Hey /co/, South Park says that global warming isn't real, but Futurama says it is!
WHO IS TRUTH?
Futurama, in this case.
>>79029265
Well, ask yourself: which one is written and helmed by qualified scientists and mathematicians who can understand the statistical trends underpinning claims of global warming, and which is written by two fucks from Colorado whose sole claim to notoriety is a show that calls everybody a cunt and is therefore right a lot of the time?
Futurama had actual scientists working on it, they know what they're talking about.
>>79029265
Global warming isn't real. Climate change is.
South Parks point wasn't whether or not global warming was real or not, it was that Al Gore is an asshole looking for attention and getting a ton of praise for the dumbest reason possible
>>79029265
Maybe you shouldn't formulate your opinions based on cartoons
>>79029403
Climate change is global warming is global cooling. The buzzword changes every twenty years but it's all the same con.
>>79030406
That's the "covering their ass after the evidence became overwhelimgly against them" version. The episode's phrasing is "X isn't real".
Global warming is real, but it's part of the natural cycle of the Earth.
>>79030534
>>79030460
>There are people who actually believe this
>>79029265
I don't know why people treat South Park as some kind of all-knowing god of wisdom. They're libertarians, which means while they disagree with both the left and the right, they have their own brand of horseshit politics that they'll spout off and soapbox about. They're just as stupid and prone to garbage reasoning when it comes to their ideologies, the only difference is, it isn't "NUKE ALL THE TOWELHEADS" or "FEMINIST VEGAN SENSITIVE MEN UNITE", it's "MUH TOTAL FREEDOMS GUBERNMINT CAN'T STEP ON CORPORATIONS IT AINT RIGHT". So when something like global warming comes around and starts saying that the government should step in and limit emissions outputs and stop companies from destroying the planet and straight up killing everyone they start freaking out because MUH GOBERNINT GONE CRAZY
>>79029265
I think they were trying to point out that Al Gore was a pundit and am ass. Even in the end he was right about Man Bear Pig but people couldn't stand him so much that they wanted him to stop. This is B8 Thread anyway.
>>79030992
This.
Manbearpig was making fun of Al Gore clinging to relevancy by using global issues. People just love to miss the point and use this episode as a "See South Park has no idea what they're talking about!", because they need a defense when South Park makes fun of something they like
>>79029265
Matt and Trey no longer hold that belief anymore, IIRC
>>79030534
lel
>>79030992
>Even in the end he was right about Man Bear Pig
No he wasn't.
>>79030577
>>79031109
>the earth never warmed or cooled before cow farts
Stop it, tumblr. Now just stop it.
>>79030446
>>79029265
the politicizing of it is the best
>is your house on fire?
NO!
>ok, we want to pass a law that no one can light your house on fire
NO!
>this multimillionaire wants to light your house on fire right now
please step right in sir.
I mean if it's real or not real, or if it's man made or natural, why the fuck would you ever oppose a law that limits bad shit going into the air or water, and why would you be in favor of that happening ever? it's just... wow..
>>79031136
He means in-universe. Not real life.
>>79031245
I know.
>>79030992
>>79031084
>>79030406
These. The discourse about Global Warming and the subsequent denialism is BECAUSE of how Gore and the forerunners approached it. If they'd approached it at a more metered way at the outset it wouldn't have become a political issue. Instead Gore chose to make it political and doomed America to being ineffectual at setting policy with respect to climate change. Alarmism is shit policy, Gore should be ashamed.
>>79029265
More like
>Hey /co/, South Park says Al Gore is a washed up loser who's wrong about everything but Futurama worships him and puts him on a jewel encrusted pedestal. Who's right?
>>79029403
>>79030460
It never changed, scientifically illiterate journalists fucking up terminology is the problem.
Global warming is the cause, climate change is the effect.
>>79030534
No no no. That's the back-up lie people say when you can't ignore the reality of global warming. It's the vast scientific consensus that humans are causing climate change. The natural changes don't account for what's happening.
Don't take my word for it though. Check out the wikipedia article on "Global warming" and spend some time reading the citations. Note that I said the citations. That's legitimate science, first-hand.
>>79031796
This.
I also still can't believe there are people that think global warming doesn't exist.
>>79031170
That's not even a shitty rebuttal. That's not a rebuttal at all. Literally no one claimed that the Earth has never warmed or cooled. What does that have to do with anything? You might as well claim that you can't be a murderer because people have died of natural causes before.
Humans are the primary cause of global warming right now. That's just plain science. Look it up.
>>79031278
Trying to impose regulations on businesses can not not be political.
>Humans are the primary cause of global warming right now. That's just plain science. Look it up.
Why do people like you, who have no idea what they're talking about, always sound like they think they're so much better than everyone else? Quite literally the self-hating white liberal demographic.
This thread isn't /co/, anyway. It's /pol/. Report it.
>>79033734
Read a textbook faggot.
>>79033734
I wasn't trying to sound like I'm better than people. I was trying to emphasize how concrete the evidence is. Why bother hemming and hawing when there's a clear-cut answer to the question of global warming? If we were talking about something that wasn't so well-established then it'd be different.
>>79031245
manbearpig wasn't real
he was in imaginationland
>>79030460
>>79031796
>>79033614
>>79033734
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei-_SXLMMfo
>>79033614
>read Wikipedia
According to Wikipedia Baracely Manning is actually Chelsea Manning. Wikipedia is objectively true as a Westbro Baptist sign.
>>79034355
>spend some time reading the citations. Note that I said the citations
You can't even read a post so I don't know if even Wikipedia is quite your speed.
>>79034451
Looks like >>79034355 got rekt
>>79034451
>citations can't be biased and untruthful
Stop it. Just stop it. Wikipedia is hilariously corrupt and biased as fuck. No one in their right mind would actually tell someone to check out a wikipedia article on a politically or socially sensitive subject.
>>79029265
More like "South Park says Al Gore is a tool"
>>79034487
Yeah. Everyone knows you can't trust the evil Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.
Learn to evaluate sources for yourself.
>>79030903
I swear people like you have never watched South Park.
>>79034124
Psssst... dumbass. That's a television program, did you miss that part about scientifically illiterate journalists. Time ran a story, they are not a scientific publication. The majority of the research at the time still said warming.
THAT was sensationalist nonsense, are you going to link stories about Batboy to disprove evolution next?
>>79031278
Denialism would have happened even without Al Gore. Combating Climate change requires government intervention regulating the activities of corporations, which is anathema to the GOP and the people that fund them.
>>79034522
>Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
Yea because that sounds really trustworthy.
>>79034601
>only the corporations would be affected!
Nice try.
>>79034640
I'm not saying only corporations would be affected, only that they have the influence over politicians to lobby against regulation and get Republicans to deny scientific facts
>>79034628
How do you propose they'd name it? Intergovernmental Panel on Liberal Lies?
The only thing I know to be true is that most people will deny all scientific facts if it happens to disagree with their opinion.
>>79030903
This characterisation resembles nothing like South Park, this is just completely obnoxious jeering.
>>79034710
This. Just try debating with an anti-vaxxer. It's impossible, doesn't matter what facts you present, they'll claim they're all lies and cite unreliable sources from the internet.
I will say this, climate change deniers are being used by moneyed interests like Oil corporations, so I can understand why there's so many of them. Nobody benefits from anti-vaxxers at all, they exist from their own stupidity and cause children to die, so they're objectively worse.
>>79034743
It's not like they're arguing that it could be dangerous to take action, they just can't be arsed to. Like what the fuck.
>>79034743
In fairness, you're claiming Climate Change deniers are being controlled by Oil corporations without a source or citation.
Anti-Vaxxers are claiming the same thing about you being controlled by Big Pharma.
You're not exactly putting yourself above them here, you're just calling them names.
>>79029387
explains why the show isn't that funny
>If climate change is happening, then why isn't it happening?
>Because we're going through an ice age and climate change is cancelling it out!
People actually buy this.
>>79034820
>>79034820
>>79034837
You need to realize that if I can't actually feel the climate changing with my own body, it isn't happening. Nothing outside of my sensory capacity is for real.
>>79034781
You're telling me you don't believe that Fox News and the GOP's climate change denial isn't done because of money interests?
>http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/15/exxon-mobil-gave-millions-climate-denying-lawmakers>>79034781
>>79029265
I think it was more about Al Gore using something to feel important about himself
>>79034848
>Nothing outside of my sensory capacity is for real
I wonder how many people take this approach to cuckoldry
>>79034743
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_hCLWtEHL8
>>79034866
Not everything is the result of money interest, believe it or not. Climate change denial is the result of one thing: it's something liberals believe in. People are consistently shown to be more inclined to dislike something if the opposite political party is for it, even if it's by all accounts unrelated to their ideology. There's no reason why social conservatism and economic monetarism should be linked, yet that's exactly how the Republican party has been for a century, and Republicans tend to be staunchly both.
>>79035034
>There's no reason why social conservatism and economic monetarism should be linked, yet that's exactly how the Republican party has been for a century, and Republicans tend to be staunchly both.
Of course there's a reason for it. The corporate interests in the GOP realized that they could use the christian right to win elections, so they made an alliance with them
>http://www.salon.com/2015/04/19/christian_america_is_an_invention_big_business_right_wing_politics_and_the_religious_lie_that_still_divides_us/
>>79029265
>>79034985
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iBLlksqztg
How are you guys posting despite being under 10m of rising sea levels? I'm lucky enough to have lived out in the boonies so now I'm enjoying the beachfront view but sometimes I feel guilty about how I could've prevented this by letting corporations throw money at third world shit holes as a tax write off.
>>79029265
I'd say the guys a millenium in the future would have a better idea mang
>>79035295
This is the dumbest strawman I've ever seen.
>>79031108
Where did they say this?
>>79029265
South Park is a libertarian circle-jerk that only gained popularity because of it's le crude humor. It was meme shit then, it's meme shit now. See, PC principal.
>>79034985
>>79035166
>normal people react
>videos made by a faggot
Homosexuality is a mental illness.
>>79035493
>rosebud.jpg
Oh no. You sure ruined everyone's day with your timely image.
>>79035084
>salon.com
The thing I don't get about this whole debate is even if you don't believe in man made climate change, surely you should still be in favour of reducing pollution?
>>79031170
>4.5 billion years ago the earth was a molten fireball
>so tell me again why I can't swim in lava
>>79035463
South Park stopped being funny when it became less about smart-mouthed kids being kids that live in a shitty town and made due with the fun there and became 'Big News story of the week' the Episode.
>>79035513
It was the only page I could find that had an excerpt of the book "One Nation Under God: How Corporate America Invented Christian America". It was a very interesting read and very well researched.
Here's a review from the WSJ, a conservative publication
>http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-world-ike-wrought-1433891576
The GCMs that purport to simulate climate are interesting experiments, and it's not unimpressive that they can be made to produce results that look at least reasonable. But they model the atmosphere with grid cells 100 miles on a side, and attempt to use this to predict the state of the atmosphere - a chaotic system - for the next century. This does not pass the laugh test.
There is simply no scientific way to verify or falsify the accuracy of any such piece of software. It is not practical to perturb Earth's climate, perturb your model's climate, and test that they both respond in the same way. And there is no other way to test a model. In the end, all you have is a curve that records past temperature, and a piece of software that generates future temperature. Perhaps if we could watch the predicted and actual curves match up for a century or so, we could generate something like statistical significance. But we can't. And hindcasting - fitting the models to data from the past - overfits, and is completely worthless.
Because of climate change, cleaner burning coal and the industries to extract it have been shut down in the UK, and instead we export dirty coal from abroad. Steel and heavy industry is dying a slow death while Chinese steel which is worse and filthier floods the market. Climate change has been used as an excuse for taxes and the end of livelihoods, yet the government would rather give billions to the EU then properly address things like flood control and so on.
To be honest, the current rate of sea level growth is looking like a foot a century. I could deal with a foot of sea levels and an end to the above nonsense.
let's just focus on getting off-planet.
>>79035518
That's actually quite funny because in the EU to address climate change, diesel engines were heavily pushed and petrol engines were heavily penalised. Only now it turns out that after a ton of people have switched to diesel, it's caused most major urban levels to have much higher levels of cancerous pollutants and far lower air quality unlike American cities where the pollutant control was focused on dangerous particulates and not climate change.
Oh, and it turns out that those diesel engines are actually just as bad as petrol engines so now thanks to that climate change legislation, backed by studies and research, we're now more polluted and haven't done anything.
The solution of course is to increase taxes on diesel engine vehicles. Obviously.
>>79035518
So we should penalize industry in countries which already have clean air laws and specialize in reducing air pollutants so that the jobs, knowledge and industry will go to third world countries where those laws don't exist and industry can re-enact the excesses of the 19th century, only this time far worse?
GOOD THINKING.
>>79029265
Uh, stop me if I'm wrong, but I don't think South Park ever insinuated that global warming wasn't real. I think it just mocked Al Gore for his entire platform being pointing at the scary thing and going LOOK, LOOK! I CAN SAVE YOU FROM SCARY THING!
>>79035844
This. But you even if you believe that man made climate change is real and a problem that needs addressing, if you dare even hint that perhaps it should be looked into carefully and perhaps certain things are unnecessary and it would be better to focus on other things, you'll be howled out.
It's become a religion. Same for multiculturalism. Dare to state that perhaps we should control immigration a bit and maybe having massive influxes of people from the Middle East and Africa won't be a success and you might as well have said 'We should round up everyone who isn't superwhite and gas them'.
>>79035783
Fuck the earth and future generations lol I'm gonna be dead who cares: the post
>>79035804
>we should just do nothing
They didn't say anything about global warming on that South Park.
It was about the dangers of man bear pig and being a fear mongering cunt instead of presenting a sane reasonable argument.
>>79035861
>if you dare even hint that perhaps it should be looked into carefully and perhaps certain things are unnecessary and it would be better to focus on other things, you'll be howled out.
I don't really see this happening. Give examples.
The only people getting howled out are those that deny that Climate change exists, those that deny that it's man-made and those that say we should do nothing.
>>79034935
Most people in the planet do.
>>79035936
>Give examples.
Not the guy you're replying to but probably the same group of people who bitched about that scientist's T shirt aka feminists
>>79035463
>It disagrees with me so I hate it
>>79033734
>Why do people like you, who have no idea what they're talking about, always sound like they think they're so much better than everyone else
Nothing personal, kid.
>people still believe in climate change
>implying it's not a big lie to make more money
Climate change has always happened throughout mankind, a rise or drop of a few degrees is not being caused solely by human modernisation alone.
Besides, the most pollutants right now is from developing countries like china or india that dont give a shit about global warming. Even if you bring into change just about everything you want, you still wont obtain any major changes in temperature or weather because human effect on the planet's temperature change is absolutely minuscule.
>>79034355
>/pol/
cuckservatives, everyone
>>79034487
>i-it's corrupt because I say so!
So whats it gonna be? Climate change or whitey going extinct? The only thing that people seem to agree on is that we're going to be at the point of no return by about 2050.
>>79029265
But they don't say it isn't real, they criticise Al Gore for how he presents global warming and people so saying every extreme weather event is global warming.
>>79030903
They aren't libertarians though.
>>79031170
When will "tumbr" become a banable offense
>>79036031
>global warming is a lie to make more money
>the countries ignoring the concept of global warming are the ones making the money
What?
>>79036075
Once climate change happens darky will move back to their own countries and whitey will colonise them out of survival.
I took more issue with the smoking episode of South Park. I don't know who Rob Reiner is, but that episode very much came off as pro-smoking. As in, promoting smoking as something cool other people should do.
>>79036031
hanlon's razor you fucking retard
>>79036131
It's not promoting smoking, it's saying fat fucks shouldn't criticise smokers as they're both as bad as each other.
>>79035906
This, Al Gore presented a perfectly reasonable argument why Manbearpig was real and how to defeat him, no one took him seriously, and so many will die to Manbearpig
>>79036144
>Being hypocritical makes a fat fuck's argument wrong about smoking
>>79036113
What's the matter? Getting triggered?
>>79036131
It's not pro-smoking. It's pro-"doing what you want as long as you don't butt-in other people's shit". But you're a retard and missed the point 'cause you watch shows to agree with them.
>>79029265
How about you look at some actual data and peer reviewed articles and make your assumption from there instead of between two cartoons. Fucking Americans.
>>79036200
I didn't say thay and neither did south park. Smoking gives you lung cancer and heart disease, no one's denying that, not even smokers. South Park just called him a hypocrite for being anti smoking, while being fat. It's like a smoker being an anti obesity advocate.
>>79036031
>>implying it's not a big lie to make more money
You do realize that Oil companies are the ones making lots of money thanks to climate change denialism, right?
>>79036238
tbf oil price is plummeting so they're not really making money. But I agree, they are exploiting climate change deniers with the aim to make money.
>>79035987
>It's flat out WRONG, so I hate it.
fix'd
Here's some reading you can be educated:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Global_warming
In addition, here's an article that I edited and got approved:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/South_Park
If I was climatology teacher, I would give Matt Stone and Trey Parker an F.
so who saw OP and instantly thought 'man, this is the fucking bad idea and will just be a huge shit storm'
>>79036411
It's a mod who created the thread, anyway. What can you do?
You can be concerned about conservation and responsible use of resources without also thinking that we HAVE to dismantle our energy infrastructure and kill off a fifth of our population so we can live like stone age hunter-gatherers.
All these people have been crying about how if we don't DO SOMETHING RIGHT NOW!!!! the world we be destroyed and unlivable and we'll all be in Mad Max in a few years. And yet RIGHT NOW China and India have some of the worst air and water pollution problems on Earth that we could be doing something about instead.
People don't like doomsday propechies. They like consequences they can see and solutions they can participate in and see results in a short time.
>>79029265
>>79036437
>what if it's a hoax and we give supreme economic power to a different oligarchy in the process of dismantling our energy infrastructure and sterilizing our population in the name of "sustainibility" for nothing
People act like the consequences of following all these crazy prescriptions will be benign even if global warming isn't a thing, but look at what happens when the government subsidizes and sponsors these programs that turn out to be hugely wasteful and don't fucking work.
>>79036437
Nothing good has come of the effort, except enriching Al Gore and his cronies.
>>79036103
Trey is
>>79036451
>Clean healthy air and nice nature is a wasteful expense
>>79036451
I live in Spain, where renewable energy has been extremely profitable to the point that it's one of the few things Spain has an edge over other countries. So I think these prescriptions aren't "crazy" at all
>>79036547
I'm sure he'd rather live in China, where these pesky government regulations about emissions and "concerns" over people's health aren't an issue
>>79034743
>>79034985
I can't wait till the episode "where the kids find out that vaccines cause autism and your penis to fall off". I'm pretty sure the neoreactionary audience would laugh it up. I know this because the libertarian God that is Ron Paul is a vaccine denier too, in addition to evolution denial.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJiTStZtrlE
Hell, mainstream entertainment is already taking the anti scientific side:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I88fDGPA7wM
I consider all forms of denialism are just as bad and disgusting.
It's denialism that is the reason why my doctor friend gets his house egged and the reason why I can't get fucking job despite how smart I am.
>inb4 get a job! etc.
>>79036571
Pollution is always worse in socialist countries.
>>79036628
I never said it wasn't. China just doesn't give a fuck and nothing we do will make them change in the foreseeable future
>>79036605
You do realize there's no actual research into the long term effects of the perservatives, right?
After leaded gas, we realized there's really no safe amount of lead.
But, alot of these compounds are known to have negative effects, in full grown humans. And we're injecting them into infants.
>>79036719
I'm pretty sure there is a rationalwiki to counteract that, let's see, ah here we go!
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/GMO
>>79036605
>and the reason why I can't get fucking job despite how smart I am
What did you study? What job is it that denialism is preventing you from getting?
>>79036806
>http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/GMO
>Says there's a lack of independant research
>Three sections later Props up scientific consensus as a valid argument.
Putting aside that prior consensus have been that the universe is a steady state, leaded gas is just fine, and is ultimately just an appeal to authority fallacy.
That comment was about the preservatives in vaccines. Not GMO food.
>>79036806
Oh god, I'm reading their fucking flouride article.
It's a classic example of double think.
>Ok, flourosis exists. Which is a disease caused by a build up of flouride in the body.
>Ok, yeah, there is an appearent link between flouride in drinking water and lowered IQ.
>But guys, that's just because there was TOO MUCH flouride in the water, it's totally safe in lower quantities! It's totally worth it... for the absolutely non-existant effect on cavity rates!
>>79036858
Hm let's see. I wanna be a doctor so that I can help eradicate diseases and make people's lives better oh!--
>Denialists make shitty schlockumentaries like House of Numbers, and Doctored. Now I can't get a job as a doctor without being harassed by stalkers
I want to be a climatologist and study change in the climate and report and oh!
>Denialists push foward MANBEARPIG meme, get harassed by people who I thought were my friends, and mocked by a television show I used to watch.
I know, I'm going to be a historian oh!
>Get targeted and beat up by neo nazi holocaust denialists.
I'm going to be a game developer and oh!
>Get targeted by internet hate mob for sticking up for inoffensive feminists who didn't hurt anybody. Gets considered a mangina by Maddox and Dick Masterson and gaming community for not being a sexist.
I'm going to be lawyer and oh!
>Get egged and harassed by tax dodgers who deny the 16th amendment despite how many times I point it out in the fucking tax payed text book I read in class.
I will be an astronaut and further space development and oh!
>Moon hoaxers and flat earthers deny Apollo missions, hamper research and prevent us from investing in space travel.
Point is, being in the workforce nowadays to do good in addition to getting paid is worthless endeavor due to conspiracy dipshits and their effort to make a world a shitty place as possible.
http://www.cracked.com/article_21341_5-ways-every-conspiracy-theory-makes-world-worse.html
The only I could make money is by being a dipshit corporate exec, which I don't have the qualifications for anyway since I don't have a degree in BS.
>>79029359
here's your reply
>>79037220
Hmm, woulda figured life was better in Bullshit Town.
>>79031170
i mean you're not wrong, in that Earth's climate has changed before, but it can change for different reasons. It just so happens that this time around its anthropogenic. I mean, ask yourself, we put our shitloads of carbon dioxide every day, have deforested a not insignificant amount of land, and have altered the landscape very drastically in some parts of the world. What's ridiculous is people claiming "no we're not affecting the climate."
All you have to do is open up the scientific literature. There are plenty of open access journals on the web. I know it's a bit difficult to learn the jargon, but cmon, you could try instead of spouting off buzzwords.
>>79029265
>this thread
I want things to get really fucking bad. City get flooded, animals go extinct by the butt loads, mass migration from inhospitable hot places. Maybe then we'll come together and get shit done
>>79037301
Won't happen.
The last the the world was several degrees warmer than it is -right now-, there were vineyards in england.
It's scaremongering bullshit propagated by a small group looking to enrich themselves.
>>79037220
>>79037220
Now,
Getting Reps to pay me to sit on my butt is the best form of revenge I can think of, and I encourage others to go welfare state so others can do it too. I consider it my moral and patriotic duty to be a soc parasite,
because after all, there would be no more war either because the government would be too busy paying us to even fund an illegal war. Now excuse me. * Farts and burps in your face if you're republican(that includes if you are a South Park Rep, same difference *
>>79034848
>Nothing outside of my sensory capacity is for real
What if nothing outside of your own mind is real?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphysical_solipsism
>>79031278
>>79034601
Climate change denial began before Gore knew it existed.
The first people to know climate change was a serious problem were Exxon and they immediately began plans to suppress information and prepare to lobby and fight the idea that climate change existed.
That's what that big scandal that just broke out was about.
>>79037297
>implying you aren't many orders of magnitude worse for posting cancer universe garbage
>>79037321
It's not absolute temperature, 'tard, it's average temperature.
The problem isn't the temperature in England, it's the effect of an average temperature increase on jet currents, ocean currents, ice flows and shelves.
>>79030534
Pretty much. There's no unarguable proof of man-made global warming.
>people actually think this decade's apocalypse scenario 'climate change' is real
>people already forgot 30 years ago everyone was afraid too much smog was covering the Earth making it too cold
>all the scientists agreed!
>implying climate change isn't a scam for scientists to get more funding
>>79037220
It's only going to get worse, anon.
The internet is allowing people to unconsciously reinforce and close off their own personal reality bubble. You can easily and unknowingly filter all your information into just what you want to hear, reinforcing your incorrect views with the agreement of other similarly deceived persons, and the guy in the house next to you will live in a totally different reality bubble.
>>79037356
Yes, global temperature has been much higher, DURING human civilization.
And it was a goddamned golden age for europe.
>>79037359
>There's no unarguable proof of man-made global warming
>>79037375
Science is a cheap whore with the popular belief of being a regal lady.
People don't realize that the vast majority of studies, on any subject, are cherry picked to hell and back.
Which only gets worse when the funding source wants a particular result. Peer review is basically a buzzword for as much as it actually happens.
Governments want global warming to be real, because then they get to take more power over the populace in the name of "doing something." Guess who's funding the global warming studies?
>>79036428
Most scientists and politicians would agree with what you're saying. Even a good portion of environmentalists would. It's the very vocal ones that don't sound like that.
It's the same reason why certain presidential candidates have gained such traction: they offer very simple answers to complex, wide reaching problems. People like that. It isn't at all how the world works, but people do like that.
We have whole academic disciplines dedicated to the study of societies, morality, and economics that are always debating and revising, and these fucks think they can boil things down to simple "do this or that" answers. Global warming is probably one less complicated problems we've got, because it really is matter of sensible regulation and encouraging clean, renewable energy.
>>79036255
>tbf oil price is plummeting
Because oil got so profitable that the US started fracking to get more and that would've undermined OPEC's interests so they made prices plummet in order to make shale and fracking operations unprofitable.
Oil companies will continue to make money hand over fist regardless.
Another large problem is coal power plants. They belch radioactive particulate into the air and build up huge quantities of dangerous and poisonous fly ash, but because apparently we HAVE to keep coal mines open, the word nuclear gives people heart attacks, and renewable energy inevitably draws the misdirected ire of conservatives, we've gotta keep our power generation stuck firmly in the industrial revolution.
>>79033614
First: how many of those scientists are involved in some manner with alternative energy? Why can we not call their objectivity into question?
Second, Wikipedia is only as factual as the agenda-driven autists that run their pages like medieval fiefdoms.
So sure anons are. They must be smart
>>79037220
Dude literally what the hell. Lots of people still have those jobs, and make good money doing it. It just sounds like you don't have the drive and are afraid of what others think of you. Man the fuck up.
>>79037375
What specific article did people get that impression from?
![marcott-A-1000[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/MPGCCOU.jpg "marcott-A-1000[1].jpg")
>>79037388
hurr durr
>>79037462
Anon, the very first scientists to agree that climate change was a man-made threat were scientists working for Exxon-Mobile. They subsequently covered up their own research.
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/08/exxon-climate-change-1981-climate-denier-funding
Pretty sure they weren't trying to get research grants.
>>79029265
Futurama had Gore shills, South Park was tired of Gore's bitching
>>79037411
Ok tumblr
people who cry about global warming are as bad as people who cry about overpopulation, it may or may not be a problem, but the biggest offenders of these issues come from one part of the world, not 1st world nations
>>79037530
>Hey, let's slap 500 years for which we won't even pretend to have data on here as a straight line. No one'll catch that.
>>79037220
>>Moon hoaxers and flat earthers deny Apollo missions, hamper research and prevent us from investing in space travel.
Do they? I was very much under the impression that they yell hot air that nobody pays attention to.
>>79037608
Ignoring that it tells you which two models they're using: if we have no data on that time period then how can you claim what you do in >>79037388
Global Warming is not a problem we can fix with Loose Change. It's a big problem that has to be fixed by everybody adopting VERY tough legislation and investing in technology that's honestly not there yet.
There's not a silver bullet, there's a lot of sides to this issue but if there was a silver bullet it'd be cars. Everybody has to buy a new car with shitty gas mileage. Everybody. Can you afford to toss out every car you have for shittier models? Neither does the rest of America
It's like you people didn't even watch the episode...
South Park rarely makes black and white claims.
>>79030505
>implying that of all shows, sp is the one that needs to cover their asses for anything
>studied Biology in college
>capstone involved designing your own research project with other classmates and presenting at a symposium
>meant to be a dry run of actually filling out grants, conducting research, and writing papers like you would be expected to do in Grad school
>get to the part where you draft your grant proposal
>part of it involves connecting your research to existing research and journals
>easiest way to justify anything environmental-related is to talk about connections to anthropocentric global warming
It's pretty much guaranteed to get the board's attention over anything else. I'm pretty convinced that the main reason why there's so many doomsday scenarios and research papers about it that come out all the time are more just because the scientists know it's easy grant money.
Do I believe humans can have an impact on the climate and environment and we need to be careful about how we use resources? Absolutely. But I also don't put a lot of stock into the "WE HAVE TO STOP USING COAL THIS WEEK OR EVERYONE IS GOING TO DIE" predictions.
>>79037335
>The first people to know climate change was a serious problem were Exxon and they immediately began plans to suppress information and prepare to lobby and fight the idea that climate change existed.
>That's what that big scandal that just broke out was about.
And people say cartoon villains and conspiracies don't exist in real life.
>>79037375
>>implying climate change isn't a scam for scientists to get more funding
You say that like they just pocket the funding. They aren't businessmen, they're scientists. They use that money to learn stuff that benefits us all.
>>79035539
>I'm too young to remember news from 1996,
>>79038173
Scientists gotta eat too. The money that funds their learning of stuff also has to come from somewhere. Scientists are just a corruptible as any politician, there are many, MANY researchers who are paid to come up with specific results.
>>79033978
PEOPLE DIED! Or is that not real to you either , MISTER SCIENTIST?
>>79029265
Al Gore is a money loving cuck.
South Park is actually right.
>>79038173
>>79038224
Again: the first to really hit on the danger of climate change were scientists working for Exxon Mobile, scientists who had absolutely no outside incentive to reach that conclusion.
The idea that climate change is just funding bait is absolutely retarded.
>>79029359
THIS!
>>79034837
FUCKING MINOANS RUINED THE PLANET
>>79038078
>"WE HAVE TO STOP USING COAL THIS WEEK OR EVERYONE IS GOING TO DIE"
That's part of what did the most disservice to the idea of global warming, the assumption that what would happen would be The Day After Tomorrow. That South Park episode was pretty funny though.
>>79029265
South Park is often wrong, but they mostly choose safe opinions, as far as edgy ones go. On global warming however, they seem to be more against the way it's presented than anything else. Sensationalist scientist have been trying to get people's attention by over hyping the issue which leads to people becoming disinterested. One can believe in man made global warming but still think that it's not worth getting worked up about. There are those who don't even want to have the conversation, so they stop it by being intellectually dishonest and deny the concept all together.
if global warming is real should be invade China? i mean they're literally going to kill us!
>>79037427
>Governments want global warming to be real, because then they get to take more power over the populace in the name of "doing something."
You watch too much Fox News.
You know which is the government that pollutes the most without caring about the environment?
China.
China doesn't curtail its emissions because it makes massive amounts of money by not doing it, even though its very badly affeting their environment and people's health.
>>79038392
the industry of studying global warming is a scam
scientists sensationalize it because they're getting $$$
>>79038408
China owns all their companies or getting paid directly by companies that go there to open shop
American companies aren't as pocket deep with out government as they are with China
>>79038408
You're missing the point. A government structured to give itself even MORE executive power for a good intention right now means that there's fewer safeguards in place to prevent someone from using that same structure down the road for less-good intentions.
>>79038422
Define sensationalize in this context and why isn't the media the better example of sensationalizing science?
>>79038500
>if we don't stop we'll be underwater in a couple years!
>>79038449
>American companies aren't as pocket deep with out government as they are with China
Because in America, it's the companies that control the government. All these oil companies lobby politicians to get them to do what they want. It's why almost nothing ever gets done to actually combat climate change. The entire Republican party and a lot of democrats are forced to deny man-made climate change or they'll lose all their campaign money.
>>79038500
Watch Age of Stupid.
>>79038522
>and yet New York City and other big blue-controlled coastal cities put zero emphasis on flood control measures and money into infrastructure that would help the cities in that scenario
The biggest problem scientists have trying to sell the idea that human activity can affect the climate, is the utter hypocrisy of its biggest proponents.
>>79038536
what do you expect us to do about global warming? stop companies from making stuff in our country? that's both bad for our economy and people, but they'll all just go to a place that'll let them fuck around, like China or Mexico
>>79029265
Southpark later changed their mind, They think AL Gore is an attention whore but climate change is real.
>>79038536
>Because in America, it's the companies that control the government
>big money controls the government!
So explain how Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump are on top right now, both of which vehemently speak out against their parties' establishments and don't have big SuperPAC lobbyists pumping money into their campaigns. (Trump you could make an argument for, but the fact is that he's still been funding his entire campaign out of pocket)
>>79038608
>are on top right now
Sorry, let me clarify. Sanders is currently edging out Hilary in Iowa and NH polls (where she has MASSIVE negative likeability scores)
>>79038608
It's easier to buy Congressional elections than it is to buy Presidential elections.
And I didn't say they controlled it, only that they have a huge influence
>>79038608
establishment republicans hate Trump
and the democrat party and liberal media is doing everything to ignore Sanders
>>79038522
>dailymail.co.uk
>>79038666
Oh yeah, I did say that they controlled it. My bad, was exagerating
>>79038422
>scientists
>getting $$$
pick one
>>79036806
>Using Rationalwiki seriously
It's run by the same kinda idiots that make up Atheism+
Not saying that you are wrong about what you're saying, but use another source man.
>>79038764
>>79038764
That's the point. I know this because I worked at a university-sponsored chemistry research lab for a year, and believe me any shit you can do to get on the radar to make sure your funding doesn't run out and the university cuts off your project is what you pursue.
A lot of times what scientists wind up doing isn't what they're passionate about or what they truly believe is world-changing, but what looks the best on a research grant proposal.
>>79038422
This is bullshit.You could say thayt about any scientific facts you don't like.
It's a conspiracy!
>>79037726
Just a few days ago NASA published a huge archive of Apollo photos largely due to conspiracy claims. They hold a much bigger influence than you'd think.
>>79030406
>>79031084
>>79030992
>>79031278
>>79034872
I will make this rebuttal to all those who think that "Manbearpig" is all about satirizing Al Gore and not about denying scientific evidence and promoting ignorance.
>Fan Question: I know there’s usually stories that inspire South Park episodes and jokes, is there anything like that behind Al Gore and ManBearPig?
>Answer: Yep, there definitely is. Al Gore came out with a documentary called “An Inconvenient Truth” right around the time that episode came out (in 2006). In it, Gore preaches about the super-cereal affect of global warming and how he’s really serious, and no one is listening to him. In simpler words, ManBearPig is an allegory for Global Warming.
And here is the sauce:
http://southpark.cc.com/blog/2014/07/01/fan-question-whats-the-story-behind-al-gore-and-manbearpig
So there you have it. No questions about it. Manbearpig is an ALLEGORY to Global Warming. In other words, Matt Stone and Trey Parker believe that Global Warming is akin to a mythological beast like bigfoot. A myth. They live in the same world your average conspiracy nutjob lives in, a world where world renowned scientists are all in on it to fleece your taxpayer money. Yes it is making fun of Al Gore, but the thing they are satirizing Al Gore for is moral and just cause. They are like the kids in my school who used to beat me up for trying to study geometry and English and for caring about environmental issues.
Therefore, just like how Martin Luther King jr. was a victim to racists, and like Anita Sarkeesian is a victim to sexists, Al Gore was a victim to anti environmentalists who would love nothing more but to burn down every rainforest and make every animal extinct.
>>79038895
You're still ignoring this, huh?
>http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/08/exxon-climate-change-1981-climate-denier-funding
>>79037608
>what are ice cores and tree rings
>>79038422
Look up Richard Muller and the Koch Bros. Muller was a climate change skeptic hired by the Koch brothers to do a comprehensive study on all the most popular research pointing to man made global warming in hopes that he'd debunk it, but he wound up finding out that it all checks out. So they hire a new guy and run a story on Forbes about how they found a climate realist who agrees with them.
>>79038522
Source? I've never seen anything quite that sensationalist.
>>79029387
>Futurama had actual scientists working on it, they know what they're talking about.
Fuck this cult of scientism. You cunts put them on such an infallible pedestal, that they've become the new Clergy.
>>79039326
What? This is the first I've heard of this.
Are you making a joke?
>>79039326
Your butt told you otherwise so we all should listen to your nonsense.
All this bitching about cutting emissions and everything, why don't people just seed the oceans with iron? It's probably cheaper and easier than shutting down factories and shit.
>>79039326
Actually it's more like
>scientists who agree with my conclusions and beliefs are saints who can do no wrong and desire the best for humanity
>scientists who don't agree with my conclusions and beliefs are dirty corrupt heathens who are not real scientists and should be tarred, feathered and driven out of the community
>>79029265
Neither
We a motes of dust in the universe
We will live and die in such a short time that the very earh holding out corpses will forget we were there and swallow us whole.
To think such micros of the universe could both understand and predict the cause and effect of millina on millina weather claimants is beyond hubris
b2/pol/ faggot
>>79033734
You know, that's the real sad thing about modern conservatives. They will deny water is wet if obama was to say it. This is why the party is cannibalizing itself, They're literally taking as many extremes possible just to be the opposite of the big bad liberal with zero regard for how this extreme will affect people.
Dropped the republican party when they wanted to go to war with a third world country over nuclear weapons that they didn't even have the capability to create, Lost all hope for the party when Obama says ISIS are in fact just a bunch of stray lunatics with guns that aren't worth the resources and the republican response was "NUH UH YOU'RE NOT TAKING SUPER THREAT ISIS SERIOUSLY". Who would take isis seriously? The only homeland attack they've ever made on the US was literally legally supplied by the US, in which case it's no different from any other mass shooting that happens once every couple of months.
>>79039522
>I don't know how Science works
>>79039522
> I agree with 97% of climate scientists who support man made climate change
> I agree with the 3% who work for private think tank
And before someone vomits out the "debunking" from Christopher Moncton, whom has absolutely no qualifications in climate science; he added in neutral papers that expressed no position, but counted them as against.
>>79035493
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZayOUdjj-Po
>>79035975
>somebody mentions feminists in yet another /co/ thread that has nothing to do with feminism
I'm amazed it took this long
>>79036131
I'm comparatively more pissed off at how they used My Future Self 'N' Me to claim that "second-hand smoke increases your risk of cancer" is a lie concoted by liberals to make you not do drugs.
Because as we all know, liberals hate people taking drugs.
>>79036232
They didn't say it in the Rob Reiner episode... they said it in My Future Self 'n' Me
>Director: Well, you know what us ultra-liberals say, when it comes to children and drugs, lies are OK. The ends justify the means. We'll take smoking, for instance. The truth is there's no hard evidence that second-hand smoke can kill but, we believe it's okay to lie about it as long as it gets people to stop smoking.
>>79039326
>somebody says that scientists know what they're talking about
>HURR DURRR SCIENTISM
I do agree that people shouldn't automatically assume that science knows everything, but the way that word gets trotted out anytime somebody wants to use facts in these debates is absurd
>this thread
>>>/pol/
>>79038078
>>79038366
Pretty much this. They're saying we're going to see some serious shit in 10 years. Well, they said the same thing 10 years ago. The 10 biggest ships in the world release more CO2 than every car on earth. And factories and automobiles are a drop in a bucket when compared to livestock and volcanoes. Is climate change partly anthropogenic? Sure. But there's really not much we can do about it. Stopping population growth would be much more effective than over-regulating industries.
>>79037462
>cancer doctor says cancer is bad
>his/her objectivity is in question about cancer
>>79041243
The ten biggest ships release more CO2 than cars.
Yes, Einstein. Big ships are bigger than cars. They get worse mileage.
What they don't do is release more CO2 than all cars put together.
That would be stupid.
>>79039944
I'm talking about people from outside the field of research who talk about scientists as infallible sources of knowledge as long as they provide results that agree with their already-held conclusions.
I fucking know how science works, I'm criticizing people who think that way you fucking idiot.
>>79036547
Please tell me about all those clean energy companies the Obama administration subsidized that ended up going bankrupt while fighting explosively profitable energy solutions like fracking and the Keystone pipeline.
>>79041243
>>79041458
>Big ships are bigger than cars. They get worse mileage.
>What they don't do is release more CO2 than all cars put together.
It's actually 15 biggest, and not specifically CO2, but overall pollution.
But yes, all cars combined emit less pollution than the 15 largest ships
>>79041429
It's more like an oncologist pushing for everyone to have yearly cancer screenings. Yes, cancer is bad and you should get screened for it, but the oncologist has an economic stake in you getting yearly screenings.
>>79042745
Who is any of what you just said a bad thing?
>>79042594
We should ban sea-faring cargo ships. That'll solve climate change/global warming/cooling!
>>79037530
>he's never heard of the Little Ice Age
>>79037583
So if we extinguish the Chinese AND the Indians, we can save the world?
If only...
>>79031232
Because in the process the economy is being crippled, you fucking retard.
>come to comments expecting rational criticism of manbearpig and also some defense of it as more than just climate change denial
>climate change denial everywhere
>totally unironic, totally serious
Not to go all /int/ about it, but like... is this really how it is in the US? I'm from Canada and I've never met a climate change denier. Surely there can't be this many in the US?
Climate change is not something to be debated. It's not a partisan issue. Sure, debate how to RESPOND to it all day long; do nothing, carbon tax, etc. etc. But the science behind it is solid.
>>79041949
>explosively profitable
>literally explosive
Fracking has been largely opposed by local residents affected by the appearance of flammable tap water.
Keystone is a boon to Canadian oil sands extractors that rape the land and provide zero return to American workers. We're better off pumping the shitty crude out of N. Dakota than slurping the sludge out of Canada.
What we really need to do is mobilize a multi-national effort to exploit the vast liquid/gas hydrocarbon wealth of Titan, Saturn's most prominent moon and the only terrestrial body in the solar system with a dense atmosphere and extensive surface liquid.
>>79042896
>money matters more than the future
Typical Republitard logic.
>>79042896
>oil companies not getting literally everything they want = crippling the economy
cuckservatives, everyone
>>79042960
This is how it is here thanks to media brainwashing. Go on /pol/ and tell them anthropogenic climate change is real. See how many cuckservatives come out of the woodwork with "muh 1998 anomalous year."
>>79042960
Yes, it's like this in the US. The GOP (with the help of Fox News and Right-Wing radio) tells their base that climate change isn't real despite all the scientific consensus, so they foolishly accept it as a matter of faith, just like every position the GOP takes. They're just being used by the interests of Oil corporations, who've been manufacturing this for years.
The suposedly liberal media also helps because they present both "sides" as "equally valid" instead of just reporting the scientific truth, classic false equivalence "both sides do it" attitude they have.
You don't see this in other countries because Oil companies don't have as much influence.
>>79042960
In the US there are people who unironically believe in creationism. It's a weird country.
>>79042960
You meet denialfags only in deep red states (i.e. the ones farthest from the ocean), but they really aren't that common for the most part.
They do bring up good arguments every so often, but they are really only concerned about issues like what >>79042896
thinks are important.
Like solar and wind farms are going to bankrupt America. I mean come on, it's THE CURRENT YEAR!
>>79043267
>Like solar and wind farms are going to bankrupt America. I mean come on, it's THE CURRENT YEAR!
This. I live in Spain and almost half of our energy comes from renewable energy now. It's actually HELPING our economy, and Spain is now a leader in renewable energies and is doing good business with other countries, which will only grow.
But all Republicans can say is MUH SOLYNDRA
>>79043221
>You don't see this in other countries because Oil companies don't have as much influence
>what is Rosneft
>what is Dutch Royal Shell
>what is OPEC
Nigga, I think you best rethink that statement because it makes you look stupid as fuck.
>>79043389
I meant influence over the media and the public discourse
>>79042960
Britbong here, we get a few of them. The main culprit is a little turd called Martin Durkin; in the 90's, he made a documentary full of lies and half-truths, got caught out in his bullshit (including not telling certain talking heads what the film was about, then editing the footage so they said what he wanted them to say), then whined about how the environmentalists were picking on him with their mean old facts.
He did the exact same thing in the 00's, on the same channel, presenting the same bullshit (and re-editing footage from completely different dupes) from most of the same arseholes in a completely different documentary, then whining about being persecuted when he got called out on his bullshit.
He broke the cycle this decade, by making a documentary about how Nigel Farage, the British equivalent of Donald Trump, was a great chap and everyone who criticised him was a stupid meanie.
Unfortunately, our Environment Minister is also a conspiracy dickbag, because our current government is run by stupid cunts, evil cunts and stupid, evil cunts.
>>79042960
We're fucked.
He;; we were fucked the second scientific evidence became an issue of belief
Pic related. Our future
>>79043441
In that case, I think you mean the Jews.
>>79029387
What kind of scientists? Theoretical physicists? Chemists? Geologists? Biologists? You can't just say "scientist". That's like saying "I know you have a heart murmur because I'm a doctor" even though you're just a psychiatrist and not a cardiologist.
>>79043444
>our current government is run by stupid cunts, evil cunts and stupid, evil cunts.
How is that any different from your last government? Or any UK government, for that matter?
>>79043535
New Labour were mostly stupid dicks, evil dicks and stupid, evil dicks. By British standards, cunts are worse than dicks. Blair was an evil cunt, but he was not Cameron, who is a stupid, evil cunt.
>>79043237
>>79042960
>tfw I had to argue with my mom about the earth not being flat
>>79029265
Are you sure South Park has this opinion, I thought they just got annoyed with the smugness some people have when doing something slightly less shitty to the environment.
>>79042960
What bothered me was I had republican friends that said they were okay with leaving Earth and finding a new planet to trash and waste once Earth was ruined.
>>79037740
You know this wouldn't be a problem if we built our infrastructure to better support public transportation and cars were only for long distance travel.
>>79043043
Isn't gas prices so low because fracking actually gave the US a fairly large reserve of their own oil?
>>79044037
Gas prices are low because the Middle East wanted to fuck Russia in the ass and made their oil prices so low that Russia just couldn't compete.
>>79043723
>Are you sure South Park has this opinion
They don't. I think more people should listen to the commentaries and see how little thought they actually put in to their messages. Quite often they're just accidental.
They used ManBearPig not because they wanted to suggest that global warming doesn't exist, but because they'd previously come up with the idea of ManBearPig and thought making fun of Al Gore was a good opportunity to use it. It was literally just because they thought ManBearPig was funny.
>>79038293
>THIS!
Kill yourself
>>79039311
>le koch bros
Immediately discarded.
>>79043985
Well it's a bit late for that now. It's too inconvenient and would cost way too much money per municipality.
>>79037278
Why don't you link those journals then, shithead?
>>79037301
>Maybe then we'll come together and get shit done
You mean create a final solution to the African problem?
>>79043387
>half our energy comes from renewable
This post must be a troll post.
>>79042960
>Canada
No one gives a single fuck about your joke WEED LMAO current year A FUCKING LEAF country
Stop chiming in you're from Canada because that just makes any opinion you may hold completely and totally fucking invalid you fucking maple syrup chugging subhuman
