In Civil War, Tony became a stand-in for Bush and Cheney.

>implying Tony isn't going to be right yet again

>>80627463
>Why would Cap be FOR unchecked power, given America by origin and design was built on preventing that?

Because he knows that the unchecked power lies in the hands of those with the moral fiber to use it responsibly, as opposed to politicians who will literally kill people under the pretense of "national interest".

It's the Superman problem in BvS: Even if Batman has a point, that Superman has unchecked power, what can he do to stop him? Even kryptonite may not be enough. He'll just have to trust him.

We have to trust our heroes. If they truly are as powerful and noble as we think they are, not only will government oversight be meaningless (how easily Cap escaped from the helicarrier in the comics), but they'll make themselves accountable to the people anyway.

>>80627893
That is the biggest load of horseshit.

That entire argument basically came down to wanting follow an individual and subjective code of morality. Superheroes need to have rules, it was what the Avengers were founded with. There were rules about who could join and there were rules about how they handled themselves. In doing that, they are held accountable to some constitution which is the way it should be.

>>80627893
He is Captain America not Captain Plato's Republic

>>80627769
How the fuck did people miss that Cap was the bad guy of CW when Punisher joined up with him and Cap himself admitted he was wrong

>>80628160
Amen brother.

I have no idea how people are trying to paint Cap as righteous.

He just honestly doesn't understand the extent of what he's even doing. His actions will have a much worse effect in the log run than he can even predict.

God bless Cap, but he is dumb as bricks.

>>80627463
Context doesn't matter, m8. Neither does the publisher. Whomever is trying to change the status quo will always be the baddie, and whomever is trying to preseve it will be the hero.

>>80628309
>Cap himself admitted he was wrong
He didn't though. He always stood by his position. He just conceded that fighting was the wrong way to defend it.

>>80627893
Yeah, no. Cap is the embodiment of a country whose core value is NOT giving one person absolute authority over the rest.

>>80627893
Rand/Ditko/Bird/DiMartino pls go

That's utter insanity. Trusting our heroes doing whatever they say is right gave us Project Insight and Ultron.

>>80627463
Because DC heroes go around killing everything wholesale or just fucking up things in general see Red Son and/or Injustice

Cap never initiates the fight and doesn't just kill people or imprison them wholesale.

>>80629727
God CW is stupid

>>80627463
I don't know, I think that's very American of him - America was founded on individuals overthrowing government institutions seen as oppressive, and has had a strong individualist ethos since.

America is the last country on Earth where people would just blindly follow the government, not since Watergate.

Cap, as someone who fought against Nazis and still fights HYDRA, would be VERY concerned about tyrannical governments abusing supers for their political power. More concerned about it than your occasional rogue cape. After all, the MCU has, what, a dozen actual superheroes? It's not like the odds of a Stamford ever happening are that high. All three incidents were Avengers saving the world. IRL this is akin to collateral damage during a justified military action.

I haven't seen the movie yet (due to my lack of time travel gear), so I don't know the specifics, but Cap's position is perfectly reasonable given the MCU's history and his established character.

>>80630849
Thats my point. The us government is designed on purpose to be inefficent as shit because of that.

Cap putting the Avengers on a pedestal due to inherent power is bullshit. Captain "checks and ballances " America says he can do whatever because he has power and hehas to answer to no one?what thef uck

>>80630849
Tony went off the save the world and caused an age of Ultron

Nick Furys old mate went off to save the world and was going to mass murduer.

Cap just lived through two disasters where people when good intentions fucked shit up and he is gonna say he should have the ability to go anywbere do anything with his WMD stuffed private army?

How is that American? Who voted for him? Where are his checks and balances? His congressional oversight? He doesnt answer to a court, a legislstion or even a constiution.

What he decides is right he will do regardless, and fuck you if you dont like it.

He is fighting to be the worlds personal self apointed super cop, without any actual consent or permission

>>80631380
>He is fighting to be the worlds personal self apointed super cop, without any actual consent or permission

Take out "super", and that's literally American foreign policy.

>>80628806
That, and Cap was posthumously proven right when Norman Osborn became top cop in the Marvel Universe.

>people still think that cap places modern day usa above all else and acts accordingly.

>people forget that cap is a world hero and as such fights for the freedom and rights of that world.

>people forget cap has left his role as mr.america several times when he clashed with the government.

Cap fights for what is right to him regardless if it's pro USA or not, Freedom and what is right existed long before the states even came along.

as other anons have pointed out Steve was right in the end.

>>80627463
And the Authority would stomp those faggots on the right.

>>80627463
because DC uses a black and white morality while marvel admits a grey morality.
it's fundamentally why marvel is seen as more progressist of DC

>>80632544
Jesus christ have you not read a comic since 1972?

>>80627463
the moral of civil war was that while tony stark a hero went bad guy and hired bad guys to enforce the law and cap seemed like the obvious voice of reason stark was correct

most people just assume the nice guy is right and the d bag is wrong. but who died in the comics?