>erase all characters and continuity in shared universe
>replace them with other people
>wonder why people don't like them
Nobody actually likes New 52. It was a disaster from the start, and has done more to kill DC than Marvel ever could.
>"B...but they didn't erase the old books!"
No, but they erased those characters. I knew a lot of people whose favorite character was Wally West. He's gone now. Martian Manhunter is completely unrecognizable.
There will be no more stories in the future with the characters people like. Instead we get stories that might as well be from a completely different comic book company.
So please, explain to me why DC thought New 52 was a good idea?
>>78922503
>I knew a lot of people whose favorite character was Supergirl. She's gone now. Hawkman is completely unrecognizable.
>So please, explain to me why DC thought Crisis on Infinite Earths was a good idea?
>>78922503
It's a reboot you fucking idiot, it was suppose t Be like this, also, MM ongoing is better than half the shit he was back in the old universe
>>78922550
This reminds me, apparently people where mad like hell at COIE tho
>>78922503
>>erase all characters and continuity in shared universe
But it didn't. They all still exist in the bleed. Did you even read Multiversity or Convergence?
Why the fuck has this been posted lately? Is this all one shill or just a bunch of casual retards?
>>78922503
Agreed. DC's rich history, legacy, past, relationships, etc is what made the universe so rich and interesting. Now it's just a lesser, confused retread to get to the same spot. Besides Morrison's work, it made me jump ship. Marvel has its problems, certainly, but I like that for the most part, they can incoportate most everything that's happened into the canon.
>>78922550
Oh please this is absolutely nothing like what happened to Wally and you know it.
CoIE was absolutely necessary for the DCU to even make sense and some characters (yes, Hawkman and Power Girl) got caught in the crossfire. New 52 was a tacky sales ploy masterminded by a handful of creators who already spent the 90's almost destroying the industry with their previous cheap sales plots. 9/10 of the best stuff we got out of New 52 thus far didn't even need a reboot to happen.
>>78922677
That's all still canon. Fuck casuals are handicapped. The Crisises happened in universe. Let me break this down so your little brain can comprehend it.
You have a lamp, you break that lamp and buy a new one. Now you have a new lamp. You still know the old lamp existed and you still broke that old lamp to buy the new one, you just don't see that old lamp anymore. If somebody were to pull that old lamp out of the trash to use it, they could. You just aren't using that lamp anymore in your house.
>>78922550
>Hawkman has several different origins. Let's consolidate his confusing backstory and fix him.
Nu52
>Lets make Wally the Niggest. We need the Urban Demographic
>>78922806
Now let me break it down for you.
The old lamp could easily light up the enitre room. The new lamp can barely make it past the table. Instead of buying the same model of lamp you got a shittier version that wow, also has a completely useless red-light mode.
Also, the main advantage of COIE era comics as well as the main problem of the N52 era comics is that it's the same people at the helm before and after reboot, each time.
JT Kruls and Geoff Johnses and Dan Jurgenses have been making the universe shittier with their comics since 2006 or earlier, it's only natural they'd keep making terrible stuff after reboots and relaunches
Oh, it's time for this thread again.
>>78922830
>defending Hawksnarl
>>78922503
Fuck off marvel shill. We get it, you love the taste of bendis cock now go back to tumblr or wherever you're from lol.
>>78922956
You didn't read Multiversity man. It's fucking abundantly clear. Next you'll go on some stupid rant about how Morrison is a druggie so he sucks cause anyone who uses drugs is evil.
>>78922727
You don't know what you're talking about and you would be just as buttmad about COIE if it hadn't happened before you were born.
>>78923015
Morrison is alright, the complaint is that the rich history of characters' relationships is gone from the monthlies. It's just not there. It might be there in some ideaspace that powers or is powered by fanfics but who the fuck cares about those? I didn't come here for fanfics.
>>78923105
>Rich story about characters realationships
Superman and batman are still friends, Hal is still a fucking space cowboy that suffers, Diana still breaks necks from time to time, the core is here
>>78922503
I completely disagree with you. I love the new 52.
>>78923105
That may have been true at the beginning but again it hold no clout now. We've had plenty of great interactions with everyone in reference to their history. The League has been operational and theyve all been friends for years at this point. It sounds to me like you stopped reading immediately.
>>78922601
What a shame /co/ didn't exist back then. Imagine the whining.
>>78922956
>Geoff
>Making shitty comics
When Jonhs wants to do something he likes, like green lantern was, you know you are in for a ride though
>>78922503
Nu52 was a huge success in terms of sales and quality
>>78923206
Anon, usenet archives exist. You can look up the reactions yourself if you want to do enough digging.
Lotta bitching about Earth-2 getting the shaft.
>>78922806
>were to pull that old lamp out of the trash to use it, they could
How? It's broken
>>78923010
>"We get it, you love the taste of bendis cock now go back to tumblr or wherever you're from lol."
For real, dude?
>>78923301
They can use the pieces to build something new. Have you ever even seen the homeless work? They are magicians.
>>78923263
>Quality
Not if you were a Earth-2 fan like me it wasn't.
>>78923015
DUDE LSD LMAO
DUDE DRUGS DONT ACTUALLY PROVIDE ANY INSIGHT THEY JUST MAKE THE MUNDANE SEEM DEEP LMAO
DUDE EGO DEATH IS A MEME LMAO
DUDE DRUG INDUCED EGO DEATH IS NOT REAL BECAUSE NOTHING CAN SEPERATE US FROM THE SUM OF OUR EXPERIENCES WITHOUT PERMANTENTLY DAMAGING THE BRAIN LMAO
>>78922503
This shitty pasta will get hundreds of replies instead of being deleted.
Also, fuck you all for not buying Martian Manhunter.
>>78923010
>implying Marveldrones don't love New 52
>>78922503
I like the new 52
The old stuff still exists and I can read it at my leisure
>>78923432
N-no it doesn't work like that!!!
>>78922503
New 52 took a while to get good but it got there, unfortunately the DC You line bombed and we're getting a bunch of good books canceled due to low sales. It's a pity people don't buy good books anymore.
>>78923394
>Anything I disagree with is Pasta!
Fuck you, you fucking drone. Since when are people forbidden from not liking something?
>Martian Manhunter
Sorry, I'm not interested. As somebody who liked MM before the reboot, that book is a huge slap in the face to me. I don't care about this new character, so why should I buy his book?
>>78923432
>literally ignoring half the OP
epin
>>78923477
>samefaggin
double epin
>>78922806
>so your little brain can comprehend it.
followed by that bizarre lamp story
wow
>>78923594
What part did I ignore? I'm still getting stories with characters I like. Just because they are not exactly the same as they were six years ago (spoiler alert: most characters do change within a six year period even if it's not as blatant) doesn't mean I can't like them.
>>78923285
>Lotta bitching about Earth-2 getting the shaft.
The more things change, huh?
>>78923361
I mean, Robinson's run was much better than the late JSA runs, and honestly Taylor's run was slightly better than Guggenheim.
>>78923571
Explain to me how the current Martian Manhunter is at all different from pre-Flashpoint MM
>>78922503
it wasn't the reboot per say that was the bad idea it was the decision to start all the books five years in the future from Justice League and trying to copy Marvel's decompressed writing for Trade format that instantly killed the New 52
Every book should have started at Ground Zero even if that meant no legacy characters and sidekick characters still stuck in their silver age sidekick rolls
the 1st year should have all been done in one issues reestablishing characters and concepts not spending 6 months on new shitty villains like The Mirror, White Rabbit and Nobody.
>>78924040
But I liked Nobody
>>78923015
Not even the same anon, but you sound like a Morrison fan, and so your opinion seems a bit biased.
>>78923520
I'm a MCUdrone, what was DCyou and how was it different from the regular lineup? I've only ever heard of it mentioned here.
>>78924059
I agree, Tomasi's B&R run was generally pretty decent
>>78924248
DCYou is/was the branding for the DC line post-June 2015, and in particular the new books that launched in June (Omega Men, Prez, Midnighter, Dr. Fate, Robin: Son of Batman, etc.)
The books were supposed to allow the creators more freedom, and to produce better books that more people would buy. Instead they produced great books that nobody bought.
As usual, dudes on 4chan confuse their opinion with everyone's opinion. Nothing to see here.
>>78924248
>I've only ever heard of it mentioned here
>/co/ is better at marketing DC than DC's marketing department
>>78922550
>abloo bloo bloo this is not muh Jason Todd, Jason was a fun redhead circus kid, not some fucking edgy street rat who steals tires!
>>78922503
What the fuck Aquaman is fine. Been my start to comicbooks back in 2011.
I'm tired of them changing everything about old characters or giving the mantle to randoms just to fill some imaginary quota.
>>78923263
>Nu52 was a huge success in terms of sales and quality
Denial is strong in this one, I see.
By every objective measure, the reboot was a failure. It boosted sales for two months, and afterwards the sales sunk lower than before.
And quality? Who the fuck are you kidding?
>>78924040
thank you. i thought i was the only one who thought they wanted to use the old feelings to sell new versions. post crisis superman is different from pre crisis in notable ways.
>>78922503
>explain to me why DC thought New 52 was a good idea?
A reboot and new #1s bring in more sales. They're still up from what they were before the reboot.
Changing and simplifying history makes it easier for newcomers to understand.
They were clearly changing shit around for their inevitable cimenatic universe.
Hence the Justice League having Cyborg, being the first and most important team, and having no other members at first. And tons of other stuff like Shazam's name change and the ethically diverse Shazam kids, Barbara and her red hair being the first and only Batgirl, not giving a shit about the Titans in general, etc.
>>78922503
>Martian Manhunter is completely unrecognizable.
Every single solo book Martian Manhunter has had has completely changed his origin, starting with DeMatteis' mini in the 80's. This is nothing new.
>>78927883
>not giving a shit about the Titans in general
That would imply that anyone gave a shit about the Titans before the reboot
>>78922503
Nu52 Sold enormously, but alienated about half their audience. DC is a company built on the big three. Batman Superman Wonder woman.
It brought in new readers but DC figured out two years later that those new readers weren't staying. Sure the Superman title has found it's floor at about 35,000, a mixture of people who are going to buy the book no matter what and fans who like jean wearing, blog posting, jerk Superman. But Lois and Clark shows that there are readers who won't touch the new version but will read the old one.
Wonder Woman's the most glaring case. The book under Brian sold about five thousand better than the previous volume, but at the expense of her prior audience. Plenty of girls have informed me in shops they hate the new take including the rape origins.
Except for Batman, the Nu52 screwed up DC's most important properties. It may have been necessary, but it came at the cost of immediate sales.
>>78922503
>erase all characters and continuity in shared universe
>replace them with other people
In conclusion, as always:
People who don't like n52 = non readers.
>>78928215
>But Lois and Clark shows that there are readers who won't touch the new version but will read the old one.
Is that why it's already dead in the water?
>>78926304
>giving the mantle to randoms just to fill some imaginary quota.
name five examples from the new 52
>>78926304
This is a DC thread, not a Marvel one.
>>78928215
The second string have the same shit. Aquaman is the strongest he's ever been. Justice League, while heavily Bendis, has consistency that's been missing for a long time. Yes the flip side is a weakened Flash book, a mess of their young heroes. But without the reboot, you don't get Swamp thing Frankenstein JLD and Animal Man.
No the revamp isn't perfect,
Bat family titles lost cult favorites and classic stories. Despite Babsfags, the ginger Batgirl has never carried her own title. Nor has Damien. Tim Drake has carried TWO titles, and both Cass and Steph Brown not only had two big runs with Steph's book being the lowest readership at only 20,000ish.
>>78928309
Sells more than Omega men, Prez, and Gotham Academy with Dan Jurgens writing. And it was always a limited series.
>>78928215
>DC is a company built on the big three. Batman Superman Wonder woman.
Wonder Woman is not one of the big three. Green Lantern is.
>>78926119
tbf senpai I use adblock too.
>>78928423
>heavily Bendis
In what way?
>>78928449
Yes, but your original post was implying more people would read Lois and Clark than Nu52 Superman which is just untrue.
>>78928456
In our shared dreams.
>>78928456
Green Lantern has a similar audience, I mean reading demographics. Diana brings a different audience than GL.
>>78928127
>That would imply that anyone gave a shit about the Titans before the reboot
They had two books before the reboot which is more than you could say for the reboot. They cared so little about the Titans they just got rid of the version anybody cared about and stuck two 90s guys on it.
>>78928490
Have they sold any of the movie variants as posters? I would love to buy thisand the Sinestro one
>>78928499
A different audience who doesn't read comics and gets confused why there might be kangaroos in it?
>>78928485
No, I didn't imply that. But there is a large contingent that won't read the jeansupes. Splitting a readership like that isn't necessary post convergence.
>>78928423
>But without the reboot, you don't get Swamp thing Frankenstein JLD and Animal Man.
Why not? Nothing about 2011 continuity would've prevented any of those titles from being launched.
>>78928558
And had no idea that WW had its origins on Bondage, no wonder people don't get Morrisons E1
>>78922503
>But most that green lantern stuff totally happened, what do you mean I can't have my cake and eat it? Screw you the cake is now the orange spectrum animal I can do the fuck I want if it makes money!
Only one that got it fucking right was swamp thing.Saying that you dreamed of a Scottish guy dreaming you does not count Animal Man, even if it is awesomespoiler]
>>78928580
THey probably would've been a little weary to launch things like Swamp Thing and Animal Man since they would've sold even worse with pre-52 numbers.
>>78928592
I think Green Lantern got it best. Most of the history stuck around, and it doesn't carry the Batman problem of "four Robins in five years".
>>78928467
Johns is do the same constant decompressed cross title build up that Bendis did for the Avengers. He's working on a long game that comes at the expense of the model the JLA has had since the Modern era began. Less, super task force of the world's most powerful heroes who shut up and get the job done, more random group of different personalities bicker and deal with crisis as they appear.
>>78928558
Not Kangaroos, but one that isn't so bloodcurdlingly masculine and tediously same.
>>78928693
>and it doesn't carry the Batman problem of "four Robins in five years".
That's because you aren't thinking into it that much. Hal became Earth's single lantern, became Parallax, died, became the Spectre then returned from the dead and went through all of Johns' run in 5 years. That's some serious compression. Let's not even get into Kyle "All my supporting cast has been erased from continuity" Rayner.
>>78928717
Eh. He's not cross-title that often, and I wouldn't put him in the same ballpark as Bendis, at the very least just for the fact that his dialogue and continuity are a lot better. You're right about the decompression though.
>>78928580
Frankenstein contradicted Morrison's continuity. JLDark contradicts the established continuities of Zatanna, Madame Xanadu, and several others. Animal Man contradicts Morrison's run. Swamp thing is the only run that exists within Moore's continuity.
>>78928693
>it doesn't carry the Batman problem of "four Robins in five years".
So why are people so assblasted about this?
Bruce having any Robins after Jason should be a problem too but people don't give a shit about that
>>78928797
>Animal Man contradicts Morrison's run
In what way? Everything about it reads like a follow-up to the Vertigo seriesexcept the whole Chimera thing
>>78928592
Wonder Woman reboot was awesome, problem was it was a complete reinvention of the character. So was Superman. Neither one is what they were. And what sucks is DC won't admit that these two have basically been completely changed.
>>78928770
Way I see it: Before Justice League: Hal becomes Lantern, does shit. First year is same stuff, Guy and John join at some point. Second year, Hal starts to grey, things go down hill. Some point during third year is Parallax, from then on is Kyle up till year five, then Hal comes back and we get Johns' run.
>>78928717
Since it began, the Johns crossed over with the JL International Annual, Vibe 1, Justice League America, Justice League Dark, Forever Evil. The difference is Johns is immensely talented. His earliest work stands up with some of the best. But he changed his storytelling after the success of New Avengers. Unlike Frank Millar or Alan Moore or Grant Morrison, Johns is willing to alter his style and write what he thinks his readers want. He's not an elitist.
>m-muh muh continuity
We are entering the golden era where story trumps continuity. Go jerk off to your character encyclopedia pages somewhere else.
>>78928979
It also crossed over with Aquaman, which was fucking great. And I agree with you, but that certainly doesn't make him superior at all to the others you listed. It just makes him different.
>>78923149
>>78923183
Where's Hal and Ollie's friendship?
>>78929102
We still got Hal and Barry, which is superior.
>>78923432
>>78923520
Look, The New 52 gave us a lot of good books, but it gaves us even more mediocre and outright bad books and these books laid out the new canon for a lot of characters
I mean, if you were a fan of the Earth-2 or teen characters in general you're fucked. Completely fucked.
>>78929087
I don't, but as a commercial writer with actual talent, something that's rarer than you'd think, he's really got little to no integrity. It's refreshing.
>>78922503
Kill yourself continuityfag
It's all about characters and story
>>78923571
>As somebody who liked MM before the reboot, that book is a huge slap in the face to me.
HOW THE GOD DAMN FUCK IS THAT???
Him being more mysterious and epic and not joking about oreos is a slap in the fucking face???
I say that as someone who loves him pre new 52, tas and new 52.
>>78929174
Teen characters have always been fucked.
The last good thing was PAD's Young Justice and pre-52 Blue Beetle.
Gotham Academy and WAR is you want to count those.
DC doesn't really do teens well since they usually just shove them on Teen Titans which is always horrible.
>>78929102
Soon™
Hal is a hobo and Ollie is currently getting in touch with his non-privileged self.
>>78927413
>sales sunk lower than before
No they didn't, I don't have the information onhand but I did the research in a previous thread and CURRENTLY sales are better than the last month before the reboot, even though they are down from the start of it
>>78929230
>Teen characters have always been fucked.
Not as fucked as now. Now they're utterly fucked.
>>78929369
Except there's way less continuity so a hard retcon is easy
>>78929369
Agreed, but with Didio there it really isn't possible to fix them without a reboot. He's firmly anti young Justice, but short of de-aging the characters there just isn't much you can do with the Titans.
>>78929474
Not really? Lobdell managed to make the teen characters continuity so convoluted and fucked that things are harder to untangle like before.
>>78929331
But they are sinking fast. Further the talent DC roped in to do the reboot is mostly gone. A reboot only works as long as it has consistency. Otherwise you run into the Ultimates problem
>>78923984
What hurts Earth 2 fans the most is that we had something really cool at the start and it's just been turned into an unrecognizable husk of itself now.
>>78929599
>Further the talent DC roped in to do the reboot is mostly gone
Which is why you get new talent... whcich they have done...
>>78929599
That might be a problem if we were talking Marvel, but DC is constantly bringing in fresh talent. Hell, just recently they've picked up King, Seeley and Valentine, to name a few.
>>78929561
Just reboot it then
>>78929102
Johns got rid of it because he clearly didn't like their abusive relationship
>>78922503
>I knew a lot of people whose favorite character was Wally West. He's gone now
actually, he is backIn black.
If only DC brought back a pre-new52 character. I'm sure it'd sell like gangbusters......
![latest[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/QSRj1uU.jpg "latest[1].jpg")
>>78922503
>Nobody actually likes New 52. It was a disaster from the start, and has done more to kill DC than Marvel ever could.
>>78929994
Johns a hack
>>78922503
As painful as it may have been for you personally new52 was a huge success commercially. So much so that it boosted comic sales for the whole industry not just DC. Even today numbers still haven't quite fallen back to the pre reboot levels.
You can certainly argue that the didn't have to shit on existing fans to do that but you can't say it didn't work.
>>78929561
You could nuke it and start over with Emiko, Daimian Wayne, John Kent, and another female character. Course Titan name is shit now.
>>78929736
It sucked, Robinson sucks, and you people have shit tastes.
>>78929783
>>78929826
You haven't named any artists. Valentine's Catwoman had shit-tier sales so even if people like her she's more of a Bryan Q miller or Sterling Gates than the people they've lost.
King and Seeley are decent writers who have primarily taken Dick Grayson, a character who sold well and are writing a book that sells well. Until King and Seeley actually take on characters that aren't big names, then they haven't proved themselves as big talent.
>>78931137
>You could nuke it and start over with Emiko, Daimian Wayne, John Kent, and another female character.
Don't forget Wally after he gets powers, he's in the right age range :^)
>>78922503
>Nobody actually likes New 52.
Speak for yourself you faggot.
>>78929994
Johns didn't really have anything to do with that. That was more Lemire doing his own shit and Arrow being completely different than his other selves.
>>78931290
Remember that early issue of JL where Ollie begs to join and Hal bullies him
>>78930809
the tired point is that for every new reader DC either lost one or turned off another. Comics aren't all or nothing anymore. People want good stories. The Nu52 is having the some things go wrong as what happened to books in the old universe.
>>78931252
>You haven't named any artists
Lupacchino, Tarr, Wu, Ferreyra, Caldwell?
>>78931252
King is writing other stuff too, you know.
>>78931254
I think at this point Wally is a lost cause. Plus you need to balance the book one boy one girl is the magic formula usually. Black Wally is going to hurt either way. Better to just leave that mess out. A wonder girl or teen lantern would be great. But there are too many lanterns. Have to kill one. Anybody seen Guy Gardner?
>>78931359
>People want good stories.
Then why do widely acclaimed, well reviewed books sell so poorly? People might say they want good books but what they want is something gimmicky and not too far out of their comfort zones
>>78931332
Yeah, but I felt that was more Johns doing his Hal's an asshole thing. Not so much being a bully but abrasive. Whatever, Johns entire GL run is a quagmire because of Flashpoint.
>>78931450
>But there are too many lanterns. Have to kill one. Anybody seen Guy Gardner?
De-age one of them to a teen. Problem solved!
>>78931359
>People want good stories.
Then why are good books selling like shit?
People want character wanking. They'll buy any turd that's starring their favorite character, quality has nothing to do with it. If quality mattered, Wonder Woman would sell 10k and books like Omega Men/Prez/Midnighter would be more popular.
>>78931450
Is the black Wally a nephew to Barry too? They can always bring up a nephew called Wally and establish him as a different character from black wally.
>>78931521
Well there were also those pre Flashpoint issues where Barry says he never liked Hal hanging around Ollie, or the Black Mercy dream where Ollie realize it was a dream because he's not as good as Hal thinks he is
I don't think Johns HATES Ollie or anything but I don't think he minded splitting those two up much
>>78931252
All of King's books get critical acclaim. How is he responsible for bad sales?
>>78931556
He'd Iris's nephew
>>78931377
point on Tarr. Luppacchino unfortunately can't maintain a monthly schedule. I expect Marvel to use that Avengers money to buy Tarr.
>>78931435
Tom King isn't writing another ongoing at DC other than Omega Men, and the sales on that book are laughable.
>>78922830
Race continues to be as important to you people as it is the SJWs. It's funny how truly alike you are.
Funnier that you lack the basic self awareness to see it
>>78928215
>including the rape origins.
DC did what? Oh boy!
>>78922503
most of the New 52 books pretty much could have happened with or without reboot too
>>78931610
>Tom King isn't writing another ongoing at DC other than Omega Men, and the sales on that book are laughable.
He's still cowriting Grayson
>>78931621
at least the good stuff
>>78931490
Most well written cape books sell fine. But you and I might disagree on well written. Reviews do not mean something is well written. if CBR is believed, Bendis is a modern day Chaucer.
>>78931529
I mean is he still red or green? I thought and if Kyle is over in Omega land and Guy is red not green, then you could probably get away with guy's ring choosing another person.
>>78931739
Nope he's Green again
>>78929207
>him being a completely different character is a slap in the fucking face???
YES IT IS YOU CORPORATE COCKSUCKING FAGGOT
>>78931556
Yeah, but tell me that wouldn't piss off tumblr.
>>78930809
Wonder Woman and Batman Inc. were both planned before New 52. Likewise, Dick Grayson is continuing on from pre-New 52, so it's success has nothing to do with the new continuity.
>>78931596
Because your holding out as a replacement for writers whose work was both acclaimed and sold well. King is certainly different. But he hasn't had his Sandman yet. DC needs to keep putting him on different books. See what happens.
>>78931775
>>78930939
>new52 was a huge success commercially.
It boosted short-term profits, like all reboots do. Look at where DC is now.
Reboots may attract new readers, but it doesn't keep them, and they chase away old readers.
>>78931616
Amazon's make babies by going out, seducing men with magics, and then murdering them. Oh, it gets better, they then sell the babies to Hesphastus for swords and shit. If they're boys. Girls they keep.
>>78931648
Yeah, which means he gets half credit for a book with a character that sells well regardless.
>>78931884
As Marvel is also finding out now.
>>78931763
godammit all. Is it so wrong for Guy to be something other than Hal Jordan's bitch.
>>78928456
Flash is more popular than Green Lantern, fuck off Johns
>>78931612
But Black Wally IS fucking terrible and him being black is the reason why. Getting race-changed led to all these other changes that made him a totally different person.
>>78931904
Well, I don't follow DC and only know about them because cartoons, some movies and wikipedia and holy shit that doesn't seem appealing in the least
>>78931904
Sounds like what a feminist utopia would be like. Rucka's wanking over muh perfect female society was boring. Themyscryia is boring.
>yfw Marvel will buy DC in your lifetime
>>78932019
>admitting to being a wikifag
>in a thread discussing comics
Off yourself.
>>78932045
Don't say that, man.
This is literally 'not MUH': the thread.
>>78932019
It really was though. It was Azzerelo deconstructing wonder Woman. He has these great moments with Diana where she's what people always claim she is, inspiring.
>>78932033
yes, but feminist utopia is worse
>>78932346
>>78932068
Fuck off. It's not like he pretended to be a big fan. He admits to having no interest in the comic.
>>78932265
Man you people give Azz way more credit than he's due. Yeah the run was nice but his WW characterization was wonky at best.
>>78928423
>Yes the flip side is a weakened Flash book
That is a massive understatement. Flash is in a dismal spot right now. They aren't just writing poor stories, they are retconning out some of the best Flash history.
>>78932376
speaking of reboots, AUs and so on, injustice is releasing again, how come no threads?
>>78931800
There is NOTHING majorly different about him much less entirely different, are you fucking insane?
>>78932450
>>78932407
yeah, but, Comics is what we are talking about....
>>78932431
His Wondy Characterization was amazing, and didn't stick. So eh.
>>78932566
Why can't he talk about comics if he knows about DC in general, just not that SPECIFIC character? Come on man.
>>78932019
>not wanting to be seduced and raped by a big muscley amazon.
>>78930357
But he's not.
New origin, new friends, new traits, new family structure, new behaviours, new hobbies etc.
It's a new character.
>>78932440
Yes, and the KJ and most pre Morrison Batman. Every Superman story. Every Wally story. Almost Two hundred issues written by three Eisner winning writers and Geoff Johns. So Booch could give the Rogues super powers and make Iris black.
>>78923387
>DUDE DRUGS DONT ACTUALLY PROVIDE ANY INSIGHT THEY JUST MAKE THE MUNDANE SEEM DEEP LMAO
What's not deep about the mundane? Insight basically is seeing something special or new in things that don't look special or now to others. So the mundane can be deep if you look at it close enough. Actually, that's what science is all about. Not that I'm saying sience is the same as taking drugs.
Sorry, that just caught my eye. I'm moving along, now.
>>78932632
And then murdered. You forgot the murder bit.
>>78932350
Yes, did you see the sign. Tacky.
>>78922503
What an idiot
>>78932483
isn't he a woman now who kissed aquaman?
I wont forgive the new 52 for wasting potential.
>>78923149
>Superman and batman are still friends
It's not the same though, what with Batman being 10 to 15 years older than everyone else in the JL. Clark and Diana are closer to Dick in age.
>>78934253
He was split into like 5 different beings and one of them was a woman who kissed Aquaman, yes.
>>78934376
............
trash.
>>78934253
yeah
he's also like five other people
>>78934402
>talking shit about Mr. Biscuits
kill yourself
>>78934402
Bet you like the same white martian story over and over again, huh
>>78934437
Martian manhunter has been my favorite character since I was 12 I don't like this change.
>>78934472
you could say the same for literally any comic book character
Personally I don't think you need to reboot the universe to make it friendly to new users. Just reset back to #1 with a free #0 that includes origin. #1 can be a line in the sand whereby it doesn't rely on the outcome of preceeding stories.
>>78934508
>you could say the same for literally any comic book character
Yes I know
>>78928423
>both Cass and Steph Brown not only had two big runs with Steph's book being the lowest readership at only 20,000ish.
To be fair, Gail's run lasted almost about the same ammount as Stephanie's entire run.
Also Cassandra's was in the late 20,000s near the tail end of her series. Of course that was at #73 so to have it running like that and be who she was. That's just amazing.
>>78934554
Gail's run had a number one, was a part of the 52 reboot, and had the strongest bat book since hush. Gail got tie ins to court of owls death of the family gothopia and zero year, all of which dramatically inflated her numbers.
Gail's run may have decent numbers, but only because of all this. It also lasted a year longer. In the end, Simone's lasting contribution will be the eye patch james jr. wears and a shitty trans character.
>>78922677
But that's Marvel's biggest weakness. Their sliding timescales creates a metric fuckton of inconsistencies and overall their history makes no sense whatsoever.
>>78932600
>and didn't stick. So eh.
Like every other WW run in history?
>>78932990
>literally no fun allowed
O' I am laffing
>>78934508
>Martian manhunter has been my favorite character since I was 12
Then actually read his ongoing before judging it you tard
>>78932045
>Disney owns Superman
>they make a superman cartoon/movie
Yes please
>>78922503
>This guy again
>This many posts
>>78932990
Why is the sign in English? Shouldn't it be in Greek, or at least bilingual?
It not being a total reboot with big events that collectively advance time was a mistake. Just tell one big story over a decade or so then reboot again! #1s for everybody, whos with me
>>78922503
It was never a good idea, just helped to generate an initial quick bump of sales, but a terrible idea in the long run. /co/ will only defend this shit because they started to read comics with it and because "the years previous to N52 were shit so therefore N52 must have been good!"
>>78922503
as someone who rarely reads comics and comes here mostly to talk about shows, here's how I see it.
New52 was a good idea, and actually got me interested in reading some comics for the first time ever. Fresh new start, none of the incredible baggage and stupid crap from 50+ years of comics, sounds great. First thing they do? Immediately start filling every comic with the same old shit as before. Dropped everything I had started to read within a year.That was their mistake, if you're not going to change anything for the better, why bother doing it at all.
>>78938960
Because it was written for an English speaking audience back before people felt the need to ask stupid cuck questions like "Why isn't this belingual for my POC friends"
>>78923349
>we should be happy because there exists the remote possibility that parts of those characters can maybe be salvaged someday if DC feels like it
>>78922503
Hey, but Donna Troy is back... Oh wait.
>>78931808
They can go to Marvel and jackoff to that dyke Captain Marvel as she'll be leading one of the two sides on CW2.
>>78932045
Scary, it'd be weird having all the guys on a single thing, then perhaps Civil War III could be Justice League vs. Avengers, heh.
>>78932538
That smug face in the second panel, what the hell.
>>78939217
What do you consider "the same old shit"?
Hows the teen titans book after the re-relaunch?
>>78934508
Those other characters have different stories even if they decide to go back to basis. Not so much J'onn.
>>78932045
Yeah no, they would have to buy WB for that to happen so you can forget about trying to force that meme here, guy.
>>78922503
>company reboots
>faggots complain that everything isn't exactly the same
Why does superman wear the tee shirt sometimes then the full costume other times?
>>78922956
>>Complaining about Geoff J who gave us one of the best modern GL runs that hasn't been able surprassed no matter who they have at the helm.
Oh right, it's cause he's doing JL and not MUH MORRISON JL.
>>78928520
No because DC hates money it seems.
Question gents: what is the absolute best of the new 52 and what is the worst?
>>78932600
So can you explain to me how Wonder Woman is so different from all the other amazons when she grew up in that toxic culture? She should hate men and support the rape/killing thing.
Her characterization didn't made any sense. She was your typical RPG protag. She just did and went where other people asked or demanded to complete the quests. She was a passive protagonists that was just super and awesome because she is, no rhyme or reason tro it.
>>78946790
Diana was brought up differently and wasn't exposed to the truth about rape raids, so of course she would be different from the rest, especially after spending time away from the island and mingling with people from the Man's world. It's always been part of her character than she's different from the rest.
