Was adding the symbiote and Venom a mistake?
Yes. Raimi hated Venom and had no intentions of including him, but Avi Arad forced him to use Venom because that's what the kids wanted.
>>80834324
No the mistake was adding Sandman and Green Goblin II. Just a symbiote and venom story would have been perfect.
>>80834324
>>80834336
They sure showed us.
>>80834336
>>80834324
Let's say we get rid of Venom and Eddie Brock, and that whole business, so that the two antagonists are Harry and Sandman. How does this change the movie?
>>80834336
>>80834359
Sandman and GG2 were in the story long before Venom.
If the movie had dropped either Venom or Sandman it would have worked much, much better, but I can't hold it against Raimi for trying to hold on to his original plans even after the movie got stuffed with plotlines that made them no longer work.
>>80834336
This, Raimi hated alot of character and aspects in spiderman, which is why he cast people in their 30s to play teens and early 20s.
He especially hated venom which is weird considering he's one of the favorite characters of all the spiderman villans.
Easiest way to fix the plot would be to cut Sandman and have Harry be the target of EmoPete's rage.
>>80834411
Raimi was a child of the '60s and '70s and grew up reading old-school Spider-Man. Venom came way after his time so he just didn't understand the character nor did he think he was central to Spider-Man.
>>80834411
Because Raimi is an old-school Spidey fan. Venom is new-school.
>>80834336
>but Avi Arad forced him to use Venom because that's what the kids wanted.
Dumb kids they should know that Carnage is better!!
>>80834398
>but I can't hold it against Raimi for trying to hold on to his original plans even after the movie got stuffed with plotlines that made them no longer work.
Yeah but when I read some interviews he seemed like such a baby about it. He was just phoning it in cause he didn't give a shit.
>>80834497
I can't blame him. The guy had a project he put a lot of love and planning into for years, and then late into the game some guy comes in and shoves in a bunch of terrible ideas that you now have to use.
>>80834497
He brought them huge success with SM1 and 2, I'd be pissed too if all of a sudden the suits came in and started telling me what to do.
>>80834411
>i like it, so it's weird that he doesn't like it
How dare he, what a fucking child
Sandman was kinda lame. Suits had the right idea wanting venom in it but Raimi hated it and well what we got was shit.
>>80834398
>>80834359
Goblin was the unnecessary one. They were never going to make Pete's best friend an unredeemable villain, so that gay-ass tag team fight was inevitable. But Harry's redemption is virtually identical to Sandman's, except that Sandman actually has something to be redeemed for, whereas Harry just gets an action sequence at the start.
It would have been far better to drop the Goblin stuff and have Harry either seeking Peter's help with his mental problems or just plain forgiving Peter after a difficult period of mourning and reflection over his father; instead you have this is-that-a-ghost guessing game and a large focus on Harry, which I guess was in Franco's contract. Then you have the ridiculous lack of time for Sandman, who's pushed out of the movie until Spider-Venom finds and "kills" him, then just fucks off until Venom-Venom finds him later as a convenient ally.
It's really very much out of the convenience playbook of the Raimi films, but they are seriously trying to do too much with what they've got. Was the plan to bring Harry back at some future movie? Because otherwise that's just wasted storytelling; better to give those themes and lines to Sandman instead. Marko wasn't really a bad guy, and it would have been good to explore that.
Would have made it easier to use Venom effectively as well; Pete's loss of control played against Harry's quiet dignity would have been very sharp on-screen. A little less of the cartoony shit from Venom himself and it would have been a very different movie.
>>80834704
>gay-ass tag team fight
bite your tounge
>>80834398
Urk I hate when I hear harry as green goblin 2 should of just make hob goblin instead and actually make him look like it not some fucking snowboarder dude.
>>80834773
>Harry Osborn as Hobby
>Not wanting based Kingsley
>>80834431
I agree. Have Venom still be the main villain, but cut out the Sandman "muh daughter" bullshit and have Peter accindently kill Harry in his symbiote emo rage, then the movie ends with him killing Venom and going into hiding because of the guilt for killing Harry.
they easily could've come back with a fourth if they wanted and have peter fall in love with gwen when he returns and redo the gwen storyline with a different villain like vulture or something then have MJ and Peter reunite in a timeskip at the end of 4 or if 5 was successful
its honestly really easy to plan out cape movie plots, lol. all you do is remix comic storylines and adapt them to your liking without raping the source material to death.
>>80834873
or 5 if 5 was successful I meant to say
>>80834901
if 4 was successful* FUCK WHY CAN'T I TYPE
>>80834411
>Raimi hated spiderman
Then why was he directing it?
