out. I absolutely love Gerhard as well, but to say that Sim's layouts aren't the driving force behind the art of Cerebus is bullshit.
>>81008346
>>81008402
>>81008731
>Cerebus 152
Holy shit. I've been meaning to read Cerebus for a while but how long is it? Is it worth the time investment?
>>81009018
300 issues.
Yes, read it. Many consider it to be one of the best comics ever made.
>>81009084
>Many consider it to be one of the best comics ever made.
I don't.
I consider it important. I consider it influential. I consider it the most impressive comic ever made.
But the best?
Pfffffffffft no.
>>81009018
Read it.
Cerebus the Aardvark #001-300, by Dave Sim and Gerhard
https://www.mediafire.com/?buant4il44b2b
Born in 91 so...
Brian bolland.
>>81009193
I said many, not all. I'm not forcing you to be apart of that group.
>>81009303
Your words are oppressing me, Kevilist scum.
t. Cirinist
The work of Moebius was just something else.
>>81009193
He said one of the best comics ever made anon.
To me that sounds like top 25-50, which is reasonable. Fuck I wouldn't even think it's weird to see it in a top 10
>>81009548
If you ask me, it doesn't even belong in the Top 100!
>>81009193
Damn that quality meter is pretty accurate especially about the 200+ stuff.
Personally I think it starts really strong, solid 8/10 for the sword and sorcery stuff, and outside of the prose stuff 50-200 is pretty much 10/10 the whole way through. However I found the Marvel/Vertigo parodies very funny, which some don't.
The weakest part of the comic is the prose. Sim can't write prose for shit, the dude is a full blown cartoonist and his lettering is really important to his storytelling. Prose is such a handicap for him. Didn't help he was trying to ape other famous writers' styles too.
>>81008257
Yeah I have to second Kirby. Too many artists just have one golden period of their work. Kirby has decades of work that's all fantastic
>>81009588
Are you saying that anon or is Gary Groth?
Cerebus is tricky to truly pin down in terms of where it belongs all time, there are over 200 really, really, really spectacular issues, and then there are a solid 40 absolutely dogshit ones, along with some incomprehensible bullshit.
I think one thing that can be said definitively is that Sim and Gerhard definitely stand as the best artist duo in the history of western comics. Putting that shit out monthly and double shipping sometimes as well at that level of quality.
Sim certainly used the medium in the way that a lot of artists and writers don't even think about.
>>81009588
You're a cunt Gary Groth, it should have been you put in a shallow grave instead of Thompson.
>>81009962
He referring to the fact that TCJ didn't include Cerebus on the Top 100 comics of the 20th Century. People claim that the reason it was omitted was because Groth and Sim had some public arguments and not because of the work
>>81009509
I was thinking Moebius too, he was an amazing artist who was constantly changing up his art and trying to improve. He also had a fair bit of plasticity in his art when you compare his gag strips compared to his serious ones.
Also without a doubt the most influential artist comics had on a global scale.
>>81010019
They wanted to give Thompson a deeper grave but the Fantagraphics "Deep Grave for Thompson" Kickstarter didn't meet its goal.
>>81010033
TCJ top 100 comics of the 20th century is "it's old so it's good" to anything not autobiographical, historical or slice of life/"grounded" drama. It is a miserable list. I'd be fine with not including cape/fantasy/whatever if that's how they want to do it, but's a joke to put Stan Lee cape comics on there even if the art was really good. To value whatever "influential" shit was involved in those comics and to not include Monster Society of Evil or Seigel/Shuster Action Comics? I fucking hate that list as a capefag who does read a lot of non-cape stuff.
>>81010219
>Monster Society of Evil
Captain Marvel actually was on the list
Lee/Kirby Fantastic Four, Lee/Ditko Spider-Man, Jack Cole's Plastic Man, C.C.Beck's Captain Marvel, and Kirby's Fourth World are all very good choices, so what if they're old?
>>81010304
Jack Cole's Plastic Man (one of the GOATs cape or no) Kirby's Fourth World and Beck's CM are really great but Lee comics are fucking WORDSWORDSWORDS garbage with really good art for the most part. Fuck Stan Lee as a writer.
Wanking the Marvel method comics because they're influential is so dumb. At least could have thrown in O'Neil/Adams Batman or Miller DD, which both are massively influential and actually still hold up.
>>81010448
I have zero problem with most of Lee's Silver Age stuff. Lee Kirby Fantastic Four is the greatest run on that title and one of the greatest in general
from before i was born
moebius nigga
>>81010448
I think some overblow his contribution to the genre talent wise. but I think a good deal of his spider-man stories are still fucking amazing. Theyre some of the few things from that era that I can find that involving even after all this time.
>>81010570
>>81010629
I just can't enjoy an action/adventure comic that has a dense speech or though bubble in every goddamn panel. I think 4th World has a similar issue but Kirby writes better/more entertaining dialogue
Will Eisner and Alex Toth for comic book art, for painters that aren't also comic book artists, to my knowledge at the least, J. C. Leyendecker is way up there.
>>81010589
Is that recolored? Looks very modern
>>81011015
You can tell it isn't modern by the gradient at his feet senpai.
