So now it's practically all done, is it safe to conclude that Hackman's run was the biggest flop of all time
Consider
>44 Avengers issues
>33 New Avengers issues
>6 Annuals
>6 Issues of Infinity
>8 Issues of Secret Invasion
ALL that crap leading up to one shitty event, that's a ridiculous amount of issues with stories that have no individual payoffs and story arcs
I've thoroughly enjoyed it. I'm rereading it and I love it. Different strokes, I suppose.
It definitely wasn't as good as his FF run. It would have been better if he just wrote his New Avengers story and went right into Secret Wars.
Kill yourself
Secret Wars gave us great tie-ins which were better than the garbage Marvel had been putting out for the last few years. So I don't give a fuck if the main book isn't that great, it gave me M.O.D.O.K. Assassin and that's all that matters.
>>78007865
A 33 issue lead up to anything isn't acceptable
The stories are worthless on their own
Secret Wars is probably my favorite Marvel event. It was basically a big "What if?" story that gave the old Marvel Universe a proper sendoff.
hate marvel, huge hickvengers fan. thought it was a beautiful lengthy run
New Avengers I read and liked. Avengers was too full of "oh noes, we struggle! yeah, deus ex machina character will save us all!" for my liking.
Secret Wars as event? Bad event with bad art and everything happens between panels and off-screen. Some of tie-ins were good, though.
Why is it that Hickman gets all the hate when Remender's Uncanny Avengers run was just as disappointing?
>>78007953
Marvel books are shit in general, Hackman is just a bigger target
>>78007921
>This shit taste
>>78007953
because it wasnt as long and wasnt as meaningless.
>>78007797
>6 Annuals
Hickman didn't write a single one of them, and they were barely connected.
Other that that... yeah, I'm with you.
>>78007953
IMO, each issue of Remender's run felt a lot more meaty in terms of character, action and plot.
there's no way to defend hickman when it comes to his avengers stuff, it's just bland and boring, and the poor man can't into narrative flow for shit.
New Avengers was much, much better than the main book but I enjoyed both well enough.
>>78007797
to me the entire premise felt half-assed, borrowing too much from DC's Crisis storylines and elements. Marvel has a really rich variety of both cosmic and mystic source material... and like, this was the best they could do when they knew ALL of those dedicated issues would be put into it?
I'm with you on this Anon.
I dropped his run because he was raising more questions than answering and then Infinity was kingdom of boredom I didn't even want to suffer through it.
>>78007797
That is what I said in 2013, right after infinity, and during Time runs out.
Not sure who to blame here, a lot of writers had to sit and wait for Hickman, and that sucks because they could not plan out arcs outside of some short lived events to sustain sales while they were waiting.
Initially Secret Wars had so many tie in comics it looked like it was going to last at least 6 months....turns out the tie ins already finished and the story is purely centered around the Fantastic Four.
The scope of the story was huge but it looks like Hickman took on a lot of responsibility for a single writer who honestly wanted to do something to rival Crisis on Infinite Earths in terms of quality but got a severe writers block and Marvel has Disney executives to answer to so Marvel wanted everyone to move to the next big thing.
I think the blame is on Disney and Marvel executives since there was not a lot of commitment since it is not like everyone got their "Last Days of..." stories out in time, in some cases they were wrapped up by the time comics like Weirdworld confirmed that the Multiverse was going to be magically restored so none of it matter.
The funny thing here is that DC did Convergence and wrapped that up in two months alone and was honestly more fun than SW. Feels like SW had enough material to carry the next year or so of Marvel, but executives did not like the idea especially since Marvel has a lot of movie fans to pander to. A movie works as a big advertisement for Marvel, they would be mad to alienate that audience with a series most of /co/ pirate because I am not going to be an hypocrite....
I read most of it on /co/, bought a few issues, and I was planning to buy the entire $200 worth of comics and $100 worth of tie ins if the event did deliver.
Maybe Hickman was not given enough power to carry SW. It feels like his own "A Song of Ice and Fire" but not everyone was on board with it.
>>78009177
I am not implying it was the fault of the executives that Hickman could not plan the event all the way just that it makes it way harder on him, and the way the series were released took away a lot of the impact.
>>78008819
>borrowing too much from DC's Crisis storylines and elements
This.
Builders = Guardians
Alephs = Manhunters
That not-Justice League
Obviously, Hickman wanted to write a DC book; why didn't he ask for work there?
Yes, the payoff was trash, but how did people not like the Incursion/Illuminati saga of New Avengers?
It was tense, exciting, and depressing. It had everything! Even the Justice League!
I just reread through the whole thing.
Honestly, Secret Wars has been dragged out way too long, but it isn't shit, When read together, the 7 issues out so far go well. Even moreso with Avengers
Why are we talking about a book that has been delayed to hell and back?
Do I have to read both avengers and new avengers to enjoy the story?
>>78007797
Shouldn't we count his fantastic four and FF runs as build up also? Plus, his secret warriors run? And the Avengers World ongoing? All these books had ties his work.
>>78009177
the approach to comics you present needs to go.
muh event where everything ties together and you read "everything". Most people do not think this way.
>>78009313
The story he wrote was waaay too similar to Crisis on Infinite Earths, Zero Hour, Infinite Crisis, Final Crisis, etc. It'd be a retread. We've never seen a story like this in Marvel before.
>>78010290
>what would Marvel do without DC?
>>78007901
Have you read Cerebus or Lucifer?
>>78010512
>comparing this dreck to those good books
>>78010574
>speak in absolutes
>completely backpedal on your absolute
>>78010774
Have you read Cerebus or Lucifer?
>>78007867
this
>>78007953
>Uncanny Avengers
Yeah, it was terrible. Liked hick,men's more.
